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Offlinerumfor69
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: SWBZA]
    #28688237 - 03/06/24 12:07 AM (10 months, 6 days ago)

I will tell you those dishes are not ready to go to grain so hopefully you transferred them a lot more but there is another type of thing that can happen bacteria in your grain spawn can be almost undetectable it's very difficult to identify clean spawn and what happens is you mix it up in a tub when you spawn to bulk and for some reason it's like it can't beat the race It is fighting bacteria it's immune system is weakened it can't fight off things that are in the air they are able to land in there Get a foothold and boom you get trich like before or during first flush.

My question to you is what ratio are you spawning at how much spawn are you using with how much CV?


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Offlinerumfor69
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: rumfor69] * 1
    #28688240 - 03/06/24 12:09 AM (10 months, 6 days ago)

Wanna know something crazy...this is a bad culture



This thing had an infection that existed in the mycelium plane that didn't show up on the agar and would grow trich before fruit EVERY TIME


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Offlinerumfor69
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: rumfor69] * 1
    #28688242 - 03/06/24 12:12 AM (10 months, 6 days ago)

Agar always seems like the holy Grail but it's really not it is a wonderful way to identify things quickly and easily but it doesn't mean that it's some full proof method there can still be things that can live and feed in an almost symbiotic way. The only real way to get good results is replication make a lot of dishes from your spores make like 10-15 multi spore dishes then transfer those to new dishes like 4 times and then if they look like the one I pictured transfer them to grain and try to fruit them keep track of everything label everything.


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InvisibleSWBZA
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: rumfor69]
    #28688264 - 03/06/24 12:57 AM (10 months, 6 days ago)

Quote:

rumfor69 said:
I will tell you those dishes are not ready to go to grain so hopefully you transferred them a lot more but there is another type of thing that can happen bacteria in your grain spawn can be almost undetectable it's very difficult to identify clean spawn and what happens is you mix it up in a tub when you spawn to bulk and for some reason it's like it can't beat the race It is fighting bacteria it's immune system is weakened it can't fight off things that are in the air they are able to land in there Get a foothold and boom you get trich like before or during first flush.

My question to you is what ratio are you spawning at how much spawn are you using with how much CV?



I've got transfers on water agar and tea agar to help with bacteria. I've use pure coir. Based on feedback from the previous thread, I PCd the coir for those two tubs for 2 hours to eliminate that. I changed my rye tek to Spitball's one to ensure they are not too wet. Also upped the PC for the grain for these last two tubs to 2 hours. Did boxes from 1:1 all the way to 1:6, pseudo casing, no pseudo casing. Spawn to bulk was done in a humidity chamber that I don't use at the moment. It is fed by a fan that filters air through poly, so it is a positive pressure environment with at least cleanish air. I switched off the fan for 2 hours before spawning to bulk in it, essentially giving me a monster size SAB. I didn't touch the spawn or coir, used a stainless steel instrument only, obviously ISOd. Before doing all this, I took all the furniture out of my dedicated shroom room and sprayed all surfaces, ceiling included, with a broad spectrum antifungal. Also sprayed all tables, etc., before putting back in the room, except for surfaces I will touch when I work - those I cleaned with ISO. Despite wearing a KN95 mask, got a nice asthma attack for my efforts. So, clean (not sterile, I know) room, SAB for noccing grains with agar, spawn to bulk in large SAB, no-touch, standard shower / brush teeth, ISO the crap out of everything like only a noob can, but my tubs trich out.

I've changed coir supplier and will use the new supply for my next tubs, and I've bought popcorn and milo. I have 3 jars of popcorn going. I'm off on leave for two weeks this Friday, and I'll make milo jars when I get back.

No idea where the trich comes from, but "trich causes trich", so I'm hunting down every possible vector in the whole chain.

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Offlinerumfor69
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: SWBZA]
    #28688267 - 03/06/24 01:06 AM (10 months, 6 days ago)

The words fan positive air and S.A.B should not even exist in the same sentence in any way. If air is moving ever no matter how clean you think it is then that has nothing to do with the still airbox cause it is not a still airbox at that point know what I mean?

My guess is you probably went to grain too early with those dishes. They should have been transferred 3..4...5 times and you'd have a beautiful agar plate to display that you took to grain. The real purpose of agar is it's a media plane that you can make multiple transfers to and create an axenic culture in hopefully. So unless you habe a pretty picture updated agar plate pic then I'd surmise you went to grain too soon


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InvisibleSWBZA
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: SWBZA]
    #28688269 - 03/06/24 01:10 AM (10 months, 6 days ago)

Oh, I've also got two BRF pucks going nocced with Josex's poke. Hoping to run from bacteria, but no idea how that will help with mold, which I can't see - hence the scope. No worries, I'll keep at it.

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Offlinerumfor69
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: SWBZA]
    #28688273 - 03/06/24 01:16 AM (10 months, 6 days ago)

Mold is actually really easy to identify it's not something that's very sneaky because it's very aggressive it's very carnivorous it loves to overtake everything really fast If there was mold you would know it very quickly


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InvisibleSWBZA
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: rumfor69]
    #28688274 - 03/06/24 01:17 AM (10 months, 6 days ago)

Quote:

rumfor69 said:
The words fan positive air and S.A.B should not even exist in the same sentence in any way. If air is moving ever no matter how clean you think it is then that has nothing to do with the still airbox cause it is not a still airbox at that point know what I mean?

My guess is you probably went to grain too early with those dishes. They should have been transferred 3..4...5 times and you'd have a beautiful agar plate to display that you took to grain. The real purpose of agar is it's a media plane that you can make multiple transfers to and create an axenic culture in hopefully. So unless you habe a pretty picture updated agar plate pic then I'd surmise you went to grain too soon



Thanks. BTW, that's why I switched off the fan for hours - to get the air still. No matter. I'll keep transferring.

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Offlinerumfor69
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: SWBZA]
    #28688278 - 03/06/24 01:26 AM (10 months, 6 days ago)

Show us a pic of your grain spawn b4 you goto bulk next time so I can help. Compare it to the pics in my links of Clean Spawn Checklist and How it Should Look. I'm here to help ya friend, I hope you don't take my demeanor offensive. We're here to face science observations so we gotta let go of emotional assumptions sometimes.


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InvisibleSWBZA
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: rumfor69]
    #28688279 - 03/06/24 01:28 AM (10 months, 6 days ago)

Quote:

rumfor69 said:
Show us a pic of your grain spawn b4 you goto bulk next time so I can help. Compare it to the pics in my links of Clean Spawn Checklist and How it Should Look. I'm here to help ya friend, I hope you don't take my demeanor offensive. We're here to face science observations so we gotta let go of emotional assumptions sometimes.



No offence taken, I appreciate help.

:thanx:

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Invisibleelasticaltiger
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: rumfor69]
    #28688734 - 03/06/24 01:19 PM (10 months, 6 days ago)

Quote:

rumfor69 said:
Dude even if you could magnifi to see trich...what would you do at that point. You got macroscopic cellular cutting and transfer tools? You gonna preform surgery that even brain surgeons cant? You think you gonna remove every cell? Not trying to sound condescending truly. I just ask what's the goal? Just start a bunch of MS plates...like 20. Then work with what you think looks good after 3-4 transfers then grow them all and find out then take a clone. Then take soores from fruits that look great and repeathe process into infinity.




You could serial dilute a blended piece of agar and put one drop onto multiple plates until you get a plate with just mycelium. This was the suggestion I received after I asked a question about micromanipulation for physically seperating the threads under a microscope.

Edit: thread here https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28651301#28651301


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Edited by elasticaltiger (03/06/24 01:22 PM)

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Offlinerumfor69
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Re: Transfers from this plate? [Re: elasticaltiger]
    #28688947 - 03/06/24 04:11 PM (10 months, 6 days ago)

Serial dilution would probably work but I still doubt it's trich. Trich doesn't hide in a plate as far as I know it will show it's face. Also the process of cleanly preforming serial dilution in an SAB might be tough for OP


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