|
Falcon91Wolvrn03
Stranger



Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 32,557
Loc: California, US
Last seen: 4 months, 20 days
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: sudly] 1
#28420635 - 08/04/23 03:15 PM (5 months, 21 days ago) |
|
|
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
Edited by Falcon91Wolvrn03 (08/06/23 05:09 AM)
|
sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,789
|
|
The royal letters where the first signs of Australian sovereignty being dead, but yeah we use tax funds to eat up US military deals that could better be used on the people.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,470
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
|
Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: HE DAY AUSTRALIAN SOVEREIGNTY DIED
Meh, they weren't using it anyway.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
Stable Genius
Durka durka


Registered: 09/26/18
Posts: 5,755
Loc: Durkadurkastan
Last seen: 1 hour, 16 minutes
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: sudly]
#28421304 - 08/05/23 01:56 AM (5 months, 20 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
sudly said:
Quote:
Stable Genius said: Yeah well we got $380 gazillion we need to scrape together to buy 8 subs so quit complaining and get back to work.
I thought you weren't a fan of Aussie spending on the subs.
I'm not, I'm pointing out the reality of coming up with $38million every week until 2040, which means I have get back to work to pay for this madness as well. It shits me to tears.
|
Stable Genius
Durka durka


Registered: 09/26/18
Posts: 5,755
Loc: Durkadurkastan
Last seen: 1 hour, 16 minutes
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: sudly]
#28421309 - 08/05/23 02:00 AM (5 months, 20 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
sudly said: The royal letters where the first signs of Australian sovereignty being dead, but yeah we use tax funds to eat up US military deals that could better be used on the people.
I've already explained to you that Whitlam's dismissal had zero to do with the Queen, why do you have such a hard time dealing with reality?
|
sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,789
|
|
Yeah the subs suck, and so does cutting tax refunds for those with less income.
Access to the letters was restricted by a foreign power.
Quote:
10.06.2020 Introduction
On 29 May, the High Court handed down its decision in Hocking v Director-General of the National Archives of Australia [2020] HCA 19. In an emphatic 6:1 decision, the Court held that correspondence known as the ‘Palace Letters’ – letters between the Governor-General Sir John Kerr and the Queen in the lead up to the dismissal of Prime Minister Gough Whitlam in 1975 – are “Commonwealth records”, not “personal records” as asserted by the National Archives, and thus potentially subject to release under the Archives Act 1983 (Cth) (‘Archives Act’). The High Court ordered that the Director-General of the National Archives reconsider historian Professor Jenny Hocking’s request for access to the Palace Letters.
The Palace Letters are copies of 211 pieces of correspondence between Sir John Kerr and the Queen’s private secretary, Sir Martin Charteris, exchanged between August 1974 and December 1977. The letters were deposited with the National Archives by Sir John Kerr’s official secretary, Mr David Smith, in 1978 as part of Kerr’s personal collection, with instructions that they not be made available for 60 years (i.e. until 2037), which was when the Queen’s copies of the letters would be made available. In 1991, the access period was brought forward to 2027 on the Queen’s instruction, with the condition that release of the letters to the public be subject to potential veto by the Queen’s private secretary or the Governor-General’s official secretary (‘royal veto’).
Since then, Buckingham Palace has indicated that all letters between the Queen, her private secretary and her Governors-General should not be made available until 5 years after her death, and then still be subject to royal veto. The Queen’s unilateral power to embargo the letters from release raises concerns about what the Palace’s role in the dismissal was, the impact of a foreign institution on access to information held by Australian institutions, and why the actions of Australia’s Head of State are being hidden from scrutiny.
Accountability in our political system can only be achieved if the decisions made by the holders of the highest offices in our democracy are subject to transparency and public scrutiny.
https://www.auspublaw.org/blog/2020/06/palace-letters-are-commonwealth-records-a-victory-for-democratic-transparency
Long live the Queen
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
|
Stable Genius
Durka durka


Registered: 09/26/18
Posts: 5,755
Loc: Durkadurkastan
Last seen: 1 hour, 16 minutes
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: sudly]
#28421324 - 08/05/23 02:30 AM (5 months, 20 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
‘Palace letters’ show the queen did not advise, or encourage, Kerr to sack Whitlam government
Published: July 14, 2020
https://theconversation.com/palace-letters-show-the-queen-did-not-advise-or-encourage-kerr-to-sack-whitlam-government-142376
I keep explaining this but you just don't listen.
|
sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,789
|
|
You can read my quotes if you choose to, access to the letters was restricted by a foreign power.
Tell me that's sovereignty?
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
|
Stable Genius
Durka durka


Registered: 09/26/18
Posts: 5,755
Loc: Durkadurkastan
Last seen: 1 hour, 16 minutes
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: sudly]
#28421383 - 08/05/23 04:24 AM (5 months, 20 days ago) |
|
|
You are right about about the Monarchy having a final say in the release of the letters, however this was a stipulation made under a legal agreement with Kerr, as he was in possession of them before he handed them over to the National Archive.
The National Archive was not legally allowed to release them, this was also the view of the Federal Court and it wasn't until Jenny Hocking's successful High Court challenge that this was overturned.
So to be honest, to say that the Queen somehow usurped our sovereignty just isn't correct 
The Director General of the National Archive explains it here https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/watch-live-national-archives-director-general-releases-the-palace-letters-20200714-p55bua from 4.54-9.58
It's also worth listening from 22.58-23.44.
If you have half an hour to blow the whole thing is worth watching from the start up until 34.40
|
Brian Jones
Club 27



Registered: 12/18/12
Posts: 12,340
Loc: attending Snake Church
Last seen: 1 day, 3 hours
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Stable Genius] 1
#28422697 - 08/06/23 05:07 AM (5 months, 19 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: HE DAY AUSTRALIAN SOVEREIGNTY DIED
I wont argue with the substance presented in your link. No matter how slanted it was informative.
All the Pacific allies will be increasingly entangled in our web. There are two powers on earth and the Pacific is where it's at. Australia, New Zealand, Japan, and South Korea are already attending NATO meetings (which needs a name change or a geography lesson).
I think Europe anticipated this and realizes THEY have to contain Russia more or less by themselves. Any GOP anti-miltarism and isolationism rhetoric is complete bullshit. Both parties know the China issue is center stage, economically for sure and militarily to some undetermined level; new form of cold war while still trading, probably proxy wars, and hopefully not beyond that. This is completely different from the U.S./Soviet cold war because U.S. and China are so economically interdependent, even while vying for world supremacy.
But back on topic, I had to LOL FW when googling the bias of your source. The first 4 entries said: Registered in Russia, based in Crimea (my comment, who knew the Crimeans were this interested in Australia) Online disinformation and propaganda site Heavy on conspiracy and pseudoscience A fascinating hybrid of detailed military intelligence and totally bogus stories
Yeah these were Western biased interpretations, but even RT gets much better ratings from them.
The world changes but it stays the same. Idealistically countries should strive to maintain their autonomy, and U.S. allies are mostly more progressive than us. But to some extent every country of value (however measured) will be China's bitch or our bitch. They could rebel against that, but historically not that many and not that much. They go along willingly.
India is the one I'm not sure about. They're in the BRICs meetings but they also have fatal border clashes with China. India is a big world economy, and always knew how to play off the superpowers. IMO they're still a swing state.
-------------------- "The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body" John Lennon I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either. The worst thing about corruption is that it works so well,
|
christopera
Stranger


Registered: 10/13/17
Posts: 14,201
Last seen: 18 minutes, 29 seconds
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Brian Jones]
#28422737 - 08/06/23 07:07 AM (5 months, 19 days ago) |
|
|
Looking into SouthFront.org reveals a lot about where FW's head is these days. Yikes.
Most interesting is that RT uses southfront.org as a source on some articles. Particularly the German version of RT, but also Russian versions, and they do so going back to 2015. Which is also when the domain was registered. I only looked at a few of the articles, but like three out of four talked about the "criminal groups in the US government."
-------------------- Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result. A Dorito is pizza, change my mind. Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things I’m sorry it had to be me.
|
Brian Jones
Club 27



Registered: 12/18/12
Posts: 12,340
Loc: attending Snake Church
Last seen: 1 day, 3 hours
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: christopera]
#28422760 - 08/06/23 07:37 AM (5 months, 19 days ago) |
|
|
I was confused about the concern with Australia cause just thinking about Russia and Ukraine and not the big picture. With the AUKUS deal Australia allied with U.S. after decades of a neutrality stance regarding China.
That link was Russia staging propaganda for China, as much as against U.S. There is no doubt who's the big dog and who's the little dog.
-------------------- "The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body" John Lennon I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either. The worst thing about corruption is that it works so well,
|
christopera
Stranger


Registered: 10/13/17
Posts: 14,201
Last seen: 18 minutes, 29 seconds
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Brian Jones]
#28422771 - 08/06/23 07:55 AM (5 months, 19 days ago) |
|
|
I should have kept those tabs up, but most of the 2015 RT published articles that were South Front supported were in regards to Montenegro joining NATO. I feel like there is a theme here.
-------------------- Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result. A Dorito is pizza, change my mind. Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things I’m sorry it had to be me.
|
maensel
Stranger


Registered: 05/04/23
Posts: 53
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: christopera]
#28425038 - 08/07/23 09:44 PM (5 months, 18 days ago) |
|
|
u sure there is even a legit Australia?
|
twighead
mͯó



Registered: 08/27/08
Posts: 29,547
Loc: Glenn Gould's Fuck Windmill
Last seen: 52 minutes, 2 seconds
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: christopera]
#28425272 - 08/08/23 05:11 AM (5 months, 17 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
christopera said: Looking into SouthFront.org reveals a lot about where FW's head is these days. Yikes.
Most interesting is that RT uses southfront.org as a source on some articles. Particularly the German version of RT, but also Russian versions, and they do so going back to 2015. Which is also when the domain was registered. I only looked at a few of the articles, but like three out of four talked about the "criminal groups in the US government."

lol hes actually on a site called southfront.org? Like a play off of stormfront the maximum white nationalist haven?
|
Stable Genius
Durka durka


Registered: 09/26/18
Posts: 5,755
Loc: Durkadurkastan
Last seen: 1 hour, 16 minutes
|
|
Quote:
Brian Jones said: I was confused about the concern with Australia cause just thinking about Russia and Ukraine and not the big picture. With the AUKUS deal Australia allied with U.S. after decades of a neutrality stance regarding China.
That link was Russia staging propaganda for China, as much as against U.S. There is no doubt who's the big dog and who's the little dog.
Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: THE DAY AUSTRALIAN SOVEREIGNTY DIED
Just when I was ready to never say a kind word about the Australian Labor Party ever again, this happens;
Quote:
AUKUS dissent has ALP power-brokers worried
Over twenty ALP branches around Australia have now passed anti-AUKUS resolutions and the list is growing by the day.
Many of the branches are calling on the Albanese government to withdraw from the pact while others want a parliamentary inquiry into the $368 Billion deal.
AWPR supports the call for a full and open inquiry which was suggested by The Australia Institute and others in May.
The grassroots revolt within the ALP is being pushed along by a new informal group called “Labor Against War” which is headed by former Labor staffer and journalist Marcus Strom.
Speaking at a recent public meeting in Sydney, Strom said the group is part of a long tradition within Labor that opposed unjust wars, including the Vietnam war and the Iraq invasion.
The opposition among Labor members appears to be growing strongly. In some places like Tanya Plibersek’s electorate of Sydney multiple branches are demanding a change in policy. Four branches in her electorate managed to get the whole Federal electorate council to pass this resolution:
‘(Sydney FEC) calls on the Australian Government to withdraw from the AUKUS alliance and cease any program in pursuit of the acquisition of nuclear submarines’
A similar motion was passed by the Electorate Councils in the South Australian seats of Mayo and Boothby.
Some of the resolutions have expressed dismay that the Albanese government has proceeded with a policy that was conceived and implemented by Scott Morrison.
One of the motions read: “It was conceived by Scott Morrison, without proper process or debate, as a desperate election ploy”.
Several of the branches have also given their backing to War Powers Reform: “after the experience of Iraq, Federal Labor should commit to a policy that any decision to send Australian troops abroad will only be made by debate in the Australian parliament.”
The internal dissent has been spurred on by a growing number of senior Labor figures who have publicly criticised AUKUS. The list includes Bob Carr, Paul Keating, Gareth Evans, Peter Garrett, Carmen Lawrence and Doug Cameron.
But can this internal backlash turn around such a massive foreign policy, which saw Anthony Albanese shaking hands and signing an agreement in San Diego with President Biden and UK PM Rishi Sunak?
Even public polling shows little support for the decision to pay so much money for a handful of nuclear submarines. The most recent Lowy Institute poll found that 47 per cent of people didn’t think the spending was worth it, and only 27 per cent support the expenditure.
Mr Albanese and some of his key ministers appear to be somewhat rattled by the membership revolt. Several articles have appeared in recent weeks with ministers trying to play down the issue, which will come to a head at the ALP national conference in Brisbane in a few weeks.
Some reports point out that the progressive wing of the party have the numbers for the first time in a long time. But others say a deal will be done ahead of the meeting that ensures Mr Albanese will “not be embarrassed” by the final outcome.
Even if that occurs it’s hard to see the genuine community concern about AUKUS going away. In particular the longer term decisions about where to set up a nuclear submarine base on the east coast and how the resulting nuclear waste will be dealt with are highly contentious matters.
There are 64 branches of the ALP, 8 in each State/Territory
|
mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,256
Loc: where?
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: twighead]
#28425365 - 08/08/23 07:43 AM (5 months, 17 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
twighead said:
lol hes actually on a site called southfront.org? Like a play off of stormfront the maximum white nationalist haven?
a red pill site to inform you of the greatest threat the world has ever seen.
|
chopstick
nobody



Registered: 07/26/08
Posts: 5,076
Loc: Chin's Wok
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: twighead] 2
#28425524 - 08/08/23 09:52 AM (5 months, 17 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
twighead said:
lol hes actually on a site called southfront.org? Like a play off of stormfront the maximum white nationalist haven?
Jesus you guys are ridiculous. Southfront is a geopolitics website that gives updates and analysis on global geopolitics, the people running it aren't even Americans and it has nothing to do with white nationalism or any kind of US domestic political bullshit.
"Oh, it has the word south in it, it must be like Stormfront!"
|
mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,256
Loc: where?
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: chopstick]
#28425587 - 08/08/23 10:42 AM (5 months, 17 days ago) |
|
|
red pill site
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,470
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: mushboy]
#28425611 - 08/08/23 11:03 AM (5 months, 17 days ago) |
|
|
Southfront is a Russian company. It's basically RT with a different name.
Quote:
SouthFront is a disinformation site that receives taskings from the FSB. Following the 2020 U.S. presidential election, SouthFront sought to promote perceptions of voter fraud during the 2020 U.S. presidential election cycle, and was designated pursuant to E.O. 13848, E.O. 13694, as amended, and E.O. 13382 on April 15, 2021, for having engaged in foreign interference in the 2020 U.S. presidential election and being owned or controlled by, or for having acted or purported to act for or on behalf of, directly or indirectly, the FSB.
https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy0628
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
|