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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
Loc: Here
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Re: 16 days no pins monotub - P. cubensis [Re: gabbk]
#27060903 - 11/27/20 10:21 PM (3 years, 2 months ago) |
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Bacterial or no, fruits will not form unless the environment allows them to. My advice on the top layer of coir is to improve the immediate fruiting environment on the substrate surface, that's basically the only function of the top layer in this case.
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
Loc: Here
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Re: 16 days no pins monotub - P. cubensis [Re: Your Daddy]
#27060931 - 11/27/20 10:44 PM (3 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Your Daddy said: Mateah, is your assessment any different than mine has been throughout this thread? Inquiring minds want to know. Would you say that they aren't bacterial (whether it be OP or the next dude that posted asking), or that either of those tubs still look like winners???
This is the thing, in this post you're almost making me choose to either wrongfully lable that substrate surface as a "winner" or to utter the word "bacteria" pretending that I somehow can rationally or scientifically explain what kind of bacteria is causing that or why, or how it can be avoided and so on and so on. This is what I'd call pure speculative bullshit. Bacteria can not be seen unless you have a densely packed colony displayed in a medium making the colony extremely visible. For all I know the culprit that's causing the substrate surface to resemble ice cream could be yiest infection, could be mold, or could be some completely other kind of infection or even a disease making the cube colony sick. Hell, it could also very simply be environmental, the point is none of us knows anything for sure and that's why I personally avoid these widely used (useless) speculations that are grounded in absolutely nothing quantifiable cause all that does is confuse new growers further cause they learn basically nothing even after years of reading about other calling their substrates "bacterial" or "slightly" bacterial.
Ill give you another example: nothing makes me cringe more than seeing TC's not mention it but totally argue to point that their LC is "just a tad bacterial" or "slightly bacterial" completely unaware that there is no such thing as "just a tad bacterial" when live bacterial colonies are present in a liquid medium. The colony will firdt go through a short lag phase getting settled in the new environment and then in a matter of hours the log phase growth rate will have expanded even the most minute amounts of bacteria unto Narnia and back running circles around itself. In a matter of 24h bacteria will utterly and completely take over any kind of liquid growth medium, and that's counting the lag phase as well. Now imagine some growers are still arguing their point (speculating) about how their LC that's 14 days old is "slightly bacterial" then when I go to explain to them scientifically exactly why this is impossible (as I've explained using the bacterial growth phase terms) some posters will at times try to counter with "yeah but what if bacteria was introduced only at the latter stage of the LC colonization"? Like when? Lol. During the last 2.5h of your 14 day LC colonization? Hahahaha cell division occurs every 15-20min for most bacteria lol yeah so good luck explaining the theory behind the scenario that your weeks old LC is "slightly bacterial". But posters will often still kick and scream and try to fabricate even more elaborate speculations and why? Because speculations are seemingly what the vast majority of the basic understanding here is about stuff.
And I'm glad you didn't take offense at my rants, this is just me frustrated and feeling entitled and special cause I've been lurking microbiology forums since this summer so I'm basically just a prick (but nevertheless with a slightly higher knowledge about bacteria than most here) *entitlement intensifies*
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
Edited by Mateja (11/27/20 10:51 PM)
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Your Daddy
Registered: 11/13/20
Posts: 55
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Re: 16 days no pins monotub - P. cubensis [Re: Mateja]
#27060987 - 11/28/20 12:33 AM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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I will be happy to see you around the boards sir 
You are very right of course.
I, for one, will try to be more careful throwing out blanket terms when doing visual assessments. Rather than throwing out a term I can't actually verify from eyeballing something I will instead just focus on what the visual cues tell me from my own personal experience as far as what tub will likely produce or have a better shot at it versus others etc.
You are right it does muddy the waters both for people just starting, as well as those advancing. I'll do my very bestest to not contribute to the problem! 
Although from what I know of the shroomery you must spend a good amount of your time cringing and being peeved lol Seems like a ship that you'd have a hard time turning
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Nijamagi
Stranger


Registered: 10/29/20
Posts: 14
Last seen: 2 years, 11 months
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Re: 16 days no pins monotub - P. cubensis [Re: Mateja]
#27062665 - 11/29/20 09:12 AM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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Appreciate the advice man. At this point I have accepted the tub is probably lost - a day after posting 2 small areas of yellow bacterial growth appeared and it's starting to smell a little musky. I'll try a very thin coir casing anyway but it looks like I'm back to square 1. At least I've learnt a lot from this experience.
I was being extremely sterile in my whole procedure and I'm and not convinced it has this texture because of bacterial contamination, to me it just looks very very tomentose and so did in the jars before I threw them in the monotub, and I was very picky with which jars I chose to use - they all smelt like mushrooms and looked healthy as far I can tell.
I have discovered something rather interesting and pretty intuitive though that I think I'm going to utilise in my next run. This is that I did not throw away a few jars and lo and behold the remaining colonised grains started sending off rhizomorphs to search for food. I had a hard time getting rhizomorphic mycelium and perhaps this is a true way to induce it: putting a grain or two of rye inside a petri dish and inoculating it, then transferring the resulting rhizomorphs to agar! I'm just not certain that it wouldn't revert back to the tomentose type in the agar, will have to just try it and see.
Edited by Nijamagi (11/29/20 09:15 AM)
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Nijamagi
Stranger


Registered: 10/29/20
Posts: 14
Last seen: 2 years, 11 months
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Re: 16 days no pins monotub - P. cubensis [Re: gabbk]
#27062683 - 11/29/20 09:22 AM (3 years, 1 month ago) |
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My tub has gone bacterial too, although I'm not sure this is the reason for the texture.
Gives me a glimmer of hope though, cheers for the concise insightful input!
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