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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: koods]
#27690202 - 03/10/22 08:13 PM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
koods said: Kill every single one of them and show the pictures. They’re the aggressors violating the sovereignty of a democratic nation
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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Kryptos
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What, are you seriously going to argue that Russia should get to decide what the military forces of other countries do?
Would you take an order from a Russian general?
On second thought, don't answer that.
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koods
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Kryptos]
#27690207 - 03/10/22 08:15 PM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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He’s a Russian imperialist. That has been obvious for years
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ballsalsa
Universally Loathed and Reviled



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Coups happen all the time. Sometimes the U.S. orchestrates it and sometimes its other covert forces. They can't be constructed from ether though. There have to be local partisans in place to have real effect. You don't just get to invade everyone whose political winds aren't blowing your way at the moment. Or maybe you can if you're Russia. We're finding that out. Seems like a total shit show so far and if we extrapolate vs initial U.S. successes in Iraq, this is going to be a complete military, financial and political disaster if it continues even a fraction of the time that conflict did.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: ballsalsa]
#27690212 - 03/10/22 08:26 PM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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The reason the US orchestrated a coup in Ukraine is because the majority of Ukrainians voted for a Russian friendly leader.
Do you support coups over democracy? I'm surprised by what mainstream propaganda is able to do.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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koods
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There have been two democratic elections since the coup.
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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ballsalsa
Universally Loathed and Reviled



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I support coups over invasions...I guess? I mean, I don't really support either tbh and I don't see how opposition to one equals support for the other.
I'm pragmatic enough to believe that western and russian actors have had thier fingers in the Ukraine pot. I haven't seen anything to make me believe that Russia is all benevolence and rainbows NATO and the EU are all kid diddlers and war criminals.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: koods]
#27690242 - 03/10/22 09:01 PM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
koods said: There have been two democratic elections since the coup.
And were the Crimean people included in those votes?
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: ballsalsa]
#27690248 - 03/10/22 09:06 PM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
ballsalsa said: I support coups over invasions...I guess? I mean, I don't really support either tbh and I don't see how opposition to one equals support for the other.
That wasn't the question. I didn't ask if you support the Russian invasion, I asked if you supported a coup over democracy, because without the coup Crimea and Donbas would still be part of Ukraine and there would be no invasion.
Quote:
ballsalsa said: I haven't seen anything to make me believe that Russia is all benevolence and rainbows NATO and the EU are all kid diddlers and war criminals.
Nor have I, and nowhere did I say that. People keep thinking that because I explain what the mainstream news doesn't tell us, that means I'm pro-Russia. It doesn't mean that.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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koods
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Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:
koods said: There have been two democratic elections since the coup.
And were the Crimean people included in those votes?
Make up your mind. Is Crimea part of Russia or Ukraine?
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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koods
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: koods]
#27690265 - 03/10/22 09:18 PM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Nor have I, and nowhere did I say that. People keep thinking that because I explain what the mainstream news doesn't tell us, that means I'm pro-Russia. It doesn't mean that.
The Russian ambassador to the Shroomery isnt pro Russia.
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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Psilynut2
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Quote:
n, I asked if you supported a coup over democracy, because without the coup Crimea and Donbas would still be part of Ukraine and there would be no invasion.
It's kinda disingenuous to say we staged a coup in Ukraine . Yanukovich had already lost legitimacy in the eyes of Ukrainians due to rampant corruption and repression . We are talking about a guy who's first election was nullified due to voter fraud . The people of Ukraine spent months in the freezing cold protesting and fighting for a better Ukraine . We tried to affect who got positions of power after he fled . That may not be right but we didn't overthrow his ass , the people of Ukraine did . I think it's safe to say they are not very pro Russian .
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koods
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Psilynut2]
#27690291 - 03/10/22 09:34 PM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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He was also robbing the country blind
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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larry.fisherman
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Psilynut2] 3
#27690301 - 03/10/22 09:38 PM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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As soon as Ukraine became independent Russia was meddling. They were in their politics and funding the separatist neo-nazis. The reason Crimea happened was the US meddling but they meddled because Russia was trying to swoop in and steal away Ukraine's sovereignty like a jealous ex. The US surely had their agenda, namely to suppress the formation of a new USSR, but their agenda also aligned with Ukraine having a choice and Russia never intended on giving Ukraine a choice from the moment they became something other than part of the Soviet Union.
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koods
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Quote:
a jealous ex.
That pretty much sums it up
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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ballsalsa
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Without direct Russian aggression Crimea and Donbas would still be part of Ukraine but what does my support have to do with anything at all? Can it change the past? Maybe the Russians will be greeted as liberators by the Ukrainian civilians. If not, it's probably because they're all nazis, am I right?
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koods
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: ballsalsa]
#27690393 - 03/10/22 11:14 PM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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Just saw an interview on BBC of Nigerian students who have been evacuated from Sumy after being trapped there for 13 days. They all said they wanted to return to Ukraine when the war was over.
Doesn’t sound like they have been terrorized by nazis like chopstick has been saying for days
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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bukkake


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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: koods] 1
#27690477 - 03/11/22 02:21 AM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
koods said: Make up your mind. Is Crimea part of Russia or Ukraine?
That's a complicated historical question, unless a person believes history in that region began less than 10 years ago.
Quote:
koods said:
Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:
shivas.wisdom said: Every war in the history of war could have been prevented by submitting to the demands of the aggressor.
Right, but I pointed out Russia's conditions for peace, which aren't super unreasonable to me and many others. Russia doesn't even want Ukraine. Do you think Ukraine ceasing military action is irrational, insulting, or stupid, like Kryptos does?
Why does Russia have any right to make demands of a sovereign democratic nation under the threat of destruction.
You’re gross. Just the worst kind of apologist for fascism.
You’ve been making excuses for Russian war crimes for years.
The same reason the US was able to make demands during the Cuban Missile Crisis. The same reason the US wouldn't find it acceptable to have Chinese military equipment in Mexico, Canada, or anywhere in Latin America. It'd be grand if so-called liberal democracies operated with benevolence and altruism, but they often don't. It's nice to say countries should be allowed or able to decide their own fate, but that isn't always the reality. Just because it should be so, doesn't make it so. Although it should be noted, the idea of Ukraine being a democracy is suspect.
Russia doesn't want NATO on its border, which is a reasonable demand. Russia was attacked twice by Germany in the two world wars in Ukraine. It's an area of vulnerability for the Russia state. Additionally, NATO was established as a defensive pact, but since the USSR's collapse has been operating in an aggressive, offensive capacity.
Russia would be insane to be ok with NATO positioned at its doorstep. Likewise, the US and NATO are also crazy for playing this game of chicken with Russia. Ukraine will never even become a member of NATO or the EU. The country is far too corrupt, even more corrupt than Russia, and the latter is pretty damn corrupt. Ze himself was included in the Pandora Papers leak for setting up offshore accounts. Ze is using his own people as cannon fodder in an unwinnable war with nothing for Ukraine to gain by having NATO ambitions.
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Kryptos
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: bukkake]
#27690671 - 03/11/22 08:09 AM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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Russia not wanting NATO on its borders is a reasonable demand.
Russia invading a sovereign country because of the possibility that they are joining NATO is no longer reasonable, nor a demand.
I'm surprised choppy and fall haven't brought up the bioweapon hypothesis yet.
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The Ecstatic
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Re: The Official Ukraine War Thread. [Re: Kryptos] 1
#27690674 - 03/11/22 08:11 AM (2 years, 2 months ago) |
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Kamala’s weird instinct to laugh hysterically when faced with a tough question gets her in trouble yet again.
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