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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27429066 - 08/15/21 11:17 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

This shoebox was spawned using the method outlined in the OP, it was spawned on Aug 2nd and is pretty much ready for the sweater box fruiting chamber.

No issues with stalling, going anaerobic etc. The mycelium looks pretty happy to me.





You can clearly see the change in growth pattern once the mycelium reached the top layer.


Edited by Stipe-n Cap (08/15/21 11:46 AM)

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InvisibleMike Hawck
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27429076 - 08/15/21 11:27 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

How much better is using CV for this compared to using straight coir? I plan on doing this for some 6qt shoeboxes in about a week when my spawn finishes colonizing.


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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Mike Hawck]
    #27429078 - 08/15/21 11:30 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

Coir alone can definitely work, it just doesn't have the holding capacity for h20 as it does when mixed with vermiculite.
This is all about maxing out the available water.

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InvisibleYeatster
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27429117 - 08/15/21 12:05 PM (2 years, 7 months ago)

Would it be fair to assume, the "best" ratio of spawn-sub would depend on RH in the grow area? For example, my summer/70% vs winter/20%

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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Yeatster]
    #27429134 - 08/15/21 12:15 PM (2 years, 7 months ago)

There's zero correlation, so no.

The best spawn ratio for your culture depends upon how much water it can efficiently convert to fruits with the minimum necessary grain/food source.

You could use this recipe with an inefficient clone and get shitty results, but that's the same with any recipe or rstio that you choose to mention.

Pick cultures based upon 4 criteria:

1. Efficient transportation of h20 into fruits;

2. Efficient utilization of substrate surface area;

3. Solid stipes;

4. Potency.

These are all genetic traits that can be selected for when choosing clones. Choose clones that readily cluster, have dense solid stipes, contain a significant amount of water, and pin evenly across the entire surface of the substrate.

People have clones that check some of these boxes but not all, it's a shame to see an even canopy of hollow stipes. Pretty to look at but that's about it.

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Offlinemonkey_accident
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27429166 - 08/15/21 12:36 PM (2 years, 7 months ago)

how do you go about calculating how much verm you use?
I've only ever ran straight coir and just do 5x(coir's weight in grams) / 1000 = liters of water needed
would that equation change with the addition of verm?


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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: monkey_accident]
    #27429174 - 08/15/21 12:43 PM (2 years, 7 months ago)

I didn't use an equation.

It's the same amount of vermiculite used in the standard recipe, the only difference is the amount of coir and water in the mix.

A standard recipe:

650gr coir
3 liters (quarts) vermiculite
4 liters (quarts) h20

The recipe in the OP:

800-1100 gr coir
3 liters vermiculite
5 liters h20

This tweak allows for an extra 1000 grams of water. Without vermiculite you would exceed field capacity, the same goes for the extra coir.

A liter weights a thousand grams, it's easy to remember..:lol:

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Offlinemonkey_accident
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27429387 - 08/15/21 03:53 PM (2 years, 7 months ago)

alright! simple enough I guess
you don't have any issues with the fluctuation between 800-1100g coir while ur water stays at 5 liters?


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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: monkey_accident]
    #27429388 - 08/15/21 03:54 PM (2 years, 7 months ago)

Nope. I rarely weigh out my bricks and have always followed the same protocol. No issues.

Might account for my fluctuating harvest though:rofl:

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OfflineOra
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27436687 - 08/20/21 11:46 PM (2 years, 7 months ago)

id like to try this. got some APE jars that will be ready in a few days. 1 jar was super fast so i spawned it today using that shaperdreamer 1:1.5 ratio, kinda regret it now but oh well it can be a control box.

so with 3x the substrate for shoeboxes, what have you gotten for yields compared to a 1:1 or 1:2 or whatever?

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Offlinewahhwahh
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Ora]
    #27436695 - 08/21/21 12:10 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

I bought a trowel and used nearly a whole block of coir for two shoeboxes of this tek tonight. Let's go  :sporedrop:

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Ora]
    #27436885 - 08/21/21 06:45 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Ora said:
so with 3x the substrate for shoeboxes, what have you gotten for yields compared to a 1:1 or 1:2 or whatever?




Like any set-up it will depend upon the efficiency of your culture, nothing is guaranteed, but you should expect larger fruits due to the increased volume of water.

Just remember that you'll need a fruiting chamber for these.

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OfflineOra
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27436929 - 08/21/21 07:29 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

Someone mentioned dubtub earlier in the thread which I can do, but don't have monos. I'll just start with 1 dubtub and see howmit goes I guess

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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Ora]
    #27436932 - 08/21/21 07:31 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

I don't see why it would be a problem, it's a makeshift after all.

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InvisibleNimpo
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27437051 - 08/21/21 09:07 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

Hey P, got my PE nearing completion and got two questions for ya:

1. Do you use a liner when making a full mono with this method? Or does the even compression of the sub + compression of the top layer help prevent them?

2. Assuming you have all materials needed and 4 myco-qts ready to go, do you have any preference to roll with 4 shoeboxes, or would you rather go with a mono?

:cheers:

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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Nimpo]
    #27437055 - 08/21/21 09:09 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

Yes I use liners especially for PE, and if my spawn was clean I'd  choose a 66qt mono over a few shoeboxes every time.

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InvisibleNimpo
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27437088 - 08/21/21 09:42 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

p9hu7 said:
Yes I use liners especially for PE, and if my spawn was clean I'd  choose a 66qt mono over a few shoeboxes every time.




Appreciate the insight :raisemyglass:

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Offlinebagga
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27437145 - 08/21/21 10:23 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

Thanks for the write up. Great idea with the trowel.

I've struggled to get properly even subs, often one end taller than the other. It's like I have a disability, just can't get it even.

Anecdotally I noticed larger fruit with lower spawn ratios, but not a huge difference in total yield. I'm running 1:1 and 1:5 tubs as an experiment right now, if yield is similar why waste the spawn right?

I've been using the compression approach for a while too. I did a side by side of light vs firm, no question that firm results in denser, healthier sub.

Have you tinkered with bottom watering mid flush vs thicker sub?

If you're open to content suggestions, I'd love to see you go deep on the colonizing/fruiting Vs grow conditions debate 😎👍

Appreciate the rigor you put into this, everyone has feelz, very few do the work.

Thanks again!

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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: bagga]
    #27437170 - 08/21/21 10:47 AM (2 years, 7 months ago)

I've only bottom watered small tubs like shoeboxes. This isn't necessary for large substrates that contain sufficient water reserves.

No need to float a shoebox if you ad more hydrated sub  but either will work. I used to float shoeboxes and sweater boxes.

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InvisibleNimpo
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27439475 - 08/23/21 12:02 PM (2 years, 7 months ago)

Made a 56 qt PE mono with this method as well as two Huaulta shoeboxes. First time going this thicc with it. Ill report my findings in the coming weeks, looking forward to seeing the PE perform!

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