Home | Community | Message Board
You are not signed in.
Sign In New Account
Forum Index Search Posts Trusted Vendors Highlights Galleries FAQ User List Chat Store Random Growery

Sporeworks
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.

Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Advanced Mycology
Threaded Mode Threaded  Previous topic Previous  View all topics Index  Next topic Next 

Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   Mushroom-Hut Substrate Bags   Sporeworks.EU Spores for European Microscopy   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   North Spore Cultivation Supplies

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
Genetics, Isolating, Cloning, A Few Questions...
    #27288248 -

Hey all! I've been searching through some posts but I still have questions regarding what is FACTUAL with genetics. I have 2 close friends I am growing with, and am the laboratory personnel if you will. I extensively take notes, study, and label my petri dishes. I have recently encountered some divided opinions.

1. "Do not clone a clone."

2. "If you clone a clone, that becomes the 2nd generation."
   
3. ^^^ Opposing thought, no, a 2nd generation is when you grow out a clone, and start spores from this clone.

4. "If you grow out a tissue sample in a petri dish, and isolate from said dish onto a new one, the resulting dish will be genetically the same."

5. ^^^ Opposing thought, insisting that no, they will not be the same, you have separated/altered genetics.


Can anyone help to clear up exactly how you would regard generations, genetics, and so on and so forth?

Slightly unrelated, but I have done/found some things that differ from the regular methods, and I would like to share. 

I prefer to use sterile cotton swabs instead of liquid culture. I shred off the tip of the swab onto the agar. The spores begin growing much faster this way. The cotton provides a fantastic growing medium in this early stage, whereas the liquid is too watery and doesn't settle quite right.

I let spore dishes grow out a little longer than usual, allowing hyphae knots to form. If you isolate 1 hyphae knot, it grows out beautifully. 1 isolation in comparison to the multiples I was doing to get good rhizomorph mycelium.

If the spore dish is free of contaminates and stress indications, the whole dish goes to grain as a multi-spore grow.

Do lots and lots of individual spore dishes. There will be a lot of variety.

I have been cloning clones several times over and have found that you see more consistent, fuller, flushes. Yes, senescence does begin to occur after about 3-4 repetitions. (I gather spores throughout these grows to begin fresh.)

These repetitions are what I previously thought where considered "generations". Now I don't know what to think.

I have isolated a sector from a tissue sample from a clone of a clone, and it resulted in a completely different looking bin. Now I lean more towards the thought that isolating from a tissue sample DOES INDEED alter genetic makeup.

Help me, help you, help everybody in the name of mycology genetics research!

Thank you, sorry for the length, but I got some shit to say!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetics, Isolating, Cloning, A Few Questions... [Re: frikiriki]
    #27297999 -

1. You can clone a clone.. I’ve done it a few times to save the culture with no adverse effects.  If you keep doing it over and over, eventually you’ll run into problems.
2. & 3. Yes, the next generation comes from starting from spores.. clone of a clone is just that.. a clone.

4. & 5. If you pull tissue from a ms plate, you’re isolating genetics from a mix of multiple genetics... you usually have to do many transfers like that to isolate down to a single genetic line or monoculture.  If you think that it only takes two spores mating to produce a monoculture and there’s thousands of spores in a very small amount of water, you can see why it takes so much to isolate down to that when all those spores germinate and find mating pairs.

There’s debate that there’s many genetic lines in even one cloned fruit body.. could be why you’re seeing different growth from a clone of a clone and not because there’s altering of genetic material, but mutations aren’t uncommon in fungi.

Faht

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetics, Isolating, Cloning, A Few Questions... [Re: fahtster]
    #27303572 -

Thank you! I will continue cloning clones... and I will now apply this new generation information to my practice. Also, regarding the theory that there are multiple genetics within a clone, yes this does seem very true. That is why I grab several fruit bodies from a single grow, and take multiple tissue samples from each. I have another question as well, if you don't mind. Do spores get better/more refined through each generation if you know what you are doing with the genetics?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetics, Isolating, Cloning, A Few Questions... [Re: frikiriki]
    #27303590 -

Well if you find a phenotype you like from an ms grow, you can keep selecting that pheno from each new generation from spore and eventually you narrow the genetics down so that pheno will be the only one expressed from multispore.. for the most part.  Environmental factors can play a role to what a fruit looks like but the majority of fruits will look like that one you kept choosing.

Faht

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetics, Isolating, Cloning, A Few Questions... [Re: fahtster]
    #27305472 -

Wow! Awesome. I appreciate the information, thanks again!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetics, Isolating, Cloning, A Few Questions... [Re: fahtster]
    #27312802 -

fahtster said:
Well if you find a phenotype you like from an ms grow, you can keep selecting that pheno from each new generation from spore and eventually you narrow the genetics down so that pheno will be the only one expressed from multispore.. for the most part.  Environmental factors can play a role to what a fruit looks like but the majority of fruits will look like that one you kept choosing.

Faht


Just what I was looking for thanks :smile:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetics, Isolating, Cloning, A Few Questions... [Re: fahtster]
    #27313053 -

fahtster said:
1. You can clone a clone.. I’ve done it a few times to save the culture with no adverse effects.  If you keep doing it over and over, eventually you’ll run into problems.



I've read somewhere about this and I can't find it now, the thing is that if you keep cloning your fruits eventually you won't get fruits right?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetics, Isolating, Cloning, A Few Questions... [Re: elunicotomas]
    #27313061 -

It takes a good amount of “reclones”.. I’d imagine you can do it at least a few times before you start noticing anything depending on how old the culture is

Faht

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Genetics, Isolating, Cloning, A Few Questions... [Re: fahtster]
    #27313307 -

fahtster said:
It takes a good amount of “reclones”.. I’d imagine you can do it at least a few times before you start noticing anything depending on how old the culture is

Faht


I cloned a big mushroom i got last month, made 1 or 2 transfers, and inoculated some grain jars which I'll be using in about a week or so, so the culture is not old.... I'll see what comes from this and future cloning, thanks!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1

Shop: Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   Mushroom-Hut Substrate Bags   Sporeworks.EU Spores for European Microscopy   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   North Spore Cultivation Supplies

Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Advanced Mycology
Threaded Mode Threaded  Previous topic Previous  View all topics Index  Next topic Next 

Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Cloning question Pinhead 1,223 3 07/25/01 09:29 PM
by Pinhead
* Mexicana Strain A Scelortia Cloning Question. bent 3,810 9 06/08/04 02:19 AM
by RogerRabbit
* Cloning Question TM 1,338 8 07/03/02 11:44 AM
by meatman
* HoneyWater Tek and Mycelium cloning question..... UnclePimpy 1,527 2 02/13/02 03:21 PM
by UnclePimpy
* Really quick cloning question peruvian spark 877 2 03/03/04 09:43 AM
by peruvian spark
* Getting a strain isolate without agar ??
( 1 2 3 4 all )		 majik_monkey 14,586 61 01/13/04 10:44 PM
by Joshua
* Yield differences between cloning and multispore? kjb1891 2,656 2 02/14/04 04:44 PM
by kjb1891
* What's the best isolated strain you've ever seen? Baby_Hitler 1,173 2 03/15/03 07:33 AM
by zeronio

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: RogerRabbit, cronicr, Stipe-n Cap, Pastywhyte, bodhisatta
1,522 topic views. 0 members, 86 guests and 1 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2026 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.029 seconds spending 0.007 seconds on 14 queries.