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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto *inoculation day update* * 4
    #27163702 - 01/22/21 04:37 PM (1 month, 11 days ago)

How to Prep Unsealed Spawn Bags


What up mush cult!
Seen lots of posts lately concerning bags and how to keep them from popping during the PC cycle, as well as
whether or not they should be sealed or not sealed before cooking, and whether or not to use tyvek etc inside the bag.

If you've asked any of these questions before, then this thread is for you! I will be documenting how I cook bags
in a 23qt presto, unsealed, no tyvek, 6 at a time as well as documenting their inoculation, as I don't use a sealer and instead use zip ties to close bags.

Aight, I start with Wheat prepped using this method:smirk:


Grain meant for bags is removed from the heat just a little bit early since bags cook longer and grains can get mushy if overhydrated.


Once the grain is dry on the outside, start filling your bags! I use .2 micron bags for spawn, and I use that red scoop and a canning funnel (fucking great tool)
to scoop roughly 4qt of grain per bag. I don't really measure but 2 of those scoops is a bit over a mycoquart.

I made enough bags for 2 presto 23qts, so 12 bags total. Fill all your bags then set them aside to do the gussets after.

I am extremely anal about my gussets. If they aint straight then I aint happy:lol:

Start by placing your bags with the gussets upright and the grain inside as level a possible

Line up your gussets and try to remove as much air from the bag as possible. Turn over your bag and try to remove as much
grain from the little triangles on the short side of the bag as you can to make lining up the gussets easier and allow the bag to sit flat.

Trust me this helps a lot.

Explaining the fold is a little difficult so the visual aids here really help.
Lay the top of your bag over so the filter is facing up. At this point you want to try to remove as much air as possible from the bag.
Bags need to be nearly void of air so the grain can properly sterilize and to minimize inflation during the cycle. Seriously, don't skimp on this!!

As you can see the gussets are perfectly lined up and most of the air has been removed from the bag. Now it's time for the accordion fold.

With the bag in the above position and the filter facing up, fold the bag towards you so the filter is now facing down and
the crease is nearly flush with the long side of the bag like so


Bag should look like this from a profile view


Now take the top of the bag and accordion fold it away from you so the bag looks like this. The filter will be sealed
between the bag and the accordion fold after the cook which will protect it from the elements.


Now set the bag aside, accordion fold down, that way the weight of the bag will help crease the fold and keep the accordion from unfolding. Now fold the rest of your bags and stack them in the same manner to be loaded.

12 bags, 2 prestos

Now it's time to load up the bags. Pick one up and the accordion fold should be nice and creased like so


So I do 3 levels of 2 bags side by side per presto. Put a trivet down with a couple jar rings under it then take a
bag and place it in the cooker. Take another bag and squeeze it in there next to the first bag. Now add water til it
comes a little less than halfway up the bags. level 1 should look like so


Now, to separate the bags from the walls of the pressure cooker which helps them not pop, place jar rings between
the walls of the cooker and the bags, and a single jar ring between the bags themselves


Place a trivet or plate over the 1st level


Do the 2nd level just like the 1st. I like to alternate the direction my bags face as it helps with stability of the stack, like a jenga tower.


Place a trivet over layer 2


Do the 3rd layer the same as the first 2


Now lay a plate or trivet on top of the 3rd level to stop the upper bags from inflating and blocking the vent. A little inflation is inevitable


Both PCs packed and ready to go. No towels necessary to fill voids and no tyvek slips.


I cook my bags for 3hrs minimum and often do 3.5hrs if I have the time. I also run it at near 17psi since I live at over 8000ft. If you live closer to sea level, just run it at 15psi to minimize over heating.

Once the cook is done, allow it to cool completely before opening. I like to do my cooks at night so that I can just
turn the stove off, go to bed, and wake up the next day to unload. You want to give at least a few hrs of cool down
so the PC can pull a proper vacuum and seal the bags.

When I open the PC the bags have slightly deformed but that's ok. They also shrunk quite a bit due to the vacuum


The top layer is pulled out and as you can see the gussets opening is completely sealed


Middle layer is less deformed since they had more weight on them and again gussets are sealed


In this photo you can see how the filter is sealed between the bag and the fold so it isn't exposed to the elements


Ok and the bottom layer of bags. Usually it's less deformed than the top two and again the gussets are sealed


After unloading both prestos, I take all my bags and stack them carefully, so as to not disturb the seal, into a tub with a lid to be saved
until I've cooked all the bags I need, in this case that's near 80 bags! They last just fine in the tub for the
few days it takes me to cook all the bags I need.


Bags are a daunting task and when they pop it can be a serious damper on your day and a whole 3hr cook wasted. This is how I do
my bags and out of the hundreds I run per year, I rarely have a popped bag. Seriously, maybe 1 or 2 total and usually
only because I let the PC get too hot.

Towels to fill empty space, bricks to elevate bags, sealing, etc are all unnecessary and only take up space that can
be filled by 2 more bags!

Hope this helps some of you and don't worry, I'll be back to update this thread once all bags are cooked, inoculated, and colonized! Thanks for following along!



--------------------
Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind.
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.




Edited by natedawgnow (01/28/21 01:30 PM)


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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: natedawgnow] * 1
    #27163723 - 01/22/21 04:49 PM (1 month, 11 days ago)

INOCULATION DAY
How to g2g to bags without a sealer

Sup. So the other day I took the tote of bags out to the tiny house where my hood currently resides. It's friggin cold in there so I work quick when I'm out there haha

I had 36 bags to do and I thought it would be a good idea to document how I do them. So without further ado...

I typically g2g 1 jar to 2 bags


Start by breaking up the master jar. Then wipe it down after it's nice and broken up. DO NOT  try to break it up after wiping it down, it will be slippery and possibly fly out of your hand :lol:

As you finish wiping it down, unscrew the lid until it is just seated and set it off to the side. Unscrewing it before the time comes just saves you from fumbling around infront of open bags when the time comes.


Now it's time to wipe down the bags. I start by wiping down the top and sides


Then start wiping down the folds of the bag but be careful not to break the seal!


I dont bother wiping down the actual gussets since they're sealed pretty tight.
I got my filter patch a little wet with Iso while wiping it down. Thats ok but try not to get it wet at all.

Now unfold the bag and pull the gussets up. You can see how well the vacuum is pulled by the pc in this pic


Turn the bag so the filter is facing the hood and run your fingers up the gussets on both sides to break the remaining seal and to separate them.


Now grab opposing corners and pull on them to open the gussets all the way. Exactly like opening a bag of popcorn


Now grab your master jar and remove the lid. I like to palm the lid in my left hand and pour with my right, but for this photo I put the lid down so I could take the pic with my left hand. I always pour from the side and slightly behind the bag so there is no chance of the jar getting between the bag and the filter face.

Now sometimes the bag is gonna wanna flop over or close on you, so I gently pull on a corner to open it more with my left hand as I pour. Just make sure not to put your hand over the bag opening.

Pour in a however much you want. I do 1 jar to 2 bags so I try to pour half a jar per bag. Recap the master jar and set it to the side for bag number 2.

Now for the zip ties. I keep mine on top of my hood for easy access


Start by taking the bag you just g2g'd to and bring the gussets inward (while keeping as much air in the bag as possible, the plenum is necessary) to a bundle or bunch like so

While doing this try not to get your hand over the opening of the bag and minimize your hand going between the bag and the filter. For this photo my hand is between the bag and filter so you can easily see what I mean by a bundle or bunch.

Then fold the top of the bag over


Now take your zip tie and zip tie the fold closed like so


Make sure to pull it as tight as possible. And there you have it


All 36 done the same way


It's so cold in here the bags cant stay. I store them in my house so they just sit on that shelf til I'm done with the g2g then they all get moved again.

Thanks for following, I'll update this thread with some mushrooms so you know it works :lol:





Edited by natedawgnow (01/28/21 01:27 PM)


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Offlinesonoramo
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: natedawgnow]
    #27163724 - 01/22/21 04:51 PM (1 month, 11 days ago)

"...in this case that's near 80 bags..."  You could start a separate thread on how to distribute the product from that many bags...  :takingnotes:


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OfflineCulliganman360
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: sonoramo]
    #27163739 - 01/22/21 04:58 PM (1 month, 11 days ago)

Quote:

sonoramo said:
"...in this case that's near 80 bags..."  You could start a separate thread on how to distribute the product from that many bags...  :takingnotes:



:trollcop:


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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: sonoramo]
    #27163745 - 01/22/21 05:01 PM (1 month, 11 days ago)

Quote:

sonoramo said:
"...in this case that's near 80 bags..."  You could start a separate thread on how to distribute the product from that many bags...  :takingnotes:



I cook bags for more than just cubes :shrug:


--------------------
Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind.
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.




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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: natedawgnow] * 2
    #27163798 - 01/22/21 05:23 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Thanks for writing this up Dawg

It wouldn’t be very hard to distribute that many bags.


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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: Land Trout]
    #27163815 - 01/22/21 05:31 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Pretty sure he was talkong about distributing mushrooms from that many bags.

AKA asking me to incriminate myself :kingcrankey:

Not cool, bro. Not cool

I use all my mushies as bait :fishing:

Trout love em


--------------------
Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind.
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.




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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: natedawgnow]
    #27163835 - 01/22/21 05:40 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Just sayin the market for oysters and shiitake is pretty wide.


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Invisiblemushhead
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: Land Trout]
    #27163836 - 01/22/21 05:40 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

:threadmonitor:
I'll be using this for oysters mainly.
Lions mane too :loveeyes:


Edited by mushhead (01/22/21 06:15 PM)


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OfflineHide
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: Land Trout]
    #27163895 - 01/22/21 06:10 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

362 bags?


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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: Land Trout] * 1
    #27163904 - 01/22/21 06:15 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Land Trout said:
Just sayin the market for oysters and shiitake is pretty wide.



I have an edible and medicinal mushroom business. We sell tinctures and whole fruits.
Currently stocked in 3 stores and organizing a local farmers market this spring in the town we just moved to:rockon:


--------------------
Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind.
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.




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Invisiblemushhead
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: natedawgnow]
    #27163914 - 01/22/21 06:17 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Quote:

natedawgnow said:
Quote:

Land Trout said:
Just sayin the market for oysters and shiitake is pretty wide.



I have an edible and medicinal mushroom business. We sell tinctures and whole fruits.
Currently stocked in 3 stores and organizing a local farmers market this spring in the town we just moved to:rockon:



This is the dream right there.
It's what all my cultivation practice is leading me to.


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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: natedawgnow]
    #27163915 - 01/22/21 06:17 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Is that your pic land trout? Would love an actual autoclave.

Working on a propane atmospheric steam sterilizer cause I dont have any electricity out
here. But damn running that many bags at once would be nice haha


--------------------
Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind.
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.




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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: natedawgnow]
    #27163936 - 01/22/21 06:25 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Solid!! :rockon:


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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: natedawgnow] * 1
    #27163939 - 01/22/21 06:26 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Quote:

mushhead said:
Quote:

natedawgnow said:
Quote:

Land Trout said:
Just sayin the market for oysters and shiitake is pretty wide.



I have an edible and medicinal mushroom business. We sell tinctures and whole fruits.
Currently stocked in 3 stores and organizing a local farmers market this spring in the town we just moved to:rockon:



This is the dream right there.
It's what all my cultivation practice is leading me to.



Start an LLC and just start growing mushies man. My first contract back a few years ago,
I just called fancy restaurants downtown, spoke to the chef, and asked if they had a mushroom supplier.

A vegan restaurant did but only for oysters and agaricus so I brought them a sample
of shiitake and lions mane and they loved em. It's that easy.

The tinctures are a but more niche but all you have to do is call local apothecaries
or health food stores and bring samples of your product, Certificates of analysis if you make claims about the content of something, etc.

File your taxes and youre good to go. Dont expect to make bank right out the gate though

Good luck man, starting my own business was the most rewarding decision I ever made


--------------------
Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind.
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.




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OfflineLemgrub
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: natedawgnow]
    #27163959 - 01/22/21 06:41 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Good info, thanks a lot. The few bags I trial ran all contammed, so I've been waiting to try it again once I saw a good write-up on no preseal bags. :thumbup:


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Invisiblemushhead
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: natedawgnow]
    #27163964 - 01/22/21 06:42 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Quote:

natedawgnow said:
Quote:

mushhead said:
Quote:

natedawgnow said:
Quote:

Land Trout said:
Just sayin the market for oysters and shiitake is pretty wide.



I have an edible and medicinal mushroom business. We sell tinctures and whole fruits.
Currently stocked in 3 stores and organizing a local farmers market this spring in the town we just moved to:rockon:



This is the dream right there.
It's what all my cultivation practice is leading me to.



Start an LLC and just start growing mushies man. My first contract back a few years ago,
I just called fancy restaurants downtown, spoke to the chef, and asked if they had a mushroom supplier.

A vegan restaurant did but only for oysters and agaricus so I brought them a sample
of shiitake and lions mane and they loved em. It's that easy.

The tinctures are a but more niche but all you have to do is call local apothecaries
or health food stores and bring samples of your product, Certificates of analysis if you make claims about the content of something, etc.

File your taxes and youre good to go. Dont expect to make bank right out the gate though

Good luck man, starting my own business was the most rewarding decision I ever made



I am as the mushroom is, very patient.
Once my process is more refined I'll follow your advice closely, seems like its a good route.


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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: natedawgnow]
    #27163978 - 01/22/21 06:48 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Quote:

natedawgnow said:
Is that your pic land trout? Would love an actual autoclave.

Working on a propane atmospheric steam sterilizer cause I dont have any electricity out
here. But damn running that many bags at once would be nice haha



No, I’m nowhere near that yet


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OfflineJarhead3521S
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: Land Trout]
    #27164061 - 01/22/21 07:36 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

The update going to include the zip ties, I assume?  I’ll be looking for it, bags in a SAB are a real pain.  But this is good knowledge until then.

Edit: reading comprehension is important, disregard.


Edited by Jarhead3521 (01/22/21 07:40 PM)


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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: Always be baggin: How to efficiently run unsealed bags in a presto [Re: Jarhead3521]
    #27164122 - 01/22/21 08:05 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Yup yup. I'm cooking 12 more right now. Hopefully in a couple days I'll be ready for inoc and zip ties.
I use a hood. It's doable in a sab but not practical for much more than a couple bags


--------------------
Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind.
And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.




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