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OfflineMarcusCactus
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Substrate won't colonize
    #27113996 - 12/29/20 11:09 AM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Hey guys,

This is my first ever post. First of all thanks to all of you for this amazing community, I've learnt so much out here and now I've finally started my first grow.
I've successfully made liquid cultures and inoculated grain jars with them. The whole process was so fulfilling and made me so happy. All went perfect. Now I'm having some trouble and I'm hoping some of you can help me figure it out.

I spawned my bulk substrate 6 days ago now and there is no sign of any colonization yet so I'm pretty sure I've got it wrong.
My substrate is a mix of horse manure, vermiculite,  coco voir, worm castings, coffee grounds and gypsum. Pasteurized of course.
It's in a mono tub that is airtight sealed, no light, 76degrees, and the air holes are duct taped.
The only thing I have a doubt about is the field capacity, thinking my substrate might be a little too wet.
When I opened it to take a picture it smelled good but a little gassy. Air exchange problem too ?..

Is there anything I can do to make it happen or must i start all over ?
Some pictures of the substrate that shows not a single sign of colonization.

Thank you so much for your help fellow voyagers, love and strength to all.







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OfflineProfessor X
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: MarcusCactus]
    #27114023 - 12/29/20 11:21 AM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Few things here.

Did you make LC from agar or multispore?

If from agar, how many transfers before you went to LC?

Most people here suggest plain coir for cubes, there is absolutely no benefit to using what you are using and a lot that can go wrong. I grow in WBS coir and get average 6 oz dry per 4qt spawn in a 1 to 1 32qt poly stuffed monotub.

Don't tape holes, that's outdated info, there are 2 conditions stalling and fruiting.

Cubes prefer 72 degrees. 76 is ok but 72 is optimal.


--------------------

My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1


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OfflineTstone
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: Professor X]
    #27114054 - 12/29/20 11:42 AM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Here's my take. First off, adding all those nutes and additives on top of manure, with really exposed, seemingly uncolonized grains, may not end well. In general, that's a complete overload of nutes. It's not a vegtable garden. Keep it simple.

Sure, everyone wants to keep adding stuff, in hopes of getting the perfect flush. However, fungi  doesn't need the nutritional values like a vegtable garden.  All the nutritional value is in the grain.

When you add nutritional value to the sub, that opens up the sub for contamination Just coir and verm have no real nutritional value, so contams will have to struggle to germinate. I'm not saying as of today, that tub is contaminated, just saying, it a perfect storm for contamination.

Idea is,  clean spawn with 100% colonized grain, and we hope the mycelium will colonize a substrate ( usually does), before contaminates can germinate. Once you put all those nutes in there, you are giving the potential contaminates a free for all to germinate.

More info needed...

1. Photos of spawn

2. Your pastuerizing tek

3. And of course your original grain tek.

Gods honest truth: first 2 rounds of cultivating, have a solid general agriculture background. I was was driving 2 hours round trip to a horse farm, spent money on manure tubs, shoveling shit into tubs, driving shit home in my car, breaking it by hand. Pastuerizing.

Telling you, I have had  much sucess
cut my time down, and generally happier cause my house doesn't smell like manure , saved loads of time, by just 3 simple ingredients: coir, verm, and gypsum. However if anything, I'd try to add verm. Gypsum truly optional. Forget the poo, really. We  wanna think mushrooms love poo, some do, some don't care. Cubensis doesn't care.


--------------------
Wake now, discover that you are the song that morning brings, but the heart has it's seasons, it's evenings and songs of it's own"


Edited by Tstone (12/29/20 12:18 PM)


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Offlinebw86
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: Tstone]
    #27114094 - 12/29/20 12:02 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

:whathesaid:
Either way this grow is not going to end up successful.
If you even made it to clean spawn it wasn't healthy enough to re colonize the grains after spawning let alone the substrate.
If no pics.What did your spawn smell like?
IMO agar to lc is silly. Just go agar to grain then g2g.


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OfflineProfessor X
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: bw86]
    #27114103 - 12/29/20 12:09 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

I agree, LC is silly period. I think most people who use it do so because they don't have a flow hood or can't follow proper technique and you need both for clean LC. I use strictly agar to grain myself. I use agushy 2oz slime plates from amazon pasty style 1 plate to 14qt spawn. Have about 150 ready to use plates in a dedicated fridge.


--------------------

My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1


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OfflineTstone
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: Professor X]
    #27114165 - 12/29/20 12:34 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

My tubs always colonized by the the 7th day. My little trick, you know you're going to making tubs, you need to bust up the grain anyhow. I bust up 2 days before use, so when I go to use them, they are still  loose, however myc has already started re-growing. 2 light taps on my palm, into the tub, 66 qt tubs, fully colonized in 7 days.


--------------------
Wake now, discover that you are the song that morning brings, but the heart has it's seasons, it's evenings and songs of it's own"


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OfflineMarcusCactus
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: Professor X]
    #27114514 - 12/29/20 03:56 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Thank you all for your prompt replies.

I'll try to answer all questions asked and remarks made.

I am a newbie when it comes to growing mushrooms in an artificial environnement, but i have a worthwhile experience of biology in general and have been growing my own food for years. I know this is not the same discipline but I understand the functioning of mycelium and have had success with growing most things. Pretty sure I'll figure this out thanks to nature and this community's precious help.

I don't have any professional equipment like a flow hood so I  built a glove box to operate in a sterile environment.
I made sterile jars with self healing injection ports and tyvek breathing holes.
I followed instructions from a book called "The Psilocybin Mushroom Bible" and from shroomery teks.

I must specify I am living on the small island of New Caledonia in the Pacific Ocean and thus have limited access to needed furniture for growing. I only had access to a couple spore syringes to start this grow, which is why I turned it to liquid culture to make more so I could inoculate many jars. I included a picture of the culture which I believe is healthy.
I haven't move to agar yet as I wanted to fully understand what I was doing before moving to more professional methods.
I inoculated rye grain, it colonized in a few days, then I colonized more with g2g, which also grew very fast.
I followed the pillow case pasteurizing method mentioned in the book. Used a candy thermometer and pasteurized substrate at 176f for 2 hours. Drained it to field capacity although as it is the first time I am doing it and lack experience, I thought it might be too wet.

So I'm including pictures of the grain I've spawned with. I have no doubt it was properly colonized and healthy. Fluffy with clouds smelling like earthy mushrooms upon opening of the jars, all the jars had the same healthy fungi smell.

I understand that I might have put too much nutes in the substrate. I was following the the tek from the book I mentioned above. I did think this book I was basing my grow on wasn't right on point, this is why I searched a lot on shroomery forums and why I am writing here now. Including book cover in the pictures too. 

I believe my problem must be due to substrate being too wet or because there is absolutely no air exchange, the bow I am using being truly airtight and the hole are completely sealed by duct tape.
What your take on it ?

Thank you all for your precious help this is a beautiful journey and I love learning by making mistakes and figuring them out. This community here is precious and so are our fungi friends and teachers.
Blessings to all











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Offlinebw86
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: MarcusCactus]
    #27114527 - 12/29/20 04:03 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

nice fuckin lophs!
The jars looks alright.
Wghy are you choking your substrate out?
How hot was your substrate when you mixed it with your spawn?
If its too wet you should see growth after 48 hours. How does it smell now?


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OfflineBlazer Man
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: bw86] * 2
    #27114556 - 12/29/20 04:23 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

My man is growing lophs and cubes on an island somewhere in the Pacific. One of you bastards better help him out! HAHAHAHA I don't know why, but that is funny!


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Offlinebw86
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: Blazer Man]
    #27114654 - 12/29/20 05:21 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

whoa 
22°18'28.3"S 166°55'12.0"E


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OfflineMarcusCactus
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: bw86]
    #27115444 - 12/30/20 05:12 AM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Hehehe yes I come from a tiny paradise island lost in the ocean. We actually have wild growing Gold Caps in the rainy season, huge Cubes growing spontaneously in the damp tribal valleys. I mean forearm length bluefoot wild boys.
Just trying to grow a steady regular supply at home here... when season come again I'll try to actually get spores from these local wild shrooms.

Anyways, I slightly cracked open the top of my tub and 12 hours later it's showing clear signs of colonization. So I believe my problem was just that the lid to my tub is 100% airtight, and it shouldn't be as it doesn't allow for gas to escape and fresh air to enter. When I first opened it, it smelled like healthy anaerobic bacteria, straight bokashi smell for those who know it. Now that it's breathed grain has begun to recolonize bright white and smell is more earthy and fresh.

It's just the type of tub I bought.. would make for a proper glove box though.

I am quite positive this is gonna work. Will post pics when it does. Thanks you for your insights!


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OfflineMarcusCactus
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: bw86]
    #27115447 - 12/30/20 05:17 AM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

bw86 said:
whoa 
22°18'28.3"S 166°55'12.0"E




This place you highlighted is the waste reservoir of one of the biggest nickel extraction mines on the planet. We've been fighting these mfers out of our island with all strength and might but they're still polluting the crap out of soils, rivers and lagoon.
New Caledonia has a 76% endemic species rate (3rd highest rate in the world) so any spill would be a butterfly effect catastrophe.
Anyways, little off topic here but thought would be interesting to share.


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OfflineProfessor X
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Re: Substrate won't colonize [Re: MarcusCactus]
    #27115466 - 12/30/20 05:35 AM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Even though your LC LOOKS ok and your jars LOOK ok there can be bacteria hiding in there. It only takes a few uncolonized grains when you add it to a nutrient rich substrate to ruin the whole thing. The problem is if mold has taken hold even where you can't see it the mycelium will spend all it's energy producing metabolites trying to fight it rather than colonizing the substrate.

I suggest using a still air box rather than a glove box, still air boxes work great, glove boxes cause problems.

I also suggest starting those spores on agar and transferring at least twice to ensure clean healthy growth, besides agar is easy with a good no pour tek and a2g is super easy. I don't even mess with g2g like I mentioned before, I keep a fridge full of agar. LC directly from spores is almost always a bust.

Finally I suggest using straight coco coir or a coir and vermiculite mix and ditch everything else in your sub including the gypsum. I have never seen a healthy jar spawned to straight coco coir mold until after the first flush. Usually the earliest is 3rd flush and besides maybe a day give or take of speed you are gaining nothing. Way too much risk with way too little reward.

One more thing, never tape off the holes, lack of FAE can stall cubes but won't harm some contaminates. Good luck in your future grows!


--------------------

My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1


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