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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Ora]
#27440936 - 08/24/21 11:57 AM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
kidcharlemagne said: He was speaking theoretically there
No I wasn't, this thread is the result of testing, it has progressed past the Hypothetical/theoretical.
So with my TOC my efficiency was very low at ~40%, I was working on clones when I shut down and couldn't continue.
When I was running poor quality coir with only 2500gr of water (shitty coarse coir doesn't hold much water) I was harvesting roughly ~2.8 oz dry @ 40% efficiency with TOC;
when using this culture on better coir that could hold 5kgrams h20 I was pulling about 5.7 dry ounces.
PE:
With PE my efficiency is a bit higher at 50%
I didn't run my PE on shitty sub but my harvest from 5000gr of h20 was ~2500gr which produced just over 7 dry ounces first flush.
Further culturing is required on my part to increase efficiency but that has been my experience without changing spawn, and tweaking h20 content.
Unfortunately I'm not currently running any actives but there is room for improvement, it's important to track wet harvest weights to track your clone program.
Edited by Stipe-n Cap (08/24/21 12:05 PM)
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kidcharlemagne
Stranger


Registered: 11/14/13
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Ora]
#27440951 - 08/24/21 12:07 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ora said: these are from his first post
Quote:
p9hu7 said: Mushrooms are ~90-92% water by weight, because of this fact mushrooms benefit from having access to as much water as possible without exceedingthe limits of field capacity, so to increase available h20, you must increase substrate; by increasing the volume of substrate in my tubs and shoeboxes, combined with a thick compressed top layer I've managed to maximize the biological efficiency of my cultures.
Quote:
p9hu7 said:
A good clone should move ~70% (3500gr) of the water into the fruits.(achieved by selecting the right clones)
Does that answer my question? Hint: No. Can it necessarily be inferred given the complexity of a non-linear dynamic system without actual experimentation? Hint: No. Now take your insults born of a pathetic desire to curry favor with a TC for reasons beyond me and suck it.
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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There are further implied variables like environment, spawn health, conditions, etc.
It is assumed (by me) that cultivators will square away all of the above variables before assessing their cultures, this is common sense, one must work from a suitable/stable baseline.
You have to use averages due to fluctuating variables and conditions but when enough data points are collected you can get a pretty good average in terms of performance.
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TheBoJim
Strangest


Registered: 07/23/20
Posts: 449
Last seen: 10 months, 7 days
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: mushboy]
#27440964 - 08/24/21 12:15 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
mushboy said: i agree. larger spawn to sub ratios even 1:1 can give me issues like mutations or just lack luster performance. 1:3 or 1:4 is the way to go imo.
and ALWAYS with a top layer
Top layer is included in the ratio I assume?
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kidcharlemagne
Stranger


Registered: 11/14/13
Posts: 261
Last seen: 1 year, 4 months
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
#27440975 - 08/24/21 12:22 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
p9hu7 said:
Quote:
kidcharlemagne said: He was speaking theoretically there
No I wasn't, this thread is the result of testing, it has progressed past the Hypothetical/theoretical.
So with my TOC my efficiency was very low at ~40%, I was working on clones when I shut down and couldn't continue.
When I was running poor quality coir with only 2500gr of water (shitty coarse coir doesn't hold much water) I was harvesting roughly ~2.8 oz dry @ 40% efficiency with TOC;
when using this culture on better coir that could hold 5kgrams h20 I was pulling about 5.7 dry ounces.
PE:
With PE my efficiency is a bit higher at 50%
I didn't run my PE on shitty sub but my harvest from 5000gr of h20 was ~2500gr which produced just over 7 dry ounces first flush.
Further culturing is required on my part to increase efficiency but that has been my experience without changing spawn, and tweaking h20 content.
Unfortunately I'm not currently running any actives but there is room for improvement, it's important to track wet harvest weights to track your clone program.
I know the OP wasn't hypothetical but his quoted post was, or was at least presented as such. The parts that weren't hypothetical didn't answer my question. It still hasnt been answered but I'm spent at this point. In my last post to you I asked the question as simply as I could. I appreciate all the help you give on this forum. Ill just drop it.
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,268
Loc: where?
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: TheBoJim]
#27440984 - 08/24/21 12:28 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
TheBoJim said:
Quote:
mushboy said: i agree. larger spawn to sub ratios even 1:1 can give me issues like mutations or just lack luster performance. 1:3 or 1:4 is the way to go imo.
and ALWAYS with a top layer
Top layer is included in the ratio I assume?
 i wing it
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TheBoJim
Strangest


Registered: 07/23/20
Posts: 449
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: mushboy]
#27440992 - 08/24/21 12:35 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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So, 3 quarts of spawn I’ll mix with 12 quarts of sub for a 1:4 then add a top layer?
Or, 3 quarts or spawn I’ll mix with 9 quarts of sub and add 3 quarts of top layer for a 1:4?
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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My bad.
There's a lot of info packed into the OP and the subsequent responses, so I'm sure you can extract whatever info you require from that. I've tried my best to understand what you're saying, perhaps your question is just beyond my capability to answer.
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Ora
Stranger


Registered: 07/09/21
Posts: 734
Loc: in your heart
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
#27441098 - 08/24/21 02:08 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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the only thing im sucking is going to be shaped like a penis
and thats ape...yeah ape...
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monkey_accident
fail now learn later


Registered: 05/10/19
Posts: 678
Loc: im here, bro
Last seen: 4 months, 22 days
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: TheBoJim] 1
#27442133 - 08/25/21 08:55 AM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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bojim, I do 12q sub - 4q spawn - then add another 3q or so for the top layer that's about 1:4, if i were running a PE variety id probably jack up the top layer to 6q instead of 3q
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Lostkeys
Fractal Thought Pattern



Registered: 06/06/09
Posts: 1,355
Loc: Sirius
Last seen: 2 months, 3 days
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap] 2
#27442571 - 08/25/21 02:06 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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I tried your method on a recent PE shoe box. The results are the picture in my sig. This shit rocks!
-------------------- So heavy I fell through the earth...

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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Lostkeys] 1
#27442574 - 08/25/21 02:07 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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Fuck yeah, nice flush
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TheBoJim
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
#27442655 - 08/25/21 03:09 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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Ok great, I have a few varieties that I am starting to do with a 1:4 to 1:5. Hopefully I’ll update here with good results. Only problem is I am running out of coir and verm fast!
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: TheBoJim]
#27442662 - 08/25/21 03:12 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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I stockpile whenever I hit the store, fortunately each pack of coir comes with 4 lobes so I can easily eyeball exactly how much I need...and then I buy the huge bags of verm.
Looking forward to your results.
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monkey_accident
fail now learn later


Registered: 05/10/19
Posts: 678
Loc: im here, bro
Last seen: 4 months, 22 days
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Stipe-n Cap] 2
#27442709 - 08/25/21 03:43 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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there's cheap verm on amazon, 4cuft for like $30 might do a tek for prepping a 5kg coir brick since I couldn't find one maybe include some tub prep to spread the gospel of thick subs
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Lostkeys
Fractal Thought Pattern



Registered: 06/06/09
Posts: 1,355
Loc: Sirius
Last seen: 2 months, 3 days
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Quote:
monkey_accident said: there's cheap verm on amazon, 4cuft for like $30 might do a tek for prepping a 5kg coir brick since I couldn't find one maybe include some tub prep to spread the gospel of thick subs 
You talking about the 120qt bag? It's huge.
-------------------- So heavy I fell through the earth...

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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Lostkeys]
#27443025 - 08/25/21 08:33 PM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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I'm not sure if my bags of verm are 3 or 4 cubic feet, but it's big.
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monkey_accident
fail now learn later


Registered: 05/10/19
Posts: 678
Loc: im here, bro
Last seen: 4 months, 22 days
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Re: Top Layer/Pseudo-casing by p9 [Re: Lostkeys]
#27443676 - 08/26/21 10:46 AM (2 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Lostkeys said:
Quote:
monkey_accident said: there's cheap verm on amazon, 4cuft for like $30 might do a tek for prepping a 5kg coir brick since I couldn't find one maybe include some tub prep to spread the gospel of thick subs 
You talking about the 120qt bag? It's huge.
yep, 120qt, the bag is massive
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SingularFusion


Registered: 10/31/18
Posts: 1,208
Last seen: 4 hours, 22 minutes
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I have already realized myself some time ago that almost every variety I have run does better with the top layer at spawning, and I was adding some compression to the top by hand, but the idea of compressing both layers separately never occurred to me
based on your observations I will surely try going thicker with the top layer and adding some more even compression with a trowel, will post some pics when I have the opportunity...
appreciate your work p9 thanks again
-------------------- 🅃 🄴 🄰 🄼 🄲 🄻 🄸 🄽 🄶 🅆 🅁 🄰 🄿
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