Home | Community | Message Board

Edabea
Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract, Kratom Powder For Sale   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds, Bulk Cannabis Seeds, Feminized Cannabis Seeds, High THC Strains, USA West Coast Strains   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale, Red Vein Kratom

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1
Offlinetunhing
Stranger
Male
Registered: 05/04/20
Posts: 8
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 1 month, 27 days
Permanent Physiological Damage?
    #27391981 - 07/18/21 12:59 AM (4 months, 9 days ago)

So, where to begin...

I, like many people, was inculcated with the notion that all drugs were harmful, dangerous, destructive, invariably addictive to the point of self destruction, and only utilized by degenerates and escapists too cowardly to face reality. As a child, that's an easy doctrine to swallow, made easier by observing the effects of drug use on my peers while in highschool (albeit from a place of predetermined "objectivity").

Fast forward to age 21, and my lack of capacity to manage the content of my life over the previous decade left me a seriously depressed, temperamental, angry, unnihilistic, trauma case. I'd earned enough money to explore all of my interests, which upon possessing the means to realize, were suddenly, quite meaningless and and what joy they offered was fleeting. I could tolerate the company of maybe 3 people, and strong alcohol.

One day the YouTube algorithm graced me with, of all things, Jordan Peterson's GQ interview. I did my due diligence on the man in question, being far too cynical to have faith in any individual at that time, and began making a morning routine of watching his in class lectures. Frankly, the impact shook me to the core. Here was a man saying essentially, that not only was there a structure that meaning followed, but that it could actively be pursued, and that the only thing of which I was victim, was my own condition, and that it was on my shoulders to alter it. One line will always resonate with me from those lectures: "well I can't help being nihilistic, all of my belief systems have collapsed" "yeah, maybe, or maybe you've only allowed them to collapse because it's easier than acting them out".

Fast forward 4 months, and I'm somehow, back in much the same place I've always been. I could understand the information logically, work with it intellectually, but I couldn't seem to integrate it. I genuinely started contemplating suicide, not as an impulsive act, you understand, but as a sensible conclusion. I reasoned that if my present state was going to be the norm for the next 60 years, I'd rather just cut to the chase. There was no value, or sense in prolonging my life, such that it was.

First though, I thought I might consider one last thing. I'd heard Peterson talk about the results of Roland Griffith's research into psychedelics, and the consequences of their use on individuals overall state of being, so I thought, what the hell. Now understand something, to me taking mushrooms was more insane than suicide, at least conceptually. Having said that, if mushrooms resulted in utter insanity, I could still have an exit, doing it the other way around left an avenue untrodden. So, I called an old highschool friend who supplements his income with such things.

I took a two gram tea, and I cannot express in words what it did to me. I can describe the visuals, sure, but the sensations, the way it turned my perception inside out...the way I felt relieved, ok....for the first time in so long. Until then it was such a far gone memory, so vague, like the memory of a dream in years passed. I knew that I'd experienced it once, but I could not conceive of it beyond a faint sensation. It was like I'd been fighting a deathmatch that I was chronically losing, but could never die, and out of nowhere I was tapped on the shoulder and told "hey, it's over, you can stop now. You're done".

I had defined myself for so long in terms of my misery, that in its absence I really didn't know what to do with myself, even what to think about. So I continued with my "experimentation". First I educated myself a little bit regarding tolerance, and the general stuff. I tripped roughly every two weeks for 9 months. My tolerance seemed permanently elevated, I seldom took less than 8 grams, and generally took 10, and I'll tell you, that 14 grams did not have the same effect on me as that original 2, in either visuals, or intensity.

I took 1PLSD 3-4 times, 500UG my second time on it. Not a bad trip, but it lasted a solid 20 hours, and I felt horrible the next two days. 1PLSD I found introspective, but it was empty, and never euphoric, and visuals were fairly mundane for me with less than 300ug. I stuck predominantly to the mushroom, with which I developed some synergy with. I could direct my trips somewhat, not control per-say, but I had a hand on the steering wheel. I filled the days between trips with philosophical writing, regarding the conclusions my experiences has led me to. I listened to hundred of hours of lectures, between Peterson, Alan Watts, Krishnamurti, and Ram Dass.

Knowing the background, here I lead into my area of primary concern at the present. I've had bad trips, especially when I started out. However, my second last time taking 1PLSD (400UG) I experienced a full blown anxiety attack that lasted for several hours. It left me, jarred for weeks, I didn't touch the mushroom for a month. I chalked it up to having tripped too early to my morning coffee, and not having had enough to eat before tripping. Two months later, so this past December, it happened again, but this time on 8g of mushrooms. I felt a tingling rising through my whole body, and my body was panicked before I was psychologically. I spent 3 hours in the tub. The trip only lasted 4 hours, thank fuck for lemon tekking.

I've had/have PTSD, at my worst, this was like that, but amplified. Like being under attack. Racing heart, etc. Again, I thought it was a lack of food and excess caffeine. Keeping with my schedule, two weeks later, and having eaten plenty, I took 6g, in just plain water, thinking it would mellow out the experience. The first of these bad mushroom trips, began after an hour or so. This one descended into hell immediately. It lasted 6 hours, only this time, I didn't feel normal again after a few days. I was still anxious. I couldn't drink coffee, or even work out without experiencing a milder version of what happened that night. Some days, oddly, I was ok, even if I drank 5 cups of coffee, other days, one sip was too much.

I was a few weeks before I could handle one cup a day. I was experiencing heart palpitations, irregular beats and was generally anxious. Strangely, fluorescent lighting seemed to trigger anxiety. My blood pressure was in the low range of normal, and my heart rate was in the mid 80's, up from the high 50's-low 60's prior to this.

After ore than a month of this, I began looking into blood sugar and found that a bowl of oatmeal had me feeling normal again all day, if eaten for breakfast. Those last two trips I had flavored my tea with a Kool-Aid flavored sucralose sweetener, which as it turns out can cause an insulin response, coupled with the typical blood sugar drop during the come up. I suspect I had a hypoglycemic episode both times, and that was the cause of the abnormality. Day to day, I'm more or less ok now. On a recommendation I started taking a B supplement in the mornings, which keeps me feeling alright, though I'm uneasy by 5:00 if I miss it. I discontinued the oatmeal. I should add, I have been working out 3-5x a week for two years, and run a caloric deficit more days than not.

I'm concerned that I've done serious and permanent damage to my body, and I miss tripping, and would like to again, but I'm genuinely concerned I won't survive another trip like those last two. My tolerance for alcohol is also not was it was before. I used to be a perfectly coherent drunk, now I find it very hard to articulate after about 4 drinks, and wine gives me headaches. And I've never had a hangover, since this happened I cap myself at 6 drinks, and drink that much very rarely any more. Previously I'd had 18  one night and felt totally normal the next day.

I'm primarily looking for insights into what has happened to me, and any recommendations going forward. Aside from the obvious one, abstinence. I have no intention of consuming the mushroom again until I have a better understanding of what's happened to my body.

*** I should also add that a 12 hour fasting blood test 3 months ago revealed no abnormalities in my blood sugar.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OnlineCreonAntigone
Stranger
Registered: 05/31/21
Posts: 741
Last seen: 1 minute, 20 seconds
Re: Permanent Physiological Damage? [Re: tunhing]
    #27392012 - 07/18/21 01:44 AM (4 months, 9 days ago)

How do you think about your life now as compared to how it was before you discovered mushrooms? Because here you ask about damage but you also describe significant healing. It sounds like some aspects of your life has improved but this new anxiety is derailing things. So what do you think of the mushrooms overall as a medicine? How would you rate its pluses and minuses?

My interpretation of your experience: You had been trying to fight your tolerance with increasingly high doses, chasing that first experience. You need to know that eventually all your trips won't always be so pleasurable or intense, but some of the more laid-back ones can be more productive. You need to listen to your body, those anxiety attacks aren't just 'lack of food' but physical reactions to the drug. After you had that anxiety, you should've reduced the dose substantially. That 6g trip should've been much less. And you shouldn't have had it on a two week 'schedule'. From the sound of it you weren't truly ready when you took that 'scheduled' trip so scheduling it was part of the problem. The main problem though is that you don't have a healthy relationship to your tolerance since you just kept trying for more and more.

What you describe is similar to my experience, which is that trips build on each other. If I have anxiety there's a likelihood the same anxiety returns. You have to go in with the attitude that you're ready to deal with everything that comes with a trip. You can't brush it off and hope for the best. So if there's a bad reaction, you needed to take it more seriously and process it and not sweep it under the rug. I don't think you've done permanent damage. For a start you were in a bad place when you started mushrooms and in some ways your post describes some things getting better.

Instead of as 'damage', this is more like just a scar. Your use of high doses too quickly eventually caused residual side-effects for days after the trip. You didn't allow your body to truly recover and the residual effects just kept building and getting stronger. Then when you finally did trip (when you weren't ready) your trip occurred in that context of all this residual side-effects. So of course you got anxiety on it. And it sounds like it wasn't even particularly magic for you. It seems like you were in a state where you'd taken doses so high your tolerance had still not returned and yet the anxiety hadn't gone away yet either. So taking it at that time was like just getting the anxiety and not the positive. It was the wrong time, wrong dose. I wouldn't worry about permanent effects if I were you since you now understand what the problem was. So now the healing begins - these effects are quite likely to go away with time. You know what was causing them, excess mushroom use, so now you know that your body will adjust and recorrect itself.

If you decide to trip again, your next trip should be the lowest possible dose you think will be active. The intention should be to reconcile yourself mentally and physically with the mushrooms. Rediscover their medical potential. IMO, for you I think you can do that with a low dose. A low dose after a tolerance break (quite a bit of abstinence) is sort of like coming back to that first experience where you were more filled with wonder. And it will teach you a new respect about the dangers of trying to keep stacking on more and more. It will teach you that these are medicines to be respected that can be dangerous if they aren't respected. And it will help get you out of this destructive cycle where you take beyond your proper measure.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineNZ.huntress
Stranger
Female User Gallery
Registered: 07/03/21
Posts: 88
Loc: Wellington NZ Flag
Last seen: 21 days, 6 hours
Re: Permanent Physiological Damage? [Re: tunhing]
    #27392090 - 07/18/21 04:35 AM (4 months, 8 days ago)

Have you had your iron levels checked? Get a full blood count and iron studies. Sometimes small things can make big impacts on the body.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinetunhing
Stranger
Male
Registered: 05/04/20
Posts: 8
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 1 month, 27 days
Re: Permanent Physiological Damage? [Re: NZ.huntress]
    #27392257 - 07/18/21 10:18 AM (4 months, 8 days ago)

I haven't had my iron levels checked, though I do eat red meat daily as something of a necessity with my exercise frequency. I ate chicken for a while, but got sick of it.


I also didn't really build incrementally from 2-10 over a long stretch. I went 2-5-7-10, and then just hung out around that dosage. I pushed the envelope a couple of times, but I was at the point where I had full control lover letting my dissolve-or not, regardless the dosage.

These "bad trips" I'm describing, were unlike any I'd had previously. There was little sense of despair of meaninglessness, or inadequacy, just abject panic and terror. They were not particularly visual. To give you some context of the severity, while I was in the shower I couldn't stand, the physical load of standing exacerbated the issue. Nor could I lay down, the water droplets splashing my face made it worse too.

Three months after the last of these experiences I tried taking a single tab of 1plsd on a day I felt pretty good, but it was the strangest trip I've ever had. It was a rollercoaster ride between angst and euphoria, without visuals except for 1/2hour right at the peak.

I noticed no appreciable difference in tolerance between 2 week pauses and 4 week pauses with the equivalent dosage.

The research says two weeks is enough for a full reset, you're statements imply that it is not. I'm aware of the difference between a physical and psychological tolerance, but I can't really account for one empirically.

I abandoned the prospect of every reliving that first trip early on, assuming it was just the result of being a first timer. I didn't really have a specific goal, I happy to follow where it lead me. It was always interesting, fascinating, and enthralling.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OnlineCreonAntigone
Stranger
Registered: 05/31/21
Posts: 741
Last seen: 1 minute, 20 seconds
Re: Permanent Physiological Damage? [Re: tunhing]
    #27392320 - 07/18/21 11:41 AM (4 months, 8 days ago)

Quote:

tunhing said:
The research says two weeks is enough for a full reset, you're statements imply that it is not. I'm aware of the difference between a physical and psychological tolerance, but I can't really account for one empirically.





Tolerance seems extremely variable. People sometimes report getting crazy trips multiple days in a row. I think the research just isn't there yet so you really should rely on your own experience first and foremost.

I think if the trip is as difficult as the ones you talk about 2 weeks is not enough. What is understudied about psychedelics are the lasting psychedelic effects, good or bad. You have noticed that your heart rate has changed, right? I have used a pulseOXometer to monitor my heart-rate after tripping and found that my heart-rate was different for days afterwards. So instead of going by some research that has X time 'should' be good, listen to your body. Use mushrooms again when you can evaluate the signals your body sends and see that you're ready.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleCHUCK.HNTR
feral urbanite
Male


Registered: 09/30/19
Posts: 1,301
Loc: SF, CA, USA
Re: Permanent Physiological Damage? [Re: tunhing]
    #27392344 - 07/18/21 12:16 PM (4 months, 8 days ago)

Psychedelics can’t be used liked other medications where scheduled routine doses are taken like prescribed drugs. Nor do they work like other medications where they ‘fix’ the problem.

I know you said you were writing after and between the trips and that’s great but it seems that more integration is necessary between the trips. And don’t restrict it to philosophical notions, simple and basic thoughts and feelings are worthy of exploitation. 

You were suicidal and now you are concerned about physical damage. It seems also that you are becoming much more ‘mindful’ aware of the sensations of living. Before you were numb to it which is why alcohol and coffee etc did not effect you as much. However it’s not only the substances it’s other pressures and awarenesses that contribute to the anxiety.

It’s not often spoked about but there is a lot of suffering involved in ‘waking up’ becoming more mind and body aware. The highs are intense and euphoric but the lows are felt in just as real of way.

I have intense anxiety that I learned to keep in check with hard work but that doesn’t help in a trip. I learned that these feelings are chemical responses and can only be maintained for 15-20 mins before they are processed. My method is to practice deep breathing when this occurs and it has really helped me deal with anxiety, terror and panic in the trip and now in daily life.

You might try simple breathing meditations as part of your integration process. Also not sure how you go about your workout regimen (sounds intense) but make time to be outside even just at a public park or small back yard etc.

Anyway to each their own, but I think looking into ways to integrate your trips will be beneficial.


--------------------
"What is the practical application of a million universes?" -Alan Watts
:mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2:


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSub-Easy
slowly dying since birth
Male User Gallery


Registered: 04/23/21
Posts: 559
Loc: USA NC Flag
Last seen: 3 hours, 13 minutes
Re: Permanent Physiological Damage? [Re: tunhing]
    #27392372 - 07/18/21 12:39 PM (4 months, 8 days ago)

First, I think you take things to the extreme when it comes to your sense of identity, and that might be why you enjoyed so much relief in the shrooms at first, they free you from seeing everything from your point of view. but now once again you are going to extrems in making the shrooms part of your self identity. Now, I'm not that smart and I can only hint at the feeling I get from your post. I realize you are just giving information to give us a better idea of who you are and where you are coming from, but I also believe that people answer there own questions when they ask them. The things that you do and beliefs that you hold take a lot of commitment. Working out, dealing with PTSD, depression, drinking, delving into spiritual and philosophical study, writing, it takes a lot of dedication and the ability to take a strong judgement and stick to it. All these things mean that you have to have a strong sense of self, a large investment in being that person, but also you trouble trying to find meaning in it all. That might be why you do it, to make outward thing give your inward self The feeling of being a person with a strong identity, when you really can't identify with any of it. PTSD has this caricaturistic. You hinted at that diagnosis but didn't elaborate because I think that you know that might be a big part of it. Also you make shrooms such a big part of your Person, that they hold up part if your identity. But you can't lean on any of this stuff for your well being but so much. You have made it clear that you are a smart and caring person. You have a strong sence of responsibility, and judge right and wrong strongly. You drink, but dismiss it as a strong factor in what might be causing problems, but understand that in your own words, drug addiction is looked at in a bad light by you yourself. You have a real suffering, and you also are getting older and I'm sure your life style, with all the strong effort you put to using your brain at max gear, stress on your body from exercise and alcohol, stress from tripping, work, life long struggle with your mind and mood. Even low blood sugar, which is not so bad on your body, it can really have an effect on your mood and routine. Your smart, your able to take care of yourself and find solutions that work for you. Mushrooms have a big impact on a person's sense of self, and you go extreme when it comes to investing in the things that make you you. Be they good or bad, but I'm sure you are in danger of stress related experiences, I'm sure the shrooms give you a great deal of relief, and maybe because of that you are putting too much blame on them. Building to much expectations around them helping you, and they just are not a strong fortress anymore. Like the guy said, maybe it's easier to be a niallest than to hold up your beliefs and you and the shrooms are saying it's time to knock down that tower of refuge, because holding it up is taking to much of an investment in your life. The fear of them not doing it for you anymore, or the stress of loosing that safety net, or just the realization that they can't fix everything, could be causing you to have a bad experience while on them. your very life is a big thing to put into their healing hands. You might just have said it as an interesting story to tell, but if you started using this medicine as a last resort over the alternative, then that might be how deeply reliant you are on needing some answer to your problem, and that may very well be where your anxiety around this medicine is coming from. I don't know, like I said I'm not that smart, but even if this is a fairytale story, with no touch on reality, it is a good representation of how complicated even small experiences are when it comes to psychology. You might find people commenting about having similar experience with your problem, but if there is a well stated answer then I haven't heard it yet.


Edited by Sub-Easy (07/18/21 01:22 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSub-Easy
slowly dying since birth
Male User Gallery


Registered: 04/23/21
Posts: 559
Loc: USA NC Flag
Last seen: 3 hours, 13 minutes
Re: Permanent Physiological Damage? [Re: Sub-Easy]
    #27392380 - 07/18/21 01:00 PM (4 months, 8 days ago)

Like you, I should also add, that mushrooms cured my low blood sugar. It could be because they pushed me towards a better diet or cured my social anxiety so I don't get grumpy from it anymore, as mild as it was, but I've found relief at least as long as I do them every month or month and a half. I haven't had a long enough run with them to comment on how they work in the long run yet.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineBlue Cthulhu
Fresh Spore

Registered: 05/27/19
Posts: 38
Loc: Pluto
Last seen: 29 days, 16 hours
Re: Permanent Physiological Damage? [Re: CHUCK.HNTR]
    #27392471 - 07/18/21 02:45 PM (4 months, 8 days ago)

Quote:

CHUCK.HNTR said:
Psychedelics can’t be used liked other medications where scheduled routine doses are taken like prescribed drugs. Nor do they work like other medications where they ‘fix’ the problem.

I know you said you were writing after and between the trips and that’s great but it seems that more integration is necessary between the trips. And don’t restrict it to philosophical notions, simple and basic thoughts and feelings are worthy of exploitation. 

You were suicidal and now you are concerned about physical damage. It seems also that you are becoming much more ‘mindful’ aware of the sensations of living. Before you were numb to it which is why alcohol and coffee etc did not effect you as much. However it’s not only the substances it’s other pressures and awarenesses that contribute to the anxiety.

It’s not often spoked about but there is a lot of suffering involved in ‘waking up’ becoming more mind and body aware. The highs are intense and euphoric but the lows are felt in just as real of way.

I have intense anxiety that I learned to keep in check with hard work but that doesn’t help in a trip. I learned that these feelings are chemical responses and can only be maintained for 15-20 mins before they are processed. My method is to practice deep breathing when this occurs and it has really helped me deal with anxiety, terror and panic in the trip and now in daily life.

You might try simple breathing meditations as part of your integration process. Also not sure how you go about your workout regimen (sounds intense) but make time to be outside even just at a public park or small back yard etc.

Anyway to each their own, but I think looking into ways to integrate your trips will be beneficial.




Great post, I second this. Try slowing down, way down, and see your process of unfolding as a gradual one. No need to rush. Anxiety sucks. Learn how to ground back into your body.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSocrateshroomS
сталкер


Registered: 09/05/18
Posts: 1,643
Loc: Westworld
Last seen: 2 days, 3 hours
Re: Permanent Physiological Damage? [Re: Blue Cthulhu]
    #27393306 - 07/19/21 09:25 AM (4 months, 7 days ago)

It's incredible how much I can relate to your story. (I too was pulled from the depths by both mushrooms and Peterson).

The only difference is I went to Burning Man seeking mushrooms to give me one last experience before I ended my misery (which the mushrooms immediately changed my mind on suicide).

The difference is I was older when I sought the mushrooms, and somewhat "experienced" with mind-altering substances (I had smoked weed for close to 7 years prior to my first mushroom dose). With that being said, I had experienced much of what you experienced before I even tried mushrooms.

I called it, and still do, an existential crisis. And I still struggle with it.

As a human, you are prone to the human condition. Within that condition is all of the things that gurus, artists, writers, etc struggle with and portray in their work. These things include, but are not limited to, questions such as

What are my origins?
What is the meaning of my life (or life in general)?
How do I come to terms with my mortality?
What, if anything, is on the other side of this life?
Is there indeed a transcendental realm that exists in parallel to this one?
Why is there so much suffering in the world?

And the list goes on and on.

Along with these questions, we also have an unending list of very personal questions to ourselves. Put all of these together and you get a recipe for one big existential crisis.

So why am I mentioning all of this? Because marijuana, being my first "mind-altering" substance, had manifested in me such an existential crisis. I had a whole host of physical disturbances and emotional/psychological issues as I navigated through my own rapidly expanding awareness.

I had multiple panic attacks from marijuana, all with incredibly uncomfortable, and seemingly dangerous, physical manifestations. And, when these episodes were intense, I would feel "off" and have various physical after-effects (like palpitations) in sober days afterward.

As I grew older, I realized that 1) I was overdoing it with weed and 2) What do you expect when you rapidly expand your mind? I was having deep philosophical musings and existential realizations while the majority of my peers still only cared about video games and getting laid.

And with mushrooms, you push the envelope of awakening even quicker than something like weed. So what does the mind and body do when it is put under "existential" pressure before its matured properly? It manifests physical and psychological ailments.

Here's what I mean by that. As an 18-25 year old (my heaviest marijuana smoking years), I had a whole host of issues and areas in which I hadn't matured enough (obviously). But I pushed the envelope so much with weed that my mind focused too hard on the existential expansion of my metaphysical exploration rather than maturing properly as a young adult.

Thus, when it came down to it, I was a psychological mess because I did not mature in the ways I was supposed to during those young adult years. And those psychological issues manifested in intense physical symptoms as I could not control the ever rising anxiety.

But, the marijuana use, and later alcohol use, was also (unbeknownst to me at the time consciously) a way of running away from facing those required steps of maturity.

And perhaps that is what is akin to what is happening in your case. You are quickly outrunning your normal human maturity by imbibing in these powerful substances too often without enough integration.

And the subsequent anxiety is manifesting in negative physical symptoms (many people underestimate the magnitude of physical illness that can be caused by depression/anxiety/psychological troubles).

One question I have is, What were the sorts of insights/realizations you were having during all of these trips? And, what issues are still troubling you that you've yet to conquer?

This might give insight into whether your psychedelic trips have been about healing or escaping (and sometimes we don't realize when we've crossed that line).

Hope something from this wall of text helps. If you'd like to speak privately on the issue, feel free to :pm: me.


--------------------


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinetunhing
Stranger
Male
Registered: 05/04/20
Posts: 8
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 1 month, 27 days
Re: Permanent Physiological Damage? [Re: Socrateshroom]
    #27393612 - 07/19/21 01:24 PM (4 months, 7 days ago)

First I think I should clarify a couple things I think alluded to in a way that has led to some erroneous, albeit, reasonable conclusions. My 2 week "schedule" was a loose 2 weeks, sometimes 13 days, sometimes 16 or 18. There were just days where it was inconvenient, other days I just intuited that it wasn't in my best interests to. Listening to that little voice in the back of my head spared me many bad experiences, I think. I wasn't chained to a 14 day clock, just, I was trying to maximize my frequency while minimizing my tolerance and the probability of negative experiences.

My alcohol use is fairly conservative, I'm habitually a 1-2 drink a night type. The only time I have more is when I have company over, and really that's just one highschool friend that drops by once or twice a month. We used to split a bottle of champagne and play COD until the early hours of the morning, but since wine gives me headaches now, we've substituted it for martinis or scotch or absinthe. Still usually only 3-6 drinks each though, typically 3-5.


Regarding the insights I had on my trips, well, I did my best to constrain my focus long enough to jot notes in bullet point to elaborate on later. I spent a lot of time going through conceptual scenarios, usually ones that were past experiences, though not always things I was directly involved in, but just observed. Sometimes just hypothetical. I was recognizing patterns, and correlations, motivations and the like, mainly deconstructing the process of though and identification, and their implicit and explicit derivations. I went through structures of family dynamics, fear, security, greed, anger, revenge, as well as more specific interpersonal scenarios that had be presented to me through my own life. Without the veil of my own identity being projected over and through my own interpretive mechanisms of perception, so much was and is still, at least somewhat, so clear. I could grasp any situation presented, at depth, with tremendous speed. Much faster than I could write about it, my understanding exceeded my capacity to represent was I was perceiving. So sometimes single sensations would turn into 5 pages written back to back, because of the complexity of what there was to unpack.

I found myself in states of mind where I was unable to make meaningful distinctions between myself and others. Where I could speak freely like I was reading from Faust, or a Dr. Seuss story, in perfectly rhythmic rhyme. On my second trip my memory flashed through my mind, and I was presented with a host of scenarios from my past that I had completely misapprehended by a part of myself...like a decision of my personality that was never dormant, never slept, and maintained an objective record of the content of my of life, sans any halfcocked notions stablished by my ego. Like one was a biographical record on tape, and the other was the "official" front page, text book history.

I logged roughly 28 full dosage trips in the 9 month stretch I was taking psychedelics. There's really a lot to recount. I hadn't established frequency of use limits early on, but the quality of the experience was much better after a 2 week hiatus, the research supported that, and it was easier on mushrooms. Not to mention, I went from having bad trips with a frequency of 1-2 to about 1-8/10.


I tried 4-aco, with both shrooms and shrooms and 1P. I never found it as clear headed  as shrooms, and just plain goofy. I also found it left me feeling tired and mentally slow after taking it, whereas shrooms were always refreshing and clear, even if I hadn't enjoyed the trip itself.


I have considered that maybe what I've exposed myself to and learned has altered my personality beyond my body's chemical and neurological maturity to integrate properly. But then, what recourse do you have once you've seen through the validity of your own game?

LSD is the only thing ever out me in what I might regard as an existential crisis. Occasionally Golden Teachers left me in a state of love, like being in love, but without object, or externalized point of origin. I was just there, for days after too.

This anxiety I describe during the trips, it came on physically first, then mentally, which is why I'm inclined to think it doesn't have a psychological catalyst. I do wonder about what kind of damage I incurred being under that kind of intense stress alone for that many hours.


Edited by tunhing (07/19/21 01:25 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSocrateshroomS
сталкер


Registered: 09/05/18
Posts: 1,643
Loc: Westworld
Last seen: 2 days, 3 hours
Re: Permanent Physiological Damage? [Re: tunhing]
    #27394784 - 07/20/21 10:06 AM (4 months, 6 days ago)

Quote:

tunhing said:
I have considered that maybe what I've exposed myself to and learned has altered my personality beyond my body's chemical and neurological maturity to integrate properly. But then, what recourse do you have once you've seen through the validity of your own game?




You are young. You are well articulated and clearly have a high degree of self-awareness (which is often what leads one on these metaphysical searches of meaning). And sometimes, being so intelligent, you are lead to believe that you've seen through, as you put it "your own game". And, based on what I'm reading, it seems your self-awareness has grown tremendously, but you are just as much, if not more blind, than when you began (and I say that as someone who is older and still blind but somewhat more tempered in experience due to age). You have not altered "altered your personality beyond your body's chemical and neurological maturity to integrate properly.". You might be maturing much faster intellectually than your peers, but you are so young that you've just begun your exploration. Between the ages of 18 and 25ish I went through all manners of mental, psychological and physical change. Some good and some bad. Some seemingly so bad that, at the time, I thought my "goose was cooked" as they say.

Only when I had my first full psychedelic experience at 25 (i don't count marijuana as a full psychedelic experience, which I consumed frequently before my mushroom experience) did I come to realize how lost a young person can be. And that was the point. Before 25, you have room to play. And at that age, you begin to really discover worries that you'll only make peace with as you get older.

And personally, I was glad not to have a psychedelic experience before then. In the last few years, being open about my psychedelic use, I've met a lot of young people (ages 20-23) that were dabbling in psychedelics. They all were unbelievably well-articulated and intelligent for their age (like you). Yet those psychedelic experiences had made them more neurotic due to this increase in awareness. And I was absolutely the same at that age.

You have just begun to discover the limitlessness of your mind and the limits of your body. And that might be alarming. When I was 20, I put quite a bit of wear/tear on my body from hockey. A few years later, I began to feel the effects and that lead me on a rabbit hole of hypochondria. I used to be able to drink coffee in my younger years no problem. Now 1 cup makes me feel like I'm going to crawl out of my skin and my heart will explode.

But all of my medical tests (and in my worries I did a lot of them) are fine. But as I got older, I began to realize that my body will inevitably change physiologically. I won't always be able to do the things I've done. And its not because I took mushrooms or smoked a lot of weed. Its just that my body has limitations and it will, inevitably, decline with age.

To get to the point of all this story-telling, I think what you are experiencing is this inevitable realization, but you don't realize it yet. Somewhere deep in your psyche, after spending so much of your self in the transcendental world, your subconscious had a realization: This vessel has limitations that will start to be rapidly imposed on me.

And that does not jive with your youth and your experience of ascending the limitations of your mind. But this is all happening somewhere where you might not be reaching, because we often avoid the mundane truths when we have access to these grand mental experiences.


Quote:

tunhing said:
This anxiety I describe during the trips, it came on physically first, then mentally, which is why I'm inclined to think it doesn't have a psychological catalyst. I do wonder about what kind of damage I incurred being under that kind of intense stress alone for that many hours.




You underestimate the physical manifestations of psychological distress. I've put myself under unbelievable physical stress (full contact hockey with no protective gear for YEARS). And to this day I play with that same group (although we rarely play physically at this point). And I have paid the price for it. But even though I put myself in such danger for sheer enjoyment (and I've had some serious injuries throughout the years) the physical pain and issues from playing (barring the one time I was impaled), does not come close to the physical issues I've struggled with due to my anxiety/depression. Those are the issues that plague you for years if your psychological health is unattended. And they're the ones that seem and feel most dire (and made worse by the fact that your medical tests come back negative for any real issues leading to deeper anxiety/depression).

I'm not sure what will solve your issues. Time will help (something I always hated hearing when I was young but realized the truth as I got older). Get whatever medical tests will put your mind at ease. And if nothing is wrong, try to be young and have some fun. Go do stupid things. Put the metaphysical exploration to the side and drench yourself in the physical world.


--------------------


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Jump to top Pages: 1

Shop: Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract, Kratom Powder For Sale   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds, Bulk Cannabis Seeds, Feminized Cannabis Seeds, High THC Strains, USA West Coast Strains   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale, Red Vein Kratom


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Long-term physiological consequences GreenOsiris 1,361 10 01/13/05 12:45 PM
by skullfarmer1979
* Cannabis vs alcohol, Brain damage Stephen 2,678 17 05/01/10 09:35 PM
by Janamil
* Would you want your kids tripping?
( 1 2 all )
GrizzyCappy 3,122 27 06/30/07 11:43 AM
by Pmeth
* FAQ 24. What is, and how can I avoid/reduce come up anxiety? RoseM 4,096 15 04/01/05 03:39 AM
by Rose
* permanent pupil dilation
( 1 2 3 all )
Sophistic Radiance 8,888 46 06/11/12 11:11 PM
by danlennon3
* Salvia gone bad? Permanent damage?
( 1 2 all )
GrizzyCappy 12,004 26 07/12/07 09:51 AM
by Pennenga
* Is there really alot of concrete evidence that Salvia is physiologically safe? freddurgan 3,009 16 06/16/05 11:11 AM
by redgreenvines
* Anxiety attack after consuming a quarter, bad trip! xeallos 1,215 1 03/12/07 03:14 PM
by MorphMan

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: psilocybinjunkie, Asante, Rose, mushboy, karode13, LogicaL Chaos, Northerner, bodhisatta
677 topic views. 1 members, 72 guests and 27 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Print Topic | ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2021 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.048 seconds spending 0.013 seconds on 16 queries.