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OfflineHamHead
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Registered: 03/17/15
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Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: HamHead]
    #27087135 - 12/13/20 11:04 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

HamHead said:
Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Great.  Then you realize your post is a bit dated, as HamHead mentioned.



No, my post is based on the most updated information from the NIH.  That's only a few months old, and no one has posted any newer information from the NIH about it. 

Do you have newer information from the NIH?




Are there any other credible sources you would accept outside NIH?




Guess all these control measures are causing people to expand outside their normal thread viewing habbits.

I got some more :popcorn: to see if any other sources are accepted.


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The Italian researchers’ findings, published by the INT’s scientific magazine Tumori Journal, show 11.6% of 959 healthy volunteers enrolled in a lung cancer screening trial between September 2019 and March 2020 had developed coronavirus antibodies well before February.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-timing-idUSKBN27V0KF

This online first version has been peer-reviewed, accepted and edited,  but not formatted and finalized with corrections from authors and proofreaders

https://www.icandecide.org/

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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 66,982
Loc: Uncanny Valley
Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: HamHead]
    #27087137 - 12/13/20 11:06 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

HamHead said:
Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Great.  Then you realize your post is a bit dated, as HamHead mentioned.



No, my post is based on the most updated information from the NIH.  That's only a few months old, and no one has posted any newer information from the NIH about it. 

Do you have newer information from the NIH?




Are there any other credible sources you would accept outside NIH?



Sources for what?  The effectiveness of the drug is not going to be debated in this thread.  If you have sources that other credible health organizations have approved it for use, that might be relevant to the issue of whether the NIH is dragging its feet, but I'm not sure where you think you're going with these other "credible sources."


--------------------
Censoring opposing views since 2014.

Ask an Attorney

Fuck the Amish

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OfflineHamHead
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Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: Enlil]
    #27087158 - 12/13/20 11:30 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I just find it odd how information is accepted from one source and not another.

So, I am simply asking, are there any other credible sources that we here can refer to in these discussions?

Example. What if a different county does its own trials and their health institute find a drug to be effective?


--------------------
The Italian researchers’ findings, published by the INT’s scientific magazine Tumori Journal, show 11.6% of 959 healthy volunteers enrolled in a lung cancer screening trial between September 2019 and March 2020 had developed coronavirus antibodies well before February.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-timing-idUSKBN27V0KF

This online first version has been peer-reviewed, accepted and edited,  but not formatted and finalized with corrections from authors and proofreaders

https://www.icandecide.org/

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Offlinekoods
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Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: HamHead]
    #27087175 - 12/13/20 11:53 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

You really find that odd?

You’ve been wrong about nearly everything for eight months. Why should anyone trust your judgement or your sources of information?


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NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”

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OfflineHamHead
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Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: koods]
    #27087179 - 12/13/20 11:57 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
You really find that odd?

You’ve been wrong about nearly everything for eight months. Why should anyone trust your judgement or your sources of information?




Yeah, it's odd. When information is only accepted from a single source. Duh?
:homerdrool:


--------------------
The Italian researchers’ findings, published by the INT’s scientific magazine Tumori Journal, show 11.6% of 959 healthy volunteers enrolled in a lung cancer screening trial between September 2019 and March 2020 had developed coronavirus antibodies well before February.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-timing-idUSKBN27V0KF

This online first version has been peer-reviewed, accepted and edited,  but not formatted and finalized with corrections from authors and proofreaders

https://www.icandecide.org/

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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: HamHead]
    #27087214 - 12/13/20 12:36 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

HamHead said:
I just find it odd how information is accepted from one source and not another.

So, I am simply asking, are there any other credible sources that we here can refer to in these discussions?

Example. What if a different county does its own trials and their health institute find a drug to be effective?



Again, we're not going to be arguing whether or not any particular drug is effective.  You can certainly use another nation's approval of a drug to argue that the U.S. should approve a drug.


--------------------
Censoring opposing views since 2014.

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Fuck the Amish

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Offlinewolf8312
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Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #27089899 - 12/15/20 05:48 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)



Here's another video with a different (British) doctor exploring this subject who says there is enough accumulated evidence around the world now to the point where governments need to be looking at this seriously.

I can say with certainty that this man is not a charlatan or (somehow) trying to cheat people.


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"I'm every nightmare you ever had. I am your worst dreams come true. I am everything you ever were afraid of."

Pennywise the dancing clown


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: wolf8312]
    #27089960 - 12/15/20 07:03 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Here's a newer article explaining why the AP did a bad job of covering this, and it explains why:

Fact Checking the Fact Checkers: The Case of Ivermectin for Publicly-Subsidized Research


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I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Offlinekoods
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Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #27090070 - 12/15/20 08:47 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

CLAIM: The antiparasitic drug ivermectin ‘has a miraculous effectiveness that obliterates’ the transmission of COVID-19 and will prevent people from getting sick—-AP’S ASSESSMENT: False. There’s no evidence ivermectin has been proven a safe or effective treatment against COVID-19.” The claim is about ivermectin as a prophylactic to prevent getting COVID-19 illness, but the assessment’s language states that it is not an effective “treatment against COVID-19.” Since prophylactic prevention is for the well, and treatment is for the sick, confusing these medical uses appears to be sloppy journalism or worse.




These are not accurate definitions. Treatment isn’t only for the sick. Also, this is an extremely petty argument considering these people were actually calling the drug a miracle.


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”

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InvisibleByrain

Registered: 01/07/10
Posts: 9,664
Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: koods]
    #27461125 - 09/08/21 11:28 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:these people were actually calling the drug a miracle.




I realize this is an old thread, but its worth pointing out that ivermectin helping people is well documented. What is not fully well understood yet is how much it specifically helps against covid19 or not.

From 2011:

Ivermectin, ‘Wonder drug’ from Japan: the human use perspective
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043740/

Abstract:
Quote:

Discovered in the late-1970s, the pioneering drug ivermectin, a dihydro derivative of avermectin—originating solely from a single microorganism isolated at the Kitasato Intitute, Tokyo, Japan from Japanese soil—has had an immeasurably beneficial impact in improving the lives and welfare of billions of people throughout the world. Originally introduced as a veterinary drug, it kills a wide range of internal and external parasites in commercial livestock and companion animals. It was quickly discovered to be ideal in combating two of the world’s most devastating and disfiguring diseases which have plagued the world’s poor throughout the tropics for centuries. It is now being used free-of-charge as the sole tool in campaigns to eliminate both diseases globally. It has also been used to successfully overcome several other human diseases and new uses for it are continually being found. This paper looks in depth at the events surrounding ivermectin’s passage from being a huge success in Animal Health into its widespread use in humans, a development which has led many to describe it as a “wonder” drug.




Note that none of the African Programme for Onchocerciasis Control (APOC) countries had major outbreaks while only some of the non-APOC countries did. Maybe there is another explanation for this correlation?

COVID-19: The Ivermectin African Enigma
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33795896/

This still seems true today based on the data recorded here.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

Also on a side note this is interesting, although I am not sure if it will go anywhere?

Indian Bar Association sues WHO scientist over Ivermectin
https://www.thedesertreview.com/opinion/columnists/indian-bar-association-sues-who-scientist-over-ivermectin/article_f90599f8-c7be-11eb-a8dc-0b3cbb3b4dfa.html
https://indianbarassociation.in/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/IBA-PRESS-RELEASE-MAY-26-2021.pdf

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Offlinekoods
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Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: Byrain]
    #27461155 - 09/09/21 12:46 AM (2 years, 6 months ago)

APOC shut down six years ago.

Why haven’t there been as many cases in Africa? Are there really no other explanations aside from ivermectin?

Six months ago we were told that ivermectin was keeping covid at bay in India and Indonesia. But then covid exploded in those countries. India is estimated to have nearly four million deaths based on mortality data.

It’s pretty clear how that modern countries have fared far worse than the most undeveloped countries. Of course the modern countries are better at counting cases and deaths and that probably accounts for a significant amount of the disparity. But, mostly it’s the way the virus weaponizes modern indoor spaces. Recycled ventilation, fairly stagnant airflow, no exchange with outside air. Places without widespread ac and heating have structures that are often open to the outside. People are not congregating in places where the virus can linger in the air. People in poor countries are essentially spending a lot more time in open air, outdoor like situations


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”

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InvisibleByrain

Registered: 01/07/10
Posts: 9,664
Re: COVID-19 hearing/Professor asks for review [Re: koods]
    #27461523 - 09/09/21 09:26 AM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
APOC shut down six years ago.




I'm having a hard time finding current data on how much ivermectin is still used in these countries, onchocerciasis (river blindness) is a parasite transmitted by black flies in the genus Simulium. I presume just because the study has stopped it doesn't mean the flies and parasites are no longer a problem. Perhaps they still take it regularly to prevent the disease with the known results from the APOC study?

Quote:

koods said:Why haven’t there been as many cases in Africa? Are there really no other explanations aside from ivermectin?

Six months ago we were told that ivermectin was keeping covid at bay in India and Indonesia. But then covid exploded in those countries. India is estimated to have nearly four million deaths based on mortality data.




That is what I want to know. There are promising numbers from both South America and parts of India and according to the Indian Bar Association there are places in India that did not use ivermectin and have had much larger outbreaks.

The problem I am seeing is instead of real data showing why it doesn't work we get fear mongering propaganda on the level of DARE. Not to mention the opportunistic politicians willing to use this crisis to advance their own agendas which have significantly exacerbated already existing economic and social decline in some places such as NYC or various Californian cities.

I would also not underestimate the financial incentive for large pharmaceutical companies that are highly invested in selling as much vaccine as possible. How much did you trust these companies before covid19? It would really sell confidence if they were wiling to drop the patents and release their private research, if the goal is to save as many humans as possible that should be not be an issue.

Quote:

koods said:It’s pretty clear how that modern countries have fared far worse than the most undeveloped countries. Of course the modern countries are better at counting cases and deaths and that probably accounts for a significant amount of the disparity. But, mostly it’s the way the virus weaponizes modern indoor spaces. Recycled ventilation, fairly stagnant airflow, no exchange with outside air. Places without widespread ac and heating have structures that are often open to the outside. People are not congregating in places where the virus can linger in the air. People in poor countries are essentially spending a lot more time in open air, outdoor like situations




Perhaps that is part of it, but that doesn't fully explain Nigeria the most populous African country (pop. 212,178,992) which reported 2,884,034 tests and only 2,578 deaths. Are there massive die offs of Nigerians that are not being reported?

Then there is South Africa (pop. 60,194,648) with 16,878,061 total tests and 84,152 deaths. They have had significantly more testing and a smaller population which could explain more reported cases, but are they also just that much better at reporting deaths?

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