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Invisiblewizard2k
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Registered: 05/26/03
Posts: 74
Loc: NRW
Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and other
    #2714076 - 05/22/04 08:22 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Hello dear shroomery members and readers,

what do you think about the idea to dismount a small cooling-unit from an old fridge and use it to drop the temperature inside a styrofoam-box for cold temp-lovers such as P. azurescens and P. semilanceata or Flammulina velutipes and other edibles?
Another possibility is the peltier thermo-electric heat pump.
Cooling one side, heating the other.

I wonder how that would influence my electricity bill :crazy:

But I'm sure you could do a lot with a low temerature-growroom.
bye, the wizard
What dou you think?
You may choose only one
Good idea, but nothing new
I have a better idea
Waste of money and time


Votes accepted from (05/22/04 02:00 AM) to (No end specified)
View the results of this poll



Edited by wizard2k (05/22/04 10:20 AM)


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and other [Re: wizard2k]
    #2714199 - 05/22/04 10:51 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

>what do you think about the idea to dismount a small cooling-unit from an old fridge

Why not use the old fridge directly?


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Invisiblewizard2k
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and other [Re: Anno]
    #2714260 - 05/22/04 11:28 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

That's a good question. I have no idea what's the best way to cool down some degrees below room temperature. I want to achieve temps between 10-20?C (50-68?F). A new fridge is too expensive for me, maybe I find an old one which is suitable. The termostate maybe has to be modified/exchanged, but I don't know. I thought, I could take the cooling-unit and use it to cool down the air inside styrofoam-boxes. YOu could combine several boxes with thermo-isloates pipes.
Are those peltier-elements inefficient? They look very handy.


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InvisibleSpeeker

Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and other [Re: wizard2k]
    #2714301 - 05/22/04 11:46 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

How about using evaporation for cooling...
Method is used sometimes as replacement for fridge where electricity is not available.
http://www.varaprasad.htmlplanet.com/custom3.html
http://www.rolexawards.com/journal/pdf/journal15-art3.pdf

:sun:


Edited by speeker (05/22/04 11:52 AM)


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Offlineragadinks
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: Speeker]
    #2714429 - 05/22/04 12:36 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

I like that idea with the water evaporation, but you have to consider that quite some water has to evaporate in order to cool the box down.
I do not know if in our climates enough water will evaporate.

Why not just exchanging the door of an old fridge with a glass door?
The termostat should not be much of an problem - I am sure you can manipulate it easily.


Edited by ragadinks (05/22/04 12:38 PM)


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Offlinepeachy
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: ragadinks]
    #2714722 - 05/22/04 03:04 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

I'm in favour of raga's old fridge + glass door idea. Sounds very promising. Does anyone have pics of such a setup?


--------------------
"Time bends, space is boundless. It squashes a man's ego. I feel lonely. Tell me, though... does Man, that marvel of the universe, that glorious paradox who sent me to the stars, still make war against his brother? Keep his neighbor's children starving?"


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: peachy]
    #2714765 - 05/22/04 03:18 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

>Does anyone have pics of such a setup?

Somethinjg like this:
http://www.shroomery.org/index/par/25150


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Invisibletrade_om
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Registered: 10/19/03
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: Anno]
    #2717481 - 05/23/04 06:05 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

so anyone did this again? or is this a one time success?


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Offlinepeachy
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: Anno]
    #2717488 - 05/23/04 06:18 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks Anno :laugh:


--------------------
"Time bends, space is boundless. It squashes a man's ego. I feel lonely. Tell me, though... does Man, that marvel of the universe, that glorious paradox who sent me to the stars, still make war against his brother? Keep his neighbor's children starving?"


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Invisiblewizard2k
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: peachy]
    #2718112 - 05/23/04 01:34 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks for your replies and ideas!
The best thing would be to find a cheap fridge with double-glazed front door (as shown in the tek).
I will keep my eyes open and hope to stumble across one.
But those Peltier-elements... I definitely have to find more information about them. They are used for camping-freezers.
I expect that they do not work efficient. Who knows?


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: wizard2k]
    #2721279 - 05/24/04 02:43 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

>I expect that they do not work efficient.

Efficient in terms of consumption of the electrical energy, you are right, they are not very efficient compared to a normal fridge.

"How efficient is a thermoelectric cooler?
Technically, the word efficiency relates to the amount of energy one gets out of a machine versus how much energy one puts into it. In heat pumping applications, this term is rarely used because the energy-in is very different from the service provided. We supply electrical energy to a TEC, but we get heat pumping. For TECs, it is standard to use "coefficient of performance" not efficiency. The coefficient of performance (COP) is the amount of heat pumping divided by the amount of supplied electrical power. In other words, COP tells you how many units of heat pumping you will get for each unit of electrical power you supply. It is possible, in special situations, to pump more watts of heat than the watts of electrical power input. COP depends on the application, heat pumped, and temperature differential required. Typically, the coefficient of performance, heat pumped then divided by input power, is between 0.4 and 0.7 for single stage applications. However, higher COPs can be achieved with optimized custom TECs. "

From http://www.marlow.com/TechnicalInfo/frequently_asked_questions_faqs.htm


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InvisibleSpeeker

Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: ragadinks]
    #2722628 - 05/24/04 02:04 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

I made a little cooling test...

temperature inside a beer can that was wrapped into a wet terry towel
dropped 4.4 degree Celsius (from 25.4 to 21) and it kept this
difference when the room temperature changed.

bigger vessel size, different fabric, draft... ???
What impact those have to the result...could it be improved...

:sun:


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Offlineragadinks
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: Speeker]
    #2723077 - 05/24/04 03:52 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

I think the parameters that influence the cooling capacity is amount of water evaporated per time and surface.
These factors depend on the temperature of the environment and evaporation surface.
Probably the ability of the container material to conduct heat is another factor.
So a copper container wrapped in black velvet and a high temperature of the air would give good results.
But I doubt that you can cool the vessel below 10 degrees Celsius with this method ( except the ambient temperature is below 10 degrees Celsius :wink: ).
But I have heard that they use clay jugs filled with water in hot countries in order to keep water - that is evaporating through the clay - cool.


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: ragadinks]
    #2723330 - 05/24/04 04:41 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Don't forget that evaporative cooling will also depend greatly on ambient humidity. In many dry parts of the world, such as the midwest USA where humidity is usually very low, evaporative cooling is used in lieu of air conditioning (sometimes called swamp coolers). Swamp coolers are nearly worthless in more humid areas, say the southeast USA, where the humidity is always pretty high.

I've lived in regions similar to both and know for a fact that evaporative cooling has no hope of cooling a substrate container to the desired ranges if you're ambient conditions are 90% rH. I also know for a fact that a swamp cooler can lower the temp in a 3000 sq. ft. house from 90*F to 65*F. So, I guess it all depends where you live.


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Offlineragadinks
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: mycofile]
    #2723780 - 05/24/04 06:20 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

From 90*F to 65*F would not be bad.
But do you know if it is possible to cool a smaller container to let's say 41*F - 54*F ?
It should be a kind of fridge for Ps. azures and other cold loving strains.
Maybe it could work if one would not evaporate water but something with a lower boiling point?


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: ragadinks]
    #2734980 - 05/27/04 02:31 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

>Maybe it could work if one would not evaporate water but something with a
>lower boiling point?

That's basically how a fridge works.....


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OfflineFungushead
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing shrooms [Re: ragadinks]
    #2735160 - 05/27/04 03:28 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Depending on where you live, a setup could be made out of buried nonfunctional refrigerator, which eventually would be about ground temp (it's on the low side here, like 40's -50's depending on the elevation). Humidification of your choice could be piped into the side or the top of it.

This would be my choice:

The continuous cabability nebulizer



price: free (disposable, obtained at work after use)
hooks up to: aquarium bubbler (cheap) <---hooked to timer
fill with: 50/50 water/3% peroxide


--------------------
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Offlineragadinks
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing shrooms [Re: Fungushead]
    #2737023 - 05/27/04 03:37 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

> it's on the low side here, like 40's -50's depending on the elevation

40-50 fahrenheit ? That's really low.
I think you would not need a fridge for growing azures where you live.


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Offlineragadinks
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing Azurs and oth [Re: Anno]
    #2737045 - 05/27/04 03:41 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

> That's basically how a fridge works.....

That's partly true because a fridge has an additional compressor that put's the cooling agent under pressure.
So you also need electrical energy for cooling.
That is what the "passive design" wants to avoid.


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: Cooling-unit from small fridge for growing shrooms [Re: ragadinks]
    #2737304 - 05/27/04 04:47 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

ragadinks said:
> it's on the low side here, like 40's -50's depending on the elevation

40-50 fahrenheit ? That's really low.
I think you would not need a fridge for growing azures where you live.




he's talking about ground temp. That's not really low. Temperatures undergrounnd stay the same year round in a given region. Even in the southeastern us where surface temps may be 100*F, the temperature just a little way underground will always be about 55*F year round. But on the surface, you would definitely need a fridge (unless you do as he suggests and pipe cold air from underground into your setup).


--------------------
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PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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