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Invisiblesudly
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Brian Jones]
    #27946267 - 09/12/22 02:01 AM (1 year, 8 months ago)

where there any major points he made about the transition from communist to social democrat that stood out to you?


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OfflineStable Genius
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: sudly] * 1
    #27946292 - 09/12/22 03:14 AM (1 year, 8 months ago)

Quote:

sudly said:
Not good news for coin collectors apparantly?

I used to be neutral on her but after hiding the news on Whitlam for 50 years she's a dud in my book. Something hidden for 50 years don't sit right.




Yeah but she didn't bro, the Palace Kerr Letters prove she didn't, we spoke about this earlier :shrug: in fact Martin Charteris advised Kerr to NOT to sack Whitlam.

And before I get accused of being a raving monarchist I voted for a Republic in the 1999 referendum but I still think the Queen did a LOT of good things.

I think Australian's did the respectful thing and waited until she passed away, now we can move forward and ditch England.

I watched Souths play The Roosters last night and it was pretty cool watching the footy stadium stand in silence, well, except for a few bogans, but I thought it was very cool as well as respectful.

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OfflineStable Genius
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Brian Jones]
    #27946311 - 09/12/22 03:25 AM (1 year, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Brian Jones said:
I remember telling my students that the next leader would bring real change because that was the direction they were going, but Gorbachev went farther than anyone could have anticipated.




I was talking with my hippie lawyer about this the other night, she doesn't exactly share my views on Russia :lol: but that ok. What I said was because such massive change happened under Gorbachev I wonder if that was the reason why NATO expansion was never formally written down in some sort of accord?

Such a major point to have been overlooked in amongst all the joyous hoopla, it probably would have helped right about now.

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Invisiblesudly
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Stable Genius]
    #27947728 - 09/13/22 03:12 AM (1 year, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Stable Genius said:
Quote:

sudly said:
Not good news for coin collectors apparantly?

I used to be neutral on her but after hiding the news on Whitlam for 50 years she's a dud in my book. Something hidden for 50 years don't sit right.




Yeah but she didn't bro, the Palace Kerr Letters prove she didn't, we spoke about this earlier :shrug: in fact Martin Charteris advised Kerr to NOT to sack Whitlam.

And before I get accused of being a raving monarchist I voted for a Republic in the 1999 referendum but I still think the Queen did a LOT of good things.

I think Australian's did the respectful thing and waited until she passed away, now we can move forward and ditch England.

I watched Souths play The Roosters last night and it was pretty cool watching the footy stadium stand in silence, well, except for a few bogans, but I thought it was very cool as well as respectful.




Quote:

Stable Genius said:
Quote:

sudly said:
The Queen played a role in superseding Australian democracy and hid it for 50 years, so a flipped bird to the Queen, and may god bless the day she retires.





I think you'll find the Palace Letters prove that;

1. Kerr was advised to NOT sack Whitlam yet did so anyway WITHOUT informing her(via Martin Charteris) he was doing so
and
2. The only thing she is guilty of is not discussing this crisis with Whitlam but seeing as The Governor General is supposed to be her voice in Australia it makes sense, otherwise she'd be accused of meddling in our politics!

She did not order Whitlam's sacking.




When the queen is an accessory to the coverup, there's not much of a leg to stand on imo.

Quote:

Quote:

These are “the Palace letters”, letters between the governor-general and the Queen,

these letters had been deposited with the National Archives where they remain “under strict embargo” due not to a decision of Sir John Kerr, but of the Queen: “At Her Majesty The Queen’s instructions”.

https://www.crikey.com.au/2016/02/25/whats-she-hiding-the-secret-documents-that-detail-the-queens-involvement-in-the-dismissal/








She didn't snitch on Kerr, only the Australian public.


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OfflineStable Genius
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: sudly]
    #27947783 - 09/13/22 05:19 AM (1 year, 8 months ago)

That article you've posted is 4 years too early and doesn't show the Letters though :shrug: Jenny Hocking still hadn't won her High Court challenge to have them released, they were only released in 2020. She was still guessing at that point in time when that article was written.

The Queen knew she had done nothing wrong and even though she could have spoken and cleared her name because they were embargoed until 2027?? she did the right thing and remained silent.

Look how much shit she endured over this, yet she kept her mouth shut. That's tough. Much respect for the Queen.

https://theconversation.com/palace-letters-show-the-queen-did-not-advise-or-encourage-kerr-to-sack-whitlam-government-142376

https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/letters-reveal-kerr-sacked-whitlam-as-a-pre-emptive-strike-20200714-p55bzv

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Invisiblesudly
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Stable Genius]
    #27952316 - 09/16/22 02:25 AM (1 year, 7 months ago)

It's not about the Queen directly sacking Whitlam because it doesn't appear she did, it's about her hiding the letters from the public for 50 YEARS. They didn't release them, it took a federal court to turn over the 'private' title that made the governor general's actions more clear.

Quote:

The public was denied access to the letters because they were deemed "personal" correspondence and subject to a royal embargo.

Prof Hocking launched a court case in 2016 to overturn that status, arguing the letters were critical historical records. She said their access should not be restricted by the rules of a foreign power.

The release of the letters was "a terrific outcome for transparency and history", she told the BBC.

In a statement, Buckingham Palace said the Queen had consistently demonstrated "support for Australia" throughout her reign.

"While the Royal Household believes in the longstanding convention that all conversations between prime ministers, governor-generals and the Queen are private, the release of the letters... confirms that neither Her Majesty nor the Royal Household had any part to play in Kerr's decision to dismiss Whitlam." 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-53386554.amp ;




Being an accomplice is just as bad as doing said crime.

If you'd be fine with someone knowing who murdered a close family member, but that person hid the confession letter for half a century, then that's on you, imo.

Why where they embargoed?! A private discussion of superseding democracy is no excuse.

She lied by omission of truth. Zero transparency and interference from a foreign nation.


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OfflineStable Genius
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: sudly]
    #27954953 - 09/17/22 04:57 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Ok so you've come to understand she didn't advise Kerr, through Martin Charteris, to sack Whitlam, cool :thumbup: Kerr even states he purposely didn't advise the Queen of his ultimate decision, so as to distance her from the situation.

The letters that were released were actually Kerr's copies, not The Queens, held by the National Archives in Canberra, which refused to release them because they were deemed as private documents.
Kerr resigned in 1977. Respectfully, maybe you could do some snooping around and tell us both why they chose 50 years as an appropriate time frame to withhold them as I don't know why.

What I do understand is that the High Court eventually ruled they belonged to The Commonwealth, but it appears the Queen and Kerr were both stuck following protocol.

Here's a different angle to look at this from; if she chose to release private documents(don't forget they were also Kerr's) then that action would have been a purposeful foray into our democracy. I think she very wisely chose the correct course of action :shrug:

As for your question about me being fine with someone keeping their mouth shut with knowledge of a murder, I'm going to choose to ignore that one.

I'd be interested to see what you can find about the National Archives though. Cheers :thumbup:

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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Stable Genius] * 1
    #27982781 - 10/05/22 01:09 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Jefferson Earl, a political candidate for the Federal 2022 election in Australia sends a message to Vladimir Putin from Melbourne:



I don't know anything about him other than this video, but he's fed up with Western disinformation to Australia and is calling for truth.  Have you heard of him?


--------------------
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #27982808 - 10/05/22 01:29 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Jefferson Earl [...] I don't know anything about him other than this video, but he's fed up with Western disinformation to Australia and is calling for truth.  Have you heard of him?




That's the risk of searching for random individuals based on the criteria that they repeat the talking points you already believe.

Here's some of his most recent tweets:

Quote:

#TruthAboutMRNAVaccines
https://t.co/u3Ic9M2CVa




Quote:

@Partisangirl I agree totally with his comments.  Just because the westscontrolled media wants us to follow their narrative continually doesn’t mean I have to. Putin seems sane compared to Biden, Clinton and Obama. Anyone who cannot see the west is deeply involved in Satanism has closed eyes.




Quote:

@ellymelly God is not done yet. The greatest darkness and greatest hope will begin in 2023. The next virus dice is about to be rolled, many will die, but through it the perpetrators of both virus 1 & 2 and the highly evil 💉 will be brought to justice. Late 2023 to Mid 2024 justice rises.




Quote:

Many of the western leaders currently in power are working solely against the interests of their people. They lie consistently and are much more dangerous than Russia. China releases a Bio Weapon on us and Russia is the bad guy? This is laughable if it wasn’t so damn scary.




Quote:

Russia fought against the Nazis in WW2, Russia fought side by side with the west against ISIS.  It is a FACT that a Coup d'état took place in Ukraine sponsored by Mr. George Soros.  See the film by Oliver Stone called Ukraine Under Fire https://t.co/AIDG169BKt




Quote:

@UHhospitals Do you even understand why the variants are developing.  For your information it’s called immune escape. Your pathetic biological JABS have created this mess. Natural immunity would have lead to virus extinction but now you just chase your tail with additional mRNA.




Quote:

New study on ivermectin finds 92% effectiveness at stopping death from COVID - LifeSite. When the masses learn what has been done to them, they will finally join us in bringing to account the people who have deliberately done this to humanity. #NIHgate  https://t.co/XTvoDGU8bw




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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: shivas.wisdom]
    #27982910 - 10/05/22 02:38 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Too much of a religious fanatic for my liking, but otherwise he sounds reasonable.


--------------------
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #27982968 - 10/05/22 03:03 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

"the highly evil 💉"

"China releases a Bio Weapon on us"

"Coup d'état took place in Ukraine sponsored by Mr. George Soro"

"Natural immunity would have lead to virus extinction"

"New study on ivermectin finds 92% effectiveness at stopping death from COVID"


___ ___ ___



He sounds reasonable to you? Why don't you just be upfront and say 'people who confirm my bias appear more reasonable to me than people who challenge it'.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: shivas.wisdom]
    #27983177 - 10/05/22 05:16 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
"the highly evil 💉"

"China releases a Bio Weapon on us"

"Coup d'état took place in Ukraine sponsored by Mr. George Soro"

"Natural immunity would have lead to virus extinction"

"New study on ivermectin finds 92% effectiveness at stopping death from COVID"


___ ___ ___



He sounds reasonable to you? Why don't you just be upfront and say 'people who confirm my bias appear more reasonable to me than people who challenge it'.



I'll be upfront and say people who have evidence-based arguments appear more reasonable to me than people who make believe.  Which of the above (other than "highly evil" which is subjective), do you believe has no evidence?


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #27983213 - 10/05/22 05:33 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Not a single one of those quotes is an evidence-based argument, so take your pick.

PS: to preempt a rehashing of your ol' Ukrainian coup argument, that quote is specifically about attributing events to George Soros.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: shivas.wisdom]
    #27983295 - 10/05/22 06:11 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
to preempt a rehashing of your ol' Ukrainian coup argument, that quote is specifically about attributing events to George Soros.



Soros' International Renaissance Foundation funded organizations and news channels that encouraged revolution in Ukraine rather than waiting for the next scheduled election.

Maybe you're a fan of violent revolution, but regardless, Soros' money fueled things that encouraged the coup.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 2
    #27983297 - 10/05/22 06:14 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

S
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
"the highly evil 💉"

"China releases a Bio Weapon on us"

"Coup d'état took place in Ukraine sponsored by Mr. George Soro"

"Natural immunity would have lead to virus extinction"

"New study on ivermectin finds 92% effectiveness at stopping death from COVID"


___ ___ ___



He sounds reasonable to you? Why don't you just be upfront and say 'people who confirm my bias appear more reasonable to me than people who challenge it'.



I'll be upfront and say people who have evidence-based arguments appear more reasonable to me than people who make believe.  Which of the above (other than "highly evil" which is subjective), do you believe has no evidence?




Hard to believe anyone took you seriously at one point


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”

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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: koods] * 1
    #27983343 - 10/05/22 06:38 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Oh ya, well you're a big fat poo poo head too (if that's how you prefer to debate).


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #27983344 - 10/05/22 06:38 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Soros' International Renaissance Foundation funded organizations and news channels that encouraged revolution in Ukraine rather than waiting for the next scheduled election.

Maybe you're a fan of violent revolution, but regardless, Soros' money fueled things that encouraged the coup.




Turning 'International Renaissance Foundation funds Ukrainian NGO's' into 'George Soros sponsored a coup d'état in Ukraine' isn't an evidence-based argument - it's conspiracy theory that falls in line with the countless other Soros conspiracy theories. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Soros_conspiracy_theories

What evidence are you aware of for the other quotes in my post?


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: shivas.wisdom]
    #27983355 - 10/05/22 06:43 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Turning 'International Renaissance Foundation funds Ukrainian NGO's' into 'George Soros sponsored a coup d'état in Ukraine' isn't an evidence-based argument



More like 'International Renaissance Foundation funds Ukrainian NGO's pushing revolution in Ukraine.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #27983372 - 10/05/22 06:53 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Okay? That's still a far cry from 'George Soros sponsored a coup d'état in Ukraine'. An evidence-based argument would detail how Soros is personally behind decisions made by the IRF, and how the IRF is responsible for decisions made by the relevant NGO's, and how those NGO's are responsible for the events in 2014 Ukraine. Otherwise, 'George Soros sponsored a coup d'état in Ukraine' remains a conspiracy theory.

What evidence are you aware of for the other quotes in my post?


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Re: The Australian Politics Thread [Re: shivas.wisdom]
    #27983393 - 10/05/22 07:11 PM (1 year, 7 months ago)

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Okay? That's still a far cry from 'George Soros sponsored a coup d'état in Ukraine'. An evidence-based argument would detail how Soros is personally behind decisions made by the IRF, and how the IRF is responsible for decisions made by the relevant NGO's, and how those NGO's are responsible for the events in 2014 Ukraine. Otherwise, 'George Soros sponsored a coup d'état in Ukraine' remains a conspiracy theory.



That's like saying you want 100% proof rather than greater than 50%.  Enlil's favorite strategy.

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
What evidence are you aware of for the other quotes in my post?



Your post literally included a link to the ivermectin evidence.  Here's one link to the actual study.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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