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Offlinesoyjohngalt
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Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started!
    #27293335 - 05/04/21 06:32 AM (3 days, 9 hours ago)

So I'm very much a noobie, but here's what I wish I would have understood starting out. 

1.  FIGURE OUT AGAR FIRST! 
I wasted about 2 months because I tried to go from a spore syringe to grain.  First purchases should be everything you need to go from spores to agar.  You'll have a few weeks growing things in agar to figure out the next steps.

2.  WHAT TO BUY FIRST:
A) Spores
B) Petri dishes (I'd start with AT LEAST 30 plastic dishes....but you'll use those faster than you think.)  I like the 90mm x 15mm (mine were $.33 cents each).  Best I've seen is about $.22 if you buy 500 at a time.
C) Large Pressure Cooker (you'll use this over and over and for many steps).  Cheap ones can be had for $100.  You might get lucky at a thrift store.
D) Still Air box (basic version: upside down clear plastic container with holes in it for your hands.
E) Other supplies:  Scalpel, Agar ingredients, Mason Jars + lids or Pouring container + lids, flame (lighter, butane torch, or alcohol lamp), disposable gloves, protective sleeves, 70% isopropyl alcohol, sharpie, parafilm, micropore tape, inoculation loop, Spray bottle (I'd get 3), drying rack (for the bottom of your still air box.  These are for cookies that come out of the oven but work well to keep your supplies away from the bottom of the box.)
F) You'll want to set up an incubator or a room that will main maintain about 76 to 80 degrees for your agar plates to grow.  You can probably use the same heater/thermostat in your fruiting chamber later.  There are $20 options on Amazon that seem like they're good for this.  You can set up an incubator in a cardboard or plastic box. 

3. AGAR PREP:
This seems obvious to me now, but pour your agar dishes, and let them set (1 hour minimum, overnight is probably better) and then inoculate them with your spores.  Don't add spores before the agar has set.   

4. Don't under-estimate the importance of trying to work in a bacteria-free environment.  My first attempts were pretty casual and I wasted many weeks.

5. There are a few different ways to proceed once you have spores.  Here's what makes the most sense to me:

A) Transfer spores to agar plate  & spread with inoculation loop.
B) As the mycelium grows on the agar plates, cut out contamination and/or transfer your best mycellium to new plates.  You only need a small piece to spread it to your new plates.
C) Once you have some petri dishes with contamination-free mycelium that you like, make sure you save some in agar, but one whole petri dish can inoculate 6-8 jars of grain spawn.
D) Transfer a few small pieces of the agar-mycelium to your prepped grain spawn jar.  (Don't bother making a liquid culture from the mycelium on your agar).

6. After you've got your mycelium growing in agar you've got a couple weeks to start reading about the next steps, eg: prepping grain spawn, prepping your bulk substrate, making your fruiting chamber, and the other processes.  You've got a few weeks while you're getting your spores growing.


At this point you'll want to start shopping for things like:
Mason Jars
Grain for grain spawn
Bulk Substrate ingredients
Fruiting Chamber
Humidity control
Light & Light control
Mason Jars (up to 12 depending on how much you're doing - get the wide-mouth jars and lids)

I'm open to criticism.  If someone with more experience disagrees with something on my list.....listen to them not me.  :smile:


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OfflineDziber
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: soyjohngalt]
    #27293343 - 05/04/21 06:53 AM (3 days, 9 hours ago)

I don't understand why is everyone trying to scare noobs with agar and other shit. You can literally have enough mushrooms for yourself if you're not selling with just buying jars grains and polyfill or some other filter. There's no need spending bunch of money for agar(not that it costs that much) and pc and other stuff when most of the people growing for themselves can make a 1 grow a year and have more than enough. I feel like this mentality of "you need to buy all of this shit or you won't be successful is scaring the shit out of noobs" of course it's better to have a PC but you can have bunch of success with just boiling jars. Also I've seen bunch of people saying you should put mss on agar. Maybe 10years ago but nowadays they're super clean. I always advise noobs to skip agar if they're just starting. Agar is easy and kinda useless if you're gonna do 1-2 grows a year. If you like the hobby start agar you'll figure it out first try.


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Offlinesoyjohngalt
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: Dziber]
    #27293403 - 05/04/21 08:01 AM (3 days, 8 hours ago)

My first grow attempt (spores to grain spawn) resulted in 8 out of 8 heavily contaminated jars.....and that was after I felt pretty good about how I'd done things.  It was pretty discouraging for me.  Maybe others have better luck than I did.  I probably was too lax on my sterilization technique and I didn't use a SAB but I did use a pressure cooker. 

I'm certainly not trying to scare anyone away; I just wish I would have understood then what I do now.  The step into agar wasn't very hard or expensive.  I'm far more confident that my next attempt will go far better. I was grateful to a few members who shared their honest and blunt opinions without sugar coating it. 

Just to clarify, would you recommend spore syringe to grain spawn for noobies?  I failed catastrophically doing that.


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OfflineSofaking420
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: soyjohngalt]
    #27293413 - 05/04/21 08:10 AM (3 days, 8 hours ago)

I drop spores on grains all the time, is the right way, no but for me it works.

You might get 1 or 2 fonky ones, toss em and start over. :shrug:

Ive always wanted to play with agar and all the "fancy" stuff but i drop spores on grain and ride the good ones and g2g and youd be suprised what 10 quarts will do.

Also i only use popcorn. Bring the heat.


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OfflineDziber
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: Sofaking420]
    #27293499 - 05/04/21 09:30 AM (3 days, 6 hours ago)

I wouldn't blame 8/8 contam on mss. Especially since I'm playing with agar 1 whole syringe on idk how many plates but shitload. Had 2-3 contam. If syringe is that bad just buy a new one don't even bother with it... I've done mss to grains so many times always worked unless i fucked up my grain prep. I don't use Sab at all. Just close windows few hours before inoc, clean everything mask gloves alcohol. I get contam sometimes but really rarely. Had problems with too wet grains and my sterile technique when I started and after i figured out where my mistakes are it's just been sucess after sucess.


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Offlineanatomality
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: Dziber]
    #27293504 - 05/04/21 09:35 AM (3 days, 6 hours ago)

I did syringe to brown rice (broke boi) a couple times, it was fine.
Tossed a few jars, still ended up with plenty.
My advice is to just go for whatever, and learn as you go.


--------------------
“The strength of a person's spirit would then be measured by how much 'truth' he could tolerate, or more precisely, to what extent he needs to have it diluted, disguised, sweetened, muted, falsified.”


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OfflineAtomsplit
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: anatomality]
    #27294003 - 05/04/21 03:24 PM (3 days, 1 hour ago)

Even after 4 months of really hard work I still have not had a successful bulk grow.


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OfflineDziber
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: Atomsplit]
    #27294054 - 05/04/21 03:59 PM (3 days, 24 minutes ago)

Why not? What's the problem? Your grain gets moldy, bacterial? It gets contamed when?


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OfflineAtomsplit
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: Dziber]
    #27294127 - 05/04/21 04:36 PM (2 days, 23 hours ago)

Quote:

Dziber said:
Why not? What's the problem? Your grain gets moldy, bacterial? It gets contamed when?





Im guessing my agar work or grain prep. Im trying to narrow it down. I have a thread going on the 2nd or 3rd page in the mushroom cult forum.

:mushroom2:


Edited by Atomsplit (05/04/21 05:01 PM)


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Invisiblefungusul
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: Atomsplit]
    #27294408 - 05/04/21 07:43 PM (2 days, 20 hours ago)

I've started with PF-TEK and I've realized pretty soon that rate of failure is very high. Depending on spore's vendor and your techniques, you might get lucky from time to time.

Spore prints and spore syringes are inherently dirty, filled with lots of contaminants. This is considered normal. If you can get a spore print, don't ever consider buying a spore syringe.

Using agar is a simple way to ensure that rate of success is constant and high. With agar you can clean a spore print or a spore syringe, ensuring your success for the next step.

Whenever you are failing, you are wasting money and time, not to mention the disappointment and frustration. The more you invest upfront, the more you'll have to loose. Using agar ensures that you have a good start in the cultivation process before throwing more resources.

You can only understand using agar once you've failed enough.

My first step would be to do lots of reading before starting anything. Skip any information that is older than 3 years, and follow to the letter tek instructions or advice from more experienced cultivators. This will save you time and money. After you have some experience under your belt, you can adjust teks to your needs.

I would recommend reading this No Pour Plates Ziran Style.

Agar is a lot easier than you might think, costs pennies, and it's going to save you from lots and lots of frustration.


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InvisibleSmartattackS
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: fungusul]
    #27294451 - 05/04/21 08:21 PM (2 days, 20 hours ago)

Growing mush is a lot like money management. You are either a gambler or a wise investor. Spores to grain is a gambling mans game. Agar, flow hoods, sterile technique, cloning ETC. This is is all for the folks who dont want to lose any of what they put in and want to know exactly what is going to happen. To be honest, if I was only breaking out my cult stuff once a year for personal stash amounts - I would still want to know exactly how it was going to go every time.


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Invisiblefungusul
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: Smartattack]
    #27294525 - 05/04/21 09:17 PM (2 days, 19 hours ago)

If you have access to a trustworthy source for spore prints/syringes(like Shroomery vendors, which are highly recommended), you can try to be a gambler.

There are plenty of vendors which sell plain water in spore syringes. Hard to tell if it's your technique or your syringe without using agar. With agar you can identify if your spore syringe is the problem.


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Offlinesoyjohngalt
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Re: Noob2Noob Advice: What I wish I would have known when I started! [Re: fungusul]
    #27294855 - 05/05/21 01:50 AM (2 days, 14 hours ago)

My experience:  Agar is giving me an early sense of accomplishment and success.  I can see when I do it right and I can see when I screw up.   

Failed grain spawn was disheartening.  It left me with a lot of questions and I didn't really know where I went wrong.  I like the gambling analogy above.


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Shop: North Spore Bulk Substrate, Cultivation Supplies, Injection Grain Bag, North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Capsules, Buy Kratom Extract, Kratom Powder For Sale   Bridgetown Botanicals CBD Edibles   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder, Kratom Powder for Sale, Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Amazon ½ Pint Jars, Agar, Brown Rice Flour, Hot Plate, Laminar Flow Hood, Parafilm, Petri Dish, Pressure Cooker

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