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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,532
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: InnerWisdom]
#27082204 - 12/10/20 01:26 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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actually no
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OutsideOfMyMind
LSD Self Administrative Director



Registered: 10/05/20
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: redgreenvines]
#27082912 - 12/10/20 07:56 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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Everything is based off of the Fibonacci code. Even an unrepeated pattern still contains the Fibonacci sequence. Gravity waves are a spiral and our whole universe is a spiral.
Edited by OutsideOfMyMind (12/10/20 07:59 PM)
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InnerWisdom


Registered: 08/09/19
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: redgreenvines]
#27083388 - 12/11/20 02:40 AM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
redgreenvines said: actually no
True. I was talking out of (ass)umption. But that's how it feels anyways. Entity contacts, peculiar visuals, symbols, like some intelligence is communicating to you more. This could be us becoming more conscious of what's going on in the right brain. I know the effects are due to decreased cerebral blood flow and activity in regions. The question is what explains the subjective consciousness changes and where is the consciousness.
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STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: PatrickKn]
#27083588 - 12/11/20 08:20 AM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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Though I can see humans trying to equate the universe with new technology, I think this case is slightly different because the reality does coincide. For example, you mentioned binary code. 0 or 1. Nothing or everything. Off or on. The universe is quite binary when considering space, in fact modern scientists claim to be able to prove that everything in our universe is in fact binary...
Then you got physics which say time slows down around objects of larger mass, well, that in itself can be thought of as processing power when you load a big game file, the game is going to move slower as well.
You also have real life supernatural occurrences people have experienced such as seeing into the past/future, but not being seen back, astral projection and, memories from past lives. (Reincarnation is like a video game characters ability to respawn.)
When you get down to the microscopic level the world starts looking unreal. I'm not forcing you to believe, I'm only saying there are actual reasons for believing we could be in a simulation, whereas comparing the universe to locomotives was unfounded.
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"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
Edited by STPLSD25 (12/11/20 08:30 AM)
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,532
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: InnerWisdom]
#27083639 - 12/11/20 09:06 AM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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in other threads, philosopher shroomies seem to be questioning existence, as well as locus of consciousness, awareness, presence, ego, subconscious, mycelial networks, concentration, attention, orders or reality and simulation/dreams etc.
My wife and I were watching My Octopus Teacher on Netflix
this has stimulated a fair amount of thinking and conversation about consciousness and intelligence, curiosity, play, etc.
As with most things, the questions you ask are worth so much more than the answers.
Questions open things up.
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laughingdog
Stranger

Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: DividedQuantum]
#27084129 - 12/11/20 03:07 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
DividedQuantum said: David Bohm called your knots "fragmentation." And he pointed out that wherever there is fragmentation, we can be sure it was put there by a human.
. Some people like to say there are no straight lines in nature, I guess they either never saw a sunbeam or a crystal.
. Others like to say there are 360º in a circle, & 60 minutes in an hour, I guess they never heard of the Babylonians, or number bases.
Others wonder if numbers are real, and others differentiate between matter and energy, as if the 2 could ever be separated,... so i wonder can mind & number be separated? can mind & body be separated? can body & universe be separated? and therefore can mind and universe be separated? and therefore can universe and number be separated? and therefore can number, math, and universe be separated?
. Hence the question many have posed as to whether or not math is a human invention, seems a dualistic question to me, and it is the failure to realize this, that keeps many , who are not Taoist in spirit to keep pondering the question, even though many who have opined on the subject are far smarter than I am, like for example Roger Penrose; IMO.
. It seems all of human thought, is based on artificial distinctions, and this is fine as long as we remember this. While also realizing that one aspect of the impersonal process of continuous manifestation or creation, is to produce life and death, and mind and artificial distinctions, seemingly out of emptiness. . Just as the quantum physicist say virtual particles arise and vanish, nano-second by nano-second in a "vacuum". Seems we forget physics borders on the non-sensical & miraculous, even without invoking theories like "the big bang", 'dark energy & dark matter', string theory, and so on. . So in the end, it seems to me the question is just another aspect of the ego's unconscious assumption that the subliminal separation it feels from the rest of the universe is real. . If I remember correctly quantum physicists sometimes say something like: actually words like 'electrons', 'particles', & 'waves', are only words we use when talking to laymen, actually without equations that can't be visualized, there can be no deeper understanding. . And the equations severely limit what can be known about any particular electron - (if there even is such a 'thing'), and about all electrons (and elementary particles). . Sounds sort of like the Tao. Of which it was said long ago that it cannot be grasped, and that this point may be worth grokking.
. Rather than this overly long post it might well have been much simpler just to ask: "... and are humans a human invention?"
Edited by laughingdog (12/11/20 03:11 PM)
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OutsideOfMyMind
LSD Self Administrative Director



Registered: 10/05/20
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: redgreenvines]
#27084147 - 12/11/20 03:18 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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I believe the universe does work in binary but it is not like a computer. There is no off/on/reboot "switch." If there is a switch, it might be gravity itself or the big bang that sort of turned everything "on."
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OutsideOfMyMind
LSD Self Administrative Director



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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: laughingdog]
#27084163 - 12/11/20 03:25 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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You bring up an interesting topic of straight lines not existing. I would agree because we don't live in a linear universe. We live in a finite universe. Even if it is not infinite it is still finite. I would probably say that straight lines only exist for artists, architects, designers, engineers, and any other person in any similar creative or technical industry. And it is only a matter of perspective. From an artist's perspective, he can draw a straight line with a graphite pencil. From a molecules perspective, there are no lines, only spinning and vibrating energy called carbon, held together by attraction or gravity or some physical or chemical force. A straight line is just a bunch of graphite molecules (or paint molecules) put together on paper but molecularly it is not straight at all.
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pineninja
Dream Weaver



Registered: 08/17/14
Posts: 12,468
Loc: South
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: laughingdog]
#27084168 - 12/11/20 03:30 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
laughingdog said:
Quote:
DividedQuantum said: David Bohm called your knots "fragmentation." And he pointed out that wherever there is fragmentation, we can be sure it was put there by a human.
. Some people like to say there are no straight lines in nature, I guess they either never saw a sunbeam or a crystal.
. Others like to say there are 360º in a circle, & 60 minutes in an hour, I guess they never heard of the Babylonians, or number bases.
Others wonder if numbers are real, and others differentiate between matter and energy, as if the 2 could ever be separated,... so i wonder can mind & number be separated? can mind & body be separated? can body & universe be separated? and therefore can mind and universe be separated? and therefore can universe and number be separated? and therefore can number, math, and universe be separated?
. Hence the question many have posed as to whether or not math is a human invention, seems a dualistic question to me, and it is the failure to realize this, that keeps many , who are not Taoist in spirit to keep pondering the question, even though many who have opined on the subject are far smarter than I am, like for example Roger Penrose; IMO.
. It seems all of human thought, is based on artificial distinctions, and this is fine as long as we remember this. While also realizing that one aspect of the impersonal process of continuous manifestation or creation, is to produce life and death, and mind and artificial distinctions, seemingly out of emptiness. . Just as the quantum physicist say virtual particles arise and vanish, nano-second by nano-second in a "vacuum". Seems we forget physics borders on the non-sensical & miraculous, even without invoking theories like "the big bang", 'dark energy & dark matter', string theory, and so on. . So in the end, it seems to me the question is just another aspect of the ego's unconscious assumption that the subliminal separation it feels from the rest of the universe is real. . If I remember correctly quantum physicists sometimes say something like: actually words like 'electrons', 'particles', & 'waves', are only words we use when talking to laymen, actually without equations that can't be visualized, there can be no deeper understanding. . And the equations severely limit what can be known about any particular electron - (if there even is such a 'thing'), and about all electrons (and elementary particles). . Sounds sort of like the Tao. Of which it was said long ago that it cannot be grasped, and that this point may be worth grokking.
. Rather than this overly long post it might well have been much simpler just to ask: "... and are humans a human invention?"
The sunbeam is straight relative to what?
-------------------- Just a fool on the hill.
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OutsideOfMyMind
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: pineninja]
#27084174 - 12/11/20 03:36 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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Exactly my question. Sun beams are made out of photons and x-rays and other kind of radiation. All of those things are not straight lines in the slightest.
The nature of reality is perspective. This is what one of my good metalhead friends told me when we were talking about psychedelic concepts.
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laughingdog
Stranger

Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,828
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: OutsideOfMyMind]
#27084469 - 12/11/20 06:07 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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. Wow you guys, found one point ( straight lines) to pick an argument about, took it out of context, missed the main issue, and now feel clever, and expect someone else, to take a similar diversion, and entertain you with a pointless debate, on a subject extraneous to the thread.
Actually it may very well happen in this forum, but "it a'nit me babe".
Edited by laughingdog (12/11/20 06:08 PM)
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OutsideOfMyMind
LSD Self Administrative Director



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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: laughingdog]
#27084554 - 12/11/20 06:47 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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This is a debate, not an argument.
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DividedQuantum
Outer Head


Registered: 12/06/13
Posts: 9,818
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: laughingdog] 1
#27084633 - 12/11/20 07:44 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
laughingdog said:
Quote:
DividedQuantum said: David Bohm called your knots "fragmentation." And he pointed out that wherever there is fragmentation, we can be sure it was put there by a human.
. Some people like to say there are no straight lines in nature, I guess they either never saw a sunbeam or a crystal.
. Others like to say there are 360º in a circle, & 60 minutes in an hour, I guess they never heard of the Babylonians, or number bases.
Others wonder if numbers are real, and others differentiate between matter and energy, as if the 2 could ever be separated,... so i wonder can mind & number be separated? can mind & body be separated? can body & universe be separated? and therefore can mind and universe be separated? and therefore can universe and number be separated? and therefore can number, math, and universe be separated?
. Hence the question many have posed as to whether or not math is a human invention, seems a dualistic question to me, and it is the failure to realize this, that keeps many , who are not Taoist in spirit to keep pondering the question, even though many who have opined on the subject are far smarter than I am, like for example Roger Penrose; IMO.
. It seems all of human thought, is based on artificial distinctions, and this is fine as long as we remember this. While also realizing that one aspect of the impersonal process of continuous manifestation or creation, is to produce life and death, and mind and artificial distinctions, seemingly out of emptiness. . Just as the quantum physicist say virtual particles arise and vanish, nano-second by nano-second in a "vacuum". Seems we forget physics borders on the non-sensical & miraculous, even without invoking theories like "the big bang", 'dark energy & dark matter', string theory, and so on. . So in the end, it seems to me the question is just another aspect of the ego's unconscious assumption that the subliminal separation it feels from the rest of the universe is real. . If I remember correctly quantum physicists sometimes say something like: actually words like 'electrons', 'particles', & 'waves', are only words we use when talking to laymen, actually without equations that can't be visualized, there can be no deeper understanding. . And the equations severely limit what can be known about any particular electron - (if there even is such a 'thing'), and about all electrons (and elementary particles). . Sounds sort of like the Tao. Of which it was said long ago that it cannot be grasped, and that this point may be worth grokking.
. Rather than this overly long post it might well have been much simpler just to ask: "... and are humans a human invention?"
David Bohm also said that all of reality is undivided wholeness in flowing movement, so that would be quite apropos of your post as well. (Which was excellent).
-------------------- Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici
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OutsideOfMyMind
LSD Self Administrative Director



Registered: 10/05/20
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Last seen: 3 hours, 14 minutes
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: DividedQuantum]
#27084647 - 12/11/20 07:50 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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It's all about the gravity waves.
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pineninja
Dream Weaver



Registered: 08/17/14
Posts: 12,468
Loc: South
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: laughingdog]
#27084708 - 12/11/20 08:32 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
laughingdog said: . Wow you guys, found one point ( straight lines) to pick an argument about, took it out of context, missed the main issue, and now feel clever, and expect someone else, to take a similar diversion, and entertain you with a pointless debate, on a subject extraneous to the thread.
Actually it may very well happen in this forum, but "it a'nit me babe".
You prefaced your post with something I would like to talk about.
Sorry for "diverting" you or your thread.
It won't happen again.
-------------------- Just a fool on the hill.
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Ferdinando


Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 3,664
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: pineninja]
#27084937 - 12/12/20 01:41 AM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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rgv I highly recommend singapore sulawesi and tioman for you a vacation singapore has an island it's very special
-------------------- with our love with our love we could save the world
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Ferdinando


Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 3,664
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: Ferdinando]
#27084941 - 12/12/20 01:43 AM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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some of the best television I've seen anti-time robber is that a ...!?
-------------------- with our love with our love we could save the world
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Outerbass
Stranger
Registered: 12/16/20
Posts: 80
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: Ferdinando] 1
#27098278 - 12/19/20 06:45 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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The way this is being discussed even if this is not a simulation it would still be a simulation, and vice versa.
Edited by Outerbass (12/20/20 02:23 AM)
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,532
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: Ferdinando]
#27098815 - 12/20/20 06:16 AM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Ferdinando said: rgv I highly recommend singapore sulawesi and tioman for you a vacation singapore has an island it's very special
sure would be nice, but I only go where I can avoid nuts and beans for my wife's allergy.
too much soy sauce everywhere! she would die!
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Ferdinando


Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 3,664
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Re: Interesting debate between physicists on whether there is a simulated universe or not [Re: redgreenvines]
#27099260 - 12/20/20 12:26 PM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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hehe sure and good luck to me with cleaning up my garden!...
found golden artist acrylic just having it enhances one's like and supports one if only all had a badge like 16 tubes
it affects the time deliciously
and when one adds water almost none can be used like it costs nothing pretty much!
-------------------- with our love with our love we could save the world
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