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InvisibleVvellum
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?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951?
    #2783551 - 06/11/04 01:44 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

http://www.nhgazette.com/cgi-bin/NHGstore.cgi?user_action=detail&catalogno=NN_Bush_Nazi_2

?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? - Federal Documents
By John Buchanan and Stacey Michael
from The New Hampshire Gazette Vol. 248, No. 3, November 7, 2003

After the seizures in late 1942 of five U.S. enterprises he managed on behalf of Nazi industrialist Fritz Thyssen, Prescott Bush, the grandfather of President George W. Bush, failed to divest himself of more than a dozen "enemy national" relationships that continued until as late as 1951, newly-discovered U.S. government documents reveal.

Furthermore, the records show that Bush and his colleagues routinely attempted to conceal their activities from government investigators...


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OfflineLearyfan
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: Vvellum]
    #2784106 - 06/11/04 09:25 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

That can't be true. We all know that George W. Bush got everything that he's ever had in life through his father. If his father got were he got through his father who got rich from Hitler money than that means that..........

........ Adolf Hitler funded the presidency of George W. Bush!





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Anonymous

Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: Vvellum]
    #2784282 - 06/11/04 11:06 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951

... at which time our current president was 5 years old. weak.


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OfflineLearyfan
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: ]
    #2784300 - 06/11/04 11:17 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Your arguement shouldn't be that Dubya was only 5 years old. No matter how old he was, he and his family benifited from holocaust money.

Your arguement should be that most of Prescott Bush's money didn't come from Hitler. That's just a guess, though.






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Anonymous

Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: Learyfan]
    #2784337 - 06/11/04 11:35 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Your arguement should be that most of Prescott Bush's money didn't come from Hitler.

i would imagine that most of it didn't.

my point is that george w. bush never did business with the nazis. perhaps his family did, and maybe they profited a bit from it, but this says absolutely nothing about him, his administration, or its policies.

it's a weak angle for attack. there are plenty of things wrong with bush and his presidency. going after his family's business ties with nazi germans is about as weak as going after him for his family's ties with the bin ladens.


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OfflineLearyfan
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: ]
    #2784385 - 06/11/04 11:52 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

It's just very creepy that the leader of the free world got to where he is today partly because of Adolf Hitler money. Especially because he and his administration are becoming known more and more for trying to make the constitution irrelevant.






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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: Vvellum]
    #2784633 - 06/11/04 01:21 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

How could it have continued until 1951 when Nazi Germany fell in 1945?


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InvisibleDoctorJ
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: Vvellum]
    #2784653 - 06/11/04 01:29 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

ahhh, capitalism...

selling your services to the highest bidder...  even if they are nazis!

after all, the only thing that really matters is the bottom line

I cant believe you jack booted thugs would object to Bush's ancestor's working for the Nazis.  Those are his skills to sell as he chooses. 

:rolleyes:


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InvisibleVvellum
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2784911 - 06/11/04 02:59 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

How could it have continued until 1951 when Nazi Germany fell in 1945?




Did you read the article?

After the war, a total of 18 additional Brown Brothers Harriman and UBC-related client assets were seized under The Trading with the Enemy Act, including several that showed the continuation of a relationship with the Thyssen family after the initial 1942 seizures.

The records also show that Bush and the Harrimans conducted business after the war with related concerns doing business in or moving assets into Switzerland, Panama, Argentina and Brazil - all critical outposts for the flight of Nazi capital after Germany's surrender in 1945. Fritz Thyssen died in Argentina in 1951.

One of the final seizures, in October 1950, concerned the U.S. assets of a Nazi baroness named Theresia Maria Ida Beneditka Huberta Stanislava Martina von Schwarzenberg, who also used two shorter aliases. Brown Brothers Harriman, where Prescott Bush and the Harrimans were partners, attempted to convince government investigators that the baroness had been a victim of Nazi persecution and therefore should be allowed to maintain her assets.

"It appears, rather, that the subject was a member of the Nazi party," government investigators concluded.


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InvisibleVvellum
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: ]
    #2784937 - 06/11/04 03:06 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

my point is that george w. bush never did business with the nazis. perhaps his family did, and maybe they profited a bit from it, but this says absolutely nothing about him, his administration, or its policies.




I didnt realize this was supposed to be an attack on the present-day Bush administration...

Consider it a history lesson or an investigation into massive financial support of the Nazis and recruitment of post-WWII Nazis into the intelligence apartatus of the federal government.

"The discovery of the Bush-Nazi documents raises new questions about the role of Prescott Bush and his influential business partners in the secret emigration of Nazi war criminals, which allowed them to escape justice in Germany," says Bob Fertik, co-founder of Democrats.com and an amateur 'Nazi hunter.' "It also raises questions about the importance of Nazi recruits to the CIA in its early years, in what was called Operation Paperclip, and Prescott Bush's role in that dark operation."

Fertik and others, including former Justice Department Nazi war crimes prosecutor John Loftus, a Constitutional attorney in Miami, and a former Veterans Administration official, believe Prescott Bush and the Harrimans should have been tried for treason.


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InvisibleVvellum
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: ]
    #2784948 - 06/11/04 03:08 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

it's a weak angle for attack. there are plenty of things wrong with bush and his presidency. going after his family's business ties with nazi germans is about as weak as going after him for his family's ties with the bin ladens.




Why is the business relations between the Bush and bin Laden family irrevelent and something to be regarded as just "a weak angle of attack"? I think these are areas to question and look into to help us understand what exactly is going on in the world; to help us understand what events led to the situation we find ourselves in.


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: ]
    #2784968 - 06/11/04 03:13 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

my point is that george w. bush never did business with the nazis. perhaps his family did, and maybe they profited a bit from it, but this says absolutely nothing about him, his administration, or its policies.

Well it says that he comes from a family of corrupt, lawless bastards who made their money dealing with Hitler.

Has Shrub ever denounced his grandfather for what he did?

Then again, he's not alone. The list of american corporations who bankrolled Hitler reads like the Who's who of american capitalism. Great guys, we should give them more power..


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Anonymous

Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: Xlea321]
    #2785302 - 06/11/04 04:32 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Well it says that he comes from a family of corrupt, lawless bastards who made their money dealing with Hitler.

how many people in the bush family had financial ties with the nazis? so far, it looks like only one. how much money did they make from these ties? i think the statement, "he comes from a family of corrupt, lawless bastards who made their money dealing with Hitler" is just a wee bit of an exagerration.

do you think it's rational to think less of a person because of what certain member(s) of their family did?

Has Shrub ever denounced his grandfather for what he did?

no. perhaps he should, but the point is that this has nothing to do with his administration or its policies. i care about as much about bush's grandfather now as i did about clinton's sex life while he was in office.


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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: ]
    #2785449 - 06/11/04 05:09 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

how many people in the bush family had financial ties with the nazis?

Unless Prescott gave his fortune away to someone else, I'd imagine everyone in the Bush family has benefitted. If any of the Bush family refused to take a slice of the pie or paid compensation to the victims of Hitlers regime then they can hold their heads high.

so far, it looks like only one

How many do you need?

do you think it's rational to think less of a person because of what certain member(s) of their family did?

If they've denounced their disgusting behaviour then maybe not. As the article says - if 50 years later Shrub is still in the war-profiteering business with the Saudi's then it's cause for concern.

no. perhaps he should, but the point is that this has nothing to do with his administration or its policies

The kind of man you are and your background play a very heavy part in the administration you build around you and the policies you decide to follow. I would guess that having a morally corrupt war profiteer for a grand-daddy and launching morally corrupt wars on the basis of lies arn't entirely disconnected.


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OfflineRedo
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: Xlea321]
    #2785545 - 06/11/04 05:32 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

This is exactly like the argument of if you had slaves generations back, whats it matter, you didnt have any say, and wealth came from slave trading.


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Offlinegermin8tionn8ion
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: Learyfan]
    #2785684 - 06/11/04 06:10 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Learyfan said:
It's just very creepy that the leader of the free world got to where he is today partly because of Adolf Hitler money. Especially because he and his administration are becoming known more and more for trying to make the constitution irrelevant.




Are you equally "creeped out" about Switzerlands capitualiation to Hitler? About BMW making the "ovens"? About Mitsubishi making the Zeros that bombed Pearl Harbor? I'm betting you aren't, because it's not neato moliberalo to hate Mitsubish, or BMW, or the Swiss.








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Offlinegermin8tionn8ion
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: Learyfan]
    #2785685 - 06/11/04 06:10 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Learyfan said:
It's just very creepy that the leader of the free world got to where he is today partly because of Adolf Hitler money. Especially because he and his administration are becoming known more and more for trying to make the constitution irrelevant.




Are you equally "creeped out" about Switzerlands capitualiation to Hitler? About BMW making the "ovens"? About Mitsubishi making the Zeros that bombed Pearl Harbor? I'm betting you aren't, because it's not neato moliberalo to hate Mitsubish, or BMW, or the Swiss.








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Offlinegermin8tionn8ion
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: Xlea321]
    #2785707 - 06/11/04 06:19 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Alex123 said:
Unless Prescott gave his fortune away to someone else, I'd imagine everyone in the Bush family has benefitted. If any of the Bush family refused to take a slice of the pie or paid compensation to the victims of Hitlers regime then they can hold their heads high.




I'm wondering where your tirades against BMW are. I'll just keep waiting.
Quote:


If they've denounced their disgusting behaviour then maybe not. As the article says - if 50 years later Shrub is still in the war-profiteering business with the Saudi's then it's cause for concern.




Hm, so 50 years ago "shrub" was in the war business with the Saudis? Care to cite a link to that for me?
Quote:


The kind of man you are and your background play a very heavy part in the administration you build around you and the policies you decide to follow. I would guess that having a morally corrupt war profiteer for a grand-daddy and launching morally corrupt wars on the basis of lies arn't entirely disconnected.



So you'd never drive a BMW, because each and every one of their employees is a Nazi Sympethizer and harbors deep-seated anti-Semetic views? Makes sense.


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InvisibleVvellum
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: germin8tionn8ion]
    #2785802 - 06/11/04 07:06 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

just how relevent is BMW (a corporation that is owned privately and probably does not practice the act of inheritance) to political discussion? Not very - that's why it is never really brought up.

The Bush family and the CIA are relevent, however.


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Offlinegermin8tionn8ion
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Re: ?Bush - Nazi Dealings Continued Until 1951? [Re: Vvellum]
    #2785808 - 06/11/04 07:09 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

bi0 said:
just how relevent is BMW (a corporation that is owned privately and probably does not practice the act of inheritance) to political discussion? Not very - that's why it is never really brought up.

The Bush family and the CIA are relevent, however.




Maybe you should read some of the history of BMW and how they made "special use" ovens for the holocaust. Having a grandpa who was on the 'wrong side' seems to be an admission of Nazism, while a company that was actively involved in the murder of Jews and other nondesirables seems to be fine and dandy.


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