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OfflinePantsR4squares
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Registered: 11/02/13
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Help with bulk problem
    #27146103 - 01/13/21 05:07 PM (1 month, 15 days ago)

I came into an issue with everyone of my bulk bins. About half way through consolidating they became very pungent with a sour bacterial smell. the more mature bins started turning trich.

I also have shoe bins going of all the same cultures, which are doing completely fine throughout fruiting.

My cultures were all clean to my knowledge started from MS on agar then multiple transfers. Then inoc to oats with a wedge.

I'm trying to zero in on what happened to my bulk bins. My only theory is that they didn't have enough fresh air during consolidating. Being they have a tighter fitting lid vs the shoe boxes. Here are pictures of both shoebox and tote. Btw I kept the totes unlatched.



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OfflineDigDug
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Registered: 05/05/20
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Re: Help with bulk problem [Re: PantsR4squares]
    #27146137 - 01/13/21 05:36 PM (1 month, 15 days ago)

What were you use for the grain spawn?  I had an instance where every jar I made with oats from a particular bag turned out dirty.  Once I got rid of these oats, everything went back to being clean, as usual.  I’m not saying that’s the problem, but it just sounded similar to something I have had happen.


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OfflineDigDug
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Re: Help with bulk problem [Re: DigDug]
    #27146143 - 01/13/21 05:40 PM (1 month, 15 days ago)

Haha, just now read you used oats.  I didn’t see that before.  My money is on the oats.  They have thick husks and can potentially harbor mold/bacteria that somehow doesn’t get killed in the PC.  Most shroomery members will probably not agree with me on this, but I’ve had it happen and getting rid of them fixed the problem.


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OfflinePantsR4squares
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Re: Help with bulk problem [Re: DigDug]
    #27146223 - 01/13/21 06:23 PM (1 month, 15 days ago)

That was a thought on my mind but the shoeboxes are thriving off the same bag off oats..
The totes have foam around the seal of the lid and I'm guessing it's sealed too much and blocking air exchange letting the bacteria thrive. The totes should be fully colonized by 10 days but they are only 60% at best. Whole the shoeboxes fully colonized in 7 days. Same ratio of spawn to coir/verm 1:2 I also take the extra step to properly pasteurize my coir/verm.
If the oats were the problem the shoeboxes would be toast as well, right?


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OfflineDigDug
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Re: Help with bulk problem [Re: PantsR4squares]
    #27146277 - 01/13/21 06:54 PM (1 month, 15 days ago)

Yeah, you're right.  I had success with the same bag of oats that messed up all my jars.  I'm lucky the problem became visible before I spawned the jars to bulk.

As far as the lid, I don't think that's the case.  I like the sub colonize with no FAE holes and this has never been a problem. 

I'd like to hear some other opinions on this...

For me, the moral of the story is "FUCK OATS".  I'll never use them again because I couldn't trace the problem back to anything else.


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OfflineGlittergrower
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Re: Help with bulk problem [Re: DigDug]
    #27146293 - 01/13/21 07:06 PM (1 month, 15 days ago)

What strain are you using?  maybe it doesn't like the bigger tubs?  or maybe has something to do with the seal inside the lid?  im curious now as I'm getting ready to try those same tubs?  My two cents.


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OfflineSockadin
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Re: Help with bulk problem [Re: Glittergrower]
    #27146307 - 01/13/21 07:15 PM (1 month, 15 days ago)

Dirty Spawn. It is ok, it happens to everyone. IF you leave the shoeboxes long enough they will turn to Trich as well. The benefit of Shoeboxes over bulk subs is the time it takes to get to fruiting because of the spawn to sub ratio.

If you have an issue in your oats, it is either the spawn prep or agar. I would recommend sterilizing a fresh batch of jars and leaving them sealed for 3 weeks. If they contaminate in that time frame it is the oat prep. If they don't it is either the technique or the agar.


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InvisibleViolet
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Re: Help with bulk problem [Re: Sockadin]
    #27146552 - 01/13/21 10:07 PM (1 month, 15 days ago)

Make sure your oats are not only sterilized thoroughly but boiled thoroughly to begin with. I have to keep wheat at a full rolling boil for at least 40 minutes, stirring occasionally, to completely hydrate the inside of *all* the grains which will be pretty necessary to ensure you sterilized to the cores of the grains as well. And that's just wheat! Whole oats should take even longer because they're larger and have those husks. I thought oats were okay, but since I can also get wheat cheap, I find their smaller size to be preferable.

Some other troubleshooting check marks are relevant, too. Sterilizing jars for 90-120 minutes? Purging plenty of air from the cooker before sealing to build pressure?


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OfflinePantsR4squares
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Re: Help with bulk problem [Re: Violet]
    #27149058 - 01/15/21 06:01 AM (1 month, 14 days ago)

I bring oats to boil then time 40 minutes at rolling boil. I always check a few of the bigger grains by cutting in half with my nail. I say they are good when they is no more chalky white. Then strain over a big screen, tossing periodically letting evaporate for an hour. Load jars and PC for 2 hours. Letting purge for 10 minutes before putting the weight on. I pc @ about 17 psi
I can try going longer for the boil though. Also I will make a batch of control jars to leave for 3 weeks.
I have never tried wheat , is there a certain type you use? I've tried a few different grains over the years but prefer rgs and oats  for the short prep time. How's the prep with wheat?


Edited by PantsR4squares (01/15/21 06:19 AM)


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InvisibleViolet
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Re: Help with bulk problem [Re: PantsR4squares]
    #27150120 - 01/15/21 06:57 PM (1 month, 13 days ago)

Oh prep with wheat is easy to me. I just fill my big pot for the propane burner loosely 1/3 full, fill to a couple inches short from the top, and blare the burner. Until the boil gets rolling, grains on the bottom may be exposed to high heat for quite some time and will cook and burst early, so to reduce bursting and more evenly cook all the grains I stir them every few minutes when it's starting to get pretty hot but not boiling. Once the boiling is going solid, good heat sources will keep it rolling enough to stir itself so I set the timer I've found works for my heat and materials and forget about it until then.

I strain them in a couple sizable strainers (sometimes catching a big bowl of grainwater to process for agar or other projects), try to drop/shake some extra water from the strainers, and throw them on a screen insert like for a window propped up on two sides.  I'll turn them with my scoop a few times with a fan running nearby, and from one to several hours later I'll scoop em up into jars!

I'd do this with wheat for mass spawn for bulk substrate, which I do now only for gourmets/medicinals.  My favorite brown rice prep is quite different, and sometimes my grass seed preparation is a bit more gentle and less hurried too. I gotta make sure the brown rice isn't super soppy cooked but thoroughly soaked and expanded, and the grass seed not too sticky and wet so it remains relatively loose after sterilization.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> Mushroom Cultivation

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