|
Kryptos
Stranger

Registered: 11/01/14
Posts: 12,263
Last seen: 44 minutes, 42 seconds
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: The Ecstatic]
#27118493 - 12/31/20 02:15 PM (3 years, 28 days ago) |
|
|
And we know that smoking is bad for you, but somehow cigarette companies are still in business.
|
The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,362
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 11 hours, 33 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: Kryptos] 2
#27118749 - 12/31/20 04:17 PM (3 years, 28 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Kryptos said: Which one is more meaningful, from a societal standpoint?
I don't mean in theory, I mean in practice, today, right now, including the effects of both capitalist and right wing propaganda.
Remember that something like 40% of the country would be extremely pissed off if their minority neighbor also got a stimulus.
In practice and in theory, the more meaningful move is to delay the bloated defense bill to force a vote on stimulus checks.
--------------------
|
koods
Ribbit



Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,049
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
Last seen: 1 hour, 2 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: The Ecstatic]
#27118785 - 12/31/20 04:33 PM (3 years, 28 days ago) |
|
|
Well sanders failed. You do understand that McConnell runs the senate right?
--------------------
NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
|
The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,362
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 11 hours, 33 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: koods] 2
#27120222 - 01/01/21 11:45 AM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
You do understand how a filibuster works right?
Again, not sure if you’re this ignorant or just trying to own me by dissing Bernie. Either way it’s embarrassing.
--------------------
|
Kryptos
Stranger

Registered: 11/01/14
Posts: 12,263
Last seen: 44 minutes, 42 seconds
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: The Ecstatic]
#27120292 - 01/01/21 12:15 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
Right now, filibustering is bad optics for democrats and only democrats.
Again, 40% of the country gets its news from right wing propaganda sources. On Parler, people are calling McConnell a democrat right now. Like, they are literally saying "why do democrats like McConnell keep fucking this up for people?"
Quote:
The Ecstatic said:
Quote:
Kryptos said: Which one is more meaningful, from a societal standpoint?
I don't mean in theory, I mean in practice, today, right now, including the effects of both capitalist and right wing propaganda.
Remember that something like 40% of the country would be extremely pissed off if their minority neighbor also got a stimulus.
In practice and in theory, the more meaningful move is to delay the bloated defense bill to force a vote on stimulus checks.
Not in the US.
At least, if you don;t want to shoot yourself in the foot politically. No matter what happens, democrats will be blamed for it, and republicans will be re-elected. Which brings us back to damage control, not solutions.
|
The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,362
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 11 hours, 33 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: Kryptos] 3
#27120346 - 01/01/21 12:40 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
I feel like I’m arguing on the basis of what’s best for people and you keep pointing out what is happening now.
Yes I know the politicians are beholden to defense contractors. Has nothing to do with the argument.
--------------------
|
MycoBrainz
Mycotic



Registered: 03/14/15
Posts: 615
Loc: West Coast
Last seen: 4 months, 10 days
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: Kryptos]
#27120352 - 01/01/21 12:43 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Kryptos said: 330m americans. Guessing they're not counting children, though, so...
250m citizen taxpayers (more non-citizen taxpayers, but they don;t count as real taxpayers)
So still tricked by the party system huh!
250m*600=150B. 9/1.5=16.66%
Where the fuck did 83% of my money go, you fucking republican shitheels? Why the fuck did Moscow Mitch get re-elected with an 18% approval rating? Anybody check the voting fraud on that?
Somebody second amendment that republican bitch.
--------------------
PFC x Creeper Lets Get Stoned
|
koods
Ribbit



Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,049
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
Last seen: 1 hour, 2 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: MycoBrainz]
#27120368 - 01/01/21 12:53 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
I’m assuming all bills die when this Congress is dissolved on Sunday?
--------------------
NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
|
Kryptos
Stranger

Registered: 11/01/14
Posts: 12,263
Last seen: 44 minutes, 42 seconds
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: The Ecstatic] 1
#27120622 - 01/01/21 03:26 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
The Ecstatic said: I feel like I’m arguing on the basis of what’s best for people and you keep pointing out what is happening now.
Yes I know the politicians are beholden to defense contractors. Has nothing to do with the argument.
Yes you are.
And yes I am.
Again, the biggest failure of modern day leftism, in my opinion, is that they have a lot of great ideas but no clue how to implement them. You're going full Gene Roddenberry in this bitch, talking about the 24th century. Which is great and all, but we live in the 21st century.
Until leftists can figure out how to integrate this division into their worldview, they will remain philosophers, not politicians.
Edit: of course, Option B is an armed insurrection, but that's no guarantee of any sort of success. That's a bit like shuffling the deck and drawing a new hand: Whoever ends up in charge is the warlord with the biggest army. Which at this particular moment in time, basically means fascism.
Edited by Kryptos (01/01/21 04:24 PM)
|
The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,362
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 11 hours, 33 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: Kryptos] 3
#27120823 - 01/01/21 05:38 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
What?
I’m not talking about a leftist insurgency im talking about the tactics of the ostensibly preferable right wing political party making tactical decisions that benefit that right wing political party.
Yes dude id love it if we could end this shit with the flip of a switch but that’s not the argument. The argument is whether it’s better for Americans if we give all of them $2000 OR if we immediately pass a $770B defense budget. You keep trying to sidestep this with appeals to pragmatism. Filibustering a bill in a senate to leverage your position isn’t the utopian idealism you’re painting it as, McConnell does it all the time. There’s precedent for this.
--------------------
|
Brian Jones
Club 27



Registered: 12/18/12
Posts: 12,340
Loc: attending Snake Church
Last seen: 7 hours, 6 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: The Ecstatic]
#27120830 - 01/01/21 05:45 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
I forget the specifics of the different bills. Would filibustering prevented us from getting the $600? Biden says send the $600 now and he will start another stimulus push as soon as he gets in. I have no idea if he's sincere, or if they can ever get it past the Senate.
-------------------- "The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body" John Lennon I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either. The worst thing about corruption is that it works so well,
|
The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,362
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 11 hours, 33 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: Brian Jones] 2
#27120848 - 01/01/21 05:57 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
No, Trump had already signed the $600 check bill. Bernie was trying to filibuster the NDAA bill that would have approved the defense spending. This would have required McConnell get 60 votes to pass the funding, which is entirely doable given the Dems have 48 votes in the Senate. McConnell agrees to take a vote on the $2k checks bill, Bernie and the Dems agree to pass the NDAA, and that’s that. Even then, the $2k checks bill probably still fails but at least senators are on the record for it.
Dems caved on the filibuster. More Republicans sided with Sanders than Democrats.
--------------------
|
Kryptos
Stranger

Registered: 11/01/14
Posts: 12,263
Last seen: 44 minutes, 42 seconds
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: The Ecstatic]
#27120860 - 01/01/21 06:03 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
No, the defense bill is a separate issue. However, it has great optics due to US culture being so militarized post 9/11, and it has a pay bump for soldiers.
Basically, we're debating what ends up in the next few news cycles. Right now, McConnell is stuck calling a $2k stimulus a "giveaway for the rich", as opposed to hammering the democrats on national defense.
Quote:
The Ecstatic said: What?
I’m not talking about a leftist insurgency im talking about the tactics of the ostensibly preferable right wing political party making tactical decisions that benefit that right wing political party.
Yes dude id love it if we could end this shit with the flip of a switch but that’s not the argument. The argument is whether it’s better for Americans if we give all of them $2000 OR if we immediately pass a $770B defense budget. You keep trying to sidestep this with appeals to pragmatism. Filibustering a bill in a senate to leverage your position isn’t the utopian idealism you’re painting it as, McConnell does it all the time. There’s precedent for this.
What you're talking about is either a lack of, or complete misunderstanding of, strategy. I'm not sidestepping shit. If the defense budget didn;t pass, then every republican would be (rightfully, if only technically) saying democrats are at fault for not supporting national security, at a time when the most trusted government institution is the military. This isn't the 90s anymore. X-files and military conspiracies ended on 9/11.
Quote:
The Ecstatic said: No, Trump had already signed the $600 check bill. Bernie was trying to filibuster the NDAA bill that would have approved the defense spending. This would have required McConnell get 60 votes to pass the funding, which is entirely doable given the Dems have 48 votes in the Senate. McConnell agrees to take a vote on the $2k checks bill, Bernie and the Dems agree to pass the NDAA, and that’s that. Even then, the $2k checks bill probably still fails but at least senators are on the record for it.
Dems caved on the filibuster. More Republicans sided with Sanders than Democrats.
Unfortunately, while Bernie has great ideas, he does not understand political strategy. If he did, he'd have McConnell's job.
Edit: Though, now you're sidestepping everything I said. Which is fine. Maybe you think about it in your free time. Until someone does, leftists ideas won;t get off the ground.
Edited by Kryptos (01/01/21 06:16 PM)
|
koods
Ribbit



Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 106,049
Loc: Maryland/DC Burbs
Last seen: 1 hour, 2 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: Brian Jones]
#27120933 - 01/01/21 06:37 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Brian Jones said: I forget the specifics of the different bills. Would filibustering prevented us from getting the $600? Biden says send the $600 now and he will start another stimulus push as soon as he gets in. I have no idea if he's sincere, or if they can ever get it past the Senate.
The $600 is already out the door into people’s accounts
--------------------
NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
|
The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,362
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 11 hours, 33 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: koods] 1
#27120959 - 01/01/21 06:53 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
Political strategy doesn’t mean shit if power isn’t behind you.
Again, the argument was what is better for the American people, not what is easier to pass in the US senate.
--------------------
|
The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,362
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 11 hours, 33 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: The Ecstatic] 1
#27120964 - 01/01/21 06:59 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
Preemptively negotiating against your own position is a hallmark of American political thought. By conceding your ideals at the front door, you neuter yourself, but gain the much desired label of Serious Thinker.
Who cares what is right or what ought to be? I’m smart enough to observe what’s happening around me, not try to change it. In my own super bowl fantasy I’m the cameraman, not the quarterback.
--------------------
|
Kryptos
Stranger

Registered: 11/01/14
Posts: 12,263
Last seen: 44 minutes, 42 seconds
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: The Ecstatic]
#27121037 - 01/01/21 07:49 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
The Ecstatic said: Political strategy doesn’t mean shit if power isn’t behind you.
Again, the argument was what is better for the American people, not what is easier to pass in the US senate.
Political strategy is how you put the power behind you.
You know what's better for the American people? Guaranteed shelter, guaranteed food, guaranteed housing, guaranteed healthcare, guaranteed jobs, and a national goal that we can all unify behind.
You know the easiest way to do that? Hitler did. Militarize the populace and proceed with endless conquest for the sake of conquest. That's one thing he got right. He fully understood human psychology and how to exploit it, better than anyone before him. Unlike every leftist thinker in history, he understood that human life isn't just about leisure and happiness, but about struggle. He understood human nature probably better than any other person in existence, including modern psychological thought. Glorious sacrifice for the fatherland. That's why we have culture wars and single issue voters.
Quote:
The Ecstatic said: Preemptively negotiating against your own position is a hallmark of American political thought. By conceding your ideals at the front door, you neuter yourself, but gain the much desired label of Serious Thinker.
Who cares what is right or what ought to be? I’m smart enough to observe what’s happening around me, not try to change it. In my own super bowl fantasy I’m the cameraman, not the quarterback.
Cameramen don't speak. Cameramen hold cameras and follow orders whenever a serious thinker tells them to point their camera at something. Then they hand off their footage to an editor, and get back to silently humping a camera around.
|
The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,362
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 11 hours, 33 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: Kryptos]
#27121050 - 01/01/21 08:01 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
lol you miss the point entirely. Solid Hitler fanfic tho
--------------------
|
The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 33,362
Loc: 'Merica
Last seen: 11 hours, 33 minutes
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: The Ecstatic] 2
#27121151 - 01/01/21 09:10 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
Relevant:
https://www.dailyposter.com/p/schumer-begins-2021-promising-to
Schumer begins 2021 promising to fight, then immediately caves.
--------------------
|
OutsideOfMyMind
LSD Self Administrative Director



Registered: 10/05/20
Posts: 5,384
Last seen: 35 minutes, 16 seconds
|
Re: After 9 months, Congress finally reaches a $900 billion covid relief... [Re: The Ecstatic]
#27121158 - 01/01/21 09:14 PM (3 years, 27 days ago) |
|
|
Wow, I can't believe a thread that I started actually has more than 10 pages now. I'm quite proud of myself. So are the politicians still fucking around with our money? Have they agreed to anything yet or is it all just theater at this point still?
|
|