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Offlinefungilove
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Monotub holes?
    #27290193 - 05/02/21 09:45 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I have a large tub (66qt) and 4 1.5" on the bottom (2 on each of the wide sides) and 2 1.5" on the top (1 on each narrow sides). Are these holes suppose to be covered until it look ready to pin and then opned and covered with micropore tape?

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: fungilove]
    #27290205 - 05/02/21 10:05 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

2 layers of micropore tape on the bottom holes, 1 layer on the top. No need to cover with anything else.

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Offlinefungilove
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27290206 - 05/02/21 10:07 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

From the start?
And then leave them as such through fruiting?

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: fungilove]
    #27290244 - 05/02/21 10:58 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Yup. Spawning is fruiting.

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Offlinefungilove
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27290279 - 05/02/21 11:21 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Thank you for your help.

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: fungilove]
    #27290281 - 05/02/21 11:21 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

No prob.

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OfflineLee
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: fungilove]
    #27290361 - 05/02/21 12:30 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I believe the holes need to be covered with duck tape or something to seal them while the tub is colonizing.

Too much FAE while the tub is colonizing could lead to premature pinning. If you are using a normal plastic storage container the lid is imperfect which will allow just enough Gas Exchange for it to colonize but not enough to trigger pinning until its ready to do so.

Once the tub has been colonized 100% you'll want to remove the duck tape and replace with polyfil/micro-pore tape or nothing if you are using the small hole tek like Pastywhyte's. Removing the tape and allowing FAE in those holes will introduce your colonized tub to fruiting conditions and allow it to start pinning.

Here is a lot of basic info on monotubs and is a really good read.


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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Lee] * 2
    #27290371 - 05/02/21 12:37 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Sorry bro but thats complete nonsense.
OP, just spawn your tub, disregard that previous post.

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OfflineLee
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27290382 - 05/02/21 12:43 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Do you leave your holes open and allow air to go through them while they colonize?

Im just following advice from Trusted Cultivators I've read up on. Even linked their TEKs in my post.



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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Lee]
    #27290484 - 05/02/21 01:54 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

That is an old post. Taping holes is no longer standard practice.

FAE does not promote or even pose a risk for early pinning. It won't dry out your sub either. You might as well spray pain the outside of your tubs to prevent side pins while you're at it. You are simply regurgitating old information.

Taping holes won't hurt anything so if you insist upon doing so then feel free, it is not necessary and not many people do this anymore because its a complete waste of time.

And yes, when I run standard tubs I strictly use mp tape at spawning. I generally use Pasty's ez dialed tubs now though.

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OfflineLee
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27290547 - 05/02/21 02:34 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Okay fair enough maybe some of this info is out of date. Its been 5-6 years since Ive last grown a monotub and getting back into it now.

But just to understand what you are saying... when you create a brand new monotub and spawn grain jars into a tub you leave the holes of the monotub open and allow FAE during the process of colonization?

I knew taping/stuffing the holes was no longer standard process with Pasty's EZ dialed tek but I thought that was only during the fruiting process that you leave the holes open? Maybe I was mistaken.

oldhead trying to get on board with new METAs. 

If we are allowing FAE during colonization how does the tub know when to start pinning? Is full colonization moreso the pinning trigger than FAE? and what actually causes premature pinning?


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Edited by Lee (05/02/21 02:35 PM)

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Lee] * 1
    #27290581 - 05/02/21 02:59 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Premature pinning will happen if you have an infection that triggers the sub to attempt reproduction via fruit production and ultimately sporulation.

When spawning your grain to bulk sub in a standard mono with 1.5" holes, place 2 layers of mp tape on the bottom holes and 1 layer on the top holes. You could use poly if you like.

After spawning make sure that you have a decent top layer of coir/verm to cover the exposed grains. I find that by adding a solid inch+ of CV to all tubs, especially PE, the top layer will not only prevent blobs with mutant varieties but makes for an excellent pin set across the board with all varieties.

I have run a bunch tubs of PE this way and it works every time. I was using a standard 1/4-1/2 " top layer and was still getting blobs without using a peat based casing layer. This was solved by doing 1 to 2" top layer CV, 2" with PE is preferable whereas 1" is sufficient for non mutant varieties.

Pinning is triggered by evaporation (FAE) at the surface once fully colonized, with light as a secondary trigger. With a top layer your spawn won't experience this fresh air until the surface becomes colonized anyways, if it even fully colonizes the the thick top layer, sometimes it doesn't.
I had too many tubs running at once to bother with patching the top layer, I found this to have no discernable negative effect.

I have used this as my SOP along with trash bag liners and it is a win every time, particularly with PE.

So, spawn and move directly to fruiting room. Fruiting conditions are spawning conditions. Spawn to a tub as you intend for them to fruit, including the introduction to light. The tub knows when to start fruiting, it will pin when ready.

Edited by Stipe-n Cap (05/02/21 03:46 PM)

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InvisibleSamushlove
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27290595 - 05/02/21 03:10 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I'm just figuring this out my self , it seems to colonize much quicker this shaves a good bit of time off compared to the way I was doing it

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OfflineErnieErgot67
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27291139 - 05/02/21 09:27 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I have been following Ted‘s thread on penis envy for the past 6 to 8 weeks or so and casing with jiffy every time it gets fully colonized. Plus patching when needed. What you’re saying is I don’t need to use Jeffy and I don’t need to case every time I just need to do it once with Coco coir and Verm and make a 2 inch casing layer with it at the time of spawning and let it run its course??? And you’ve done this several times and didn’t grow blobs/mutations???


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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: ErnieErgot67]
    #27291148 - 05/02/21 09:34 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

That is what I'm saying, and yes, I've done this many times. My last PE run was 22 Pasty tubs.

I failed to mention that the sub definitely benefits from a bit of compression while leveling with a flat tool. At between 2 and 3" (id guess that my average is just a touch over 2 ") of cv top layer you won't need to patch. I just let it run its course naturally. I've done this with Pasty ez dial tubs and standard mono's, I haven't tried it with shoeboxes.

Buying that much jiffy and trying to pasteurize and patch was turning out to be far too much hassle, so I was happy to see  that I didn't need to fuck with blobs or jiffy. My pin sets were one and done, never space for pins to form a second flush unless side pins came up from where the sub pulled away at the top of the liner.

I'm waiting to see if my partner kept any pics on his phone so that I can uoad them to show how well it worked.

This was the last pic I had of my last tub to flush. This was my worst flush of all 22 tubs because I didn't leave enough CV to make a proper top layer. This layer was between 1 and 2 inches but still flushed decently.


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Offlinefungilove
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27291212 - 05/02/21 10:39 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

when you use Pasty tubs then you don't put tape, right?

2" casing sounds like a lot. Is that only for PE? And you would then end up with about as much casing as sub?

Do/did you ever grow in bags and if so would you do the same as far as casing?

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: fungilove]
    #27291215 - 05/02/21 10:47 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

fungilove said:
when you use Pasty tubs then you don't put tape, right?

2" casing sounds like a lot. Is that only for PE? And you would then end up with about as much casing as sub?

Do/did you ever grow in bags and if so would you do the same as far as casing?




No tape.

2" is a lot, but it works. 2" for PE, 1" for non mutant varieties.

My sub is about 4" thick in a 66qt tub, then 2" top layer for PE. When compressed it places the bottom holes on the long sides of the pasty tubs directly at sub level.

My substrate is 12 liters CV.

I've never really grown in bags but I don't see why it wouldn't work. I do notice that leveling and compression helps a bunch so perhaps this would negatively effect the outcome in bags, only one way to find out though.

I should also mention that the above pic was MS, and would be another reason other than the "light" top layer that the flush didn't fill in as much. Clones obviously perform better. Most of my tubs that flushed only once were a clone, however this method performed well with my handful of ms tubs I was running for further clone material.

I'll also add that the results were similar with my TOC clone. With 1"-1.5" top layer, leveled and compressed, I was only able to run first flush, no substrate space left for second flush. Not to say that this isn't possible with less, I just found it to be optimal for my conditions.

Edited by Stipe-n Cap (05/02/21 11:03 PM)

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Offlinefungilove
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27291225 - 05/02/21 11:02 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

How much coir, vermiculite and water makes up the 12 quart?

How much spawn do you add to that?

You compress before casing or the casing as well?

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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: fungilove]
    #27291231 - 05/02/21 11:09 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

So I add about 1100~ grams coir (each block is slightly different);
3 full quarts verm;
5 liters hot h20 into a bucket, let cool.

I measure out 12 liters of material from the bucket to use as substrate then dump into my tub; spawn with a 4 lb bag (or 4 jars);
Once spawn is mixed I level the sub using a trowel. After leveling I use the remaining material in my bucket to make my top layer, level and compress again with my trowel, then label and put into fruiting room with 12/12 light.

There's usually a few handfuls of cv left in my bucket when finished with the tub.
I have a stack of buckets so that if I'm running more than one tub at once I have 1 bucket per tub.


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InvisibleAshtray161
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Re: Monotub holes? [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
    #27291245 - 05/02/21 11:36 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

p9hu7 said:
Premature pinning will happen if you have an infection that triggers the sub to attempt reproduction via fruit production and ultimately sporulation.

When spawning your grain to bulk sub in a standard mono with 1.5" holes, place 2 layers of mp tape on the bottom holes and 1 layer on the top holes. You could use poly if you like.

After spawning make sure that you have a decent top layer of coir/verm to cover the exposed grains. I find that by adding a solid inch+ of CV to all tubs, especially PE, the top layer will not only prevent blobs with mutant varieties but makes for an excellent pin set across the board with all varieties.

I have run a bunch tubs of PE this way and it works every time. I was using a standard 1/4-1/2 " top layer and was still getting blobs without using a peat based casing layer. This was solved by doing 1 to 2" top layer CV, 2" with PE is preferable whereas 1" is sufficient for non mutant varieties.

Pinning is triggered by evaporation (FAE) at the surface once fully colonized, with light as a secondary trigger. With a top layer your spawn won't experience this fresh air until the surface becomes colonized anyways, if it even fully colonizes the the thick top layer, sometimes it doesn't.
I had too many tubs running at once to bother with patching the top layer, I found this to have no discernable negative effect.

I have used this as my SOP along with trash bag liners and it is a win every time, particularly with PE.

So, spawn and move directly to fruiting room. Fruiting conditions are spawning conditions. Spawn to a tub as you intend for them to fruit, including the introduction to light. The tub knows when to start fruiting, it will pin when ready.




Hey I was curious if youd think itd be benefical for me to add a casing layer to a couple tubs that I have in fruiting conditions, a couple that havent pinned yet (and I suspect are bacterial) and a couple that seem healthy and that are about to finish up their first pinset. Id add it to the pinning tubs after the first harvest if you think itd be worth it or if I should just add a CV casing from now on at spawning.
Im starting to wonder if this is one of the (probably many atm) reasons im getting trich after first harvest every tub w/o fail and low yields as far.


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