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OfflineLunatikPenguin
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To case PE or not?
    #27080013 - 12/09/20 07:29 AM (3 years, 2 months ago)

I started two shoeboxes of PE about a week ago from oat spawn. I had aggressive growth in the jars, and so far have had aggressive growth in these shoeboxes. I followed the sff shoebox tek as I've had success with it previously using other cubes. If not familiar, this tek uses a pint of coir as a pseudo casing, covering the 1:1.5 mix of spawn:coir.

I've read quite a few varying discussions re casing PE. My question is should I case with a pint of coir, or do some other type of casing, or let it be? As you can see in the attached picture, the surface has already pretty well colonized. There are a few spots on the bottom etc that haven't colonized yet, but I'm wondering if doing a light casing layer at this point would be a good idea or not?



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OfflineA.k.aM
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: LunatikPenguin]
    #27080102 - 12/09/20 08:55 AM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Definitely looks great.

Case it but with 50/50mix not coir.



My first run with PE I made two tubs and didn’t case one to see what happened. It was so bad I tried late casing half of it but it didn’t help.




Occasionally you’ll see people get good PE grows without casing but more often than not you get blobs.


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Edited by A.k.a (12/09/20 08:57 AM)


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Offlinehypercubedmt
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: A.k.a]
    #27080688 - 12/09/20 03:30 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

50/50 coir vermiculite? or some other ingredients?


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OfflineA.k.aM
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: hypercubedmt]
    #27080691 - 12/09/20 03:33 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Peat and verm. Jiffy 5050 mix is perfect but if you can’t find it and make your own casing you’ll need to add something to adjust the ph levels. Lyme and I think baking soda are popular.


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InvisibleJosex
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: hypercubedmt]
    #27080705 - 12/09/20 03:40 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

It's also common practice to add lime to raise the PH and gypsum to act as a buffer.

For every liter of peat I add ~30ml of calcium carbonate and 50ml of agricultural gypsum.

I like to hydrate the peat and the vermiculite separately and then mix them together.

You also have to properly pasteurize the mix for one hour at 140-160 F.


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Invisiblesh4d0ws
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: LunatikPenguin]
    #27080734 - 12/09/20 03:59 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

I have a good track record of running jiffy mix without pasteurization but YMMV

I'm at over 50 tubs now without any problems. Got 12 tubs going on right now, will know in a couple weeks if it still works. I always worry there might be different batches of jiffy that could cause problems but have bought at 3 different stores now with no issue over nearly a year :shrug:


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OfflineFungusFreedom
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #27080748 - 12/09/20 04:07 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

How do you guys test your su substrate's ph?


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InvisibleJosex
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #27080756 - 12/09/20 04:10 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

sh4d0ws said:
I have a good track record of running jiffy mix without pasteurization but YMMV

I'm at over 50 tubs now without any problems. Got 12 tubs going on right now, will know in a couple weeks if it still works. I always worry there might be different batches of jiffy that could cause problems but have bought at 3 different stores now with no issue over nearly a year :shrug:




Do you have a bag of jiffy around that you can take a pic of? I'd like to see the composition. We don't have jiffy here but I have a hunch I've come across something that may be similar. It'd be great if I could skip the pasteurization.


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Offlinehypercubedmt
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: Josex]
    #27081589 - 12/10/20 05:11 AM (3 years, 2 months ago)

jiffy is like corn muffin mix right?

Thanks for the explanation!

actually I think I'll just use the search engine :P


Edited by hypercubedmt (12/10/20 05:23 AM)


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OfflineLunatikPenguin
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: A.k.a]
    #27082249 - 12/10/20 01:53 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

A.k.a said:
Peat and verm. Jiffy 5050 mix is perfect but if you can’t find it and make your own casing you’ll need to add something to adjust the ph levels. Lyme and I think baking soda are popular.



Do you hydrate the jiffy mix before hand or anything, or do you just put a layer down (like an inch?) then mist it well?


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OfflineA.k.aM
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: LunatikPenguin]
    #27082282 - 12/10/20 02:10 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

I hydrate it first for the thicker PE casings. You can sprinkle it on dry nice and even and thin then spray it down for other species.


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Invisiblesh4d0ws
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: LunatikPenguin]
    #27082283 - 12/10/20 02:10 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Hydrate it first

Here's a good tek on it from FrankHorrigan (note, I skip the pasteurization step but I only started doing that after running a lot of tests first. I used to pasteurize and would suggest it if you only have a couple tubs to work with)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18880716

For myself. I weigh the jiffy mix I need to hydrate, and then add 70 - 100% of that in water weight. Depending on the bags some seem to need more water than others due to differences in moisture between different batches is my guess.

So like, if I weigh 500grams of jiffy mix I will add between 350 and 500 grams of water to get to what I consider field capacity


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Invisiblesh4d0ws
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #27082288 - 12/10/20 02:12 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

You can always just add a bit at a time until you feel its reached field capacity. Especially if you don't have a big enough scale to be weighing large bowls of jiffy. I do it because casing 10+ pe tubs is a time consuming task


Quote:

Josex said:
Quote:

sh4d0ws said:
I have a good track record of running jiffy mix without pasteurization but YMMV

I'm at over 50 tubs now without any problems. Got 12 tubs going on right now, will know in a couple weeks if it still works. I always worry there might be different batches of jiffy that could cause problems but have bought at 3 different stores now with no issue over nearly a year :shrug:




Do you have a bag of jiffy around that you can take a pic of? I'd like to see the composition. We don't have jiffy here but I have a hunch I've come across something that may be similar. It'd be great if I could skip the pasteurization.





Here.



Composition



60-70% sphagnum peat moss, vermiculite, coir pith, and lime for pH adjuster



Edited by sh4d0ws (12/10/20 02:34 PM)


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OfflineLunatikPenguin
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #27082565 - 12/10/20 04:26 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

sh4d0ws said:
Hydrate it first

Here's a good tek on it from FrankHorrigan (note, I skip the pasteurization step but I only started doing that after running a lot of tests first. I used to pasteurize and would suggest it if you only have a couple tubs to work with)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18880716

For myself. I weigh the jiffy mix I need to hydrate, and then add 70 - 100% of that in water weight. Depending on the bags some seem to need more water than others due to differences in moisture between different batches is my guess.

So like, if I weigh 500grams of jiffy mix I will add between 350 and 500 grams of water to get to what I consider field capacity



Fantastic, I really appreciate the advice! I only have two shoeboxes currently so perhaps pasteurized is a safer option for me.


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InvisibleJosex
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: LunatikPenguin]
    #27082582 - 12/10/20 04:34 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Thanks for the pic, sh4d0ws!

Nah I was wrong, too bad. The stuff I mentioned I saw has nothing to do with jiffy.

Currently I'm using potting soil for cactus, loving this stuff but I'm afraid it needs to be pasteurized, or does it.



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Invisiblesh4d0ws
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: Josex]
    #27082610 - 12/10/20 04:47 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Looking back in frank's thread it appears it used to have a lot more vermiculite in the mix. Mine has barely any compared to peat. But it still works amazingly.

I have just been microwaving the mix I use for cacti though I'm not sure it's necessary unless you know there are fungi gnat larvae. Theres a certain brand of cactus soil sold here that has fungi gnat larvae in every bag :mad:

Lately I have been using a mixture of sand, coir, and pumice for my cacti ... they really love it


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OfflineA.k.aM
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #27083263 - 12/11/20 12:01 AM (3 years, 2 months ago)

I always add verm to the jiffy too, a little for cubes but a ton for tamps.


lol Josex is electric conduction a common measurement wherever you are?? I’ve never heard of that.


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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: Josex]
    #27083299 - 12/11/20 12:29 AM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Josex said:
Thanks for the pic, sh4d0ws!

Nah I was wrong, too bad. The stuff I mentioned I saw has nothing to do with jiffy.

Currently I'm using potting soil for cactus, loving this stuff but I'm afraid it needs to be pasteurized, or does it.






I would definitely pasteurize and ph buffer that stuff. I would like that pH sitting around 8 myself.


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OfflineFungusFreedom
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #27083382 - 12/11/20 02:28 AM (3 years, 2 months ago)

EC is actually very common everywhere. When you use a meter that tests for ppm it is really just measuring EC and using a formula to change it to ppm. Different meters use different formulas, so ppm readings on one meter may differ from ppm on another brand, but EC is always the same. At least this is my understanding.


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InvisibleJosex
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Re: To case PE or not? [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #27083413 - 12/11/20 04:10 AM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Pastywhyte said:
Quote:

Josex said:
Thanks for the pic, sh4d0ws!

Nah I was wrong, too bad. The stuff I mentioned I saw has nothing to do with jiffy.

Currently I'm using potting soil for cactus, loving this stuff but I'm afraid it needs to be pasteurized, or does it.






I would definitely pasteurize and ph buffer that stuff. I would like that pH sitting around 8 myself.




How would you go about buffering it to get to 8? I don't have ph meters, so I'm playing it by ear. I add ~30ml of calcium carbonate and 50ml of gypsum for every liter of cactus soil, treating me good so far and it has quite a bit of shelf life.


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