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OfflineQuirkmeister92
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Microdosing for obesity * 1
    #27398722 - 07/23/21 04:29 AM (1 month, 28 days ago)

https://www.pharmacytimes.com/view/expert-psilocybin-treatment-may-support-patients-with-obesity-who-have-tried-everything-need-further-support


Expert: Psilocybin Treatment May Support Patients With Obesity Who Have Tried Everything, Need Further Support
July 19, 2021


Clive Ward Able, MD, BPharm, president of Clintell, consultant to NeonMind Inc, and a trained pharmacist and physician, discusses his research into the use of psychedelic compounds to treat obesity.



Pharmacy Times interviewed Clive Ward Able, MD, BPharm, president of Clintell, consultant to NeonMind Inc, and a trained pharmacist and physician, on his research into the use of psychedelic compounds to treat obesity and optimize human health.

Ward Able noted that the use of psychedelic medicine to treat obesity has 2 potential mechanisms of approach. The first is by giving a psychedelic compound as part of psychotherapy, such as psilocybin, at a psychedelic dose—this approach is called drug-enhanced psychotherapy. At this dose, it works as an agonist against serotonergic receptors, and, specifically, the 5-HT2A receptors.

“What that does is it gives you the psychedelic event, which seems to be able to help along with psychotherapy,” Ward Able said. “Secondly, it also has effects on the 5-HT2C receptors, which are very much related to satiety or hunger and the control of hunger. So there, we can look at a different formulation where we use a much lower dose, probably 10% to 15% of what would normally be used for a psychedelic dose, but you do that on a daily or 4 times a week dosing.”

This lower dose may potentially lead to an increase in satiety, causing a patient to be less hungry, according to Ward Able. Additionally, it has the potential to give the patient a sense of well-being.

However, to date, there's been no clinical research done on the effects of psychedelic medicine on obesity, but there have been promising in-vitro pre-clinical studies on rats. In these pre-clinical trials, the rats were fed a highly palatable, high calorie diet in which they could eat as much as they liked. They were then treated with 2 different doses of psilocybin—a high dose that would be equivalent to a human psychedelic dose—and a lower dose that would target the 5-HT2C receptors.

“What was found with those is that both the high dose and the low dose led to less weight gain in both of those arms that were treated with the psilocybin,” Ward Able said. “The decrease in the weight gain gives us a very good, strong signal that this actually is working the way we expect it to work. Now we've got to translate this into clinical studies, and that's what we're going to be doing next in our proof of concept study.”

Ward Able explained that before he began working on research in the psychedelic medicine field, he had thought it was a very contained, small group of researchers working in the field.

“But actually, there's a lot of work that's been going on, and we have to tip a hat to a lot of researchers who worked under a really strict regulatory environment, and still managed to continue some of this research, despite it being completely closed down in the 60s and 70s,” Ward Able said. “One of the things that NeonMind Inc. looked at was obesity, because it's a pandemic now, not just an epidemic within the North American region, but a pandemic worldwide.”

The health implications of the global pandemic of obesity are significant, not only for the patient, but for every health care system and the country as a whole, Clive Ward Able explained.

However, he noted that not every patient who is obese is dissatisfied with their weight or finds that it poses a problem in their life. In light of this, a potential psychedelic medicine treatment for obesity would provide an option for patients who are interested in losing weight and keeping it off, something that they have not been effectively able to do in the past.

“The idea is that this has to come from the patient. If the patient wants help for it, this will be able to help them get to a place where they really want to be,” Ward Able said. “But I'm not talking about every single obese patient, because there are a lot of obese patients who are happy the way they are, and they don't necessarily want to lose weight. But there's a large component of those, such as in depressed patients, who have certain triggers that get them to overeat or not to exercise, etc.”

Ward Able noted that the target of obesity treatment is not necessarily to bring every patient under a body mass index of 25. Instead, this treatment can hopefully allow patients to get to a healthier weight and maintain it, with an added sense of wellbeing that they may desire after losing weight.

“This is where I think psychedelics can add to what is being done now,” Ward Able said. “Psychotherapies are being used for the treatment of obesity or weight management, but people tend to fall back into their old behaviors again, although they do work. What I'm calling drug enhanced psychotherapy or psilocybin-assisted psychotherapy adds another facet to that psychotherapy, which should be able to instill much longer lasting positive behaviors, such as an improved diet, whether that's quantity or quality, or within expenditure of energy, such as increasing your amount of exercise.”


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OfflineQuirkmeister92
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: Quirkmeister92]
    #27398726 - 07/23/21 04:36 AM (1 month, 28 days ago)

I used to prefer LSD for self-guided therapy, but I also took to weekly macrodosing. Microdosing psilo seems very practical/logical for appetite control, but as they noted the psychedelic experience is pretty crucial and so a full trip is at least necessary for every patient to occasionally endure for lasting mental/physiological effect. Get them dendrites connected and find a new look on life.:cool:


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Invisiblepablokabute
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: Quirkmeister92]
    #27398754 - 07/23/21 06:20 AM (1 month, 28 days ago)

Mushroom psychedelia can and is currently used for self-inquiry/self-reflection.. so yeaah.


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Fermented Mushrooms!!
--- https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23378638/fpart/1/vc/1

'The second seal: “All CONTAMINATED things and events are unsatisfactory.”'



"I envy you. You North Americans are very lucky. You are fighting the most important fight of all - you live in THE HEART OF THE BEAST."

--Anonymous Guerilla, or is he..


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OfflineQuirkmeister92
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: pablokabute]
    #27399051 - 07/23/21 01:25 PM (1 month, 28 days ago)

The drugs make bugs not hungry so they don't eat the whole mush. Funny that it's not entirely dissimilar in humans.


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InvisibleBarnaby
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: Quirkmeister92]
    #27399256 - 07/23/21 03:58 PM (1 month, 28 days ago)

Lol.  Who needs a good diet and choice of foods and exercise routine.  JUST MICRODOSE!

Microdosing is for for pussies with no will power!  Take meth and coke.  And try to choke down a nutrient bar.  God those were the days in my youth.  I don't really miss them.  Just some women and friends from that time frame.

Life gets stranger as one gets older.  And the running joke that always makes me laugh when one stops caring about birthday.  Guy mad at a pub in a bad mood.  And repeatedly saying after some bad choices in his life as an excuse as no one recognizes his birthday. Made me laugh from that movie.  "and yeah, it is my birthday".


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Offlinedurian_2008
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: Barnaby]
    #27399627 - 07/23/21 09:43 PM (1 month, 27 days ago)

Do skinny people feel hungry all the time or just fat people?


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InvisibleAll41
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: durian_2008]
    #27399743 - 07/23/21 11:44 PM (1 month, 27 days ago)

I'm skinny. Not always hungry


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InvisibleBarnaby
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: All41]
    #27399987 - 07/24/21 09:00 AM (1 month, 27 days ago)

Those last two posts on this thread.  Those are minds at work, deep thinking.  Lol.

Skinny people always feel hungry and fat/obese people don't.  Shroomery logic. 

Nothing to do with exercise, dietary habits, and such.  God this is inane.


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OfflineQuirkmeister92
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: Barnaby]
    #27400068 - 07/24/21 10:43 AM (1 month, 27 days ago)

Hollistics yo, get your balance on, the middle path...:rasta:

Oh yeah, eat more fiber, less trash.:wink:


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Edited by Quirkmeister92 (07/24/21 10:44 AM)


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Offlinedurian_2008
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: Quirkmeister92]
    #27400893 - 07/24/21 10:33 PM (1 month, 26 days ago)

Depending on the high, it might be a mild distraction or a total reset.

I've had a couple jobs, cooking, and never got tired of eating.

If I just let myself go, I would be one of those people who has to get cut out of my house.


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Offlinedurian_2008
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: durian_2008]
    #27400921 - 07/24/21 10:59 PM (1 month, 26 days ago)

Some people say, eat until you are 85% full.

Others say conquer hunger, and anorexia is mildly euphoric.

Still others say that your normal amount, under stressful conditions, results in obesity.

So, I thought the question was relevant, in respect to a mood enhancer, some of which are used for weightloss.


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OfflineQuirkmeister92
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: durian_2008] * 1
    #27401020 - 07/25/21 12:56 AM (1 month, 26 days ago)

People eat poorly and so are often times hungry because of their diet, which is a downward spiral as the trash you eat makes you want to eat more. Fructose will fuck you up if you're not careful, but artificial sweeteners can also fuck you up should yoh consume actual carbs at the same time. Increasing physical activity is important but half the battle is diet. What and how much you consume. Further there's an aspect of oral sensation involved with hunger. If you eat smaller bites that involve more physical chewing you'll be more satiated that soft textureless processed food.

Some people probably have a serious condition wherein they're ravenous, but most people are just kind of unhealthy overall and it's self-perpetuating. Garbage in, garbage out. You are what you eat. Consider the source.

I've been losing weight and it feels great. Didn't have to cut out meat either, just consume in moderation and stick to quality ingredients. Nothin but dabs and mostly just drink water.


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InvisibleBarnaby
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: Quirkmeister92]
    #27401442 - 07/25/21 12:12 PM (1 month, 26 days ago)

You get it and I agree completely.  Notice how obese and overweight shift to a mind frame when asked about it that they are helpless against it or even worse, it is just genetics.  No, no it is really not.

Parents condition their kids and diet.  Ever notice fat mothers most of the time have fat kids?  Is simple to change but the sadness and weakness of those even losing feet or reaching 400 pounds.  To each their own but just look at their daily habits.  Is not complicated.

Watching the Covid and varient Olympics.  I think they have a different mindset and discipline and training and don't make many excuses or are lazy.


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Offlinemobydickofdopeness
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: Barnaby]
    #27401462 - 07/25/21 12:38 PM (1 month, 26 days ago)

Obesity is probably a byproduct of underying issues, like depression, previous trauma, etc.

So once psilocybin is able to treat the root cause of the obesity and fix the persons head, they are more likely to pursue and stick with healthy eating strategies.

We've heard of psilocybin being used to treat addictions (smoking, opiates, etc) and food is just another addiction.


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InvisibleBarnaby
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: mobydickofdopeness]
    #27401471 - 07/25/21 12:50 PM (1 month, 26 days ago)

True.  And with other esoterics as well.  With Mushrooms found it amazing how it can be used to breakdown plastics and so many other things that are toxic of the earth.  YOU HIPPY!  No, I just like the elements in life that support life like clean air, water, and food.  How underneath the ground especially how it connects and heals and spreads life basically and above it as well mentally and physically for living past the median age of 75.

Great vid and this next decade will decide so much in my esoteric experiences for life and humanity.  Is strange when one is conditioned since birth that mankind is the end all be all and superior to every living thing.  We really are not and all is connected.  On with it.  Glad I am not dead from a heroin overdose and coke abuse, speedballs of course over a decade ago.  People want to just group all plants and manufactured chemically plant/chemical drugs into one scheduled thing.

Is uninformed and inane bullshit.  One can get a Masters Degree in Mycology.  That guy that did and made the vid and his enthusiasm for it was amazing.  Never knew that one could Major in that.  Hope for the world yet.


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InvisiblePsychoReactive
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: Barnaby]
    #27401537 - 07/25/21 01:42 PM (1 month, 26 days ago)

I can just see it now in Detroit...
"Imma have a liter diet cola with a brontosaurus burger extra cheese and mayo, with a size of bucket o chips... and 1 microgram gram of cubensis."


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InvisibleBarnaby
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: PsychoReactive]
    #27401559 - 07/25/21 02:02 PM (1 month, 26 days ago)

Lol.  Reminds me of this.  I think the South really should be a different country.  NASCAR MAN says, wars were fought so people didn't have to speak in a English accent, yeah.  Down go the statues of idiots. 

Seagal.


Honey Boo Boo.



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OfflineCreonAntigone
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: Barnaby]
    #27401854 - 07/25/21 06:01 PM (1 month, 25 days ago)

I think there are a lot of myths surrounding dieting. One that still has a lot of adherents today is the idea that weight is just 'calories in, calories out'.

This has been proven wrong many times and in many different ways. For a start different foods have very different effects on the body. Eating a diet that has too much saturated fat can cause heart complications, for example, and has independently been associated with obesity. The worst for Americans is excess sugar. Too much sugar throws off the body's ability to regulate the energy it expends. The evidence shows there's a special connection between processed sugar products and obesity even beyond the calories associated with it.

The most promising evidence shows that obesity is a direct result of a dysregulated microbiome, and it can be cured without even changing the diet. Studies have shown that some people from the newest generations can't actually eat as much as their parents and stay thin. In a sense the kids were paying the consequences for the parents' actions because the kids recieved epigenes that made them less able to stay thin. Then we find even under controlled conditions they simply can't diet and stay thin. Their digestive systems have suffered damage that has stretched multiple generations.

I guess the message of this post is, ditch that diet and get some fermented food!


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InvisibleBarnaby
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: CreonAntigone]
    #27401875 - 07/25/21 06:26 PM (1 month, 25 days ago)

Drinking Kombucha with vodka.  Pounds will drop off.  Seriously am.  But in reality a Caesar salad and some fish with apple cider vin instead of distilled garbage.  Feeling great

Going out TO THE PLACE I LIVE DOWN BY THE RIVER.  No, just a hike and a lower degree and sit by a river and have a beer or two.

Life can be good even during Covid and everything else.  On with life.  Can enjoy life regardless of Covid and endless V's.  Fuck it.  Will get a booster as well when that comes up.  I have put every drug known to man for the most part in my lifetime at middle age.  Not really afraid of being double vaxxed and a "booster".  We had a different word for it when I was younger and not to do with VAX shots.

My time will come when it comes.  Feel OK with life and optimistic.  Sayeth the guy the guy that dies a week later.  Like is amusing.  Never get to overconfident or it will bite you in the ass.  Is my great wisdom to share.
"


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OfflineQuirkmeister92
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Re: Microdosing for obesity [Re: Barnaby]
    #27402308 - 07/26/21 03:50 AM (1 month, 25 days ago)

You can't sustainability change your microbiome without changing your diet...


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