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OfflineLouisBell
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Registered: 12/06/21
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Last seen: 1 year, 9 days
60-80 mg of DMT - wtf?
    #27683431 - 03/05/22 05:39 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

After some interesting sub-breakthrough experiences with enhanced leaf... I vaporised 60-80 mg (no scale, but definitely no less than 60...) in a quartz dab banger. Freebase this time, not leaf. Straight crystals that vaped smoothly and without any burning.

The piece was brand new, never used it for anything before. My friend held this glass vial with the spice dose in it while getting the stone red hot. The second it hit I sucked it all up, it evaporated with less than a 20th of the matter as residue... I'm amazed at how effective the hit was. I tasted spice and I had intense body sensations... I leant back and closed my eyes.

As I held in my breath what had been the start of visuals faded to complete black. When I finally exhaled slowly I was affected heavily... But all I saw was this orange glow that seemed to tell me up front "you're not getting in", and then it actually got a bit more intense for a few seconds before I was 80% back to normal and opened my eyes to see no OEVs.

It felt like a few seconds or a minute max after I hit it that I was back there. My friend told me 7 minutes had gone by.

Now I am familiar with "lock-out" from reading here... If I was locked out, it felt as if the reason/message from hyperspace was telling me "That was too much, but you're just a beginner, we won't hold it against you or "teach you a lesson" this time because you didn't do anything to merit the famed hyperslap, but you're not getting in."

It was weaker than doses I've had with much lower amounts of enhanced leaf. Did I get locked out?

Side note that's important: I'm on a benzo, currently tapering and only ever at baseline, constantly reducing.

I have an above average tolerance to mescaline and mushrooms, and I assume other entheogens too.

That being said, it wouldn't explain the obviously weaker experience with a large one hit perfectly vaped dose.

I'm looking for "real world" comment preferably... Not speculation about the nature of hyperspace or entities with intentions, at least not primarily, but I am nonetheless interested in what others have to say...


--------------------
A humble psychonaut with an interest in using psychedelic medicine to purge the bad and nurture the good.


Edited by LouisBell (03/05/22 07:27 AM)


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OfflineKmacmo
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: LouisBell]
    #27683471 - 03/05/22 06:57 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Enhanced leaf will weigh more than freebase dmt, so your 60-80mg will be less once you take away the plant matter weight?
I would think the benzo would dampen the experience also that along with your tolerance as you say

I've only vaped freebase and it's easy to burn in the dab rig, but going from cold start is pretty fool proof you just watch the dmt melt and once its melted its very easy to vaporize with a low flame


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OfflineLouisBell
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: Kmacmo]
    #27683510 - 03/05/22 07:26 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Kmacmo said:
Enhanced leaf will weigh more than freebase dmt, so your 60-80mg will be less once you take away the plant matter weight?
I would think the benzo would dampen the experience also that along with your tolerance as you say

I've only vaped freebase and it's easy to burn in the dab rig, but going from cold start is pretty fool proof you just watch the dmt melt and once its melted its very easy to vaporize with a low flame





Nah, this was a freebase dose, and it was dabbed without any burning(my friend said it was a fat amount of vapour and there's nothing in the way of a residue. I definitely got the hit right, that I'm sure of. But thanks for the input. Just realised that my post sounds like I was still using enhanced leaf this time, but it was freebase.


--------------------
A humble psychonaut with an interest in using psychedelic medicine to purge the bad and nurture the good.


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OfflineSpicy
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: LouisBell]
    #27683712 - 03/05/22 10:45 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

It was a brand new nail?

Hitting a nail a few times to “season” it and figure out the proper temp helps a lot. If your friend says it was good vapor then maybe it was but once you know the nail dabs perfect at “30 seconds” or whatever, then you know your sweet spot to go at.

That should be plenty to get you there if dabbed properly but yeah benzo usage might be holding you back too

Good luck and safe travels. Just try try again :smile:

Also if you didn’t weigh it there’s no way to know how much and no residue sounds like it was a hot dab


--------------------
Everything has beauty, not everyone sees it.
Perfection is subjective!


Edited by Spicy (03/05/22 10:59 AM)


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OfflineIcon
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: Spicy] * 1
    #27683845 - 03/05/22 01:00 PM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Duds and blackouts can happen, seemingly randomly. Could be the benzos or maybe too big of a dose, or too soon. Some people claim they can do DMT back-to-back with no issues but I personally had more duds if I'd repeat it within a few days. This could theoretically be related to the "lockout" if the entities / your brain decide you've been using it too much. I'd give it a short break then try again don't let this experience discourage you. There's always harmalas if you want to explore deeper, longer.

Also hitting it with intention seems to help. Intention is all subjective I guess, but if you go into it with some focused intention that seems better than a completely blank slate just depending on the substance for a magic show. It almost seems offended by that, like it wants you to show some effort and not be taken for granted. For me, the visuals only really get wild when I subconsciously submit to and participate in the experience. To me it's like a dance; Terrence described it as singing objects into existence. There's a trick to fully unlocking the experience that you find in the rhythm/waves of the experience itself.



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OfflineTyperwritermonky
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: Spicy]
    #27684209 - 03/05/22 06:20 PM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Spicy said:
It was a brand new nail?

Hitting a nail a few times to “season” it and figure out the proper temp helps a lot. If your friend says it was good vapor then maybe it was but once you know the nail dabs perfect at “30 seconds” or whatever, then you know your sweet spot to go at.

That should be plenty to get you there if dabbed properly but yeah benzo usage might be holding you back too

Good luck and safe travels. Just try try again :smile:

Also if you didn’t weigh it there’s no way to know how much and no residue sounds like it was a hot dab




Yeah I think there's two things here; one, the nail was probably way too hot and burned the DMT too hot.

Two, you're still on a benzo, and benzos mute psychedelics a lot.


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OfflineLouisBell
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: Typerwritermonky]
    #27684521 - 03/06/22 02:10 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

I used a quartz cup with no "nail". I really don't think it burnt. Also I am new to DMT experimentation so there's no "overdoing it" aspect.

I also take lots of time to properly integrate entheogenic experiences.


--------------------
A humble psychonaut with an interest in using psychedelic medicine to purge the bad and nurture the good.


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InvisiblePsicomb
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: LouisBell]
    #27684638 - 03/06/22 06:00 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

I'm guessing you vaped less than 60-80mg because freebase can be very fluffy and eyeballing a dose isn't as easy as many other powders in my opinion.  Still, though, you could've tripped way harder off that amount.  I'd venture that the DMT just decided to give you a different kind of ride that time as well.  Sounds like you dabbed it properly.  I like to let the nail cool for an extra 10-20 seconds for DMT than I do hash oil; harsh DMT rips can be really rough.


--------------------

When we constantly pull things apart trying to see how it works, we may end up with only an understanding of how to destroy something
- nick sand


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OfflineLouisBell
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: Psicomb]
    #27684779 - 03/06/22 08:35 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Psicomvb said:
I'm guessing you vaped less than 60-80mg because freebase can be very fluffy and eyeballing a dose isn't as easy as many other powders in my opinion.  Still, though, you could've tripped way harder off that amount.  I'd venture that the DMT just decided to give you a different kind of ride that time as well.  Sounds like you dabbed it properly.  I like to let the nail cool for an extra 10-20 seconds for DMT than I do hash oil; harsh DMT rips can be really rough.





There was no resdidue, a strong sweet taste of DMT and initial effects were very heavy. I eyeballed it sure, but given the total I was working with I'm certain that it was no less than 60, and likely more.

That being said, I could be wrong, I am no psychic and I welcome all speculation.

Also, I'm using a quartz piece with no "nail", just a bowl with the hole at the top, drop in the powder and slurp. Unless I'm missing some terminology on what exactly a "nail" is... I'm picturing those titanium rigs which isn't what I used.


Oh, and as for Harmalas, can't touch em. Interactions with stuff. Not my cup of hospital bed tea.


--------------------
A humble psychonaut with an interest in using psychedelic medicine to purge the bad and nurture the good.


Edited by LouisBell (03/06/22 08:45 AM)


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OfflineIcon
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: LouisBell]
    #27685060 - 03/06/22 01:00 PM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Interactions with stuff? You on SSRI's too? That's the only dangerous interaction that comes to mind but I guess follow your doctors advice. There's a thread here on sublingual DMT if you want the ayahuasca experience without having to use harmalas.


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OnlineNorthernerM
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: Psicomb]
    #27685148 - 03/06/22 02:09 PM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Psicomvb said:
I'm guessing you vaped less than 60-80mg because freebase can be very fluffy and eyeballing a dose isn't as easy as many other powders in my opinion.



:werd:

60-80mg could be a very big pile, a few little chunks or anything in between.

Eyeballing DMT is a fools game. If you had put 80mg DMT and it had worked as expected it would have ripped you a new psychedelic asshole and pulled your mind through it. People get operated on by aliens on that sort of dose.

Get a scale.


--------------------
The nearest we ever come to knowing truth is when we are witness to paradox.


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OfflineSpicy
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: Northerner]
    #27685199 - 03/06/22 02:56 PM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Nail, bucket whatever you want to call it. You need to figure out the sweet spot for whatever you’re using as all nails have a unique cool down time. A few dabs of cannabis extract will tell you the proper time so you know you will get it right and become familiar with the proper dab time and temp.

Like others have said, you have to weigh it. There’s no way to be certain. Not that hard tho just weigh out more and go again and again till you get it right.

Don’t talk about it to figure it out, experience is the best teacher. :smile:


--------------------
Everything has beauty, not everyone sees it.
Perfection is subjective!


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OfflineLouisBell
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Registered: 12/06/21
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: Northerner]
    #27685838 - 03/07/22 04:03 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Northerner said:
Quote:

Psicomvb said:
I'm guessing you vaped less than 60-80mg because freebase can be very fluffy and eyeballing a dose isn't as easy as many other powders in my opinion.



:werd:

60-80mg could be a very big pile, a few little chunks or anything in between.

Eyeballing DMT is a fools game. If you had put 80mg DMT and it had worked as expected it would have ripped you a new psychedelic asshole and pulled your mind through it. People get operated on by aliens on that sort of dose.

Get a scale.





Whilst I can understand this, I also think it's a bunch of hyperbole. I started with a certain amount, I homogenised the powder and I used measured division. I would get a scale if I planned to do this a lot, but there's no way my lowest estimate is significantly higher. A missed inefficiency sure, but the dose was definitely significant and I didn't eyeball different consistencies


--------------------
A humble psychonaut with an interest in using psychedelic medicine to purge the bad and nurture the good.


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OfflineLouisBell
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: Icon]
    #27685840 - 03/07/22 04:09 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Icon said:
Interactions with stuff? You on SSRI's too? That's the only dangerous interaction that comes to mind but I guess follow your doctors advice. There's a thread here on sublingual DMT if you want the ayahuasca experience without having to use harmalas.




I take Trazodone. I'm not sure how much it interacts with MAOIs but I believe it does to an extent. Since I have no problem admitting my DMT use to my doctor I'll wait for his opinion.


--------------------
A humble psychonaut with an interest in using psychedelic medicine to purge the bad and nurture the good.


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OnlineNorthernerM
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: LouisBell]
    #27685866 - 03/07/22 04:58 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

There's 101 eyeballing DMT trainwreck anecdotes. It's literally one of the most powerful hallucinogens that exist. Just giving you the alert tone man. If you think you're all cool then that's all cool. :thumbup:


--------------------
The nearest we ever come to knowing truth is when we are witness to paradox.


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OfflineIcon
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: LouisBell]
    #27686133 - 03/07/22 11:12 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

"Taking MAO inhibitors with this medication may cause a serious (possibly fatal) drug interaction. Avoid taking MAO inhibitors (isocarboxazid, linezolid, metaxalone, methylene blue, moclobemide, phenelzine, procarbazine, rasagiline, safinamide, selegiline, tranylcypromine) during treatment with this medication. Most MAO inhibitors should also not be taken for two weeks before and after treatment with this medication. Ask your doctor when to start or stop taking this medication."
https://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-11188/trazodone-oral/details

Sounds like harmalas are definitely a no-go unfortunately. I wonder how much, if at all, trazadone dampens psychedelics.

This study seems to suggest some effects of LSD are dampened by trazodone.
https://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content/early/2010/07/20/jpet.110.169417


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OfflineIvyBloom
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: Icon]
    #27688254 - 03/09/22 04:07 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Definitely a temperature issue unless I missed a detail. 80mg of DMT freebase should skyrocket you, even momemts after a full breakthrough experience. 30mg is enough for most, assuming you vape it perfectly and don’t destroy any. 50mg is a safe dose to account for error typically. Saying all this without any experience using a rig, only the sandwich method and pizzos.


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OfflineLouisBell
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: Icon]
    #27689378 - 03/10/22 05:27 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Icon said:
"Taking MAO inhibitors with this medication may cause a serious (possibly fatal) drug interaction. Avoid taking MAO inhibitors (isocarboxazid, linezolid, metaxalone, methylene blue, moclobemide, phenelzine, procarbazine, rasagiline, safinamide, selegiline, tranylcypromine) during treatment with this medication. Most MAO inhibitors should also not be taken for two weeks before and after treatment with this medication. Ask your doctor when to start or stop taking this medication."
https://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-11188/trazodone-oral/details

Sounds like harmalas are definitely a no-go unfortunately. I wonder how much, if at all, trazadone dampens psychedelics.

This study seems to suggest some effects of LSD are dampened by trazodone.
https://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content/early/2010/07/20/jpet.110.169417





After a chat with my doctor about trazodone and MAOIs as well as psychedelics, he's told me to stop the trazodone if I wish and that he recommends going with a lower dose after 4 days off the drug. That's mushrooms, the lower dose recommendation, as my usual dose is 4-7g. He also said within a similar time period, but an extra week for extra caution, an MAOI would then be safe(relatively).


--------------------
A humble psychonaut with an interest in using psychedelic medicine to purge the bad and nurture the good.


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OfflineLouisBell
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: IvyBloom]
    #27689384 - 03/10/22 05:33 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Quote:

IvyBloom said:
Definitely a temperature issue unless I missed a detail. 80mg of DMT freebase should skyrocket you, even momemts after a full breakthrough experience. 30mg is enough for most, assuming you vape it perfectly and don’t destroy any. 50mg is a safe dose to account for error typically. Saying all this without any experience using a rig, only the sandwich method and pizzos.




The more I reflect, the more I lend myself to this way of thinking. The bizarreness of the onset and rise is still a puzzling element.


--------------------
A humble psychonaut with an interest in using psychedelic medicine to purge the bad and nurture the good.


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OfflineIcon
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Re: 60-80 mg of DMT - wtf? [Re: LouisBell]
    #27689726 - 03/10/22 12:26 PM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Quote:

LouisBell said:
Quote:

Icon said:
"Taking MAO inhibitors with this medication may cause a serious (possibly fatal) drug interaction. Avoid taking MAO inhibitors (isocarboxazid, linezolid, metaxalone, methylene blue, moclobemide, phenelzine, procarbazine, rasagiline, safinamide, selegiline, tranylcypromine) during treatment with this medication. Most MAO inhibitors should also not be taken for two weeks before and after treatment with this medication. Ask your doctor when to start or stop taking this medication."
https://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-11188/trazodone-oral/details

Sounds like harmalas are definitely a no-go unfortunately. I wonder how much, if at all, trazadone dampens psychedelics.

This study seems to suggest some effects of LSD are dampened by trazodone.
https://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content/early/2010/07/20/jpet.110.169417





After a chat with my doctor about trazodone and MAOIs as well as psychedelics, he's told me to stop the trazodone if I wish and that he recommends going with a lower dose after 4 days off the drug. That's mushrooms, the lower dose recommendation, as my usual dose is 4-7g. He also said within a similar time period, but an extra week for extra caution, an MAOI would then be safe(relatively).



Holy shit what a cool doctor. That's great you're not afraid to have that open communication with them.


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