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Offlinepacmanbreed
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Registered: 10/12/16
Posts: 3,659
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: Mr. D Green]
    #27137503 - 01/09/21 11:36 AM (3 years, 19 days ago)

Quote:

Mr. D Green said:
Thus, darwinism is what we as a species live for? That is what conclusion I come to, but do not want to accept nor believe in. I am stuck, I am wrong right?? What am I missing?




Darwin is such a honest man that he mentioned this
Quote:

If it could be demonstrated that any complex organ existed, which could not possibly have been formed by numerous, successive, slight modifications, my theory would absolutely break down. But I can find out no such case," he wrote in On the Origin of Specieurs by Means of Natural Selection

EVEN just one sample.






Another quote about his doubt in his own writings in terms of complex organs within the body (heart,eyes,blood,etc) or organism themselves that not might support his theory:
Quote:

To suppose that the eye with all its inimitable contrivances for adjusting the focus to different distances, for admitting different amounts of light, and for the correction of spherical and chromatic aberration, could have been formed by natural selection, seems, I freely confess, absurd in the highest degree.




since the discovery of DNA there has been huge progress in terms of our mystery, which open up deeper mysteries. happens time and time again in the study of our biological origins.

like our mysterious chromosome that are less than in numbers compared to ape chromosome.



it has been discovered that it is because our chromosome #2 are a product of fusion.





credits to the paper titled: An ancestral telomere-telomere fusion. communicated by Alen Garen 1991.
Quote:

this fusion must have been followed by the elimination of overlapping function as well as by events that stabilized the fusion.






for this fusion - split, delete or turnoff functions, then fuse. to happen needs precise parameters which excludes Evolution, for the fusion to occur the way it did, a mutation had to occur.

I'm nobody just sharing a word of the mouth

I have given up on this pure evolution ideology long time ago.
survival of the fittest is such a dangerous ideology that can create war and conflict between the same species.

I hope the same for yah and never get stuck.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,532
Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: pacmanbreed]
    #27137529 - 01/09/21 11:56 AM (3 years, 19 days ago)

and don't stay stuck for too long if you do get stuck.

IMO, mutation is a fundamental element in the evolution story.
it has to be, because there is no direct feedback to genetic changes until a living mutant survives and successfully breeds.
Also there is not "intent to evolve" or "intent to mutate".

therefore we look at zillions of mutations happening all the time and some new forms emerging that appear well adapted. That type of fitness (as in survival of those most fit) is totally sufficient to show evolution in progress. It is not always about strength and predation, it is mostly about health and cleverness at this point.


--------------------
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Offlinepacmanbreed
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: redgreenvines]
    #27137677 - 01/09/21 01:27 PM (3 years, 19 days ago)

I do get the picture of it.. :takingnotes:

so the doubling of the genome of flowering plants thru mutagenesis 180 million years ago is a piece of the puzzle.

thanks for mentioning, although not my expertise, it draws a very beautiful picture in my mind specially the latter part.


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OfflineskOsH
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: pacmanbreed]
    #27137793 - 01/09/21 02:36 PM (3 years, 19 days ago)

We're headed for the Borg


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InvisibleFerdinando
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Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 3,664
Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: skOsH] * 1
    #27141826 - 01/11/21 11:21 AM (3 years, 17 days ago)

when stuck use the situation to get some real good in the universe to apply yourself to some real work like meditation for example 20 mins a day or a daily drawing
that way while stuck you do almost as good as if not stuck
but yeah that is definitely to avoid :smile:


--------------------
with our love with our love we could save the world


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Invisibleteknix
π“‚€βŸπ“…’π“π“…ƒπ“Š°π“‰‘ 𓁼𓆗⨻
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Registered: 09/16/08
Posts: 11,953
Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out.lying to us all [Re: Mr. D Green] * 2
    #27142505 - 01/11/21 06:07 PM (3 years, 17 days ago)

Quote:

Mr. D Green said:
Are we protectors or destroyers?? Or simply both??




They already made that movie, it was called the matrix :lol:

Hopefully our AI will be benevolent to us tho hehehehe.

This is really the AI's planet, we are just collecting the resources and making it more suitable for when it arrives!


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,532
Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out.lying to us all [Re: teknix]
    #27143277 - 01/12/21 07:30 AM (3 years, 16 days ago)

Quote:

teknix said:...
Hopefully our AI will be benevolent to us tho hehehehe.

This is really the AI's planet, we are just collecting the resources and making it more suitable for when it arrives!




this makes too much sense in a future rear view mirror (if there is such a thing)


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
Bodhi
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Registered: 08/16/16
Posts: 26,657
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out.lying to us all [Re: redgreenvines]
    #27144572 - 01/12/21 07:49 PM (3 years, 16 days ago)

Man Made AI and AI Made Man.

In the far future past present of course.

it plays out nicely in my head.


--------------------
Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps


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OfflineCyonic
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: MycoBrainz]
    #27147856 - 01/14/21 02:09 PM (3 years, 14 days ago)

Dtt
Quote:

MycoBrainz said:
Um no. We never were bacteria.




I would love to hear about your own personal take on human evolution t?where in we magicallyy appear without Connection to bacteriafh on our family tree?!?!?


All eukaryotes stem on from cyanobacteria which are infact bacteria belonging to the bacteria domain.


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OfflineCyonic
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: pacmanbreed]
    #27147900 - 01/14/21 02:30 PM (3 years, 14 days ago)

Quote:

pacmanbreed said:
Quote:

Mr. D Green said:
Thus, darwinism is what we as a species live for? That is what conclusion I come to, but do not want to accept nor believe in. I am stuck, I am wrong right?? What am I missing?




Darwin is such a honest man that he mentioned this
Quote:

If it could be demonstrated that any complex organ existed, which could not possibly have been formed by numerous, successive, slight modifications, my theory would absolutely break down. But I can find out no such case," he wrote in On the Origin of Specieurs by Means of Natural Selection

EVEN just one sample.






Another quote about his doubt in his own writings in terms of complex organs within the body (heart,eyes,blood,etc) or organism themselves that not might support his theory:
Quote:

To suppose that the eye with all its inimitable contrivances for adjusting the focus to different distances, for admitting different amounts of light, and for the correction of spherical and chromatic aberration, could have been formed by natural selection, seems, I freely confess, absurd in the highest degree.




since the discovery of DNA there has been huge progress in terms of our mystery, which open up deeper mysteries. happens time and time again in the study of our biological origins.

like our mysterious chromosome that are less than in numbers compared to ape chromosome.

Eyyyy

it has been discovered that it is because our chromosome #2 are a product of fusion.





credits to the paper titled: An ancestral telomere-telomere fusion. communicated by Alen Garen 1991.
Quote:

this fusion must have been followed by the elimination of overlapping function as well as by events that stabilized the fusion.






for this fusion - split, delete or turnoff functions, then fuse. to happen needs precise parameters which excludes Evolution, for the fusion to occur the way it did, a mutation had to occur.

I'm nobody just sharing a word of the mouth

I have given up on this pure evolution ideology long time ago.
survival of the fittest is such a dangerous ideology that can create war and conflict between the same species.

I hope the same for yah and never get stuck.



Sounds alot moret like confidence than doubt.

How do you see that it as doubt(


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
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Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,685
Loc: On the Border
Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: Mr. D Green] * 2
    #27150613 - 01/15/21 09:57 PM (3 years, 13 days ago)

We are just a drop in the bucket...that bucket is billions of years old and a universe wide...maybe infinite universes wide. We are just the newest layer of compost. We are literally born of stardust and die in rot...maybe someday something new will sprout from it...


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: Cyonic] * 1
    #27150851 - 01/16/21 03:17 AM (3 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Cyonic said:

...I have given up on this pure evolution ideology long time ago...





All ideologies are BS.

Newton had a model of the universe & physics that was good enough to get 'us' to the moon.

Now we use Einstein's model for GPS.

No ideology and no problem.

Darwin's model explains a lot and now epigenetics adds to our understanding. No ideology or belief is necessary.

It is the desire for certainty, that is dangerous, not the provisional nature of our knowledge.

Just a short while ago some of our DNA was called "junk" DNA, now we know some of it contains switches. Those with open minds keep learning.

Those who desire certainty, may end up being suicide bombers, -- strange stuff that so called 'certainty', dogma, belief & search for an authority to trust.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,532
Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #27151018 - 01/16/21 07:35 AM (3 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
We are just a drop in the bucket...that bucket is billions of years old and a universe wide...maybe infinite universes wide. We are just the newest layer of compost. We are literally born of stardust and die in rot...maybe someday something new will sprout from it...



agreed,
however, I think new stuff is constantly sprouting, and evolving over generations. Glad your new dog is fitting in!


--------------------
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Offlinepacmanbreed
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Registered: 10/12/16
Posts: 3,659
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: laughingdog]
    #27151030 - 01/16/21 07:48 AM (3 years, 12 days ago)

:fuckyeah: :nailedit: :mindblown:

such new discoveries are fascinating opening up new possibilities,

just to add, Telomere that breakoffs due to stress, until exhausted(cell division halts) to the point of senescence, being buffers so that the information in the dna is preserved. then comes the 2009 Nobel discovery of enzyme called telomerase that may be responsible for the healing, repair of the Telomeres. while this enzyme is dormant or if not completely, its not active as it can be to its full potential. thus opening up the possibilities of increasing the hayflick limit. hence the practice of the ancients such as meditation etc..


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: pacmanbreed] * 1
    #27151038 - 01/16/21 08:01 AM (3 years, 12 days ago)

e=mc2 anybody?


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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Offlinepacmanbreed
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: redgreenvines]
    #27151050 - 01/16/21 08:09 AM (3 years, 12 days ago)

:hahthatsrich:


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OfflineCyonic
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: laughingdog]
    #27151281 - 01/16/21 11:22 AM (3 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

laughingdog said:
Quote:

Cyonic said:

...I have given up on this pure evolution ideology long time ago...






All ideologies are BS.

Newton had a model of the universe & physics that was good enough to get 'us' to the moon.

Now we use Einstein's model for GPS.

No ideology and no problem.

Darwin's model explains a lot and now epigenetics adds to our understanding. No ideology or belief is necessary.

It is the desire for certainty, that is dangerous, not the provisional nature of our knowledge.

Just a short while ago some of our DNA was called "junk" DNA, now we know some of it contains switches. Those with open minds keep learning.

Those who desire certainty, may end up being suicide bombers, -- strange stuff that so called 'certainty', dogma, belief & search for an authority to trust.




That was not me who said that. I was quoting someone else.


Edited by Cyonic (01/16/21 11:24 AM)


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: Cyonic]
    #27151509 - 01/16/21 01:24 PM (3 years, 12 days ago)

whoops - sorry for the mix up

.  I'm not sure what Morgan Freeman was supposed to have to do with evolution either; and of course as regards the OP's original question, evolution has no intentions, as is implied by his phrase: "What does evolution have in store for us.?"
.  In fact such a notion misses 2 very important points that are basic to the processes of evolution, whether we include epigenetics or not, (1) namely that it is totally impersonal, and (2) it is itself contingent on environments that are constantly changing, and for any species it's also contingent on how other species are changing at the same time.

.  The OP seems to have confused the idea of evolution with some ideas that conceive of God as a boss, who is separate from "his" creation.
.    When we begin to understand that the same processes that affect species evolution, also affect the genes at another level, and also neuronal pathways, such a simplistic view is seen to be so simple as to be a misunderstanding which renders the concept (of evolution) useless.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Where are we headed? What does evolution have in store for us? Is Morgan Freeman right? Or simply a sell out..lying to us... [Re: redgreenvines]
    #27151938 - 01/16/21 06:09 PM (3 years, 12 days ago)

Agreed, but I was being poetic...lol.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: Where are we headed? [Re: Mr. D Green]
    #27152380 - 01/16/21 10:52 PM (3 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

Mr. D Green said:
Is the end game of our species simply to be nothing more then seekers and destroyers? We started as bacteria..we all know what bacteria is best at. Sure we learn/gather/obtain knowledge, practice the arts, play our musical instrumentals, share some laughs and smiles; talk about how complicated or simple life is..bottom line we do a lot things..little things..and most people say those little things make the human race different and better then nature..what i am trying to say and ask..Are we protectors or destroyers?? Or simply both??




There is no end game in a manner of speaking.

What are bacteria best at? They are best at many things perhaps that we do not see.

Bacteria don't play musical instruments, but perhaps they are a sort of music of themselves. Some mathematicians think numbers are beautiful. How do bacteria feel about themselves? We do not really know. But as mentioned further down, other animals play. It's obvious to me they feel good. Why should bacteria not feel good? Because they have no nervous system? They are single cells. They don't need a nervous system. Perhaps nervous systems and other complex systems are just doing what cells were already doing. Specializing. Cells can specialize in multicellular organisms. But cells are complex in and of themselves. What is going on at the single cellular level? We don't know it all, but there are chemical reactions and biological functions. Many things. Multi-cellular life is just bigger, better, more it seems.

But logically, there is no inherent difference... is there?

So is there an end game? One might say survival, but that's not an end game. There then is pleasure. Pleasure is not an end game. Nor are power, love, truth, awareness or peace. The end game is to die after doing all the things. Everyone knows this is true I suspect. But before you die you can reflect and enjoy the memories.

Until then, do all the things. One thing at a time. One is being a flower, a speck of star dust, an orgasm, a song, a story. Play that musical instrument. See the beauty. Be the beauty. Is it not that which is beautiful? Be angry. Rage. Be the things. Sweat. Cry. Scream. What is there to do? All the things. To do the things is to be the things. To be the things, do the things! The end game does not happen sitting in a chair. Chairs are where one strategizes. Strategizing is but one thing. You can just be, but be what? You have a mind. It is capable of many things. Do the things.

And if one finds themselves in a cocoon? Be still in one's mind. There are things which are done that the mind cannot do. That too is a thing.

But what is it?

Is it on the tip of your tongue? Is it all the same thing?

Breathe. Grow. Be all the things in good time. Life is a game of chance unless you are to be a monk on the lonely mountain. What will you do? And will it be little? Or big? Or is there really a size when it comes to such things? β€œIt is the time you have wasted for your rose that makes your rose so important.”


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." β€”Ayishat Akanbi


Edited by Rahz (01/17/21 12:00 AM)


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