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sudly
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
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twighead said: Naturally the country has the parallel to our right wing which finds the authoritarian politics of china and russia to be more enticing.
I don't think it's "authoritarian politics" anyone finds enticing. It's a refreshing breath of honesty and common sense.
I considered myself liberal, but liberals in the US have become the party of war, censorship, and make believe.
What I find odd imo is that hypocrisy is non-existent or straight ignored within and around the kinds of parties that lean authoritarian, because no matter what the individual does, they will still be trusted to vote in line with their base. Be it on rights, energy, welfare etc.
I do not personally have an Australian politician I directly align with and could out right believe in, but there are contenders.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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sudly
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Brian Jones] 3
#27987565 - 10/08/22 06:01 AM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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Brian Jones said:
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
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twighead said: Naturally the country has the parallel to our right wing which finds the authoritarian politics of china and russia to be more enticing.
I don't think it's "authoritarian politics" anyone finds enticing. It's a refreshing breath of honesty and common sense.
I considered myself liberal, but liberals in the US have become the party of war, censorship, and make believe.
IMO it's not honesty or common sense. For some, it's a refreshingly different version of the complete bullshit propaganda that every powerful country spews, and it carries more weight because they're powerful countries.
In the U.S. there is no partisanship on the issues of war, censorship, and make believe. Trump was maybe a couple percent better on war, and took make believe to such an extreme that it may have made even a semblance of truth irrelevant. I'll grant you that the liberals might be worse on censorship now, but that's an issue that requires analysis. Liberals inhibit and sometimes ban public speech. Conservatives want to prevent school children from having any exposure whatsoever, from books or teachers on certain subjects. On both sides the right or wrong, or appropriateness for children, should be determined on a case by case basis.
When you go on a case by case basis one group wants to take your rights, your wages, your healthcare, support and value overall.
The culture war imo is made up to distract from real underlying economic issues.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Stable Genius said: More excellent reporting on the state of affairs from The Australian Citizens Party.
If you have the time listen from the 27.28 mark to a well informed analysis of the dire position of Europe's economy which ties in with a brilliant breakdown of why Australia SHOULD NOT be supporting the Nazi regime in Kiev as well as why the U.S. is breaking it's own laws by backing a state that has a sponsored hit list on it's own citizens.
They cover a LOT of ground in this report. These guys and girls rock 
Those folks really seemed to understand the situation quite well.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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Stable Genius
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Yes they've been covering these type of stories for a long time it seems, I like what they have to say.
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Stable Genius said: what this guy is saying about being lied to is being understood by more and more people.
Thousands march for Julian Assange's release
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Brian Jones
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: The Ecstatic]
#27989517 - 10/09/22 04:03 AM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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The Ecstatic said:
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twighead said:
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Stable Genius said:
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twighead said: Naturally the country has the parallel to our right wing which finds the authoritarian politics of china and russia to be more enticing.
If you got the time have a listen to Elisa Barwick and Craig Isherwood talk, they're sensible centrist's not fringe dwelling looneys.
I'm sick to death of this idea that only the left or the right can have good policies, it's obstructionist thinking that doesn't deliver good outcomes.
What the hell is wrong with being friendly with China anyway?... which is something they discuss, have a listen 
Right what's wrong with aligning with a political party that solidified its power through terror and the killing of 50+ million Chinese?
Your own country knows what's up
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-03-31/australia-treasurer-plans-trade-outreach-to-slip-china-coercion
The more China expands its influence in the region, the more it will seek to bend countries behest to it - to its will.
Little known fact: Chinese communists invented violent revolution and the concept of geopolitics. That’s why they continue to wage wars like madmen all over the planet, killing millions of innocent people for no other reason than to stem the spread of an ideology hostile to theirs.
Good sarcasm. China has kept their worst behavior close to home. We'll have to wait and see how they do when they're the hegemon. I'll probably live just about long enough to find out.
China is a new breed: Business Communists. All things considered I'm appalled, but still impressed.
-------------------- "The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body" John Lennon I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either. The worst thing about corruption is that it works so well,
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twighead
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Brian Jones]
#27989523 - 10/09/22 04:09 AM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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shit like this is why China is lame af
sending like 20 plain clothes agents just to block a reporter from interviewing an independent candidate, bringing styrofoam and shit to block their windows? Fucking insecure losers
It's a good thing they were a foreign reporter or they prob just would've ended up in a reeducation camp
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Brian Jones
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: sudly]
#27989531 - 10/09/22 04:41 AM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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sudly said:
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Stable Genius said:
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twighead said: Naturally the country has the parallel to our right wing which finds the authoritarian politics of china and russia to be more enticing.
If you got the time have a listen to Elisa Barwick and Craig Isherwood talk, they're sensible centrist's not fringe dwelling looneys.
I'm sick to death of this idea that only the left or the right can have good policies, it's obstructionist thinking that doesn't deliver good outcomes.
What the hell is wrong with being friendly with China anyway?... which is something they discuss, have a listen 
I'd be careful of introducing a neutrality bias here. Every political party has a range of good to okay and poor or bad policies they put forward.
The priorities of the policies each party puts forward are usually clear to see, all though sometimes in hindsight because there are trends of putting lipstick on policies when it comes to representing them on tv stage.
Admittedly when it comes to China all I really know is they tend to use economic colonialism over classic colonialism.
Yes, economic colonialism vs classic colonialism, which I usually think of as imperialism vs neo imperialism. Colonialism went in stages. I'm overgeneralizing here, but the Spanish wanted the subjugated to convert religions or die, then the British modernized that into we just want to economically exploit you, but it was still colonialism. The Americans popularized neocolonialism where you economically exploited them without taking over their country (except sometimes they did), but the political manipulation that involved begs the question of how different it really was. The form did change however.
China is following the current model with the rest of the world. But Hong Kong is legally theirs and Taiwan IDK, but either way I think China would be better off just taxing those two cash goldmines.
That's what puzzles me about Russia, which seems to have reverted a century in style, and the costs benefits equation doesn't add up.
-------------------- "The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body" John Lennon I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either. The worst thing about corruption is that it works so well,
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Stable Genius
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: twighead] 1
#27989584 - 10/09/22 05:57 AM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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Stable Genius
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: twighead] 1
#27989591 - 10/09/22 06:14 AM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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twighead said: shit like this is why China is lame af
Fucking insecure losers
It's a good thing they were a foreign reporter or they prob just would've ended up in a reeducation camp
Ukraine is preparing a law on full control over the media, as the last vestiges of press freedom disappear in Kiev
Looking forward to reading your outrage about this
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twighead
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twighead
mͯó



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Quote:
Stable Genius said:
Quote:
twighead said: shit like this is why China is lame af
Fucking insecure losers
It's a good thing they were a foreign reporter or they prob just would've ended up in a reeducation camp
Ukraine is preparing a law on full control over the media, as the last vestiges of press freedom disappear in Kiev
Looking forward to reading your outrage about this 
I admit its funny, Russia trying to generate outrage in regards to media laws which would resemble their own.
I've never made the point that they have no issues, domestically - etc.. alot of the Eastern Bloc still does. Nothing nearly bad enough to justify an invasion though.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: twighead]
#27990724 - 10/09/22 06:16 PM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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twighead said:
shit like this is why China is lame af
sending like 20 plain clothes agents just to block a reporter from interviewing an independent candidate, bringing styrofoam and shit to block their windows? Fucking insecure losers
It's a good thing they were a foreign reporter or they prob just would've ended up in a reeducation camp
I suspect (though I don't know) that they were blocked because they were foreigners. I think Russia, China, and others have learned to be suspicious of Western instigated color revolutions that have no purpose other than create internal fighting, like we've seen in so many other countries.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: twighead]
#27990731 - 10/09/22 06:23 PM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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twighead said: I admit its funny, Russia trying to generate outrage in regards to media laws which would resemble their own.
Resemble their own? Ukraine's FAR worse at this point.
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twighead said: I've never made the point that they have no issues, domestically - etc.. alot of the Eastern Bloc still does. Nothing nearly bad enough to justify an invasion though.
The invasion has zero to do with internal issues.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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twighead
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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
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twighead said: I admit its funny, Russia trying to generate outrage in regards to media laws which would resemble their own.
Resemble their own? Ukraine's FAR worse at this point.
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twighead said: I've never made the point that they have no issues, domestically - etc.. alot of the Eastern Bloc still does. Nothing nearly bad enough to justify an invasion though.
The invasion has zero to do with internal issues.
Tell me then, how many sites are banned in Ukraine vs Russia
and oh really? I thought it was to get rid of nazis
but please don't pretend that now you care about freedom of the press lmao.
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Brian Jones]
#27990872 - 10/09/22 07:57 PM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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Brian Jones said: Yes, economic colonialism vs classic colonialism, which I usually think of as imperialism vs neo imperialism. Colonialism went in stages. I'm overgeneralizing here, but the Spanish wanted the subjugated to convert religions or die, then the British modernized that into we just want to economically exploit you, but it was still colonialism. The Americans popularized neocolonialism where you economically exploited them without taking over their country (except sometimes they did), but the political manipulation that involved begs the question of how different it really was. The form did change however.
China is following the current model with the rest of the world. But Hong Kong is legally theirs and Taiwan IDK, but either way I think China would be better off just taxing those two cash goldmines.
That's what puzzles me about Russia, which seems to have reverted a century in style, and the costs benefits equation doesn't add up.
Hong Kong used to be THE economic hub of China. While it's still considered a hub, it's GDP has been overtaken by other Chinese cities over the past few decades. Many speculate that the relative decrease in GDP is why Beijing was willing to crack down as hard as they did in 2019. The show of force became less risky.
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sudly
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Brian Jones]
#27991283 - 10/10/22 03:11 AM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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Russia is just a russian roulette game atm, a shitshow hitting the fan.
I lolled at this,
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The Americans popularized neocolonialism where you economically exploited them without taking over their country (except sometimes they did),
Banana republic anyone? Can't think of a time they didn't invade lol, they in 7 countries atm without afghanistan but good lot that did.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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sudly
Quasar Praiser

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Quote:
Stable Genius said:
Quote:
twighead said: shit like this is why China is lame af
Fucking insecure losers
It's a good thing they were a foreign reporter or they prob just would've ended up in a reeducation camp
Ukraine is preparing a law on full control over the media, as the last vestiges of press freedom disappear in Kiev
Looking forward to reading your outrage about this 
Idk man this is just my 2c, but if we had missiles hitting city hall over here and a flurry of propaganda mixed in with foreign and internal interference, I think it'd be damn hard to get a clear message out there, and in a full on military situation as is, I find it hard to personally come to a strong conclusion on what decisions are good or bad in the greater picture ey.

It also doesn't seem all too clear what the new legislation in a full contextual way, actually involves, like what exactly it bans, or what the 'new media standards' involve.
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A new draft media law voted on in the Ukrainian parliament on Tuesday (30 August) could see the country take a step towards fulfilling conditions set out by Brussels for EU accession.
The draft law, ‘On Media’, passed with 233 votes in favour in the Verkhovna Rada, Ukraine’s parliament, in the first re-reading following revisions.
The bill was proposed by President Zelenskyy in November 2019 and was introduced to parliament later that year. In addition to regulating online media and major platforms, the bill also seeks to expand the power of the country’s media regulator, the National Council of Television and Radio Broadcasting.
Media reform, particularly the alignment of Ukraine’s regulations with those of the EU, was one of the provisions included in Brussels’ recommendation of EU candidate status for the country earlier this summer.
However, throughout its drafting process the law has attracted criticism from press organisations within and beyond Ukraine for the potential power over the media that it would hand the government.
The vote on Tuesday saw a majority of lawmakers support the bill’s passage, following additions to the draft made by deputies in July. The changes, Ukraine’s Detector Media reports, mostly relate to the war but also clarify the definition of the “online media” that the legislation will cover.
The media reform process began with a decree signed by Zelenskyy in 2019, calling for the introduction of legislation to kickstart the process. The move, however, was met with opposition from Ukrainian journalists, many of whom expressed unease with the potential inclusion of defined “news standards”.
International media organisations have since voiced their concern over certain elements of the ensuing legislation.
In July, the Committee to Protect Journalists urged that the bill be rewritten, arguing that its expansion of the media regulator’s powers would threaten press freedom and that, while reform was needed, the law in its current state would instead mark a departure from EU standards.
The European Federation of Journalists (EFJ), an association of journalists’ trade unions, also called for a revision of the draft text, saying it was joining the calls of its Ukrainian affiliate organisations, the National Union of Journalists of Ukraine (NUJU) and the Independent Media Trade Union of Ukraine.
“NUJU calls on the Ukrainian authorities to withdraw this bill and to draft a specific bill for the regulation of audiovisual media, in line with the EU directives”, said the organisation’s President, Sergiy Tomilenko.
“We are ready to dialogue with the authorities to draft a new media law in line with European legal standards.”
A group of Ukrainian media NGOs issued a similar call last month, urging the government to consult transparently with media professionals and organisations to formulate the law.
Improving Ukraine’s media landscape was one of the points set out by the European Commission in June in an opinion on the country’s EU membership application.
While media freedom has “improved significantly in recent years, especially thanks to online media” and a good balance is being struck between preservation of the media and measures to combat disinformation, the Commission said in the opinion, issues, such as the influence of oligarchs in the sector, remain.
Brussels also singled out the pending legislation, noting that alignment with its own audiovisual media law had yet to be completed, particularly regarding the media regulator’s role, media ownership transparency and ensuring equal market conditions.
“We welcome the plans to proceed with the new draft law ‘On Media’ in the Ukrainian parliament following today’s first reading vote,” an EU spokesperson told EURACTIV. “This is an important step on Ukraine’s path towards the EU and to address one of the priority reforms identified in the Commission’s Opinion on Ukraine’s EU membership application.”
“The law needs to ensure a competitive media market with clear rules for all, an independent regulator and alignment with EU Audio-Visual Media Services Directive,” the official added. “The Commission will assess the draft voted in the first reading and make further recommendations to Ukraine to ensure its alignment with EU legislation.”
The draft law will now reportedly be considered for a second reading by Ukrainian lawmakers within the next three weeks.
https://www.euractiv.com/section/media/news/ukraine-moves-forward-on-media-law-chasing-eu-requirements/
I get that media regulations are a slippery slope, but by jesus I struggle to think (because I don't), that we here in Australia have anything close to journalists standing infront of our TV screens, because they won't hold any politicians accountable, or any flames to their feet because they'd lose access and advertisements associated with their coverage and so the overton window stays and the boat remains unrocked alas.
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Stable Genius
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: sudly] 1
#27991308 - 10/10/22 03:57 AM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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I agree, the journalistic standards here are shit. There's no tough questions on policy and a lot of times the fucking politicians office often refuses to even answer journalists questions!, the previous Morrison government in particular.
In regards Ukraine, the media censorship is just another step. It's a pity our shit media don't tell the full story in regards to the Ukrainian leadership, they're not the poor unfortunate's that they're portrayed to be.
They've banned 16 rival political parties as well, Elisa Barwick from the Citizens Party explains this in that video from the previous page from the 38.00 minute mark or listen to the whole segment from the 33.56 mark or! if you have the time listen to the lead up from the 27.28 mark
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sudly
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Eventually I'll have a deeper look, but any quotes or context to the supposed censorship?
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Stable Genius
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: sudly]
#27991330 - 10/10/22 04:43 AM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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Have a read through this page. The powers are wide ranging, Basically everything can be blocked, bloggers, media sites, internet content the regime objects to, websites can have the providers ordered to shut access to the site and so on.
https://ctrana.media/articles/analysis/275238-o-chem-hovoritsja-v-novom-zakonoproekte-o-media-kotoryj-rada-khochet-prinjat-v-ijule-.html
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