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Offlinethatmichigankid
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Registered: 04/22/12
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Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc
    #27071842 - 12/04/20 12:59 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Hi, recently decided to give this another try. Teks have come a far way since I last dealt with any of this. Used a lot of bods methods so far and put spores from a print onto some BRF agar. Used a loop to drag the spores through the agar and put way too many spores in for sure. Initially thought I wasn’t getting anything from print so i over corrected and scooped up a bunch. Used a SAB and think i followed sterile tek pretty close. Plates started to germinate at about 3-days. Had one plate develop a distinct green mold spot near edge around the same time and tossed it. I’ve since transferred my original plates to new ones at about 9 days. Still waiting for anything to happen as it’s been less than a day but I have been super curious as to whether or not my original plates were just myc or had some cobweb like thing on top. Seems to be all white colored no gray and certainly no weird smell.

Would just like clarification if this be tomentose growth or some cobweb like stuff. Pics are two plates one with several angles. Def searched around a bit for some good clarification but had trouble finding good picture examples to follow as numerous posts no longer had valid image links.

Thanks

http://


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Invisibleshroower
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Registered: 06/10/06
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: thatmichigankid]
    #27071874 - 12/04/20 01:09 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

How fast did it grow at room temperature?
Cobweb can grow half a dish in a day.


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Offlinethatmichigankid
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: shroower]
    #27071911 - 12/04/20 01:29 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

They have been growing to this level in about 6 days from first activity so not too fast I’d say. These white clouds fluffs have been there since germination at 3 days. Currently at 9 I think. Started out with a little white puff and a transparent outer ring of myc like growth. This has since spread out starting from my z pattern from the loop.

I know I didn’t necessarily transfer the best piece (large size and not the best outer sector) but it’s something I’ll try to keep improving on.


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OfflineDr.Sparkle
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: thatmichigankid]
    #27072036 - 12/04/20 02:40 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

From the picture it is tomentose growth if you leave them a bit longer they might meet and start forming some nice rhizomorphic growth. It’s really slow growing if it is. If it does eventually give you some rhizomorphic growth you can transfer a small section of it to new plates. And then you clean it up with more transfers as needed.


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Offlinethatmichigankid
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: Dr.Sparkle]
    #27072125 - 12/04/20 03:46 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Thanks for the input Dr. So it isn’t screaming mold to you then? I’d like to think they’re viable but I’m not opposed to starting the process over if need be. Just trying to get some insight. Trying to not be like every other amateur claiming it isn’t something it is. I suppose we’ll see how the next batch of transfer plates do.

I switched to oat water for the agar base so I’m hoping the switch in nutrient content might make some rhizo growth appear. I can’t wait to have some solid looking plates after some more transfers.


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OfflineDr.Sparkle
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: thatmichigankid]
    #27072141 - 12/04/20 03:56 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

I think your best bet is to wait for the original plates, it looks like you transferred tomentoise growth. I would of waited for clear rhizomorphic growth before touching them. As this is what will produce fruit bodies, the tomentoise growth will not as it is non mated.

There would be nothing wrong with getting some more plates started from your print, the more you do, the better you will get and you can then use your best looking plates to inoculate some grain.

Whatever agar recipe you use make sure it is a tried and tested one from a trusted cultivator! A poor agar recipe will hinder growth. I am not sure yours is being hindered by the agar, it’s just how slow it grows when it’s not rhizomorphic growth. Search up these types of growth for further reading.


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InvisibleLemgrub
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: Dr.Sparkle] * 1
    #27072701 - 12/04/20 10:23 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

It doesn't matter if the cubes are rhizo or tomentose, it's a diploid cell line either way and thus capable of completing the life cycle, meaning forming a fruiting body and sporulating.


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Offlinethatmichigankid
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: Lemgrub]
    #27072730 - 12/04/20 10:49 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Lemgrub said:
It doesn't matter if the cubes are rhizo or tomentose, it's a diploid cell line either way and thus capable of completing the life cycle, meaning forming a fruiting body and sporulating.




This was my current understanding. They’re just different types of growth without any direct link to future properties. Although rhizo growth is certainly easier to differentiate between mold and myc. And I’ve read that changing nutrient properties of the agar recipe can bring change. Specifically less nutritious correlating with rhizo growth as the myc reaches for nutes. My first agar was brf based but I’ve since switched to oat water and I believe 8g agar per 400ml per Bod instructions on the first set of transfer plates.

At any rate lemgrub you aren’t suspect of this cottony growth on my initial plates? I’ve read that cobweb is hard to clean out by transferring so I got worried waiting on my transfer plates.

Thanks


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InvisibleLemgrub
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: thatmichigankid]
    #27072797 - 12/05/20 12:30 AM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Its a little hard to tell from the pics, but I've definitely had growth look like that before especially on a spore plate. Shining a light from under the plate can help visualize the growth better. The transfer plate will give you a better idea either way. Cheers, hope for good stuff.


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OfflineDr.Sparkle
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: Lemgrub]
    #27073107 - 12/05/20 08:21 AM (3 years, 1 month ago)

quote:
]RogerRabbit said:
Spores from the same print are the norm.  There's plenty of genetic diversity within a sporeprint.  Rhizomorphic mycelium is strain, therefore genetic related.  When isolating strains, isolate rhizomorphic sectors.  Not all rhizomorphic sectors will be good producers, but nearly all cottony sectors will be poor producers.

Yes, rhizomorphic mycelium is a good sign that the hyphae have mated.  Monokaryons won't configure into rhizomorphs.
RR




Either way you want rhizomorphic growth. Be patient let the plates do their thing as I said earlier.


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Offlinethatmichigankid
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: Dr.Sparkle]
    #27073599 - 12/05/20 01:41 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
Rhizo and tomentose mean nothing on a dish.
Rhizo is something nice to look for but some of the best cultures grow tomentose.
Another thing is it largely has to do with the agar recipe, the % nutrition, and environmental conditions.

It's nearly impossible to have mycelium that isn't dikaryotic on your dish. You have to go through great hassle to get monokaryotic growth, trust me everything you have is dikaryotic.

Worrying about rhizomorphic growth is a no1 noob mistake. Worry about clean healthy growth, not the morphology on agar. It's meaningless until you fruit it and find out what you have

As soon as you have enough growth to transfer, make the transfer. Especially on the first dish from spores, you want to transfer asap.

On dishes 2,3... You can wait longer before transfers but on the spore plate you want to get growth onto a new dish 




Would love some further input as to which of these conflicting ideas is more correct. I understand trying to transfer rhizo growth but specifically the idea that rhizo vs tomentose has something to do with end results; fruiting, potency, yield. 

Totally an amateur and not trying to step on toes. I’m just curious if there is actually a consensus on this or if it’s still highly debated which is ok as well.

Either way thanks everyone for the notes of encouragement. Happy to hear it doesn’t scream contam to people on this forum.


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InvisibleLemgrub
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: thatmichigankid]
    #27073631 - 12/05/20 02:04 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Everything Bod said is correct. People focus on rhizo because it tends to grow further on agar than tomentose in the same time span, so that's taken to mean it will cut down on colonization times. However I don't think that's necessarily the case. Tomentose growth seems greater 3-dimensionally, and since we aim to colonize substrates 3 dimensionally, it stands to reason it performs just as well as rhizo.


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We getting that pirate bay, alien shishkebab cordycep money


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OfflineDr.Sparkle
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: Lemgrub]
    #27074044 - 12/05/20 06:41 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

I’m out! We’ve gone way above my pay grade!


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InvisibleWall.E
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Registered: 06/05/20
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: Lemgrub]
    #27074076 - 12/05/20 06:56 PM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Lemgrub said:
Everything Bod said is correct. People focus on rhizo because it tends to grow further on agar than tomentose in the same time span, so that's taken to mean it will cut down on colonization times. However I don't think that's necessarily the case. Tomentose growth seems greater 3-dimensionally, and since we aim to colonize substrates 3 dimensionally, it stands to reason it performs just as well as rhizo.




I also tend to believe people hunt or wind up getting rhizomorphic growth is because it's so much more distinguishable from tomentose. There's a fair share of people that can't pull from a moldy plate unless there's rhizomorphs just because they can't distinguish what's what and I'm one of them.

The funny thing is that my tomentose plates are looking 100% solid whereas my rhizo plates just went 1/5 :lol:


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Life’s shit, but I’m loving it



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OfflineDr.Sparkle
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Re: Spore Print to Agar Germination Cobweb or Myc [Re: Wall.E]
    #27075165 - 12/06/20 11:58 AM (3 years, 1 month ago)

Love being humbled, going to have to play around with this and see what results it gives me.


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