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InvisibleBaba Yaga

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 407
Panaeolus in Mono Tubs * 9
    #27252786 - 03/14/21 07:00 PM (4 months, 14 days ago)

Panaeolus in Mono Tubs

Hi there, today I like to share my experience with growing Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in mono tubs. I did this three years ago for
the first time with surprisingly good results although I had to go away after the first pins showed only to come back to a nice flush.




It was probably a good thing that I had to go away or otherwise I might have fucked it up back then lol, instead I witnessed that Pans can
do well in a mono tub without micro-managing the grow. I have repeated this a few times now with similar results but to be honest I haven't
matched the first grow in terms of size of the fruits. I guess I should have taken a few clones back then.

But nevertheless I managed to repeatedly grow a decent amount of Pans in mono tubs so far and if there was a tub that performed not so well
it was due to contamination (trich before or during first flush). Anyway, I hope this thread will help to encourage people that can't or don't want
to built a controlled fruiting chamber to get into Pan Cult.







Thanks to everyone who has put their time and energy into pan cultivation and providing all this
great information on the forum and I hope that there will be many more to come.

Check out the threads of great contributers like Asura, Jakeoncid419, MacMerdin, jcm4620, Blue Helix,
mary fairchild and more and of course the Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread.



DISCLAIMER

This is a write up about how I'm doing things around here, so I wouldn't call it a TEK as this is still a work in progress but I'm
getting consistent results so far as long as my spawn is clean and it doesn't look like total garbage what I'm doing so why not share.

Now as always there is no guarantee that this will work in exactly the same way for you as it does for me. Always keep in mind that what I am
writing here are just guidelines and no definitive instructions, well they could be but they don't have to and when I say: "On day 3 I do this
or that" it could well be that on my next grow it will be day 4 or what ever before I move on to the next stage. It's all fluid to some degree.


BASIC MATERIALS & METHODS INVOLVED

CULTURES, GRAIN & INOCULATION

There is lots of information about what you have to look out for when taking transfers from your germination plate so I will not get into any
details regarding this. All I like to say is that I germinate spores on LME agar and keep the germination plates at reasonable room temperature
or it might take forever before showing growth.....and I use prints, they are waaaay more reliable.

Grains I use are wheat, rye or oats, mostly oats though cause I get them for cheap at the moment and they are super clean.

LC is used to inoculate spawn jars and I do put the donor plate for my LC to grain as well if I feel like it.
A word of advice: don't shoot spores directly into spawn jars or LC broth, keep control over your grow and stay on top of things, spores
to grain or LC might save you a little bit of time in the few cases where it's actually working but will cost you a lot of time if it doesn't.


MONO TUBS

The mono tubs I use at the moment look like this:



Two different styles that work equally well with what I'm doing.

I guess you can make a lot of things work if you are able to get a good feeling for what a mushroom species needs and translate that into
sensible measures to provide good conditions with what you are working with. If you are using unmodified tubs then you have to do things
differently to control FAE, I've never used unmodified tubs so I wouldn't have the slightest clue how to work those but they are on the
list of things to try.


BULK SUBSTRATE

50-60% aged horse manure and 50-40% coir is what I use. The horse manure and coir are getting prepped separately. The coir gets bucket teked
and the horse manure gets pasteurized. I usually prep the manure a bit on the wetter side and the coir a bit dryer, once its mixed its all good to go.

For pasteurization I use a sous vide / slow cooker and pasteurize for 8-12 hours @ 155oF (68oC) (basically just like Jakeoncid419). This is easy and
foolproof and thanks to the timer and temp control of the cooker I don’t have to baby sit and break any sweat over getting it too hot.
Nothing wrong with pasteurizing in jars on a stove top but I've never done it often enough to develop a routine.




CASING

I pasteurize 10 parts peat, 10 parts vermiculite and a 1/4 part hydrated lime for adjusting pH, this is a standard recipe that many use and I
would suggest that you stick with this if you are just starting out with Pan cultivation as it is the standard and it works. This doesn't mean
that other casings won't work but as a beginner you should focus on getting the conditions right before you mess around with alternative
materials and it will make it easier for others to trouble shoot your grow if you stick to standard materials.


FROM SPAWN TO FRUITS

SPAWNING / COLONIZATION / CONSOLIDATION

For spawning I set up my tub like this.

Bottom holes taped shut with masking tape and top holes taped up halfway with masking tape and a double layer of micropore tape over the
other half. Spawning ratio is @ 1:4 grain to manure/coir sub, substrate depth: 2", temperature: 68-82oF (20-28oC)




Now I know that Pans are moving fast and your sub will look like it’s ready around day six, but here is the most important thing to do. Let
the substrate consolidate! I let it sit for 3-4 more days which puts the spawn run at around 10 days. Casing earlier than that will increase
the chance of getting overlay in my experience.

But honestly, it is of advantage if you let the substrate get to the point where it is begging you for a casing which can look like this
when consolidating pan cambos:




A couple of days can make a significant difference in how your substrate surface is going to turn out. Here a comparison 8 days vs. 10
days of total colonization, same LC, 2 days after casing. In the third image you can see where a too early cased tub will end up...not ideal.




This will obviously vary from culture to culture and for other reasons but I have a few tubs going at the moment and there are noticeable differences
between earlier and later cased substrates.


FRUITING

When it's time to fruit I case with peat/verm 50/50 pH adjusted with hydrated lime. The casing is about 1/4" thick but due to bumps in the
surface it varies and might be a bit thicker or thinner in places.

The fruiting requires ~3 days of minimal attention to get the substrate on its way. My main agenda here is to get as much water into the
sub/casing as I can before it starts pinning. Temperature: 68-82oF (20-28oC) but I try to keep it above 73oF (23oC) during fruiting.


Day 1 of Fruiting

Removing one of the micropore layers on the top holes and then I remove  the masking tape on bottom holes and place a single strip of micropore
tape so it covers half the hole.



The casing gets a light mist on day 1.


Day 2 of Fruiting

On day 2 I give the casing a really good mist so it starts to glisten and do repeat if the shine disappears after a short wait. Just enough
to get the glistening back.


Day 3 of Fruiting

I give the casing another mist and go even harder than the last time til it looks like the casing can’t take anymore. I avoid pooling but
other than that I really go for it.



and this is usually the last time I need to mist the substrate, but there is always the exception and climate situations can differ.


KNOTTING / FIRST PINS

First knotting or the formation of primordia will appear around day 3 if you have left your subtrate to consolidate long enough.



Once I can see a good amount of knots and pins I restrict the airflow slightly by placing a second micropore strip over the bottom hole,
leaving a small gap between the two strips. The top holes stay the same.



This is all the maintenance it needs, for the rest of the time I lean back and watch the magic grow.


NOT SO FINAL THOUGHTS

This is how I am approaching Pans at the moment and there is more room for experimentation for sure. Some of the things I’d like to try out in
the future are:

  • repeating the grow but covering all holes with a single layer of micropore (hoping to avoid the occasional fungus gnats infestation).
  • refining conditions and re-hydration method after the first flush to optimize performance of subsequent flushes
  • using aged or partially composted grass clippings to substitute manure
  • get my arse up and cut down some of that straw in my shed to use for the bulk sub.
  • using store bought compost products instead of manure
  • playing around with un-modded fruiting vessels (monos, jars and bottles)
  • finally, if I’m getting the time I will try and stabilize genetics that seem to do well in monotubs, especially in lower temperatures at
    around or slightly above 68oF or 20oC.


This is a long enough list and I am going to start with taking some clones and see if I can improve my results that way and probably
will be having a couple of tubs running along to test some different sub and casing materials.


:sun:


Edited by Baba Yaga (06/15/21 05:47 AM)


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InvisibleBaba Yaga

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 407
Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: Baba Yaga]
    #27252787 - 03/14/21 07:01 PM (4 months, 14 days ago)

reserved for updates


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Invisibleelpico
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: Baba Yaga]
    #27252950 - 03/14/21 09:51 PM (4 months, 14 days ago)

Great stuff, thanks for sharing the details of your method.  I'm amazed at how well-developed those fruits look in the monotub environment.  Mine would be leggy as hell in there, that's for sure.


--------------------


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OfflinecronicrM
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: elpico]
    #27252997 - 03/14/21 10:42 PM (4 months, 14 days ago)

yep i always use my tubs for pans its just easier for me rather than build new chambers as i dont run a whole lot of pans

im about ready to case a cinctulus tub in about an hour, just waiting for the material to cool a bit more


--------------------

It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn

I'm tired do me a favor


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Offlinealaskappalachian
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: cronicr]
    #27253028 - 03/14/21 11:13 PM (4 months, 14 days ago)

Just wanted to say thanks for the writeup and the push over the edge to try a tub.  Also,  Cron I look forward to seeing the cinct tub. :rockon:


--------------------
What you do on this site matters.  Be humble.  Be kind.  Contribute.  You are paving the way.


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InvisibleModularMind
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: Baba Yaga]
    #27253088 - 03/14/21 11:59 PM (4 months, 14 days ago)

:juggle:


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OfflinecronicrM
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: ModularMind] * 1
    #27253095 - 03/15/21 12:03 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)



--------------------

It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn

I'm tired do me a favor


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InvisibleBaba Yaga

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 407
Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: cronicr]
    #27253118 - 03/15/21 12:25 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)

Quote:

cronicr said:





:camping:

Looking forward to seeing some pan tub action.


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OfflinetiptrippyS
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: Baba Yaga]
    #27253123 - 03/15/21 12:28 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)

Nice write up! Good work with the monotub pans. How much LC do you use per quart of spawn?


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InvisibleBaba Yaga

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 407
Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: tiptrippy]
    #27253149 - 03/15/21 12:49 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)

I pour LC from media bottles and get about 10 Jars with 100ml so around the 10 cc mark. Don't know if that is a lot or not, I don't shake after
inoculation but roll the jar in all directions and it does get absorbed after a day or two.


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OfflinecronicrM
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: Baba Yaga]
    #27253189 - 03/15/21 01:29 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)

i do anywhere from 5 to 10 cc's per qt or 20 to 30 per spawn bag


--------------------

It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn

I'm tired do me a favor


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InvisibleIntrepid
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: cronicr]
    #27253453 - 03/15/21 08:39 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)

Excellent write up. I’m planning to try a similar technique using shoeboxes soon.


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Invisiblecoversall
إِنْ شَاءَ ٱللَهُ‎


Registered: 06/06/20
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: Intrepid]
    #27253464 - 03/15/21 08:47 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)

Great write up! I got nowhere trying to fruit pans in a mono/dub tub setup. It all looked good them boom, no knots, no pins.


--------------------

..:: E V E R Y  ::..

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OfflineeLeSDenesS
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: coversall]
    #27253481 - 03/15/21 09:09 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)

fucking well done mate!!!!


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OnlinemushboyM
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: eLeSDenes]
    #27253516 - 03/15/21 09:40 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)

:popcorn:


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OfflineA.k.a
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: mushboy]
    #27253596 - 03/15/21 10:25 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)

Do you know what rh in your spot is?


I’m about to try this too but I’m pretty sure it’s so dry where I’m at I won’t be able to get enough fae without frying them.


We’ll see though.



Awesome tubs man.


--------------------
LAGM2020


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OfflinecronicrM
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: A.k.a]
    #27253607 - 03/15/21 10:32 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)

i use ez felt for my pan tubs, they allow for a lot more fresh air exchange for me as its dry as fuck with my heater on even with a humidifier running when i remember it


--------------------

It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn

I'm tired do me a favor


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Offlineodissey
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Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: A.k.a]
    #27253612 - 03/15/21 10:35 AM (4 months, 14 days ago)

This is just what I was looking for! Fantastic results, congratz! How many holes in total do you have? How high above the substrate are the holes? Do you mist often? you never fan?
Thanks!


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InvisibleBaba Yaga

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 407
Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: odissey]
    #27254185 - 03/15/21 05:38 PM (4 months, 13 days ago)

Thanks guys!

Quote:

A.k.a said:
Do you know what rh in your spot is?





I looked it up and its around 50-65% in summer, when I had a few tubs running at the same time the room climate changed for the better.
I would run a few tubs parallel and try different things, I think you can reduce FAE quite a bit once the pin set is in and if necessary try to
hand water the casing with a syringe or put a little water down the side.

Running a humidifier like cron said sounds like a good idea.



Quote:

odissey said:
This is just what I was looking for! Fantastic results, congratz! How many holes in total do you have? How high above the substrate are the holes? Do you mist often? you never fan?
Thanks!




I never ever fan and never mist once the pins are popping the lid stays on, that is why I'm pumping in water in the first 3 days of fruiting.
The holes are about 1 inch above sub surface and I run tubs with two holes at bottom and two holes at top and some with 4 holes at the
bottom and no holes at the top cause they have vented lids. Use what ever tub you are using for your cube grows, it won't matter that much.

Main things are: a good culture, sufficient consolidation, enough water from the beginning and temps somewhere between 73oF and 82oF

Good indicators for me are: I open the lid and a thick plume of moist air is touching my face and the casing retains a glistening/shiny surface
throughout fruiting.

And as said above don't run just one tub but make it 4 or 5 and you can try slightly different setups.


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InvisibleBaba Yaga

Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 407
Re: Panaeolus Cambodginiensis in Mono Tubs [Re: Baba Yaga]
    #27254208 - 03/15/21 05:50 PM (4 months, 13 days ago)

Shit, all this talk makes me antsy to start a new grow but I am planning on doing up the room I use for cult, putting in insulation and maybe a vapor barrier.

Next week I will rip the lining off the walls and ceiling, any bets on how many rat nests I will find?


Edited by Baba Yaga (03/15/21 06:12 PM)


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