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Invisiblemapleleafmarijuana
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: LizardWizard]
    #27374165 - 07/04/21 04:29 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Interesting liz. Maybe i had a light leak in my greenhouse? The weather last year was also one of our wettest and coldest in a while, so combine a leak with additional stressors and that may explain it.

It seams to be a nearly 8 out of 10 ratio.
No herms on the females tho so far.


I am reading that same book at work right now. Trying to decide if his newer 2013 book is worth getting or pirating.


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Vinegar Tom
stay black cocksucker, thats the most important thing - joey coco diaz
Flesh is Weak. All Hail the Machine God!


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InvisibleLizardWizard
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: mapleleafmarijuana]
    #27374169 - 07/04/21 04:36 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

I wouldn't honestly. I've yet to get at the one I got from Jorge but I think it's gotta be much better.

Or maybe I think too highly of ole George, IDK, haven't actually read any of his written materials...

Did you notice the mistakes Clarke made on the way plants grow right prior to bloom? At least, it doesn't stroke with my knowledge. Something in the preflower section in the beginning of the book was off too. So now I'm wondering if I'm the only one who took notice...


--------------------
The best things in life
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Invisiblemapleleafmarijuana
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: LizardWizard]
    #27374174 - 07/04/21 04:39 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Yea. He published it in 1981 originally,  so it does seeve as an interesting building block and time capsule.

Plus i enjoy his illustrations. The hashish book has some great sections.

I think Cervantes is great. I just heard a story that breeder steve gave george a bong with salvia in it as a dirty trick one time in Switzerland.  Funny anecdote on a youtube show called hash church


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Vinegar Tom
stay black cocksucker, thats the most important thing - joey coco diaz
Flesh is Weak. All Hail the Machine God!


Edited by mapleleafmarijuana (07/04/21 04:41 PM)


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InvisibleLizardWizard
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: mapleleafmarijuana]
    #27374179 - 07/04/21 04:44 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

I'm only at page 21 but his illustrations so far have been incredibly detailed and very good, I'd think he has enjoyed some education on drawing botanical illustrations. A thing I myself intend to do in the coming years, also geared at cannabis illustrations so in that regard it is still a highly valuable book to me, and it also so far seems to be a pretty nifty little handbook filled with techniques and important tips to bringing those techniques to fruition, so it's not money wasted in my book either :p


Yeah, I had myself a too scary salvia experience to still think of that joke as funny. Took an ayahuasca ceremony to bring me back to reality so I'm good for life on the Salvia.


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The best things in life
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Invisiblehummingbird

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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: A.k.a]
    #27374209 - 07/04/21 05:18 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

A.k.a said:
Little runt redeeming itself







That second pic is sooo good, nice work!




I personally think environmental conditions when young can affect the outcome somewhat with a m to f ratio. You see that in nature other places. Temperature will greatly affect the amount of males or females hatched in a lot of reptiles...probably other animals too. The nutrition, stress level, hormones, etc in the mother(and father?) plant while the seeds or pollen are being made all seem like they could influence the outcome some too...maybe even how seeds are stored can too, idk.




If you guys haven't checked out any of the Future Cannabis Project stuff on youtube, it's worth doing if you have some time. There are so many different topics and guests, from breeders to soil scientists...some really good info collected. I'm sure some bullshit too as with most things, but...


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InvisibleRan-D
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: hummingbird] * 1
    #27374287 - 07/04/21 06:55 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

I love the concept of Future Cannabis Project, but the conversations always feel dragged out and directionless. There's dozens of 3 hour videos on that page and sifting through them all to find actual information can be tedious.

Lots of great guests for sure, but maybe too many.


Edited by Ran-D (07/04/21 06:57 PM)


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InvisibleLizardWizard
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: Ran-D]
    #27374498 - 07/04/21 10:21 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Hb, i think the process is different enough in plants to be able to say it doesn't work the same way with animals. I think I know a bit or two about it, but then again science knows little about plant sex determination. So here's why I think it has to be determined from the get-go:

Plant Tissue Culture.

When any living plant cell is harvested and placed in the right nutrient solution, it will start to grow again. From any and every cell, in theory, can be produced an entire new plant, this concept is called omnipotency. To maximize the growth potential and vigor of plant cell cultures, it is highly recommended to choose cells from young specimens when possible. So we can rest assured that plenty cells have been taken from very young specimens to start new plants from. Specimens that might not have differentiated sexually yet, to the eye at least. Before an entire new plant is grown, however, this tissue sample goes through a bunch of regeneration steps, and it starts these by turning into "undifferentiated cell growth", which is exactly what it is. A heaping bunch of plant cells.Undifferentiated. Seems to not know exactly how to grow. It becomes a lump of cells not resembling a plant part, but resembling plant matter nonetheless. After this undiferentiated growth it turns back to vegetative growth and eventually, when taken out of it's petri dish, it will grow out to bloom with the same female flowers than her cell donating mother did. I have never ever heard of a female plant, no matter how young samples were taken, turning into a male plant afterwards. Every time, to my knowledge, the cell that started life in an "undifferentiated plant", turned out the same sex than his or her donating plant did, no matter if the donating plant was sexually differentiated or not.

Environmental conditions can hardly be more different than in that one instance which has been reproduced millions of times by now scientifically; the only 2 ways I could see this wouldn't be true, is if it did happen but it wasn't widely known, which, with the current cannabis knowledge, I would find unlikely, OR, if cells were never or not often taken from plants undifferentiated in reproductive plant parts, which, given young age of the donor plant specimen is often a requirement for successful plant cell propagation, also seems highly unlikely.

:twocents:

To highlight my point I invite you to read this page on tissue culture propagation in the cannabis industry. It's not a long read and it's in laymen terms so you can rest assured it'll explain things way better than I can. It doesn't talk about plant sex but it mentions "... explants used to produce callus include cotyledons, hypocotyls, epicotyls, ..." which all have to be taken when still in their growing stage, so that tells you sex would certainly not have been expressed yet to the human's naked eye.


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The best things in life
can be smelled on one's fingers.


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Invisiblehummingbird

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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: LizardWizard]
    #27374644 - 07/05/21 03:32 AM (2 years, 6 months ago)

I can't completely disagree with that Ran-D. There's so many, and some are 3-5 hours long. I've fallen asleep to a couple of those longer ones on days off. Some of the conversations can drag on too. There's really good info on some of their episodes though, and they do a relatively good job being specific with episode titles as far as contents inside.


@Liz I'm always open to being wrong, anyone can be. Plants are pretty different than animals, we also still have things to learn about them.  I don't know a ton about it, but tissue culture is fascinating to me. I was thinking whatever post germination influence would happen really young. The article you linked does mention using tissue as young as you could possibly get, so...


I did find an article about inducing sex change in cycads that has an interesting theory on sex determination. It's not about cannabis and is somewhat complicated (and possibly outdated?), but might be relevant if true...

"Dioecious seed plants generally have putative sex chromosomes that are indistinguishable under a light microscope. Close inspection, however sometimes reveals slight heterochromatin differences, which is itself due to differential methylation. Therefore, it is distinctly possible that methylation controls sex determination. Methylation and accompanying heterochromatin can be removed by various factors - such as temperature, osmotic stress, or hormones - resulting in sex change. Sex change occurs only in organisms that have (virtually) indistinguishable sex chromosomes, indicating that incipient sex chromosomes are formed by slight differences in methylation. Differential methylation is evolutionarily the first difference between females and males and is the likely cause of reported sex changes in cycads."

https://rootgorelick.files.wordpress.com/2015/06/gorelick-osborne-2002-s-afr-j-sci-983-4-983-4.pdf



It's weird when people get wildly varying ratios on the same batches of seeds sometimes...or how I've heard from a couple places besides here about fem seeds popping males. Maybe it is just a genetic lottery kind of thing, or maybe not, idk...


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InvisibleLizardWizard
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: hummingbird]
    #27374708 - 07/05/21 06:18 AM (2 years, 6 months ago)

in humans heat stress and a lot of other adverse factors will kill off the male spermatozoa first, so in order to try to have a girl, people will leave their sperm out in a cup for a couple hours before inseminating, or wear thighty whities and only fuck on hot days for instance.

Those are techniques that work, and I have heard of similar strategies being employed on young seedlings but yielding more males iirc...

The genetic info contained in the seed however does seem to contain a preferential sex expression that the plant will apply itself to if left in normal conditions. The reproductivity of cell culture is also dependant on those conditions.

but just like you say, diversion from the naturalexpression is possible through stressors.


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The best things in life
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InvisibleMr Piggy
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: A.k.a]
    #27374870 - 07/05/21 10:30 AM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

A.k.a said:
Little runt redeeming itself







If you ever get the chance to run a sea of green with autos in half gallons, it's a blast!


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InvisiblemushboyMDiscord
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: Mr Piggy]
    #27374875 - 07/05/21 10:34 AM (2 years, 6 months ago)

that plant is so adorable i want one :Awemazing:


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InvisibleHFM
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: LizardWizard]
    #27374900 - 07/05/21 10:54 AM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

LizardWizard said:
Hb, i think the process is different enough in plants to be able to say it doesn't work the same way with animals. I think I know a bit or two about it, but then again science knows little about plant sex determination. So here's why I think it has to be determined from the get-go:

Plant Tissue Culture.

When any living plant cell is harvested and placed in the right nutrient solution, it will start to grow again. From any and every cell, in theory, can be produced an entire new plant, this concept is called omnipotency.



They're totipotent,cheers


--------------------
Trees lay chipped across the paths,
we hunt their souls to eat the wrath-HFM


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InvisibleLizardWizard
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: HFM]
    #27374909 - 07/05/21 11:04 AM (2 years, 6 months ago)

You're totally right, my mistake :rofl:


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The best things in life
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InvisibleHobbit GDF
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: LizardWizard]
    #27374987 - 07/05/21 11:59 AM (2 years, 6 months ago)

plant tissue culture is crazy man. i have watched youtube videos and read a bunch of info on it. i thought about ordering hormones and making some agar slants. just to try and do it ya know. that way if i can land a gig doing something like that. kinda like mushrooms but with weed. making agar and transfers and stuff.
that stuff amazes my dumb ass.


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OfflineA.k.aM
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: Hobbit GDF] * 1
    #27375162 - 07/05/21 02:29 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

I’m considering chopping a couple branches now and then waiting a week to take more or all of the rest. Do you guys think it’s too soon?




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Invisiblehummingbird

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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: Hobbit GDF]
    #27375165 - 07/05/21 02:33 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Totally. Anyone who already knows how to do agar work and practice decent sterile technique has a pretty big advantage starting out I would think.


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InvisibleMr Piggy
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: A.k.a]
    #27375175 - 07/05/21 02:43 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

A.k.a said:
I’m considering chopping a couple branches now and then waiting a week to take more or all of the rest. Do you guys think it’s too soon?








Without the ability to look at tricomes with a magnifying glass or jewelers loupe, I cannot say for shure.  To my eyes they appear to need more time.

Get yourself a jewelers loupe so you can track the progress of your tricomes.


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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: Mr Piggy] * 1
    #27375349 - 07/05/21 05:02 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Ok cool I definitely don’t want to cut too early. I do want to do a somewhat staggered harvest to see how big a difference it makes after hearing so much about it.


I’ve got a usb microscope I’ll hook it up and see if I can get clear trichome pictures.


The brown pistils should curl up a lot more when it’s ripe right?


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LAGM2020


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OfflineIcon
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: A.k.a] * 1
    #27375422 - 07/05/21 05:57 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

A.k.a said:
I do want to do a somewhat staggered harvest to see how big a difference it makes



This is great to see. Too many people are set on doing one thing like flushing vs no flushing or harvesting early vs late. I really think a good grower is willing to sacrifice some branches or plants to learn directly from experience. There's multiple right answers so experimenting and finding what works best for you is key.


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InvisibleHobbit GDF
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Re: The Official Cannabis Growers Thread. [Re: A.k.a]
    #27375427 - 07/05/21 05:59 PM (2 years, 6 months ago)

yeah, they all will be brown or orange or red. but there wont be many white ones unless its like foxtailing in the end. that sort of thing. on my mimosa evo i could visibly see the trichomes be amber on the tops. they was cloudy and then almost all the main tops were amber. i waited for a while. it flowered pretty fast.

jeweler's loop is easy way to tell. its really hard to just look at it and judge. you could probally get some good usb pics and zoom in on them to see a little.

they look good and frosty. they look green still like maybe a little longer?


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