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Invisiblefungusul
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: Bakedbeings]
    #27294484 - 05/04/21 08:54 PM (1 month, 10 days ago)

Welcome to Shroomery! :mushroom2:

1. Use fine vermiculite but not dust. Coarse or medium vermiculite are not good for dry filter.

2. It's recommended to use wide mouth jars if you are planning to get them out to fruit them inside an SGFC or humidity chamber(HC). However if you plan to grate them to a shoe-box it doesn't really mater.

3. PF-TEK was designed to be used without a PC. However it's highly recommended to use one. If your are planning any grains/agar, then you must use one.

4. Using micropore tape is optional but it helps in my opinion. It's an extra layer of protection that prevents contamination of the dry layer during PC and before inoculation. The height of the dry layer(fine vermiculite) should be between 13mm-17mm. For size of holes you could use 1/8" = 0.12" = 3.05mm.

5. I use a paper-roll and Lysol. Alcohol 70% is also good.

Before drilling holes for SGFC, consider using a humidity chamber(HC). A lot easier with no maintenance whatsoever, better yields. Read more on Humidity Chamber Tek for fruiting BRF cakes


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OfflineBakedbeings
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: out_of_step]
    #27295439 - 05/05/21 01:57 PM (1 month, 9 days ago)

ive used just tinfoil instead of lids before and it works fine, i would suggest tightening your foil lids to the side of the jar with tape or a rubber band. you really dont want too much airflow introducing contams or drying out your brf. even tho the verm is a good shield if contans collect on top of the verm and you move the jar or tilt it to look at its progress that contam can shake its way down to the brf. its happened to me.

some people will say pf cakes need a pinhole to breath during colonization and in my experience thats nonsense. ive done cakes in sealed containers plenty of times and it seems to be that the o2 trapped in the container is more than enough for the mycelium to do its thing. but try whatever you feel like trying and enjoy the ride.


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Offlineout_of_step
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: Bakedbeings]
    #27295451 - 05/05/21 02:07 PM (1 month, 9 days ago)

I'm not doing sgfc it's too much messing and I'm trying to ruin as least reusable plastic as possible. If I drill holes in a box I can't use it for anything else.
I'm thinking of doing a couple of jars "in vitro" and the rest in shoeboxes. But I'll see what develops first.

I've got my verm and iso etc sorted now. I'm not using a pressure cooker. I'm just starting out so not investing in anything yet.

I've realised I just need to get on with it instead of asking too many questions of "what ifs..." that's part of the learning. It's all a big experiment and getting into a new hobby. But I will be asking more questions =)


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Offlineout_of_step
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: barfly]
    #27295455 - 05/05/21 02:11 PM (1 month, 9 days ago)

You seem well on your way by the sounds of it. Can you tell me more about your spawn coir? What type of container are you using and what quantities of coir mix with cake etc?


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Offlineout_of_step
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: Bakedbeings]
    #27295526 - 05/05/21 03:26 PM (1 month, 9 days ago)

Thanks for the reassurance! Yes I didn't want anything getting in the holes which is wHY ivr kept the foil lids on.. Time will tell!


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OfflineBakedbeings
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: out_of_step]
    #27295559 - 05/05/21 03:56 PM (1 month, 9 days ago)

i assume you still have the lids to the jars? if youre going invitro i would wait until the cakes are fully colonized, scrape out the loose verm on top, and then put the lids back on the jars loosely

regarding your question to barfly, 50/50 cake to coir will give you the fastest colonization time and the smallest chance of contam


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Offlinebarfly
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: out_of_step]
    #27295605 - 05/05/21 04:22 PM (1 month, 9 days ago)

Quote:

out_of_step said:
You seem well on your way by the sounds of it. Can you tell me more about your spawn coir? What type of container are you using and what quantities of coir mix with cake etc?




I'm using a 900ml ice-cream container :laugh:



I birthed a BRF cake, dunked it for about five hours and then crumbled it into the empty container. I added about the same amount of coir(more or less, haven't been exact), mixed it and then covered it with a layer of coir. Gave it a good spraying, covered it loosely with the lid and put it on the shelf.

Well, actually I did all that twice, but you get the idea...

That was on Saturday. These Ice-cream-boxes have been colonising like crazy since:



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Offlineout_of_step
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: barfly]
    #27295633 - 05/05/21 04:45 PM (1 month, 9 days ago)

Amazing! Keep us posted on progress! It's exciting seeing the different stages.
How long did it take for your jars to colonise from inoculation?


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Offlineout_of_step
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: Bakedbeings]
    #27295635 - 05/05/21 04:47 PM (1 month, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Bakedbeings said:
i assume you still have the lids to the jars? if youre going invitro i would wait until the cakes are fully colonized, scrape out the loose verm on top, and then put the lids back on the jars loosely

regarding your question to barfly, 50/50 cake to coir will give you the fastest colonization time and the smallest chance of contam




Yep still got tye lids. Thanks for advice!:thumbup:


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Offlinebarfly
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: out_of_step]
    #27296555 - 05/06/21 07:16 AM (1 month, 8 days ago)

Quote:

out_of_step said:
Amazing! Keep us posted on progress! It's exciting seeing the different stages.
How long did it take for your jars to colonise from inoculation?




Sadly, I cannot give you a clear answer on that. I inoculated a bunch of cakes in January. However, then real life happened and I had to ignore the jars for a few months. It was only two or three weeks ago that I found peace and time to return to mycology. By that time, some of my jars already looked like this:



That was a nice surprise, though :laugh:

Had a small harvest of 22g wet yesterday. Not much, but I'm happy :smile: Taking sporeprints of three of them right now:



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Offlineout_of_step
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: barfly]
    #27335046 - 06/04/21 11:49 AM (10 days, 18 hours ago)

So now my jars are almost colonised (it's been a slow process but I'm in no rush). They're all at different stages but I've got one, possibly two (of different strains) which will be ready soon.
So I'm in two minds whether to fruit them in vitro, or bulk into a shoebox...
I don't have enough of one strain ready for the size of shoebox I have (if the ratio of coir to cake is 1:1 or 2:1). So I'm thinking of doing it in a clear ice cream tub or something as posted above.
The other option is to put a layer of perlite in the bottom and sit a cake on foil. Then i can add another cake when theyre ready. Theres probably room for two or three cakes per box. I've no holes drilled in my boxes but could fan them or leave the lid ajar.
I'm a bit of a perfectionist (which probably isn't the best quality of a mushroom grower) and don't want to do one method if I know it's not going to work well. However, this process is teaching me to let go of my perfectionist tendencies and to just get on with things. If it doesn't work, there's always next time.
Edit - this is not about volume for me, it's just about enjoyment of the process.


Edited by out_of_step (06/04/21 11:50 AM)


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OfflineBakedbeings
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: out_of_step]
    #27335186 - 06/04/21 01:35 PM (10 days, 16 hours ago)

sounds like a humidity chamber is the way to go. someone already posted a link above. it can be any size, any amount of cakes, and zero mods necessary


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OfflineLtLurker
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: Bakedbeings]
    #27335213 - 06/04/21 01:55 PM (10 days, 16 hours ago)



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Offlineout_of_step
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: Bakedbeings]
    #27335942 - 06/05/21 05:44 AM (10 days, 31 minutes ago)

Brill. I think that's what I'm looking for! It says slightly hydrated coir.
Do you think I should pasteurise if first or is it really just "hydrated"? Do you think any other medium could be used? I've got coir but I'm just interested.


Edited by out_of_step (06/05/21 05:49 AM)


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Offlineout_of_step
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: LtLurker]
    #27335954 - 06/05/21 06:32 AM (9 days, 23 hours ago)

Correct me if I'm wrong but in vitro is different to top fruiting? I'm learning new things everyday and I thought they meant the same but now I'm not sure.


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OfflineBakedbeings
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: out_of_step]
    #27336068 - 06/05/21 10:08 AM (9 days, 20 hours ago)

coir is the default because its cheap and very resistant to contam. i like to pasteurize mine but people do get away with just wetting it sometimes. i think its so easy to boil some water so why risk it

invitro fruiting comes in many forms, top fruiting is one of them. the only reason i didnt like invitro was that i only had one set of jars and i wanted to start new cakes, but thats just me


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OfflineLtLurker
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: Bakedbeings]
    #27336187 - 06/05/21 12:28 PM (9 days, 17 hours ago)

Invitro is when the mushroom matures without being exposed to open air(a jar that was never opened for some reason). Top fruiting you still open the jar and do a little surface work to encourage pinning on top, so it's not really invitro.

Coir is typically prepped with bucket tek. Most would describe this procedure as "cooked", not really pasteurized or sterilized. When they say "slightly wet" you really are aiming for field capacity, which is described in that link as well.


Edited by LtLurker (06/05/21 12:31 PM)


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OfflineBakedbeings
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: LtLurker]
    #27336250 - 06/05/21 01:38 PM (9 days, 16 hours ago)

i disagree with that narrow definition. chronic tek is referred to as invitro although the cake is birthed. PFs description of invitro fruiting included a similar example, and even in cases where the cake is never removed from the jar the process often includes increasing fae once the medium is colonized

hell some dont even involve glass, and in vitro literally means "in glass". anarchy!


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OfflineLtLurker
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: Bakedbeings]
    #27336361 - 06/05/21 03:48 PM (9 days, 14 hours ago)

The only relevent link was pod tek, which is not exposed to open air. It uses the same technique as unmodded lids, which doesn't allow contams to get in.

RR's pic was about putting foil and blocking light, he didn't say anything about opening the jar. Plus, his posts are years old, things progress sometimes. That reference was 11 years old and not really about invitro.

It doesn't usually matter what offsite links say, they use terms wrong all the time and Shroomery tries to be more accurate that other places. IE, monoculture and isolate.

One of ur links was broken.

There's a reason for the distinction between invitro and and top fruit(or other exposed bottle teks). You can take sterile samples from an invitro grow. Your definition is too broad to be really useful imo.


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OfflineBakedbeings
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Re: Novice mushroom grower about to start on the adventure! Got some silly questions..... [Re: LtLurker]
    #27336437 - 06/05/21 05:25 PM (9 days, 12 hours ago)

ill start by saying that i agree that it was a stretch to include top fruiting as a type of invitro fruiting. that correction was fair. i personally think theres a lot of similarity between fruiting a half-full jar with holes in the lid and fruiting a full jar with a ziploc baggie over its mouth, so i lumped them together, but thats not a hill im willing to die on and if people take issue i repent

to clarify, the RR comment i was pointing to was above the one you saw, where he says to have holes in the lid or cover the mouth with some crumpled wax paper...both introduce unfiltered air, and here is another example of him giving similar advice. sure its an old link, as is the original PF tek, but i dont see that as a problem because we arent talking about whats the most updated practice but rather what a term can be used to describe

the definition youre asserting, "never exposing the mycelium to open air so as to maintain a sterile environment," makes perfect sense to me, but i just dont see much consensus around it. a lot of people (on this site) talk about taking the lid off and scraping off the verm layer or dunking the cake or leaving holes in the lid, and all of these things introduce outside air. pods tek, which you agreed was relevant, includes the option of watering the myc before the first flush which certainly breaks the seal


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> Getting Started

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