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Offlinegreenery1
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Why can't I take larger doses?
    #27311050 - 05/16/21 01:07 PM (27 days, 8 hours ago)

I seem to be having problems with higher doses and wanted to ask for some feedback if anyone else may have similar issues.

Perhaps it is age related, (I'm 49), or what I suspect to be the issue with simply having over done it in the past, and my brain simply can't handle it anymore. I don't know or understand how to explain this better at the moment, so I will try to explain what seems to be going on.

I took 100mg (.1g) microdose of PE from bluegoba (Canada) last Friday, and was surprised at what a profound effect it had on me. I had gone out to the seaside, beautiful day, had been under a lot of stress lately, really wasn't enjoying myself, felt bored and was getting ready to leave. I actually had forgotten that I took the microdose, or perhaps thought it wasn't having any effect.

I went for a walk, then sat down and began to chill out, calmed down, and wondered if this was from the microdose. There was a sense of quiet and peace, and I realized that this was certainly from the PE. I ended up spending another 3 hours just being very quiet and contemplative, and this carried on until the night after I returned home.

I would say that after I left the seaside, and went to buy a few things then home, it was actually feeling a bit too strong, that was surprising to me at such a low dose.

Last year I had taken 300µg of LSD at the same location, and it was very unpleasant. My head felt like it was a pressure cooker, my eyes were red, and there was very little euphoria, it just felt like I had taken way to much.

With the microdose of PE, I can't imagine taking more to make it a more intense trip, that 100mg was on the verge of feeling unpleasant after I arrived home. The thought of taking a gram or more seems like it would be an extreme overkill.

I find that I have the same low tolerance for weed now, I have to find the lowest THC brand possible, with high CBD ratio, and I just take a pinch, and that is enough. If I take something with high THC, or larger amounts, it just makes my head feel like a balloon under pressure, and it is unpleasant.

I used to be able to take more, and so I am wondering what has happened to my tolerance, does anyone else have these issues, and have you come up with an explanation for it?


Edited by greenery1 (05/16/21 04:04 PM)


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OfflineElevationChemicals
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: greenery1]
    #27311116 - 05/16/21 02:04 PM (27 days, 7 hours ago)

How are things in your life right now? I think I usually struggle with trips when I am at a place in life where I have alot going on, or where I am not at peace within my self.

Also as we get older we have alot more responsibility and with that comes anxieties and worries, so it may be harder to shut those out.


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Offlinegreenery1
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: ElevationChemicals]
    #27311869 - 05/17/21 12:03 AM (26 days, 21 hours ago)

Very good point, that would be an interesting area to explore in itself, although I would be surprised if that were the issue at the moment. Although I would say that was definitely a factor a few years back.

The tolerance issue has been an ongoing problem for sometime now, and doesn't feel to be stress related. It feels more like my mind simply can't handle a larger dose now, I will try to think of another way to describe it...


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OfflineI AM SWIM
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: greenery1]
    #27312177 - 05/17/21 08:16 AM (26 days, 13 hours ago)

Age probably has something to do with it. And fear. Fear of the objectionable realities such as blood pressure rising. I have more issues with high doses of mushrooms compared to LSD.  With LSD I can do higher doses at my age now, however 10 years from now I’m not too sure if I could. I’m almost 35, but I had my fair share with needles and abusing my body, so I think I have a rational fear.

Ego death is something I love. Hopefully I can still enjoy those experiences.

:rocket:


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Offlinegreenery1
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: I AM SWIM]
    #27313098 - 05/18/21 01:14 AM (25 days, 20 hours ago)

Yes, I am wondering now how age affects tolerance to psychedelics...I dont feel older, so perhaps I dont have a strong sense of my age, other than a lot more aches and pains...


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Offlinegreenery1
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: greenery1]
    #27314497 - 05/19/21 04:57 AM (24 days, 16 hours ago)

I took .1g microdose of GT today, something triggered a bad frame of mind in the afternoon though which ruined my day. Went out to the seaside but couldn't relax, I had taken 250mg niacin after lunch which gave it a more consistent body high, but there was no pleasure from it. Took a pinch of indica but I didn't even feel high.

I was wondering about mixing the microdose in a smoothie, or adding it to orange juice to turn it to psilocin, perhaps ingesting it differently will help.


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OfflineSocrateshroomS
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: greenery1]
    #27314703 - 05/19/21 09:05 AM (24 days, 12 hours ago)

Interesting phenomenon. I surmise there are many reasons for such a "reaction" although I believe it's more psychological than physical (chemical).

My thoughts are

1) As mentioned above it's fear related. You may think "But I'm not afraid to take psychedelics in larger doses, I just "can't"". But by reinforcing the idea that you can't, your subconscious builds a fear of taking a higher dose. I've had this experience where I started to fear "higher" doses and, as I would dose over the course of a few months, each subsequent trip would get smaller and smaller. It's a weird psychological loop of reinforcing fear. I've had the same experience with cannabis as well.

It's also important to note that this fear does not generally start with psychedelics/weed. It's usually caused by events in one's life which cause psychological distress in some fashion. That distress then extends to other aspects of one's life. And sometimes (in my case, for example) this distress is so subtle and goes unattended for so long that, one doesn't even notice as the fear creeps in and has consequences on everything else in one's life.

The cure? A person needs to sit down and really flesh out the things which are causing this distress and then face them. Then, if one desires, they can slowly increase the doses on their trips (or take a big dive if they're feeling comfortable).

But I'm always reminded when I take larger doses that there was nothing to fear.

I have more to add which I will but I need to jump out to work, lost track of the time


--------------------
“What comes true here is that which reflects your true nature. The most secret desire. It is within you. It governs you. Yet you are ignorant of it.”

- Andrei Tarkovsy, Stalker



redgreenvines said:
seek wonder, not pleasure and you will love psychedelics again, if you did in your youth. Sometimes it means be a student again. sometimes quite literally.


My First Trip


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OfflineDharmaForKarma
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: Socrateshroom]
    #27314728 - 05/19/21 09:44 AM (24 days, 11 hours ago)

I have a slightly different take.  Less is more, sometimes.  Perhaps your brain is getting better at utilizing psilocybin.

What are your goals for the microdose?  Restating for context, strictly speaking a microdose is defined as subperceptual. Calibration is recommended, even required.  Experiment to find the dose for which the desired effect is achieved.  General advice (Fadiman, others) is 1/20 to 1/10 a journey dose of 2g is a good starting place.  I had to drop to 1/40, 0.05g!  Nearly everyone would believe that's too small a dose to be meaningful, yet the effects are profound for me.  Exactly what one hopes to achieve with microdosing.

I wonder if it's possible that the experience initiated by mushrooms is something we get better at over time.  Think of it as a muscle, or a habit/pathway. The inverse of physiological tolerance: we get there faster and better with practice. If so the effect would lead to a more powerful experience with lower doses.  I've had profound experiences on what I thought was a "fun" dose of 0.5-0.75g using batches I and others were familiar with. The potency was known but the experiences were surprising. 

Separately, and to confound easy interpretations, I've had experiences where the same variety and batch that put me on my heels at 0.2g or 0.75g or 2g, was quite controlled at 4g with a 3.5g boost. How do you like those apples.

All this has me looking towards less is more, with intention, set, and setting being equally important to dose and potency in contributing to
the subjective experience.

Has anyone else had similar experiences or encounters that were unexpected based on expectations and dose?


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Offlinegreenery1
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: DharmaForKarma]
    #27315733 - 05/20/21 02:14 AM (23 days, 19 hours ago)

Well, yes, I have had some unexpected results in the last month or so that I have been micro dosing. Both positive and negative. The positive has made me try to repeat it, with the expectation that I would have the same result, which has been disappointing.

I have really just had two very positive sessions, both at .1g with PE. The first was about a month ago after a long break. I took it, then hiked up to a high look out point overlooking an inlet, beautiful location, near dusk, I had never been there before, nobody around, very remote.

I only really remember the walk back. There was emptiness, peace, fulfillment, as though there was nothing more to want, desire, or achieve in life than this.

I stood in the darkening forest for a long while, listening. The phrase 'stillness speaks' described the experience very well. Just standing there, listening to nature, empty, completely at peace within myself, or more accurately, in the absence of self.

That was surprising, in retrospect, at that dose level. I also wondered how being at higher altitudes might have affected the results?

I tried again a few days later, but it didn't work. I don't remember the circumstances now, and have tried a few times since then with PE and GT at different doses, and in different contexts, but no results, nothing like that.

But last week it happened again, as I described in my first post of this thread, .1g PE by the seaside. It was unexpected, I had been feeling stressed, was about to leave, and I sat down and felt myself gradually become more relaxed, and calm, a sense of inner peace, I sat for another 3 hours.

So, regarding goals, or intention in micro-dosing, I am still experimenting to see how it affects me, to see what happens. An ongoing interest is what happens when self drops away, that is of interest. That is often associated with larger doses, and so this was interesting that it can also occur at the micro level.


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OfflineDharmaForKarma
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: greenery1]
    #27316057 - 05/20/21 11:00 AM (23 days, 10 hours ago)

Super interesting. Thanks for sharing.

Purely from my own point of view and personal experience, 0.1g for me is more like a minidose. I wanted a less profound experience, suitable for a normal day's activities. My experience at 0.05g is classic microdose response: noticeable increase in focus, decreased distractability, greater energy, better decisions, a feeling of accomplishment and of moving through the day smoothly. Yet there is also a tiredness towards the end. I usually drink coffee only in the morning but having some 4-5 hours after the microdose takes care of it.

I'm thinking about lowering the dose again, say to 0.04g or 0.03g (best guesses - dividing up a known, measured amount), and shorter intervals. Surely there is a Minimum Effective Dose for microdosing but there is no science whatsoever to guide us here, only personal experience and logs like this. It seems to be affected by other experience with psilocybin, journeys, minidoses and the like. A learned skill that becomes more familiar with practice.


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Offlinegreenery1
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: DharmaForKarma]
    #27317040 - 05/21/21 03:29 AM (22 days, 17 hours ago)

Good points, I agree that for myself .1g might actually be more of a mini dose, so I am also going to try less. As for intentions, those seem like more reasonable expectations: noticeable increase in focus, decreased distractability, greater energy, better decisions, a feeling of accomplishment and of moving through the day smoothly.


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OfflineSocrateshroomS
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: greenery1]
    #27317277 - 05/21/21 10:32 AM (22 days, 10 hours ago)

Sorry it took so long for me to return and finish my thoughts!

Low and micro-doses, for me, seem to be more "intense" from an egoic point of view than high doses.

The reason for this seems to be that lower doses do not significantly alter your egoic faculties of perception. So you have your "wits about you" while also feeling the psychedelic effects. This seems to pull the subject in two different directions and an internal struggle ensues.

On mid-higher doses, the egoic faculties seem to dissolve enough that you don't feel "normal" while tripping, you're just tripping. You lose that hyper-vigilance of regular perception and the trip itself seems to alter the way in which you relate with the changing perceptions.

Basically, low/micro-doses feel weird because you feel normal while not feeling normal and mid/high doses you just feel like your tripping.

Maybe this isn't the case for you. Maybe you are just one of the rare people who are unbelievably hyper-sensitive or you have some incredibly strong cubes (and you mentioned PE which can be decently stronger than regular cubes. I've tripped pretty hard from 0.5g of APEs so "low" doses can definitely be strong).


--------------------
“What comes true here is that which reflects your true nature. The most secret desire. It is within you. It governs you. Yet you are ignorant of it.”

- Andrei Tarkovsy, Stalker



redgreenvines said:
seek wonder, not pleasure and you will love psychedelics again, if you did in your youth. Sometimes it means be a student again. sometimes quite literally.


My First Trip


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Offlinegreenery1
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: Socrateshroom]
    #27320159 - 05/23/21 05:34 PM (20 days, 3 hours ago)

Yes, an important distinction, I was thinking that too, it's sort of like the rockets are firing but it's not quite enough for lift off, but too much for the subtly of the micro dose effects. And as darmaforKarma says, find what works and play with it.

But the thing is 100mg PE twice gave very profound results, so I would bring back into the picture the importance of things like frame of mind, setting, health, unconscious anxieties, and so forth...


Edited by greenery1 (05/23/21 05:35 PM)


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OfflineInfinity-25
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: greenery1]
    #27320836 - 05/24/21 07:44 AM (19 days, 13 hours ago)

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

I would like to add my perspective:

In my frequent experiences at micro to heroic doses with myself and with other people I feel that everyone has their own path with the medicine plants/fungi (and life in general). I dont know/think there is a general rule that can be applied here. Some people only work with them only once or twice in a lifetime, or not at all. Others path in life is deeply intertwined with the psychedelic realms, think of shamans who have fully integrated it and may dose frequent and regular for their whole life. Key is in my experience to find your own path, by being open and receptive and learning to navigate on your feelings/intuition, also in the matter of dosing (or not dosing), the frequency of it and the specific timing in one's life.

As change is the only constant in life, it is therefore quite natural that experiences change over time, and also the required dose and effect. Like also mentioned before by others, one may become more familiar with the realms and learn to navigate them more efficiently, achieving the desired effects for your specific needs at the time with only small doses (needs which also change during ones life).

So while its indeed interesting to compare experiences of others with oneself, it can also be dangerous as it may distance you from your own path when the mind starts value judging its own experience against others.

Learning to feel what is right for you and trusting that intuition is (at least for me) the only way to keep growing. If it tells you to work only with micro dosings at this point in your life, follow that until it changes into something different.

Thanks for reading and sharing.


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OfflinePolarisZ
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: greenery1]
    #27340238 - 06/08/21 02:57 PM (4 days, 6 hours ago)

Quote:

greenery1 said:
Last year I had taken 300µg of LSD at the same location, and it was very unpleasant. My head felt like it was a pressure cooker, my eyes were red, and there was very little euphoria, it just felt like I had taken way to much.




That seems very similar to something I've been experiencing, minus the red eyes. It took about an hour 15 minutes to start happening, then a strange unpleasant feeling in my head, like a pressure  cooker, no visuals, none of the usual mental feelings of LSD, just this overwhelming sense of negativity.

Then it kept happening 3 times in a row until I gave up on LSD, and a lessor version happened on 2 g of shrooms, until I finally managed to stop it on 1g.

I've been trying hard to crack the mystery.


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Offlinegreenery1
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: PolarisZ]
    #27340907 - 06/09/21 01:12 AM (3 days, 20 hours ago)

Hi Polaris,

Thanks for your message, yes its difficult to find info about this problem when searching the internet.

Its also difficult to describe what is happening exactly, but basically it feels like my mind/brain just can't take it anymore, as though the structure itself has gone soft, and is being pushed out of shape like a balloon. An unpleasant feeling of pressure without euphoria.

I attribute it to age and perhaps over use of cannabis in the past. I'm 49 and was a heavy cannabis user for a number of years. I indulge now and then, by choice, but even with weed it has to be small amounts or I have the same problem with unpleasant pressure.

When I search about this what I find is general info about post psychosis intolerance, but its hard to know if that would be a factor from past use, or if its something else, age related, or over sensitivity.


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OfflineNeurotech
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: greenery1]
    #27342874 - 06/10/21 12:18 PM (2 days, 9 hours ago)

I did not do well with my attempt at microdosing mushrooms. I made 24 .1g capsules and have 21 left. It primarily felt like an uncomfortable come-up for a few hours. I was hoping/expecting to feel a clearer mind, but instead I was fuzzy and my body felt like laying down.

It makes me think of pre-trip anxiety, wondering "oh is 3.5 too much? should I do less?" and how once you are over the threshold, you feel great and wish you had done more.

Maybe you are stuck at the threshold, and .1 PE is more like .2 - .3 most cubes.

As for the 300ug trip, are you sure it was LSD? and 300 ug is hefty.


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Offlinegreenery1
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: Neurotech]
    #27343293 - 06/10/21 05:37 PM (2 days, 3 hours ago)

Good points, its possible.

The LSD was a blotter of Ald-52, it was 3 tabs, which should be 300 ug, is that hefty? I thought a tab was a typical low does...


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OfflineDERRAYLD
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: greenery1]
    #27343952 - 06/11/21 06:38 AM (1 day, 14 hours ago)

A tab can be hefty or not depending on the original application.
I've been blasted off to different planets on some penny farthing and Hoffmann but entered a fairy realm and heard auditory hallucinations throughout on fairytale.


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Offlinegreenery1
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Re: Why can't I take larger doses? [Re: DERRAYLD]
    #27345731 - 06/12/21 05:49 PM (3 hours, 34 minutes ago)

Hmm, I've never been blasted off to different planets or entered fairy realms, nothing even remotely like that. Is that typical on LSD and what is that like?


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