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Offlineblack strat
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Check out my agar, please?
    #27035826 - 11/12/20 09:17 PM (3 months, 18 days ago)

Absolute noob dropping in..

Firstly, hi.  I thought I was being super careful with everything; I followed PGT's agar tek video on YT.  I PC'd my two media bottles (containing the agar) for 30+ minutes @ 15psi.  I used ketchup cups.  I made a SAB.  I wiped EVERYTHING down with iso, multiple times thru-out.  I wore gloves.  I flamed my syringes until red. 

To be completely honest, I don't even know what I'm looking at here.  It's been about 48hrs, and I'm wondering if any of these look like they're supposed to, or even not terrible enough to just throw away and start over.  I used 4 different syringes/4 different strains.  Is it even too early to tell?  I can definitely be more patient, as long as someone with some real knowledge tells me to "be more patient".  I really thought I was careful enough, but maybe I fucked up somewhere.  Should I have sterilized the syringes?  I saw a video, I think it was PGT, where he wrapped a syringe in foil, elevated it off water, and PC'd it.  Maybe I should've done that?  I even iso'd the ketchup cups, although most people think they're clean enough from the package.  I dunno man.  Any feedback is appreciated.  Thanks.







oops, almost forgot - my lamp came in today too :]


Edited by black strat (11/12/20 09:56 PM)


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Offlineludwigs32
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27035832 - 11/12/20 09:20 PM (3 months, 18 days ago)

i dont know squat but mine didnt do anything for almost a week. spore to agar


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Offlinescarabaeus
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27035835 - 11/12/20 09:21 PM (3 months, 18 days ago)

Patience grasshopper. Confucious say let time march on.


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OfflineGrenik
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: scarabaeus]
    #27035998 - 11/12/20 11:56 PM (3 months, 18 days ago)

How much from a syringe did you put onto each agar plate?


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Offlinestar_bit
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27036128 - 11/13/20 01:43 AM (3 months, 18 days ago)

I'm not an expert, but they are looking a bit slimy (bacterial maybe?)


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27036170 - 11/13/20 02:12 AM (3 months, 17 days ago)

Quote:

Grenik said:
How much from a syringe did you put onto each agar plate?



7-12 I really aimed for one single drop.

on a few, which I think is apparent, more came out. a lot more. this was my first time so there was a bit of a learning curve. same with the darker agar - I tried to get fancy and make it 'purple', only to fuck it all up by making it closer to black lol. learning curve.

also, how should I be storing them? they're currently lid-side-up, in a closed cabinet. do they need light?  but obviously no air.... ....right?


Edited by black strat (11/13/20 02:15 AM)


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OfflinePhony Phone
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27036399 - 11/13/20 07:10 AM (3 months, 17 days ago)

They all look bacterial. I dont see any recognizable mycelium in them.
Check this thread and this thread.

If the syringes had spores in them, no, you shouldn't sterilize them or you would have killed the spores.

If you made a syringe out of spores, did you take care to:
- Drop the print as clean as possible on a foil? (Foil comes presterilized off the roll, open it in a sab to keep that way)

- Sterilize the syringe? You do that by boiling or pressure cooking some water, then you suck it with the syringe, 3 or so times and you leave the last water suck in the syringe to cool. You then use that water to make a spore syringe with your print.

Also did you:

Pressure cook the donor and receiving containers of the agar for 20-45 mins?

And a tip about sab: after you spray with soap water, let it sit for 30-40 min before using it, aerosolized particles fly through the air during that time and may become a vector of contamination.


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Offlinekarri0n
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Phony Phone] * 2
    #27037135 - 11/13/20 03:58 PM (3 months, 17 days ago)

All of the ones that it look like the pooled liquid over them are bacterial. The ones with a single drop you will need to wait probably at least a week to know if it's mycelium, mold, or bacteria. If it grows quickly it's probably mold.

Remember that spore syringes probably have quite a bit of bacteria in them, and if there is water for that bacteria to move around, it will get everywhere. Agar works for isolating mycelium from bacteria because mycelium can move, but bacteria can't, so long as there is no water and you aren't moving the plates around.

Spores take time to germinate, as well. So there will be probably 48 or so hours that nothing "good" can possibly be growing. Once they germinate, then the mycelium will start growing but still, it tends to be slower than bacteria or mold.

I never had any luck with syringe directly to agar. It's recommended  an inoculation loop, or what I use are sterile swabs.

You can take q-tips, wrap in neat little foil packages, and PC them to make sterile swabs. I did this in a jar with a standard modified myco lid.

You can also buy them from medical places or mushroom supply places, or get them from a doctor's office.

You can also rip the plastic off a bread tie, wrap it once around a toothpick, then twist the rest of it into a long handle to make an inoculation loop that you can flame.

Put a drop of spore solution onto a sterile swab and make a neat zig zag over the plate, or

Put a 1cc of spore solution into a sterile shotglass, flame your inoculation loop, dip it in the spores, and make a clean zig zag across the plate.

See these photos. When you make the zig zag, then you can separate the bacterial snots from white, organized mycelium. The bacteria was not able to move across the plate, but the mycelium was, and so I took a transfer from it.



If you wait a week or so and let the plates sit, you might see some healthy mycelium that grows away from bacterial areas. The ones that have water over the whole plate are going to turn completely into boogers most likely.


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27037232 - 11/13/20 04:56 PM (3 months, 17 days ago)

Quote:

karri0n said:
All of the ones that it look like the pooled liquid over them are bacterial. The ones with a single drop you will need to wait probably at least a week to know if it's mycelium, mold, or bacteria. If it grows quickly it's probably mold.

Remember that spore syringes probably have quite a bit of bacteria in them, and if there is water for that bacteria to move around, it will get everywhere. Agar works for isolating mycelium from bacteria because mycelium can move, but bacteria can't, so long as there is no water and you aren't moving the plates around.

Spores take time to germinate, as well. So there will be probably 48 or so hours that nothing "good" can possibly be growing. Once they germinate, then the mycelium will start growing but still, it tends to be slower than bacteria or mold.

I never had any luck with syringe directly to agar. It's recommended  an inoculation loop, or what I use are sterile swabs.

You can take q-tips, wrap in neat little foil packages, and PC them to make sterile swabs. I did this in a jar with a standard modified myco lid.

You can also buy them from medical places or mushroom supply places, or get them from a doctor's office.

You can also rip the plastic off a bread tie, wrap it once around a toothpick, then twist the rest of it into a long handle to make an inoculation loop that you can flame.

Put a drop of spore solution onto a sterile swab and make a neat zig zag over the plate, or

Put a 1cc of spore solution into a sterile shotglass, flame your inoculation loop, dip it in the spores, and make a clean zig zag across the plate.

See these photos. When you make the zig zag, then you can separate the bacterial snots from white, organized mycelium. The bacteria was not able to move across the plate, but the mycelium was, and so I took a transfer from it.



If you wait a week or so and let the plates sit, you might see some healthy mycelium that grows away from bacterial areas. The ones that have water over the whole plate are going to turn completely into boogers most likely.




wooooow, that was so much great info, thank you. jus got home from work, and yes, it's looking even more like snot than last night. there are one or two that haven't completely shit the bed. (more like I shit the bed.... anyway....)

I tracked everything you suggested I do, made perfect sense.

Question -- is the reason I can sterilize pretty much everything BUT the water filled syringes because in order to do so, I would need to PC them, which would kill the bacteria, but ALSO kill the spores in the process, too? Basically, it seems like I chose wrong when I chose syringes. They are from a vendor from this site, and everything came sterile-wrapped, etc., the whole 9... So that's what got me thinking, "why tf am I flaming these supposed completely sterile needles??" Seems like I'm jus doing an extra step for nothing.  In fact, by killing the spores near the tip, I'm almost going BACKWARDS in a sense.. yeah?

I'm thinking it's time to buy prints..? I have a shitload of product left, unfortunately. I bought 4 separate syringes/strains and didn't even break 1mL on any of them.  I am FOR SURE gonna do what you suggested.. jus gotta make more agar now.

Another question - the tap water in my city is fucking terrible. I don't drink it. it stains any dishes with white chalky residue. who tf knows what's all in it. so, for my agar mix, I was using bottled 'spring water'.  is this cool? is there better water I could use? distilled, etc..

And being there are so many minerals/chlorine/whatever from the tap, is it even ok to PC using that water?  after I PCd my media bottles, they too were left with white rez on them, and all over inside the actual PCer. I kept their caps on, but obviously loose. Maybe some shit got in those, too?

thanks again for your advice. I will use it!!


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Phony Phone]
    #27037237 - 11/13/20 05:00 PM (3 months, 17 days ago)

Quote:

Phony Phone said:
They all look bacterial. I dont see any recognizable mycelium in them.
Check this thread and this thread.

If the syringes had spores in them, no, you shouldn't sterilize them or you would have killed the spores.

If you made a syringe out of spores, did you take care to:
- Drop the print as clean as possible on a foil? (Foil comes presterilized off the roll, open it in a sab to keep that way)

- Sterilize the syringe? You do that by boiling or pressure cooking some water, then you suck it with the syringe, 3 or so times and you leave the last water suck in the syringe to cool. You then use that water to make a spore syringe with your print.

Also did you:

Pressure cook the donor and receiving containers of the agar for 20-45 mins?

And a tip about sab: after you spray with soap water, let it sit for 30-40 min before using it, aerosolized particles fly through the air during that time and may become a vector of contamination.




I see one of my questions was essentially answered by ya before I asked it, thank you. But yes to your first scenario - I bought the syringes from a vendor here.

pieces are starting to connect and I'm learning from y'all's responses. very much appreciated!


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Offlinekarri0n
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27037315 - 11/13/20 05:58 PM (3 months, 17 days ago)

If you PC'd a spore syringe, the spores in there are now dead. It would be sterile though!

I wouldn't blame the vendor, this is a typical experience. I haven't had the pleasure of working directly from prints for cubensis but I do believe that's what most people move toward pretty quickly. Water is a pain in the ass and bacteria loves it. I took a spore swab from a wild shaggy mane, and put that to agar and got less bacteria than commercially produced, trusted spore syringes. I wouldn't buy more spores if I had 4 syringes with 9CC each though. You have enough spores for a decade of drug use there.



Most of the pros on here use tap water for stuff. I kinda think non-chlorinated would work  marginally better, but haven't tried and city water works for me. I use a brita filter for my family, pets, and plants, and this definitely removes chlorine if you are worried about it.

To get rid of the hard water deposits, use a tablespoon or two of white vinegar in your PC water.

I am not much further along than you are. Your experience is exactly what I did the first time around and  you can read my journal to see exactly that.

Swipe some spores and you will be in business my friend. Mush love.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21922023


--------------------
Anything written above is just as likely to be accurate as it is to be corrected by someone smarter than me two posts from now.

My Journal / Grow Log


Edited by karri0n (11/13/20 06:02 PM)


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OfflineGrenik
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27037525 - 11/13/20 08:23 PM (3 months, 17 days ago)

Good attempt even if you do not get much (any) mycelium. Do not toss them yet. Let them grow and see what happens. You are doing the right thing by trying and asking Q's.

There are a lot of different ways to swab the plates from a syringe, but the picture below is how I hold the syringe. The syringe would have been shaken, held needle up and the barrel flicked with my finger, shaken some more, etc. to break up the spores in the syringe. All of this done outside of the still air box (SAB).

Of course it would have a needle on it, I would be wearing gloves, and both the syringe body and my gloves would have been wiped with alcohol. I use my thumb and forefinger to pull the plunger down. Trying to push the plunger down like you are giving someone a shot does not work for me.



In the SAB, I hold the syringe like in the picture and squeeze out a few drops onto a paper towel (or the towel the SAB is sitting on). If you flame sterilized the needle then you have to squeeze out a few drops until it stops hissing and then I squeeze out a few more drops onto the paper towel (or anyplace not on your agar).

Then remove the agar container top (hold the edges and remove it so that your hand never is above the agar) and move the needle over the agar. Just the needle, not your hand, not the barrel of the syringe, just the tip of the needle.

Most times, there is a little liquid at the end of the needle - a drop that is just forming. If that is the case, then I squeeze the barrel with my pinky and ring finger and that is normally enough to get one drop to form and drop from the needle. If not, then pull the plunger with your thumb and index finger. It will be hard to get one drop, but you should not get more than a few drops.

Whenever possible I use spore prints, but if you are going to grow gourmets like Oyster then you will get mycelium syringes and you will use the process above. However, liquid culture syringes (mycelium syringes) tend to be much cleaner than spore syringes so they are easier to clean up on agar.


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27037568 - 11/13/20 08:42 PM (3 months, 17 days ago)

cool cool cool!  thanks man.

had a thought -- in theory, would this be a clean way to do inoculation from syringe to agar plate? ::

since foil comes sterilized in the roll, instead of PCing anything, could I unroll a bit in the SAB -> shoot some spore-water onto the foil from sterile syringe -> use sterilized loop to "dab/grab" some spores from foil surface -> then do the swipe like you guys described?

also karri0n, no sir, I did not PC the syringes, thankfully. I was jus trying to figure all the logic out by typing it.

and please, after the swipe, how do I store?? lid side up, or down? is a closed cabinet ok?

Grenik, for sure, gonna hang on to em for a little bit, see what happens, update you guys with new pics, and go from there. I was super bummed at work when I read some of these first comments confirming it's bacterial. but I'm over it, ready to crack at it again. I'll get this shit eventually hahah.


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OfflineTryna
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27037613 - 11/13/20 09:03 PM (3 months, 17 days ago)

Cool post here.


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Offlinekarri0n
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Tryna] * 1
    #27037696 - 11/13/20 10:10 PM (3 months, 17 days ago)

I like that syringe hold technique and may try it next time. They are a bitch to control. I have found better luck holding it in my fist and pushing the plunger with my thumb.... The way a killer would work a needle, not a doctor. This looks like it will offer more control.


I wouldn't try that foil thing. That sounds like too much of a mess and likely to introduce contamination.

I re-read Bod's agar tek and he also mentions dropping a drop of spore solution onto a sterilized loop instead of using a shotglass, that is probably easier. Read through the whole thing again before you do another sesh. https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21922023

Flame the loop, cool it in the blank agar plate, drop spore solution onto the loop, then do the swipe.

Store it lid side up. Lid side down is for growing bacterial cultures.


--------------------
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OfflineGrenik
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27037748 - 11/13/20 10:56 PM (3 months, 17 days ago)

Good advice on transferring to the loop. I use the 90 mm petri dishes and I was not sure if you had enough room to use a loop on the condiment containers. I did a lot of plates syringe to loop to agar. I now am rather good at getting just one drop onto the agar, so I do a drop to agar and then use the loop to swab it around.

You can get clear, colored agar

You can read through these plates. I make sterile agar and then pour plates. I boil my agar before pouring. I boil it on the stove in a pan instead of the microwave. You can strain it through a cheesecloth if you are not using yeast and that will help clear it. These plates were not strained through cheesecloth.

For coloring I use gel food coloring instead of the liquid you may have used for icing and stuff. It adds a lot of color.

I make the agar a nice dark color when it is in the pot. A nice squirt, more than just a couple drops. When you pour a thin layer it looks lighter.

I do not think the clarity of the agar matters at all to the mycelium, but it may help you identify contaminants easier.

As you may be able to tell, I really like agar! I do not really care if I grow anything as long as I get to play with petri dishes :cool:


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27037855 - 11/14/20 12:24 AM (3 months, 17 days ago)

Quote:

karri0n said:
I like that syringe hold technique and may try it next time. They are a bitch to control. I have found better luck holding it in my fist and pushing the plunger with my thumb.... The way a killer would work a needle, not a doctor. This looks like it will offer more control.


I wouldn't try that foil thing. That sounds like too much of a mess and likely to introduce contamination.

I re-read Bod's agar tek and he also mentions dropping a drop of spore solution onto a sterilized loop instead of using a shotglass, that is probably easier. Read through the whole thing again before you do another sesh. https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21922023

Flame the loop, cool it in the blank agar plate, drop spore solution onto the loop, then do the swipe.

Store it lid side up. Lid side down is for growing bacterial cultures.




read it! great info! also read this one, from Stro:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18430998/fpart/all/vc/1

phenomenal write-up.

(yeahh.. not gonna do the foil thing.. gonna go needle to loop to plate. simple.)


Edited by black strat (11/14/20 12:26 AM)


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27040069 - 11/15/20 10:00 AM (3 months, 15 days ago)

Quote:

Grenik said:








this was good, worked well for me man.

I had about 6 or 7 unused agar cups from the fridge, so I made a loop with my xacto and some wire, flamed that and my syringes, put a drop on the loop, and zig-zagged the cups, all inside my SAB w/ iso, gloves, etc..

Hopefully they turn out better than the last 13 did..

ONE out of the 13 though, looks like some mycelium is trying to grow away from the snot - I'll take a pic in a few days for you guys.

one thing I don't think I've read yet is how I should store them. karri0n said lid side up, I appreciate that, but what about light? dark cabinet, or somewhere out in the open?

thanks guys.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27040460 - 11/15/20 02:16 PM (3 months, 15 days ago)

Quote:

black strat said:

one thing I don't think I've read yet is how I should store them. karri0n said lid side up, I appreciate that, but what about light? dark cabinet, or somewhere out in the open?

thanks guys.




Light is beneficial for all stages of growth.

It's not like weed where light is needed for photosynthesis, they just like to know that the light exists. A 6500k CFL bulb or daylight from a nearby window is plenty for both the mycelium and the fruits. LED is not as good as CFL for cubes.

For the plates, Put them on a shelf somewhere that you are less likely to think about moving them and looking at them and they won't be disturbed. Just the normal light in your house is fine for now.


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Anything written above is just as likely to be accurate as it is to be corrected by someone smarter than me two posts from now.

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Edited by karri0n (11/15/20 02:19 PM)


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Offlinekarri0n
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27040519 - 11/15/20 02:46 PM (3 months, 15 days ago)

I tried that syringe hold technique today to swipe some spores with a loop as well.

I love that hold, it works much better than anything I have tried so far.

I do think I prefer the sterile swab to the loop though. The loop was tougher to control. I will make one with stiffer wire next time.

Keep us updated on how this works out man! :mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2:


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OfflineGrenik
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27040920 - 11/15/20 06:53 PM (3 months, 15 days ago)

Nice to see you getting a work process that works for you. Just to set some expectations...not every drop will have spores in it. I normally do 4 plates from a syringe and 1 or 2 normally have no growth.  No contamination, no mycelium, just a blank plate. But on the plates that do grow, I always get a good area I can transfer from.

Good luck to you!


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27041053 - 11/15/20 08:23 PM (3 months, 15 days ago)

Quote:

Grenik said:
Nice to see you getting a work process that works for you. Just to set some expectations...not every drop will have spores in it. I normally do 4 plates from a syringe and 1 or 2 normally have no growth.  No contamination, no mycelium, just a blank plate. But on the plates that do grow, I always get a good area I can transfer from.

Good luck to you!




yes! this is what really had me thinking last night. I couldn't imagine EVERY drop having spores, so doing needle -> loop -> plate just didn't seem totally guaranteed in my mind. glad you confirmed and gave realistic expectations.

I know I said a few days for a pic lol but I wanna post it now.



just based on my 'luck' so far, this isn't mycelium, is it? :sad:

karri0n, took your advice - with the new plates I'm leaving them where they are now, undisturbed. but I do see the zigzags are already little bacteria-boulevards.. I was a lot more careful this time around too, so I dunno men....

I DO have a couple of prints coming in the mail now though. I wanna try everything lol. this shit is so cool.

thanks again bros.

oh, super amateur question - for an iso spray bottle -- do y'all dilute with water? any ballpark-ratio you could give me please?

and next session i am DEFINITELY gonna try the sterile swab way. just bought 300 cheapy qtips, gonna wrap in foil n PC.... is there a tek for it, or do ya jus sorta make little foil packages n elevate them in PCer, and bada-bing, sterile swabs?

:mushroom2:


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27041064 - 11/15/20 08:33 PM (3 months, 15 days ago)

I think there is a good chance that you have something salvageable. I would make a transfer where I have indicated and try growing it out to see what happens.



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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27041120 - 11/15/20 09:11 PM (3 months, 15 days ago)

really?? ok, will do, thanks brother.

damn, so that's not mold, huh? it's quite fuzzy.  then again, I don't know jack shit. hah :thumbup:


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27041211 - 11/15/20 10:30 PM (3 months, 15 days ago)

Quote:

black strat said:
is there a tek for it, or do ya jus sorta make little foil packages n elevate them in PCer, and bada-bing, sterile swabs?

:mushroom2:




I didn't see a tek when I did it, just a description. I stuck em in a jar with 4 micropore-covered GE holes, just because I had it sitting around from pf tek. Then PC'd for 20 mins. Then I did see a tek today which basically mirrored the process I used:

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22556356/fpart/all/vc/1


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Edited by karri0n (11/15/20 10:31 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27042782 - 11/16/20 09:30 PM (3 months, 14 days ago)

good evening fellas.

jus PCed 400ml of new agar, waiting for it to come down n hit that sweet temp to pour, fuck, I think Bods tek says 110F? whatever, gotta go look.  wrapped some qtips too.

anyway, please forgive my obsessive questioning, but are we sure this is myc? and not some devious fuckin fuzzy white mold?  and if we're set to go, do you concur with my red marks on where to slice from? not so much on the smaller plate, I think that one should grow a little more.. but at least from the bigger, more occupied plate?

(6 pics, but we're looking at jus 2 separate plates here)



thanks.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27043007 - 11/16/20 11:28 PM (3 months, 14 days ago)

Are all of your plates from the same source?

I am still a newbie, I just swabbed my 550th plate tonight. I feel confident that you are in good shape and it is worth transferring. I thought from the beginning you just needed time, but I am still learning also.

I find that mycelium grows with that leading edge that you have in your pics. I find contams to have a smoother, more uniform leading edge. I am sure it is not a perfect way to identify, but that growth looks good to me.  I will try and post some magnified shots so you can see the difference, but it may be a few days before I get to it. Also, mycelium seems lighter and cotton like while contams are more matted and dense.

Still, I am always happy when mushrooms grow or my plates become rhizomorphic. That is the only way I really know.:confused:

I like your choice of transfer choices. I would try the ? location for practice. On the plate with 4 red marks, I would also try the 6:00 position. You could drop the 3:00 one if you only want to do 4. But your original choices are also good spots, so your choice.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27043029 - 11/16/20 11:37 PM (3 months, 14 days ago)

It looks to me like you have the right idea, i.e. always transfer AWAY from the contamination. It is obvious to you by now (and everyone else  lol), that you have a bacterial mess. I have salvaged plates just as bad by transfer though, so I say give it a shot.

I always have a jar of anti-bacterial agar on the shelf just for this kind of situation. It consists of the usual agar recipe with the addition of gentamycin sulfate (g sulfate is the anti- bacterial component). It is available as an agar supplement from one of the Shroomery vendors (I can't remember which one at the moment). It is a bit of a pain to mix if you are not familiar with this kind of thing but definitely doable. Premixed anti-bact. agar is available from Paul Stamets' company but I don't do business with him because I think his business practices suck -but that is a topic for another thread.

The above paragraph was not targeted specifically for you, but rather just as some general info for whoever may read this. You may still be able to salvage and be  a winner using what you currently have to work with. Good luck! :mushroom2:


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: scarabaeus]
    #27043041 - 11/16/20 11:44 PM (3 months, 14 days ago)

Oh yeah! I forgot to mention. If in the future you have a mold contamination rather than a bacterial one, in my experience it is better to just start over. A mold that is turning colors (usually green) means that it is making spores, and spores float around and get everywhere. At least bacteria doesn't make a 'contamination fountain' like a sporulating mold will.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: scarabaeus]
    #27043044 - 11/16/20 11:45 PM (3 months, 14 days ago)

You can get it here. You can also buy plates from several sources with it already added to the agar.

How did plates 8 and 12 do from the original post?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27043057 - 11/16/20 11:56 PM (3 months, 14 days ago)

Ah yes, shroom supply. I was kinda thinking it was them but wasn't sure. BTW, I have ordered stuff from them in the past and have found them to be quick and reliable. Thanks Grenik :thumbup:


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: scarabaeus]
    #27043097 - 11/17/20 12:43 AM (3 months, 14 days ago)

you guys are the shit. I'm really digging this community so far. there is SO much information on this site, it's kinda fuckin absurd.

Grenik, yes sir, the substance in question is in fact 'light, and cotton-like' by the looks of it! almost wispy hah. also, when you say 'from the same source', what do ya mean exactly? I poured all 13 of those together, yes, and inoculated the same time, but I used 4 different syringes. I don't know why, I wanted to try em all and see what would happen. there's GT, Dancing Tiger, Brazil, and Mexican Dutch King. the 2 I'm transferring from are both Dancing Tiger. I poured 30 fresh cups of agar tonight, so tomorrow I'll transfer these. thanks for the advice brother.

scar, I had no idea that stuff existed, I will definitely be ordering some. and yeah, it is a mess lol, but it's my first time and fuck it, maybe what better way to start off than trying to see if I can climb my way out of this mess, ya know? to be completely honest, I actually am having a good time with this shit. yeah, of course it'd be awesome if this go-around actually pans out for me, but it's been fun so far either way. and thank you for your input as well man!!

:mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2:


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27043100 - 11/17/20 12:47 AM (3 months, 14 days ago)

Quote:

Grenik said:
You can get it here. You can also buy plates from several sources with it already added to the agar.

How did plates 8 and 12 do from the original post?




hmm, honestly not too sure which is which anymore exactly :/ most of them are ONLY snot still. the 2 above I guess are showing promise, and I'd say there are another maybe 2 or 3 that I'm holding out jus a little bit of hope for, and they're jus running a little late to the party.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27043367 - 11/17/20 08:56 AM (3 months, 13 days ago)

If that is mycelium you need to transfer asap.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: IdiotCircusBoy]
    #27044150 - 11/17/20 06:17 PM (3 months, 13 days ago)

I really hope that's not mold.

I have some growth that looks just like that on one of my plates and I Identified it as mold because it grew straight from the edge and quickly, and it has that hairy "brillo" look.

I do my photos up through the bottom of the plate since my no-pours don't have great clarity and are tough to see on camera through the tops and sides, but I will explain what I am talking about best I can.



This grew on this plate 1 day after inoculating my plates, starting from the far left edge in the first pic and from the bottom in the second. The two little circles or "bubbles" are new, and might be bacteria, or even mushroom mycelium that germinated under the mold colony.



Side view:


Note how brillo, wispy, hairy it looks, and also how quickly it grew. It appeared as a tiny spot in the corner, two days before the mycelium in the following pics appeared multiple places, and has consumed almost the whole plate, while the mycelium has the one larger colony but is mostly moving slower.



Side view:


The mycelium is also cottony and fluffy. However it seems to be thicker, and doesn't have a brillo hairy appearance moving in wild directions. I also notice that cubensis mycelium tends to eat the food coloring out of the agar, turning it to its natural brown color(I used grainwater, it will be white if you used flour) and mold doesn't.

I really hope I was able to detail the difference in appearance here. I don't know that what you have is mold or mycelium, but I wish you the best of luck and just hope I can help.

The biggest way to tell for me is speed of growth, because cubensis mycelium appearance really can be pretty variable. Mycelium is slower than mold.


Edited by karri0n (11/17/20 06:32 PM)


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27044441 - 11/17/20 09:17 PM (3 months, 13 days ago)

fuck....

man, I just really really do not know. I did the transfers a few hours ago.  all I can say for a fact is that at the very outermost edges of my 'white stuff', it begins to straighten out. I have no clue if that means anything. also, it always seems to be growing away from the bacteria. damnit, who the fuck knows. I don't even know how I am supposed to tell.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27044454 - 11/17/20 09:26 PM (3 months, 13 days ago)

yeah, now that I'm looking online at pics, I think it's cobweb mold. awesome.

basically just wasted 15 cups of agar carefully transferring different pieces of cobweb mold. wow. I am saaaalty.

edit: ok, so here is one of my newer cups, I swiped with an inoc loop a few days ago..


if what I had earlier is cobweb, then this most certainly is too. it's growing/looking EXACTLY how those others did at first when they started. I don't fuckin get it. how can none.. out of like almost 40 cups.. none of them give me even a hint of myc??

fuck. I'm done for the night. this is such a bummer.

edit again: jus read that putting peroxide on cobweb mold eats at it like wet cotton candy. dunno how accurate that it. swabbed some peroxide on the original cups I took the transfers from.... nothing happened. jus sat there kinda. who knows. who the fuck knows lol.


Edited by black strat (11/17/20 10:25 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27044562 - 11/17/20 10:43 PM (3 months, 13 days ago)

Hmmm

You are probably putting too much material on the plate. One drop on the inoculation loop and spread it around. A typical inoculation loop holds 10 microliter of liquid.  So 1 mL would be enough for 100 plates. 1 drop is about 50 microliter, so 5x the amount you need. 

Mycelium grows and spreads. It may start slower than mold, but it normally spreads faster than contams. You want a very small sample and let the mycelium run, then transfer from the edges.

Let’s look at those transferred samples in a week. The original plates that you swabbed with peroxide will probably die, that does not prove cobweb, it proves peroxide is bad. 

Deep breath.

Switch to spore prints if the syringes concern you.


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Edited by Grenik (11/17/20 10:46 PM)


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27044637 - 11/17/20 11:50 PM (3 months, 13 days ago)

:tongue2:

I was dying reading that reddit post. especially because I AM that noob hahah. man, I feel dumb. but you know, the only reason I went with the ol cobweb theory is because shroomscout's right - it keeps getting repeated over and over, propagating that paranoia, then my stupid ass sees all that, and suddenly "wahh, I have cobweb!!" lol, oh boy.

alright. I'm good. gonna leave em alone like you said. and yeah man, my prints should be here any day now, can't wait. thanks bro.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27044679 - 11/18/20 12:53 AM (3 months, 13 days ago)

Stay away from peroxide. It's toxic to any fungus, including mycelium.

Those swipe Plates still look like too much water to me.

Keep an eye on your swabbed plates and your transfer plates. Have patience.

As long as you are putting very, very small amounts of spore solution on the plate, and following sterile technique, you will get mycelium.

I saw you say something about being worried that not every drop will have spores. A drop will have thousands of spores. If you see them in the water, those are actually clumps. They're microscopic. To give you a hint of how many are in there, I aspirated sterile water back into the spore syringe after it was empty to rinse the last leavings out, put that on a BRF cake, and it germinated. This was just testing to see if there really were still spores in there.

Are these plates different varieties of cubes? You should see slightly different looking mycelium between varieties and between plates.

At least a few are going to have usable growth. You're gaining experience and understanding with every step, so just have patience and take heart in the fact that you're both learning and will see success.


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27045809 - 11/18/20 05:59 PM (3 months, 12 days ago)

very very well said at the end, my brother. I notice my little bumps of disappointment and frustration are short-lived, and then I'm wanting to start messing around with this shit more and more. for example, my prints came in today. stoked. b+, gt, ecuador, & pes amazonian(?).  already got the sterile swabs and fresh plates ready to go. gonna go smallll this time hah. I'm listening!

hey, is there any good argument for using a loop over a sterile swab? entirely curious. I'm gonna swab em tonight tho.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27046242 - 11/18/20 09:28 PM (3 months, 12 days ago)

I tried loop the other day after getting mold on one of the plates I did with the swab.

My thought was possibly that I introduced contam from the foil wrap which I didn't remove fully but only peeled down partially, and that a mood spore had landed on it at one of the times I opened the jar to take a swab out.

A solid metal wire that I flame the entire thing can't have that issue.

It will depend on the results, but I had an easier time controlling the sterile swabs than the loop. I see people using both.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27046360 - 11/18/20 10:28 PM (3 months, 12 days ago)

Can anyone tell me once the agar plates are fully colonized, do they go in the fridge or stay out in room temperature? I have not been able to find this simple answer anywhere, thank you! Also, this was my agar at 11 days, don't worry about the black, that is electrical tape as I find the dishes flimsy and more subject to contamns if I don't secure them.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: jake103]
    #27046364 - 11/18/20 10:29 PM (3 months, 12 days ago)



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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: jake103]
    #27046379 - 11/18/20 10:42 PM (3 months, 12 days ago)

I put plates I want to store in the refrigerator.  I have only removed one from cold storage and used it so I am not an expert.  Transfer before they get completely filled and then store cold.

Does your plate have condensation on the top? If so, put a warm glass or bowl of water on it to slightly heat the lid and get rid of the condensation.  Then take another picture and post it. Was it from a spore print?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: jake103]
    #27046482 - 11/18/20 11:29 PM (3 months, 12 days ago)

Quote:

jake103 said:





That colonization does not looks very good imo...
You should transfer it at least once to get some better growth.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: GrinchGrower]
    #27047355 - 11/19/20 03:31 PM (3 months, 11 days ago)

Ummm...this is only at 11 days. And no, I did not have condensation on these particular dishes. I tried the hot water method suggested for some of the newer ones but it did not work. I have them incubating with my jars. The ones pictured are from a spore syringe.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: jake103]
    #27047358 - 11/19/20 03:31 PM (3 months, 11 days ago)



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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: jake103]
    #27047399 - 11/19/20 04:13 PM (3 months, 11 days ago)

Quote:

jake103 said:
Can anyone tell me once the agar plates are fully colonized, do they go in the fridge or stay out in room temperature? I have not been able to find this simple answer anywhere, thank you! Also, this was my agar at 11 days, don't worry about the black, that is electrical tape as I find the dishes flimsy and more subject to contamns if I don't secure them.




leave in room temp in a baggie during colonization
at 2/3 of colonization put in the refrigerator. dont let it get at 100% plate colonization or it gets messy


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Phony Phone]
    #27047932 - 11/19/20 09:11 PM (3 months, 11 days ago)

OK, thank you! I have been too nervous to transfer them because I don't want to contamn and this is so far the best looking agar I have been able to colonize. All white, no other colors. I will put them in baggies as suggested and transfer soon. Also, what do you mean by they get messy?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: jake103]
    #27048021 - 11/19/20 10:20 PM (3 months, 11 days ago)

at full colonization the mycelium tends to reach for the plate walls and crawl out


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Phony Phone]
    #27048205 - 11/20/20 01:43 AM (3 months, 11 days ago)

48 hrs since first transfer....



can't even tell you how appreciative I am of you guys offering opinions and kind words..

I jus reeeally am curious to hear what maybe a trusted cultivator, or someone who's been doin this shit for a good while thinks about these plates..

I'm a slightly skeptical person as it is, but I jus can't say out of all the pics I've seen on this site of mycelium, that my plates look similar to theirs. I'm not seeing that 'ropey', uniformed length, and fan-like shape that basically all yalls tend to have. lol please tell me I'm wrong.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27048693 - 11/20/20 12:14 PM (3 months, 10 days ago)

Dude, that is not myc.  Pitch them and start over.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: CosmicKramer]
    #27048833 - 11/20/20 01:41 PM (3 months, 10 days ago)

lol yeah, sounds about right.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27048835 - 11/20/20 01:43 PM (3 months, 10 days ago)

Quote:

black strat said: I'm not seeing that 'ropey', uniformed length, and fan-like shape that basically all yalls tend to have. lol please tell me I'm wrong.





You're talking about rhizomorphic growth, I call the shape lightning roots. From spores there can be a hundred of those rhizomes crawling all over one another so it just looks like a mess. Once you isolate strains out by taking very small tissue samples on transfers, they tend to become more rhizomorphic.

Myc can take lots of forms. The common three are rhizomorphic, cottony, and leathery. Cubensis can make all three.

Not even all cube strains turn rhizomorphic. You can have a tomentose strain that produces killer fruits and a rhizo strain that never fruits at all, from the same spores from one fruit. USUALLY, rhizomorphic growth is preferred I believe due to its colonization speed and possibly ease of identification.

I really can't say either way with those. It hasn't turned green or gray or pink so that's definitely a plus. It looks wiry, bit also fluffy. I kinda thought mold from the start but I can very easily be wrong and don't want you to throw it out on my bad advice.

You could smell one as a sacrificial plate. Mold smells like mold, mycelium smells like mushrooms. You might not even smell anything and just waste a plate.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27049571 - 11/20/20 10:52 PM (3 months, 10 days ago)

Yeah, unfortunately they do not look like what I was hoping.  They do not look like mycelium. I am sorry that my advice pushed you to waste some plates and time. We have all gone through it though. I think these are probably a lost cause.

Again, sorry that I was wrong on the mycelium call. Hopefully you got some practice on technique and are still exited to try more plates!


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27049730 - 11/21/20 01:46 AM (3 months, 10 days ago)

Jus opened one to sacrifice - lmfao, smelled like the wet sock you find behind the washing machine after 2 weeks.

man, do I feel like an ass....

then I opened another. it smelled like mushrooms, and mold. then another, and same thing.

is it possible there is myc in some of these, trying to compete with mold? I mean, they obviously can and do grow together.

and just for my own curiousity, what is that stuff growing out on the edge? the stuff actually growing IN the new agar, it looks like.



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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27049735 - 11/21/20 02:02 AM (3 months, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Grenik said:
Yeah, unfortunately they do not look like what I was hoping.  They do not look like mycelium. I am sorry that my advice pushed you to waste some plates and time. We have all gone through it though. I think these are probably a lost cause.

Again, sorry that I was wrong on the mycelium call. Hopefully you got some practice on technique and are still exited to try more plates!




whaaat dude?  hell no, do not apologize. everything is about intentions, and yours were absolutely coming from a good place.  I still very much appreciate your input.

what's got me down a little and kinda bummed, is I see TC's commenting all the time on other noob posts, throwing seasoned advice at them, definitively telling em if they got myc or not, and I still feel like I'm poking around in the dark over here man.  I really do put a decent effort into taking the best, clearest pics that I possibly can with the phone I have, because I feel like if I'm gonna ask you guys for your help, I wanna make it as easy as possible for you to check out what I got. but, ah, fuck it, that's neither here nor there. and yep, I'm sure as shit gonna keep pushing on!  what else am I gonna do hahah?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27049953 - 11/21/20 09:07 AM (3 months, 9 days ago)

I've never used those ketchup cups before, but I can't imagine they are sterile or easy to make small transfers out of.  Maybe buy some plates and do a streak.  The plates aren't expensive.  I think karri0n had the right idea.  I've done and had success with shot glass approach.  My only difference is I cool the loop in receiving dish before dipping into shot glass.

 
Quote:

karri0n said:
All of the ones that it look like the pooled liquid over them are bacterial. The ones with a single drop you will need to wait probably at least a week to know if it's mycelium, mold, or bacteria. If it grows quickly it's probably mold.

Remember that spore syringes probably have quite a bit of bacteria in them, and if there is water for that bacteria to move around, it will get everywhere. Agar works for isolating mycelium from bacteria because mycelium can move, but bacteria can't, so long as there is no water and you aren't moving the plates around.

Spores take time to germinate, as well. So there will be probably 48 or so hours that nothing "good" can possibly be growing. Once they germinate, then the mycelium will start growing but still, it tends to be slower than bacteria or mold.

I never had any luck with syringe directly to agar. It's recommended  an inoculation loop, or what I use are sterile swabs.

You can take q-tips, wrap in neat little foil packages, and PC them to make sterile swabs. I did this in a jar with a standard modified myco lid.

You can also buy them from medical places or mushroom supply places, or get them from a doctor's office.

You can also rip the plastic off a bread tie, wrap it once around a toothpick, then twist the rest of it into a long handle to make an inoculation loop that you can flame.

Put a drop of spore solution onto a sterile swab and make a neat zig zag over the plate, or

Put a 1cc of spore solution into a sterile shotglass, flame your inoculation loop, dip it in the spores, and make a clean zig zag across the plate.

See these photos. When you make the zig zag, then you can separate the bacterial snots from white, organized mycelium. The bacteria was not able to move across the plate, but the mycelium was, and so I took a transfer from it.



If you wait a week or so and let the plates sit, you might see some healthy mycelium that grows away from bacterial areas. The ones that have water over the whole plate are going to turn completely into boogers most likely.




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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: IdiotCircusBoy]
    #27050005 - 11/21/20 10:00 AM (3 months, 9 days ago)

yeah, I ordered an 8 pack of those Holy Grail jawns off amazon. says driver is out for delivery right now.

if nothing else, the ketchup cups have been a cheap way for me to just dip my toes in and start playing around with agar. I'm enjoying it. I did a print swipe with a sterile swab about 60 or so hours ago. so far none of those are showing signs of anything. which I count as a small win, because up until those, every one of my cups has been just an extremely sloppy bacterial orgy from the 70s, you know, the kind where there is just complete and utter disregard for any semblance of conservative or selective love-making -- I mean everything is fucking everything. you know that scene from the movie Caligula? yeah like that, only on a microscopic level.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27050064 - 11/21/20 10:44 AM (3 months, 9 days ago)

Quote:

black strat said:
Jus opened one to sacrifice - lmfao, smelled like the wet sock you find behind the washing machine after 2 weeks.

man, do I feel like an ass....

then I opened another. it smelled like mushrooms, and mold. then another, and same thing.

is it possible there is myc in some of these, trying to compete with mold? I mean, they obviously can and do grow together.

and just for my own curiousity, what is that stuff growing out on the edge? the stuff actually growing IN the new agar, it looks like.






I was personally thinking the same thing. Some of your plates seem to have short hair along with the long hair and I think the short hair could be myc. If it continues to grow like that and consumes the food coloring I'd bet it's mycelium.

The problem is that mold might have sporulated all over everything in the plate, or it might not have.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27050376 - 11/21/20 02:09 PM (3 months, 9 days ago)

Best of luck with those things.  I'm assuming you don't need wrap those since the lid screws on.  Just found the below post from about a year ago by Mr. Alien.  Agar is pretty cool cause you feel like a scientist. 

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26374264#26374264

Quote:

black strat said:
sloppy bacterial orgy



---Best band name ever---


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: IdiotCircusBoy]
    #27053200 - 11/23/20 12:46 AM (3 months, 8 days ago)

Quote:

black strat said:
yeah, I ordered an 8 pack of those Holy Grail jawns off amazon. says driver is out for delivery right now.

if nothing else, the ketchup cups have been a cheap way for me to just dip my toes in and start playing around with agar. I'm enjoying it. I did a print swipe with a sterile swab about 60 or so hours ago. so far none of those are showing signs of anything. which I count as a small win, because up until those, every one of my cups has been just an extremely sloppy bacterial orgy from the 70s, you know, the kind where there is just complete and utter disregard for any semblance of conservative or selective love-making -- I mean everything is fucking everything. you know that scene from the movie Caligula? yeah like that, only on a microscopic level.




Hey you probably have some germination by now, eh?

And have you had a chance to try out the holy grail containers? I recommend the "defective lid" vendor that sells 20 for cheaper, they are the same ones and the lids fit on both, I bought 8 then 20 and am gonna be getting 20 more.

let me know how you like the feel of the twist containers vs those ketchup cups. I've been considering trying the ketchup cups since it's a lot easier to get a shitload of them and they seemed pretty convenient. It would be nice to have just like 100 plates I could swipe/transfer/clone/whatever to, whenever I want, and not have to worry about them so much.


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27053215 - 11/23/20 01:24 AM (3 months, 8 days ago)

Quote:

karri0n said:
Quote:

black strat said:
yeah, I ordered an 8 pack of those Holy Grail jawns off amazon. says driver is out for delivery right now.

if nothing else, the ketchup cups have been a cheap way for me to just dip my toes in and start playing around with agar. I'm enjoying it. I did a print swipe with a sterile swab about 60 or so hours ago. so far none of those are showing signs of anything. which I count as a small win, because up until those, every one of my cups has been just an extremely sloppy bacterial orgy from the 70s, you know, the kind where there is just complete and utter disregard for any semblance of conservative or selective love-making -- I mean everything is fucking everything. you know that scene from the movie Caligula? yeah like that, only on a microscopic level.




Hey you probably have some germination by now, eh?

And have you had a chance to try out the holy grail containers? I recommend the "defective lid" vendor that sells 20 for cheaper, they are the same ones and the lids fit on both, I bought 8 then 20 and am gonna be getting 20 more.

let me know how you like the feel of the twist containers vs those ketchup cups. I've been considering trying the ketchup cups since it's a lot easier to get a shitload of them and they seemed pretty convenient. It would be nice to have just like 100 plates I could swipe/transfer/clone/whatever to, whenever I want, and not have to worry about them so much.




hey bro, NO, I don't see ANYthing yet.... I am pretty content with peeking at them here and there, and not seeing any bacteria or mold, but the impatience in me gets triggered when I'm not seeing any myc either.. ah well, playing the long game, it seems they are.. little fuckers. print to swab to plate is the way to go tho for me, no doubt.

so no, I haven't used the new plates yet, I'll probably cook up a batch of agar sometime this week, and use both the new ones, and remaining ketchup cups. tbh, I couldn't really tell ya if they're the way to go yet. I'm such a noob and don't have much to compare anything to yet hah. but like I said, the cups I inoc'd 4-5 days ago are still contam free, so they must be sufficient on some level, ya know?

I talked to a couple TCs here and they both said the same thing -- I should use the rest of my syringes on good ol brf cakes. that's my next project I'm lookin forward to.

I'll remember that about the "defective" ones -- thats a fuckin steal if they work the same as the others. cheers!


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27060648 - 11/27/20 08:23 PM (3 months, 3 days ago)

hi good people..  please..please tell me i have some mycelium growing here?



I really, reeeally don't wanna give up man.. but how many fuckups before you tell yourself you suck donkeyballs and mycology ain't for ya?

BTW, they all stayed completely 'spotless' for like a week. just finally started to see something 4 days ago. they were swabbed on 11/18.


Edited by black strat (11/27/20 08:44 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27061079 - 11/28/20 06:33 AM (3 months, 2 days ago)

Dont give up.
Take transfers from clean looking mycelium like growth. you will know if its mycelium when it starts growing.
:thumbup::mushroom2:
Heat sterilize your scalpel outside your SAB before you do.
No hands hovering above plates/containers.
You'll do fine. Good luck


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat] * 1
    #27063663 - 11/29/20 09:57 PM (3 months, 1 day ago)

Quote:

black strat said:
hi good people..  please..please tell me i have some mycelium growing here?



I really, reeeally don't wanna give up man.. but how many fuckups before you tell yourself you suck donkeyballs and mycology ain't for ya?

BTW, they all stayed completely 'spotless' for like a week. just finally started to see something 4 days ago. they were swabbed on 11/18.




Hey man, sorry it's been a few days since I checked in.

All of it looks like myc dude. Congratulations, you're a mycologist.

Leave the middle plate alone, it looks slow/lazy.

The first plate looks like it has good rhizo growth and the third looks like nice fluffy cotton myc.

Take transfers from the furthest grown out part of the colonies that have grown fastest and look strongest. This gets you the fastest growing, healthiest strains that are on the plate.



I'd transfer from any or all of the spots circled in blue to other plates if I was going to transfer them to agar.

If I was going to use them to inoculate grain straight from the T0 plates, I would take the sections marked in green. This is riskier because there *could* be mold on these plates(the only reason I say this is due to the history of mold contamination from the same syringe), even though it all looks like myc, there is too much stuff on top of each other to really be sure.

Reddit would tell you to put all of the plates straight to grain and that could work. It certainly looks pretty clean, especially since you say the plates were clean for days and it all popped up at the same time.

If it were me, I'd probably take a couple small transfers to agar, and some larger sections to inoculate some grains. This way, if the grain contaminates, I still have clean  T1 plates that I can use in a few days to inoculate grain. If the grain jars go fine, then I have some assured super clean culture on T1 plates that I can use to make LC, more transfers, or more grain.


Edited by karri0n (11/29/20 10:32 PM)


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27065274 - 11/30/20 09:21 PM (3 months, 4 hours ago)

Quote:

karri0n said:


Hey man, sorry it's been a few days since I checked in.

All of it looks like myc dude. Congratulations, you're a mycologist.

Leave the middle plate alone, it looks slow/lazy.

The first plate looks like it has good rhizo growth and the third looks like nice fluffy cotton myc.

Take transfers from the furthest grown out part of the colonies that have grown fastest and look strongest. This gets you the fastest growing, healthiest strains that are on the plate.



I'd transfer from any or all of the spots circled in blue to other plates if I was going to transfer them to agar.

If I was going to use them to inoculate grain straight from the T0 plates, I would take the sections marked in green. This is riskier because there *could* be mold on these plates(the only reason I say this is due to the history of mold contamination from the same syringe), even though it all looks like myc, there is too much stuff on top of each other to really be sure.

Reddit would tell you to put all of the plates straight to grain and that could work. It certainly looks pretty clean, especially since you say the plates were clean for days and it all popped up at the same time.

If it were me, I'd probably take a couple small transfers to agar, and some larger sections to inoculate some grains. This way, if the grain contaminates, I still have clean  T1 plates that I can use in a few days to inoculate grain. If the grain jars go fine, then I have some assured super clean culture on T1 plates that I can use to make LC, more transfers, or more grain.




hey brother!  I haven't been too active on here myself, but I think I have somethin good goin on....



fuck. yes.  haha, this is what I've been waiting to see!

so, so far these are the T1 plates ^^^^.. I have 3 other T1's, but they're moving a little slower.  I also still have the 3 T0's.

great advice, I'm thinking the same way you are..

I think I'm gonna wait a few days, and then make some T2's.... what do you think?

and finally, since I've never been at this point until now, I'm very scatterbrained about my next step..

I have about 12 shoeboxes.
I have ~10lbs of corn.
I have ~10lbs of brown rice.
I have verm. I have gypsum. I have coco coir.
I have plenty of jars. pints, half pints, 1/4 pints, and quarts.

what i really wanna do is have maybe a half dozen shoeboxes goin at once..

once I have my super clean myc/agar and I'm ready to go, how do ya think I should proceed? [obviously not asking ya to write it out step by step, jus wanna know given my materials above, which tek or teks you suggest I move forward with]?

thank you dude!!


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27065354 - 11/30/20 10:00 PM (3 months, 3 hours ago)

Dude - Super happy for you. 

I don't fuck with condiment cups, but if they're like petris then probably best to not let them get to the edge.  I'll put some pics below that remind me of your number 4, hopefully it will give you an idea as to speed of growth, although all myc is a bit different and all agar too.  Boxes are .5 cm so the last one is about 4cm or approx 1.6"  As far as next steps I'd get a bunch of jars going then do shoebox tek with coco coir and your colonized  grain. 


Bod's easy AF bucket tek - for substrate https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24077162#24077162

Bod's Shoebox tek https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=25274461&page=0&vc=1#25274461

                  Day 3                                  Day 4                                  Day 5                                  Day 6



Edited by IdiotCircusBoy (12/01/20 07:55 AM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27065503 - 11/30/20 11:32 PM (3 months, 2 hours ago)

Quote:

black strat said:
fuck. yes.  haha, this is what I've been waiting to see!

so, so far these are the T1 plates ^^^^.. I have 3 other T1's, but they're moving a little slower.  I also still have the 3 T0's.

great advice, I'm thinking the same way you are..

I think I'm gonna wait a few days, and then make some T2's.... what do you think?

and finally, since I've never been at this point until now, I'm very scatterbrained about my next step..

I have about 12 shoeboxes.
I have ~10lbs of corn.
I have ~10lbs of brown rice.
I have verm. I have gypsum. I have coco coir.
I have plenty of jars. pints, half pints, 1/4 pints, and quarts.

what i really wanna do is have maybe a half dozen shoeboxes goin at once..

once I have my super clean myc/agar and I'm ready to go, how do ya think I should proceed? [obviously not asking ya to write it out step by step, jus wanna know given my materials above, which tek or teks you suggest I move forward with]?

thank you dude!!




Man I've heard bad things about both corn and rice but that could be partially due to reddit hate on here. If it's what you have, use it.

Rice is gonna stick like a motherfucker for sure. I don't think I'd use it. It over-hydrates very easily, you will probably need to add verm to prevent it from sticking, it will fall right through the holes  in your colander, there's gonna be starch everywhere, and overall it will just be a nightmare.

I'd go with the corn. I know some old hands on here use it and report good results. Seems some of the youtube mushroom personalities use it too. I use oats, and cubes as well as gourmet and medicinals seem to love the shit out of them.


Definitely make those T2 plates when you can, but get some grain knocked up too! Cut a tic tac toe board onto the surface of one of those t1's then use the scalpel to break them free from the bottom and dump that into a jar of prepared grain.

You also might try your hand at an LC. Use the same recipe as your agar, just without agar-agar powder. Use an unmodified jar lid, don't turn the lid upside down. You want an airtight seal with LC after it's pressure cooked. Leave the band lid loose and cover with foil, PC for 30 or 60 minutes. I do 60. Tighten the lid while it's still warm, but don't remove the foil and keep it in a clean, safe place until ready to inoculate. Once ready, inoculate it with a small clean agar wedge. Shake it like a redheaded stepchild as many times a day as you want and watch it grow. The first time I saw how fucking fast my grain colonized when inoculated with LC is the single most exciting moment I have had in this hobby.


As far as a shoebox tek, for set it and forget it I think shaperdreaming's shoebox tek is where it's at. You need to prepare your substrate a bit dryer than usual, then prepare the top coat wetter than usual by spraying.

The poster above linked Bod's bucket tek for substrate - I think that's prefect. If you are gonna use Shaperdreaming's tek, then just cut the water from bod's tek by a little bit.

When it comes to substrate, really just get a feel for your field capacity of your coir. I was intimidated by that at first and felt a lot more comfortable following a "recipe", but once I just tried, it was really easy to figure out, and I quickly learned that I fucked up by using the recipe and made it too moist. You want to squeeze the FUCK out of it in one hand, and have only a couple drops come out. If a stream comes out, you need to put it into a pillowcase or something and wring it out.

For shaperdreaming's tek, you want to literally use all of your grip strength to squeeze one drop of water for the main substrate, then spray the hell out of the top layer.

If you are in a dryer climate, put the shoeboxes into a monotub if you find that they dry out. Otherwise it's a matter of make the box and leave it until the fruits are there, then just unclick the edges so the shrooms can push the lid up if they need to.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26043820
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26043820

You can't go wrong with Bod's shoebox tek, munch's, or mushboy's either, but shaperdreaming's tek has probably the most detail and is my preferred one. They are all basically the same and I don't think your results will vary wildly.

I see many of the folks on here moved away from cvg and use straight coir. I personally hate verm because I got some stuck in my throat for a week and a half once and it made me think I was allergic to shrooms.

I do add a bit of gypsum to my coir for some extra placebo power though.


Edited by karri0n (11/30/20 11:40 PM)


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Offlineblack strat
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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27065575 - 12/01/20 12:30 AM (3 months, 1 hour ago)

circusboy - thank you man! yes, these T1s i have currently are the very last of my condiment cups. I got those spin-top jobbers that Alien made a thread about waiting in the wings. so.... you would suggest doing another transfer in maybe a day or so? maybe when they're bout half-way to the outer edge?  and thank you for the links, my man.

karri0n, buddy, haha lots of info! tons of awesome info man, thank you!

ok, so.... I wanna do whatever is gonna be best. I only have corn and rice, because frankly that's all I could find in the stores I've looked in so far. I was even at target today and specifically looked for raw, whole oats. the kid I asked was like, "oh yeah man ,right over here.." and he pointed at a tub of instant quaker oats.... hah. I've also tried Wal-Mart and HEB, no dice. but, if you say oats are the preferred grain, then I'm gonna find some fucking oats.

ok.. when you said to cut up one of the T1s tic-tac-toe and throw in the grain, did you mean one of the T0's..?  because those 4 up there ^^ are the T1's, and they're not ready to be diced up yet, or are they?? I should wait til it populates a little further, right? or no?? sorry, just excited as shit and don't wanna fuck anything up hah.

so I THINK I'm tracking ya on the LC method.. I've only been using 4 ingredients- agar powder, tater flakes, a pinch of corn syrup, and water.. so just those 3 minus the powder'll do it then?  oh! shit I forgot - I actually have malt extract too. been waiting to try that recipe instead of the flakes..

ok, gonna read shaperdreamings tek now.

thank you brother!


Edited by black strat (12/01/20 12:34 AM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27065611 - 12/01/20 01:07 AM (3 months, 48 minutes ago)

Quote:

black strat said:
are the T1's, and they're not ready to be diced up yet, or are they?? I should wait til it populates a little further, right? or no?? sorry, just excited as shit and don't wanna fuck anything up hah.






Correct, not yet. but they are on their way. You don't need to wait until it's fully colonized, the edges can be bad anyway. Let it grow out 1-2 more days until it's like 60-70% of the surface.

As far as oats, you want to hit a store like tractor supply or agway. Somewhere you can buy food for horses. We are talking about 12 bucks for  a giant 50 pounds sack but you're gonna probably have to drive around the back of the place, where farmers pick up giant hay bales and someone will load it into your car.

If you try to get them from like whole foods or a health food store, you're gonna pay out the ass and they also won't be the right thing. You need the hulls still on and they won't be that way for human consumption. These are for horses.


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Edited by karri0n (12/01/20 01:11 AM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27065612 - 12/01/20 01:10 AM (3 months, 45 minutes ago)

I gave you the wrong link, or rather gave you the same link twice. Here is the shoebox tek I meant.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26009662


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27065620 - 12/01/20 01:21 AM (3 months, 34 minutes ago)

Quote:

black strat said:
if you say oats are the preferred grain, then I'm gonna find some fucking oats.






Commercial producers use millet. Lots of the best TCs here use WBS(wild bird seed) which is Millet + corn. Rye has been toted as the gold standard.

Some People who have grown hundreds of pounds more mushrooms than I ever will use popcorn. Others who have done the same use oats, still others use straw.

There's no preferred grain. Some are easier to prepare in such a way that mycelium can colonize it effectively and bacteria have a harder time with it, and that's just due to the material properties of them, such as whether they turn to goo, how large or small they are to provide inoculation points, whether they compact a lot, and some other things.

Rice sucks donkey dick though. It turns to slop. Mycelium can't crawl through slop because it needs air, and bacteria loves slop. Mushrooms will eat it just fine, you're just gonna have a hell of a time getting it right and waste a lot of time with it. But it also has fewer endospores and can be steam sterilized instead of PC'd, so we use it for BRF cakes if you don't have a PC.

All grains have proper preparation techniques. The proper preparation technique for rice is to grind it into flour and mix it with hydrated verm XD


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Edited by karri0n (12/01/20 01:33 AM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27065632 - 12/01/20 01:46 AM (3 months, 9 minutes ago)

What karrion ^ said is pretty much spot on. Personally, I never liked using bird seed or pure millet -never got the hang of preparing it properly. Some people like it and use it as a matter of course though.

I used to use rye berries until my vendor changed his source and things went south. After that I switched to wheat berries, but not just ANY wheat berries. There are different varieties. What you want if you choose to go this way are: 'white winter wheat' or 'soft winter white' berries. From MY experience, other varieties of wheat berries don't cook well because of the high gluten content.

As far as corn goes? I have heard some good things about it but mostly not so good. A lot of killer mush growers love using oat though. I wish you well.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: scarabaeus]
    #27065978 - 12/01/20 11:33 AM (2 months, 30 days ago)

thanks you two, heeding y'alls advice.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27066709 - 12/01/20 06:34 PM (2 months, 30 days ago)

If it makes you feel any better I had a pretty similar experience trying to get healthy growth from syringes on Agar (two separate syringes from the same vendor). Tried for several months, growing exclusively bacteria and mold the whole time. I did some controls where I opened the plates but put nothing on them to check technique and saw no contam.

Eventually I ordered a print and got healthy myc right away on the first try. It has all been fairly smooth sailing since then. Spore syringes came from some dude on Etsy and it seems like they must have been contaminated..

Been following Bod's grain guidelines. $15 for 50lbs of oats at Tractor Supply. $3 bricks of coir from the garden store.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: hob hayward]
    #27068223 - 12/02/20 03:28 PM (2 months, 29 days ago)

Quote:

hob hayward said:
If it makes you feel any better I had a pretty similar experience trying to get healthy growth from syringes on Agar (two separate syringes from the same vendor). Tried for several months, growing exclusively bacteria and mold the whole time. I did some controls where I opened the plates but put nothing on them to check technique and saw no contam.

Eventually I ordered a print and got healthy myc right away on the first try. It has all been fairly smooth sailing since then. Spore syringes came from some dude on Etsy and it seems like they must have been contaminated..

Been following Bod's grain guidelines. $15 for 50lbs of oats at Tractor Supply. $3 bricks of coir from the garden store.





this is so fucking crazy. literally sitting in my truck in the tractor supply parking lot cause its the only place I could find that sells oats. HAH. just came here to look back at what kind karri0n said I should get. and my agar exp. is almost identical to yours, minus the etsy guy. mine came from repped vendor. cheers man. lol so weird.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27068664 - 12/02/20 07:08 PM (2 months, 29 days ago)

Dude I'm looking forward to seeing some colonizing oats now.

What variety did you end up eventually swiping and getting proper myc from?

And did you end up making those PF jars with the syringes? If you did, you'll have a fun experiment watching the colonization of those vs your oats. The speed difference is like night and day.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27069192 - 12/03/20 02:36 AM (2 months, 28 days ago)

Quote:

karri0n said:
Dude I'm looking forward to seeing some colonizing oats now.

What variety did you end up eventually swiping and getting proper myc from?

And did you end up making those PF jars with the syringes? If you did, you'll have a fun experiment watching the colonization of those vs your oats. The speed difference is like night and day.





so, I actually used golden teacher, B+, Amazonian(?), annnnd, damn I can't remember the last one, my bad.  but the prints i used must've been pristine. 

haha, yeah man, I actually did.. I used 7 1/4 pints, and 6 1/2 pints.  roughly half are showing activity after only a few days.  I need to take some pics for you guys, because I'm not holding my breath as to what's actually active in the jars.. (i think it's mold.. i'll let you guys decide though.)

right this minute I am following that "impossibly easy oat prep tek" thread, waiting for the initial water to boil.

I picked up the Producer's Pride whole oats from TS, and I'm a little bit concerned on the quality.  The maker of that ^ thread said he's had success 1/3rd of the time when using that brand, and the other 2 spoiled his whole shit.  A bit disconcerting..  also combed my hands thru the grain for a few minutes -- found a few dozen straws, a small handful of other grain, and what I'm pretty sure is a grasshopper.  either that or like, a small locust, or some shit.

need to take pics of my myc for you guys too, I'm paranoid about making sure it's legit quality, and there's some fuzzies in the center of each plate.

lemme get on that real quick....


Edited by black strat (12/03/20 03:30 AM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? *DELETED* [Re: black strat]
    #27069222 - 12/03/20 03:26 AM (2 months, 28 days ago)

Post deleted by black strat

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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27069802 - 12/03/20 12:55 PM (2 months, 28 days ago)

Yeah the cotton sticking up from the xfer is 150% normal.

Yeah my oats get stuff in them all the time. Someone who processed my oats is going bald, lost their wig in my bag, or got scalped by a farm machine. I'm pulling human hair out of every handful.

If you're doing small enough batches just grab foreign objects out. Bigger producers leave it in, it all gets sterilized in the PC.

There's a pic floating around on the forums of one guy with a big ass beetle in his pc'd jar. Myc ate him up too.


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Edited by karri0n (12/03/20 01:00 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27069976 - 12/03/20 02:33 PM (2 months, 28 days ago)

hahah, Roger that. thanks man. bout to transfer these puppies.  oats been soaking for ~11 hours.. all is well right now.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat] * 1
    #27070819 - 12/03/20 11:48 PM (2 months, 28 days ago)

I use the same oats and they have been fine. I use this TEK for the oats.



I have had no issue with them. I use RR's rye TEK and BODs oat TEK depending upon what I have locally. I do not notice any growth difference in the jars or bags, but if they were a day or two different I probably wouldn't notice.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27070881 - 12/04/20 12:32 AM (2 months, 28 days ago)

Quote:

Grenik said:
I use the same oats and they have been fine. I use this TEK for the oats.



I have had no issue with them. I use RR's rye TEK and BODs oat TEK depending upon what I have locally. I do not notice any growth difference in the jars or bags, but if they were a day or two different I probably wouldn't notice.





yeah man! that's the tek i used too.. and i have a kinda pressing question i left in there, but it's still unanswered ----


"So I may have jumped the gun just a little bit - followed the tek, and am at the point of drying the oats.  The issue is that my agar plates won't be ready for another few days to noc up the grain jars.  I have not PCed the grain yet, it's still just all laid out on towels drying.

My question is, how can I or how should I store the hydrated grain?  Bod says he'll throw them in the fridge over night, and that 'you can't get oats too dry', and 'dryer is better', etc.  Will this still be true after, say, a week?  Can I store the oats for ~1 week?  I'm inclined to load up 4 or 5 shoeboxes w/ the cooked oats and keep them in the fridge for a few days until my plates are ready for the jars.  Will the oats be, more or less, the same 5-7 days from now when I take them outta the fridge?

Should I instead proceed to PC the grain in jars, and then store them after that step? Why or why not, please?

Thanks for any and all responses.  Have a lovely night."

hopefully someone somewhere can help me soon lol


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27070891 - 12/04/20 12:45 AM (2 months, 28 days ago)

I PC them and then let them sit until I need them.  I have had them sit a couple weeks before transferring agar to them and they were fine.  Not sure what is “right”, but after PC they should be fine for a long time.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27070959 - 12/04/20 01:25 AM (2 months, 28 days ago)

ok thanks man.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27070974 - 12/04/20 01:40 AM (2 months, 28 days ago)

I did the brf to bulk tek and got a fatty on my second flush that I wanted to try cloning. I’ve not done agar before and don’t know what to expect. I split the core into 4 plates and none are doing anything but this one. Is this contaminated? It’s been a week since I started it.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27070976 - 12/04/20 01:42 AM (2 months, 28 days ago)

Definitely pc them asap.

Once moisturized, they are a perfect food source for any bacteria and mold and yeast which has landed on them during drying, woken up inside them, is in the water, etc, and will start eating the nutrition and breaking down the oats.

Once pc'd they are sterile, and if kept that way, could be good for years.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27070987 - 12/04/20 01:59 AM (2 months, 27 days ago)

Thanks, I didn’t realize till you mentioned it but this is the only one with condensation.  Is there anything to save here or just wait for the others to grow?


Edited by MellowH (12/04/20 02:55 AM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: MellowH]
    #27071412 - 12/04/20 10:43 AM (2 months, 27 days ago)

Quote:

MellowH said:
Thanks, I didn’t realize till you mentioned it but this is the only one with condensation.  Is there anything to save here or just wait for the others to grow?




It is difficult to tell what you have in the center with the condensation. The two edge blobs do not look good to me. Did you follow a cloning TEK (wipe with alcohol, take samples from inside the flesh, etc?)

Did you use a SAB for the work?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27071499 - 12/04/20 11:52 AM (2 months, 27 days ago)

Quote:

Grenik said:

It is difficult to tell what you have in the center with the condensation. The two edge blobs do not look good to me. Did you follow a cloning TEK (wipe with alcohol, take samples from inside the flesh, etc?)

Did you use a SAB for the work?




I couldn’t get a better picture but it’s looking more like what I’ve seen as good growth in the middle this morning. I did use a SAB sprayed with soapy water. For the tek, I found an old video Paul Stamets did on cloning and followed that. I took the sample from the core of the base of the stem. Is it safe to open the dish and cut the good out without contaminating a new plate?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: MellowH]
    #27072042 - 12/04/20 04:44 PM (2 months, 27 days ago)

If you think you have good growth in the center, then you would take a transfer from the leading edge of the good growth and transfer it to a new plate. Pick a location as far from contams as you can.

The transfer is done in the SAB wearing gloves, alcohol wipe of the gloves, etc. Flame sterilize your scalpel outside the SAB and make your transfer.

Did you pour your own agar plates? The contams at the edge being almost 180° apart imply you may have touched the edge of the dish when you removed and replaced the lid (during pouring or cloning). Practice!


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik] * 1
    #27072320 - 12/04/20 07:43 PM (2 months, 27 days ago)

MellowH can you take a picture from the bottom?  Transferring to a new plate as per Grenik's advice should be fine as long as you don't touch the contaminated portion which is why he is telling you to:

Quote:

Grenik said:
Pick a location as far from contams as you can.




If you need more advice on this then you should start a new post cause ur kinda jacking OP's post, and it get's confusing when two different people are asking questions.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27072351 - 12/04/20 08:00 PM (2 months, 27 days ago)

I did pour my own plates. I used bods comprehensive tek. That does make sense that I probably touched the sides cause I could tell I was slipping. I’ll try to pay better attention next time. Thanks for the insight.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: MellowH]
    #27072394 - 12/04/20 08:19 PM (2 months, 27 days ago)

IdiotCircusBoy here’s the bottom.




I thought this was the thread for these questions and must have started my post wrong. I think I’ve got enough to go on.. Thanks.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: MellowH]
    #27072725 - 12/05/20 12:44 AM (2 months, 27 days ago)

Quote:

MellowH said:
I did pour my own plates. I used bods comprehensive tek. That does make sense that I probably touched the sides cause I could tell I was slipping. I’ll try to pay better attention next time. Thanks for the insight.




That is a great TEK, just keep refining your technique through practice.  I poured 80 plates a few weeks ago and have used about 70% of them.  Today when I grabbed one it had growth on it already at the edge.  It happens.

Good luck.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27072976 - 12/05/20 07:56 AM (2 months, 26 days ago)

Quote:

Grenik said:
Quote:

MellowH said:
I did pour my own plates. I used bods comprehensive tek. That does make sense that I probably touched the sides cause I could tell I was slipping. I’ll try to pay better attention next time. Thanks for the insight.




That is a great TEK, just keep refining your technique through practice.  I poured 80 plates a few weeks ago and have used about 70% of them.  Today when I grabbed one it had growth on it already at the edge.  It happens.

Good luck.





uggghh, this is what I am worried about..  I just made about 20+ transfers (T2), and I'm worried my plates aren't clean enough.  I used a different tek and recipe for agar this time, and long story short, it was kinda a literal mess inside my PC.  I think I am definitely gonna just go back to what was working for me; actual pouring, and using condiment cups.  I transferred basically ALL of my beautiful-lookin myc from the T1s, and if these T2s fail, I dunno what to do.. I guess it's obvious, just transfer again until they clean up lol. but god damnit, that feels like such a backwards step from where I was 2 days ago.  maybe shoulda just noc'd up my jars with the T1s.. oh well.. and I dont even kno for sure if these new plates are bad yet or not lmfao, i'm just being pessimistic.. oh lord.. this is exactly why i need mushrooms in my fucked up brain.  pray for me.


Edited by black strat (12/05/20 08:10 AM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27073283 - 12/05/20 12:30 PM (2 months, 26 days ago)

What happened with the new tek? I am guessing you tried the HG's and something didn't go perfect? Nothing goes perfect the first time, that doesn't mean it definitely won't work.

What do you mean by a mess? Did they leak all over the place, melt, etc? Did the medium separate? Are the surfaces of the agar all messed up or are they flat?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27074337 - 12/06/20 12:39 AM (2 months, 26 days ago)

so, here's how i was doin it prior:

water, potato flakes, agar, and a little corn syrup.  boil it, pour into media bottles, then PC.  let it get down to about 115F, then pour into ketchup cups in the SAB.  and that's it.  whether that's a good way or not, i was starting to really get a little system down and it felt good.

so this most recent time, i thought to try something a little different:

tried following Mr. Alien's tek.  also, tried a different recipe than before - used LME, water, and agar.  when first cooking, it just didn't go well.  the malt was coagulating on the surface, and was just... lumpy?  i figured it was cause i either cooked it too much, or not enough..  anyway, then getting it from the pot into something suitable to pour into the HG's was a chore lol.  it just became a mess.  then, stacking them into QT jars wasn't easy.  so, FFWD to them PCing - after about 35 minutes, i started to smell plastic, my eyes were watering, my cat was acting weird, and i got reeeeeeally paranoid i was filling my place with fumes that could hurt my cat.  (i'm a total fucking helicopter-parent)

so i said fuck it, not worth it, and immediately turned off the burner after about 35 mins or so.. (Alien's tek says these HG's need at least an hour).

so got the PC to cool enough where i could open it, and yeah, it was a bit of a mess.. i dunno if it was the recipe, or how i put them in there, or what, etc., but some plates did boil over a little, and my new 500ml media bottle blew it's cap off and boiled over (i left the cap loose for GE), and the HG's were a little distorted/were sticking to each other when stacked.  I pulled everything out and tried to salvage what i could..

like i said i had media bottles in there too, 2 250ml and 1 500ml.. (I made A LOT of agar this time..)

so with those i at least tried pouring my old way in the SAB.  it was chunky, and a lot of the cups i poured ended up with tons of little air bubbles, (dunno if this is potentially bad down the road)..

sorry, i know it kinda sounds all over the place, but that's really what it was lol - all over the place.

I am NOT shitting on anyones tek, obviously - this was all due to my inexperience.

I just wish for this time, i had went to my tried and true method, considering my myc is looking fucking bomber at the moment, and i just want everything perfectly set up for this upcoming agar->grain transfer.

which, btw, i got 10 jars right now ready to be loaded up..  i really fucking hope they're not too wet;  i completely dried off the oats, did the paper towel test, (no water drops), and then left in the fridge overnight, and PCed yesterday.  they definitely look moist, i would say.. i wonder if letting them hangout for another day or so will evaporate a little more condensation.. (they all have the polyfil lids, for what it's worth..)  matter fact, will they evaporate a tad with the polyfil lids?  meaning, if they're just sitting out, with no myc currently in them, just slightly moist grain, will water work its way out eventually via the polyfilled holes in the lids??  curious about that..

anyway, yeah..


Edited by black strat (12/06/20 12:41 AM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat] * 1
    #27075246 - 12/06/20 02:52 PM (2 months, 25 days ago)

As I started (and I still feel like I am starting) I picked certain things that I could make constant. Do not change from the TEKs until you have them mastered. The TEKs work. You KNOW they do based upon all the people here using them.

It is ok to “purchase” some shortcuts. There are sponsors (I think) and if not eBay or Etsy (but use sponsors first) that sell agar powder premixed.  It is really high quality so you can just add the required water and put it in the PC. It is hardly more expensive than making your own and you KNOW it will work. PM me if you have Q’s about where to purchase. I have not purchased recently but I did when I started.

Make up your plates and let them sit 10 - 14 days before you use them. You have to plan ahead, but if there is no contam growth after 2 weeks you KNOW you are ok to that point.

It just takes practice (and patience).


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik] * 1
    #27075532 - 12/06/20 05:34 PM (2 months, 25 days ago)

Did you run out of water in your cooker, and/or are you adding extra weight? It sounds like maybe the pc got too hot. Also make sure you aren't taking the rocker weight off the PC, you need to let it cool to atmospheric pressure after turning it off. If you lift the weight, everything inside will instantly boil when the pressure suddenly drops.

I'd try the HG plates again with your tried and true agar recipe. Pour em nice and thin. I don't put the quart jars over them, and I do get some condensation, but I only need to PC them for 30 mins.

For your oats, If they were dry on the outside when you loaded them up they should be fine. They will always look wet out of the pc. Once they cool and are shaken, they usually looks good.

I like eatyualive's oat prep tek. Boil plain water, turn off, add oats, wait 45 mins, strain oats for a couple mins, load into jars and PC. Simple consistent results.


https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22158748


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Edited by karri0n (12/06/20 05:41 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27083256 - 12/11/20 01:55 AM (2 months, 21 days ago)

hey guys, sorry I haven't responded to your comments, but I think all is well, for now..

I'm running into a new issue haha, too much agar!! well, wouldn't call it an "issue", because I think it's great, but definitely need to get it under control for long term

this box is only about half of my agar plates. I have 20+ more, just from multiplying each previous plate by 4x.

I have noc'd up grain, so now I'm trying to get in the business of preserving/saving the extra myc'd agar plates i have on hand.

you guys know any good, easy, very explanatory LC teks? I think I read that pasty has a good one, but wanna hear your opinions.

also, for now, like for right now, immediately-- can I simply put my agar plates into a zip lock and put them in the fridge, and will they stop "growing" so fast? to give me a sort of breather while I learn a more proper way to store them?

thank yas.


Edited by black strat (12/12/20 06:33 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27083262 - 12/11/20 01:59 AM (2 months, 20 days ago)

also, sorry, so I've just been using 1 plate per jar of grain.. is this ok to do? I figured I had so many, and they're growing so fast, that taking 10 plates and throwing them into 10 jars would help to inoc the jars faster, being they each had 6-10 healthy little wedges in each jar..


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27083678 - 12/11/20 11:35 AM (2 months, 20 days ago)

Looks like things are going well for you! I have never made an LC so I do not have a TEK to recommend.

I take one full plate to a quart jar filled 75% full. I shake the jar when it looks 30-40% colonized. They colonize quickly. I have not had the need to go grain to grain or split plates. I do sometimes take a transfer from the plate before I put it to grain.

Some of your plates are showing some nice rhizo growth starting, but you may need to use the larger plates to get it to show up better. Not sure since all I have used are the 90 mm plates.

Putting a plate in the refrigerator will allow it to be good for months. I find they still grow out to the edge of the plate, but they are viable to make transfers from or to go to grain. My experience is with gourmets mainly.

I have a refrigerator full of plates.  I have tried 3 times to organize and throw out what I do not need (without success), so I probably am not the best person for advice...but what I try to do is...

If you make multiple T0 plates from a syringe or print, then only keep one in cold storage if it is clean.  Sometimes there are none clean that you can keep. Throw the rest away and keep the best looking one.

Same thing for the T1 plates. If you have a clean plate that looks really good, then save it. You want some genetics that you can fall back on if you need to, but you probably still have the original print or syringe and you will make prints or clones later assuming you get fruit.

At T2 I start keeping only perfect plates that I can put to grain. I am very selective (really I am not and this is my problem, but let’s pretend that I am...). Perfect plates if. No sign of contams, good growth. Hopefully at this point you are starting to see some areas that you can take transfers from that are starting to look  or at least growing faster. You will eventually grow that out and get better plates and then these T2 plates build up in the refrigerator and you probably Should toss them or keep just enough to make more good T3/T4 material. This is the genetics that I keep instead of trying to keep T0/T1 plates that may have contams (even if they look, clean). You can store these in the refrigerator for months. I put parafilm on them and sometimes put them into a ziplock. I keep a list of these plates as “ready for grain” and “cold storage” which are plates that I will use to make more plates so I want to hold them. Ideally, I think all my T2 plates would be “cold storage” and not go to grain.

Then I make T3/T4/T? until I get plates full of rhizo growth. Toss other plates that are not perfect. I am not trying to make an isolate, just a good plate that will colonize grain quickly. You will find that some of these T3/T4 transfers grow very quick and fill the plate quick. I try to have 2-3 plates in this area ready to go to grain and in the refrigerator. As I do, I toss the T2 plates that I had earmarked for grain. When I get jars available, take a plate out of storage and let it warm up for a day or two. It has normally grown all the way to the edges even though it was in cold storage. After 24-96 hours out at room temperature I put it to grain. My oldest plate that I did this to was 2 months old (and it was pearl mushroom, so a little different), and it is colonizing the grain fine.

When I use all of my T3/T4+ plates I make more, either from the last plate before it goes to grain or from the T2 plate that I kept.

Eventually you will get fruit. You will have to learn this skill also and the first shoeboxes (or whatever you are going to use) may not produce, but eventually you will have fruit. Then you can make your own spore prints (so T1/T2 plates are not very valuable) and you can clone your best looking fruit. Once you clean up the contams on the plates from the clone you have good T3/T4+ material that you know produces. One good clean clone plate in cold storage can easily make 10 plates that you can take to grain.

Sorry if the reply is convoluted or does not make sense. I am typing it at work between stuff. But basically what I am telling you is that you are making a lot of plates now ... so you can have good quality genetics ... so that you can get fruit ... and then have a source of good quality genetics...clear as mud?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27083712 - 12/11/20 11:56 AM (2 months, 20 days ago)

hey man, this is EXACTLY what I was looking for.. I was tracking the whole way thru your comment, and you basically answered all the agar-storage-related questions currently swimming around in my head. yeah, it was perfect - not convoluted at all, to me.

actually, I was pretty much gonna go that route you explained, long term, just because thats what made the most sense to me in my head, so its great to see someone else lay it all out like that, and reassure me that thats the way to store/go about it.

one place I hope i didn't fuck up, was I used 10 of my T2 plates for my grain jars, because they looked fantastic, and I was eager as fuck to get some myc to grain finally. [I know, I know, patience is a virtue..] so right now I have about 16 or so T3s, and probably close to a dozen other T2s.. and I agree; its kinda hard for me to pitch old plates.  I'm the type thats always like "yeah.. think I might need this seemingly useless thing some time in my future" [and that goes for all of my belongings, not just agar plates lol]..

anyway, thanks for the response brother, and also for the confidence in reassurance!


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat] * 1
    #27083874 - 12/11/20 01:39 PM (2 months, 20 days ago)

This week on Culture Hoarders lol

No joke man, this is a good problem to have!  :vibin:  :vibin:

Here's bod's LC tek, that one is pretty good but doesnt have a ton of details.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25383024

The Josex Poke tek is popular but it also takes the lc a lot longer to start up/take off than using a transfer, and you need to sterilize a syringe.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24740168

There aren't a lot of "teks" on LC because it's really simple. Sterilize nutrient broth and transfer mycelium to it. Then shake it daily or more, and just watch.  Make sure it is airtight and you are using good technique in a SAB during the transfer, because liquids can contam super easy. The broth will turn cloudy if it gets contaminated, and the mycelium will become visible if it works. The main thing is knowing what to look for. Any of the links I give here will have lots of photos.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27007467/fpart/1/vc/1
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26977498


If you can make clean agar transfers(like some of these clean AF transfers pictured here) then you can make clean LC transfers.

Use the same recipe as you use for agar but don't add agar-agar. You can go less on nutrition as well if you want the broth clearer.

If you are using LME, you can sterilize for 30 minutes. 60 or even 90  if you're using grain water.

You can use unmodified lids, lids with a whatman filter/0.22um syringe filter, or lids with an SFD or Poly-FIll.

I prefer unmodified or syringe filter, so I can shake the shit out of it. You can't let the broth ever touch the SFD or Poly-Fill if you use one and I just don't trust I'd never jostle it or whatever.

The filter is just for gas exchange so the jar doesn't burst in the PC, or so that you can aspirate the LC with a syringe if you also install a self healing injection port.

If you use unmodified lids, then you just pour the lc into the grain to inoculate. If you use lids with a SHIP, then you inoculate grain with a syringe.

Pour and unmodified lids was simple for me.

If you use the plastic jar lids, you need to also get gaskets. The gasket was a huge pain in the ass in the SAB, so I stick with metal lids. This opinion may change because I do like the plastic lids a lot more with the one piece construction. Taking the metal lid off when sealed is also a pain. Leave the ring slightly loose or it will be ultra tight out of the PC and frustrating when you need to take it back out of the SAB to get it open. The jar lid should seal down due to the vacuum created anyway, and you will probably have to fight with it a little, just make sure your gloves are fully sanitized and you handle the top as little as possible. Release the seal on the lid, then replace it gently on top, then sterilize the scalpel and do your transfer. Only lift the lid partially, when you are dropping the transfer in.

If you made 200ml of broth, you could inoculate 20 quarts, 10ml per jar. I probably went well over 10ml when inoculated, pouring, by eye, and it worked perfectly. Amazingly even. Colonization was like instant. It sounds intimidating and I was afraid to start with LC due to the possibility of contamination, but I really can't recommend it more highly.



Edited by karri0n (12/11/20 02:35 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27083904 - 12/11/20 02:05 PM (2 months, 20 days ago)

Grenik definitely has his shit together more than I do when it comes to the culture library. All of that sounds great.

The only thing I'd say that I do different is I will inoculate grain from a t1 or t2 if they are clean, I don't necessarily wait until t3/t4/etc.

This T2 inoculated 1q oats and 500ml LC.

The One shoebox is currently pushing up the lid on its first flush, and the ones inoculated 2 weeks later from the LC are starting to pin. The shoeboxes themselves colonized faster when I used LC, not just the jar. That surprised me, especially because it's the same culture.

I would never inoculate LC from a t0, though I have tried grain from a t0 of shaggy manes that looked super clean . It turned green in the jar.


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Edited by karri0n (12/11/20 02:10 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27083933 - 12/11/20 02:29 PM (2 months, 20 days ago)

This is after the last clean out...



Here is the first shoebox. I have only grown gourmets in the past, but have a ton of cube genetics in storage. So I probably made more transfers since it was just agar work for me and I was not all that interested in growing them out. I love them gourmets though...



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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27083952 - 12/11/20 02:43 PM (2 months, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Grenik said:
I love them gourmets though...

[/url]



https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26990509

I've got Chicken of The woods, Lion's Mane, Turkey Tail, and Maitake going right now. No fruits yet but there are mycelium pictures in there.

I am also attempting to grow Witches' Butter, but that's not exactly gourmet.
Edible though! No mycelium has grown on the plate yet but it's only been two days.


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Edited by karri0n (12/11/20 02:44 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27084053 - 12/11/20 04:02 PM (2 months, 20 days ago)

Two weeks ago

Quote:

black strat said:
I really, reeeally don't wanna give up man.. but how many fuckups before you tell yourself you suck donkeyballs and mycology ain't for ya?



Now you're like

Quote:

black strat said:
I'm running into a new issue haha, too much agar!! well, wouldn't call it an "issue", because I think it's great




:congrats: :dancer:  :rockon:  :headbang:


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27084186 - 12/11/20 05:44 PM (2 months, 20 days ago)

Quote:

karri0n said:

I've got Chicken of The woods, Lion's Mane, Turkey Tail, and Maitake going right now. No fruits yet but there are mycelium pictures in there.

I am also attempting to grow Witches' Butter, but that's not exactly gourmet.





I read through that thread and it is great. I want to try chicken sometime, but am working on easier species right now. The chestnuts are kicking my ass.  I just set up a small tent in my wine cellar to keep humidity high and temps good, so we will see. If you get chicken to fruit indoors I would be interested.

I have a lot of genetics for gourmet if you want to trade sometime. I cloned some wild shaggy mane if you ever want to try growing it (I have not been brave enough).

I will have to look up the witches butter.

Back on topic...I took a lot of T2 gourmet to grain without issue. No problem if they are visibly clean. It is more that now my clones and regular T3+ plates are “better” so I use them.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27084315 - 12/11/20 06:51 PM (2 months, 20 days ago)

Quote:

karri0n said:
I've got Chicken of The woods, Lion's Mane, Turkey Tail, and Maitake going right now. No fruits yet but there are mycelium pictures in there.





Been following this.  I've got some Lion's Mane and Cordyceps working too.  Progress is in my Journal.  Reishi is next, just been lazy about PCing some grains.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27084946 - 12/12/20 03:49 AM (2 months, 19 days ago)

sitting here laughing my ass off at Greniks fridge, and Circusboys comment.  :lol:  :lol:

and karri0n, thanks so much dude.. you actually explained it perfectly, and quite frankly better than some teks/writeups I've seen in the past day or so. I think it's cause sometimes posters assume some stuff is just inherently obvious, so maybe they're not spelling out every little detail, maybe..?  I unfortunately need the little minute tidbits.. I dunno, but anyway, yeah, tracking, thank you!!

Quote:

karri0n said:
This week on Culture Hoarders lol





:laugh2:


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27091399 - 12/16/20 01:37 AM (2 months, 16 days ago)

yeah.... these don't look good, do they?



it's only 4 jars. I'm asking after seeing a few threads here of grain that looks very similar, with the comments telling the lad they're not good. mold and such. is that what I have? mold again?  these were all inoculated with [what looked like to us, right lol??] great, clean agar/myc..

I obviously fucked up somewhere. I really think my grain was too dry, even tho "you can't have too dry oats".  they're also taking a very long time. they started out fine i think, and stalled kinda quick. I dunno man. pretty fuckin bummed.

also, the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th pics is the one I was really worried about - its the only one I shook up so far, probably shouldn't have, but it looked 35%+ occupied. hmm.

OH, ANNND -- could the polyfil be too tight?? thats another thing from bod - " if you think its too tight, its fucking perfect "... okay, I suppose, but this shit is TIIIIGHT... literally stuffed the holes til I couldn't stuff no mo.  issue perhaps?


Edited by black strat (12/16/20 07:26 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27091428 - 12/16/20 02:12 AM (2 months, 15 days ago)

I really can't see anything that looks like mold in there.

That all looks like cube mycelium. What specifically do you see that looks like mold? Is there any grey or green?

Your oats also look fine to me. Nice and fat, definitely not too dry.

Re: your poly, Check out Pasty's unmodified jar lids tek - myc will colonize with a fully closed jar lid to 70-80% before stalling.

If you're using poly, I don't think anything else has more airflow than poly. It really shouldn't need more GE.

That jar from pics 234 after the shake looks baller af. Great recovery, although if it doesn't start fuzzing up like that on the entire surface, you might not have shaken it hard/long enough.

Great job mate, glad to see this. I literally just got done tripping like half an hour ago and came on here to see this progress. awesome.

:mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2::mushroom2:


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Edited by karri0n (12/16/20 02:18 AM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27092345 - 12/16/20 04:52 PM (2 months, 15 days ago)

hahahaha thats so awesome man. fuck, I can't WAIT to feel that feeling again man. its been... shit, over 15 years since I've tripped. to be completely, 100% honest, trying to grow these is kinda like one of my last ditch efforts to remedy my depression. I've been on allll the meds, lol. nothing really, REALLY has worked in my life, EXCEPT, when I was a teenager and I tripped for the first time, it completely and utterly changed my view and opinion of myself, for that time. I really, truly liked and loved and appreciated myself, which I never did before and very seldom have since that short time. so, definitely excited to have some killer experiences with these, but my primary goal is to use these literally medicinally, most likely with micro-dosing, etc. I would love to find a local "guide", or provider, or whatever they call those pros that work with you WHILE they dose you, but I have no idea if there are any near me, and I am damn sure too paranoid to even ask a soul in person to find out. coming here talking to you guys even has me slightly paranoid. it's so depressing that something so potentially life changing for someone like me, that doesn't hurt ANYONE else around them by using the substance, is considered a schedule fucking 1 drug that can drastically change my life for the worse, were the wrong person to find out this part of my life about me. it's bizarre to put it mildly. almost fucking laughable, hah.

anyway, didn't mean to go off on that tangent there, this isn't even the right forum for that lol I guess, but yeah, hearing you are having a good time makes me happy for you brother. I hope I get there soon too!

thanks for the response as always.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27092400 - 12/16/20 05:27 PM (2 months, 15 days ago)

oh sorry, and to answer your question, what got me concerned was looking at this other thread, this guys jars are apparently fucked, and they do look kinda similar to mine:

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27089518#27089518

I dunno.. could be all in my head. also, heres specifically the discoloration I see:



these little marks are verrrry few and far between, and I am almost certain they've been there since the beginning, which makes me think they might be little pieces of discolored grain/debris/whatever was in there that I didn't clear out.. [grain here isn't the BEST quality you can get, but you guys know that part]..

anyway, jus trying not to get my hopes too high, thats all. I want this shit IN THE BAG before I start dancing around my place or doin any type of victory lap lol. anything can happen, I know. plus I'm so green to all this.

anyway, thanks.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27092406 - 12/16/20 05:31 PM (2 months, 15 days ago)

they almost look like little eraser bits, or like something that was once super clean, and it got rubbed too much or fucked with, so it like, collected some dirt/debris, like you know how you can rub your fingers which appeared clean, and then you sometimes see those little bits of stringy dirt clumps? like that. lmfao I'm so bad at explaining. but thats what it reminds me of. like a piece of an oat that just got thrown around and rubbed elbows with too many other little grain guys.


Edited by black strat (12/16/20 05:32 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27092775 - 12/16/20 08:57 PM (2 months, 15 days ago)

Quote:

black strat said:
hahahaha thats so awesome man. fuck, I can't WAIT to feel that feeling again man. its been... shit, over 15 years since I've tripped. to be completely, 100% honest, trying to grow these is kinda like one of my last ditch efforts to remedy my depression. I've been on allll the meds, lol. nothing really, REALLY has worked in my life, EXCEPT, when I was a teenager and I tripped for the first time, it completely and utterly changed my view and opinion of myself, for that time. I really, truly liked and loved and appreciated myself, which I never did before and very seldom have since that short time. so, definitely excited to have some killer experiences with these, but my primary goal is to use these literally medicinally, most likely with micro-dosing, etc. I would love to find a local "guide", or provider, or whatever they call those pros that work with you WHILE they dose you, but I have no idea if there are any near me, and I am damn sure too paranoid to even ask a soul in person to find out. coming here talking to you guys even has me slightly paranoid. it's so depressing that something so potentially life changing for someone like me, that doesn't hurt ANYONE else around them by using the substance, is considered a schedule fucking 1 drug that can drastically change my life for the worse, were the wrong person to find out this part of my life about me. it's bizarre to put it mildly. almost fucking laughable, hah.

anyway, didn't mean to go off on that tangent there, this isn't even the right forum for that lol I guess, but yeah, hearing you are having a good time makes me happy for you brother. I hope I get there soon too!

thanks for the response as always.





Man everything you said here hits home. I've seen the dangers of psych meds and have been surrounded by addiction and mental health issues my entire life. I liked to pretend that shit didn't affect me but as I get older, it's become apparent that I ended up pretty fucked up myself in my own special ways, heh.

I've read about psychedelics and entheogens since I got on the internet 25 years ago, but my social anxiety kept me from making the friends that would lead me to those experiences as a kid, and other than this, how would you get there as an adult, you know? The experiences I've had and changes in my outlook day to day, even just from the few times I've tripped, have been legitimately life changing.

I'm also terrified of the potential consequences. I'm taking the initiative to help myself and my partner's mental health more than anything else has or could for 20+ years, and thereby our entire life, by doing this, and could lose everything for it. It's a very fucked up system.

Back on track lol

Your jars don't look like the ones in that other thread at all. those look pretty fookin bad mate. You can see how the mycelium is like.... Scraggly? In those. Yours is bright white and strong/healthy looking. He's also got tons of excess moisture which is probably why it got bacterial, or the bacteria is liquefying the grain.

The two spots you circled could possibly look sketch. Just keep watching them and see if they grow like myc should, or if they look different than the rest. Also watch to see if any other parts of them turn colors. If not, then it's just discoloration on the grain or even possibly bruised myc.


Edited by karri0n (12/16/20 09:35 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27092848 - 12/16/20 09:33 PM (2 months, 15 days ago)

Bravo to both of you for sharing.  I just don't have it in me right now so will only comment on the grains.  Do a side by side comparison of your grains to the ones in the post you put a link to and tell me you don't see a major difference.  After you do this I'm sure you'll feel better about them.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: IdiotCircusBoy]
    #27093562 - 12/17/20 07:54 AM (2 months, 14 days ago)

How are you planning to grow out your jars?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27094506 - 12/17/20 06:20 PM (2 months, 14 days ago)

Quote:

Grenik said:
How are you planning to grow out your jars?




ideally I'd like to do shoeboxes, which I have around a dozen of.  if I finally get there, what's a good humidity percentage to be at?  I'm reading people have theirs in the 90s.. is this just for inside the actual tub, or its surrounding area too? right now I'm in the 40s, but I'm assuming it doesn't really matter while they're still in jars, right?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27094735 - 12/17/20 08:25 PM (2 months, 14 days ago)

That 90% number is inside the fruiting chamber. In this case the shoebox itself.

For growing cubes, most experts will tell you to throw out your humidity gauge and just follow the tek, misting if the substrate starts to dry.

The real place that your RH matters is on the surface of the sub, and it's impossible to measure. Case in point, Cronicr's tek about growing without a fruiting chamber at all. https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/21288129

If your shoeboxes dry out too fast, keep them in a monotub with either a cracked lid or some holes.

I have my shoeboxes in a ghetto martha, and the humidity in there goes between 85 and 94.
Theoretically the shoebox isn't necessary in such a case because the martha itself is a type of FC.

I'm going to experiment with the shoeboxes lid open in the martha and also just keeping the shoeboxes on a shelf.

I'm still getting the hang of proper surface conditions. If you don't have the surface conditions proper, then the fruits will be smaller and pins less plentiful. Perfect surface conditions will usually get you canopies, but genetics play a factor too. My last shoebox gave 13.5g dry on the first flush. You can get 1-2 oz in a flush when you've really gotten it down.

If you're gonna be running 6 boxes at once(man I need to get some condiment containers, I'm jelly of your 20+ t2's), you should be able to experiment enough to get your learning curve quickly, pulling sick canopies.



Edited by karri0n (12/17/20 09:27 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27094792 - 12/17/20 09:02 PM (2 months, 14 days ago)

I have had 2 shoeboxes produce and 2 fail, ... so not the best for advice.

If you have not worked with coir before, then take a couple cups worth and start adding water. You need to know what field capacity is like and then be just a little drier than that. So add water until you can squeeze out a drop or two (field capacity) and then add just a little more coir and squeeze that. This is what you want in your shoeboxes. You will have to add boiling water to a cooler, or sterilize, or whatever your TEK calls for, but before it goes into the shoebox, make sure the water content is right.

Then, resist the temptation to look at it every hour and also resist the “feeling” that it is too wet or too dry and make adjustments. Also, throw away your peroxide, bleach, etc. You are not going to try and treat every spot you think may be mold or whatever. Follow the TEK. Take notes and make adjustments on your next batch if you need to.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: Grenik]
    #27095142 - 12/18/20 02:08 AM (2 months, 13 days ago)

thanks y'all.

and karri0n, I think you were right dude -- I just shook up another jar earlier today that had none of those little dark discolorations in it, then went back to look at it some hours later, and I started spotting them here and there.. leads me to believe, like you said, it's just some bruising. still keeping a watchful eye, but it was a sigh-worthy moment. :thumbup:


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27105094 - 12/24/20 02:59 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

hey guys.. thought I'd throw an update..




I'm a total dumbass for not marking the date on these, but looking back at past posts, I'm thinking it was around Dec 10th that I knocked these up, so ~2 weeks. 

the first few pics are of the same jar, and that's the one that I shook up twice now. I read one shake at 30% and another at ~80% is standard, right?

the other 3 jars/remaining pics have each been shook once, at around 30%.

in person, I don't see any obvious contams, but I also have pretty thick noob-googles on my face, hah.

I guess if I had a question, it would be - does the grain have to be more/less *consumed* by the myc before you can even think about transferring to bulk?  it appears to me that most of the oats are FULL of myc on the inside, where the actual nutrients reside, which would make sense to me, logically. but the pics I've seen of others' jars looks like their myc is overwhelming their grains, shell and all, in a good way. and I'm jus not seeing my myc in the same light lol. mine is kinda.... weak looking?  dunno. what do you bros think?

and if someone were to, and I'm not saying I'm even contemplating this but, put these jars in their current state to bulk, what would happen? outta curiosity. stall-city?  death?


thanks.


Edited by black strat (12/24/20 06:44 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27107328 - 12/25/20 01:55 PM (2 months, 6 days ago)

I've seen the same thing where the myc doesn't look as thick and white as some forum pics. This could be bacterial, but it might also be normal.

The jars where it's covering everything but still sorta thin, I'd wait a 1-2 days for it to thicken, then spawn to a shoebox. Smell em when you're breaking it up, it should just be mushroomy.

I'd be more worried about the jars with the larger uncolonized patches. They might just need a shake but that could also be bacteria preventing colonization. They might end up stinking once you spawn them.

Since you're doing shoeboxes and not a tub, you don't have to worry about some jars contaminating others since it's one jar per box.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27108240 - 12/26/20 06:32 AM (2 months, 5 days ago)

ahhh, ya think so maybe?  oof, that's a bit of a bummer if it's the case..  I checked on em a little bit ago, and it seems they're all mostly colonized now, with no super-bare patches anymore, but still mostly just thin layers of myc. I am also seeing more rhyzo(?)-type growth too though. little spots, here and there, of tendrils sprouting up, which is pretty cool lookin. its what I've been hoping to see in the jars from the very beginning.

kinda torn between just waiting and waiting, wanting to see how thick they're gonna get, and just spawning to bulk like ya said.

so let's say it does happen to be bacterial, and that's where the thinness is coming from -- would you happen to know if this is the kind of bacteria that'll prevent ANY fruiting?  because I think there's some bacteria that just lessens your yield, but will end up still being edible. yea?  I guess we'll just find out if and when we finally get there, but if fruit is 'unsafe' to consume, it'll be evident as to why, right?  meaning, FFWD to my shoeboxes fruiting, right, and me harvesting, bacteria that'll be dangerous to consume will be clearly visible?

sorry for the weird hypotheticals lol, just wanna know what I should be looking out for. because I think I've read that you can have bacteria living in your boxes, and not even be aware of it, because all it does is weaken your potential quantity/size of your fruits.. right?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27108259 - 12/26/20 07:13 AM (2 months, 5 days ago)

so, here's actually a really cool example:

the red circles are reference points i used to identify new growth near them, and the blue circles are areas im seeing new growth..




so, here you can see exactly what I meant by new growth, and this actually happened in the span of a day/36 hrs..




makes me kinda think to maybe just let them keep goin and do their thing..?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27109086 - 12/26/20 04:22 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

black strat said:
ahhh, ya think so maybe?  oof, that's a bit of a bummer if it's the case..  I checked on em a little bit ago, and it seems they're all mostly colonized now, with no super-bare patches anymore, but still mostly just thin layers of myc. I am also seeing more rhyzo(?)-type growth too though. little spots, here and there, of tendrils sprouting up, which is pretty cool lookin. its what I've been hoping to see in the jars from the very beginning.

kinda torn between just waiting and waiting, wanting to see how thick they're gonna get, and just spawning to bulk like ya said.

so let's say it does happen to be bacterial, and that's where the thinness is coming from -- would you happen to know if this is the kind of bacteria that'll prevent ANY fruiting?  because I think there's some bacteria that just lessens your yield, but will end up still being edible. yea?  I guess we'll just find out if and when we finally get there, but if fruit is 'unsafe' to consume, it'll be evident as to why, right?  meaning, FFWD to my shoeboxes fruiting, right, and me harvesting, bacteria that'll be dangerous to consume will be clearly visible?

sorry for the weird hypotheticals lol, just wanna know what I should be looking out for. because I think I've read that you can have bacteria living in your boxes, and not even be aware of it, because all it does is weaken your potential quantity/size of your fruits.. right?





I'm not an expert on that by any means. Ive seen what looked like healthy but maybe weaker myc spawn to bulk and end up just stinking like sour milk with no fruits. I've seen it work fine too and produce what seemed to be perfectly healthy fruits.

I think generally if the fruits don't look or smell rotten they are ok. If you are using a dehydrator, that will make it double safe as that will kill off most any bacteria.

Your jars look like they're still cooking and doing pretty fine to me, especially if those second two pics are the same as the first two.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n] * 1
    #27109112 - 12/26/20 04:30 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

yeah, they are. the top two directly correspond to the one directly underneath it.. I was trying to show their differences in just a day or two.

I was basically using the one or two much darker oat shells and their orientation in the jar, sorta like a landmark, to locate where new growth has happened very recently. that's why I circled the landmarks in red, and what WILL be the new growth areas [in the bottom pics] in green, in the first/top pics.. sorry I didn't really make that too clear. I feel like I'm still failing to explain it coherently hahah.

thanks man.


Edited by black strat (12/26/20 04:37 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27109670 - 12/26/20 10:02 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

karri0n said:
Ive seen what looked like healthy but maybe weaker myc spawn to bulk and end up just stinking like sour milk with no fruits. I've seen it work fine too and produce what seemed to be perfectly healthy fruits.




IMO karri0n is 100% on this.  Stop looking at your jars so much.  Put the fuckers to bulk in a day or two.  You're the man!!


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: IdiotCircusBoy] * 1
    #27109774 - 12/26/20 11:13 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

lmao, ^^^^THIS is the advice I needed bro, but stupidly wasn't following myself.. leave the fookin jars alone!!

so right tho, getting neurotic with these shits smh..

I'll do better Circus, I promise man.:grin:


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27126310 - 01/04/21 04:33 PM (1 month, 27 days ago)

hey bros.

got 2 shoeboxes. everything seems to be goin ok, cept today I got home from work and pulled em out, and they were still pretty damp. I've only been misting when the coir turns light brown, and not too much, and I think I've been doin alright on that end.

all I smell is mushrooms. but stagnant water makes my butt pucker up when I see it.. I've came pretty far lol, don't wanna fucking blow it due to too much/over-care..

for now I've jimmied the tops, creating gaps at the corners for some FAE, hoping this will get rid of some extra moisture -- will that work??

pics ain't all that great, and yeah, most of the surface has a lovely dewy presence all over the myc.. there are some suuuuper small areas i can see some myc becoming sliiiiightly soggy, especially if it were to just stay as wet as it is now.

what do we think, bros?



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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27126387 - 01/04/21 05:10 PM (1 month, 27 days ago)

Just in case you hadn't come across, this thread may be of interest to you at this stage of your grow.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: coversall]
    #27126823 - 01/04/21 08:21 PM (1 month, 27 days ago)

:whathesaid:

strat - other than those few areas that haven't colonized yet, I think it's lookin good.  You want beads of water all over it and ya got beads of water all over it.  You can probably put that shit into fruiting.  How many days in are you?  It sounds like you are getting a feel for it.  Just FYI you may get more responses from a new post.  I think we're way past the "Check out my agar, please" phase.  Damn, so stoked for you.


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Edited by IdiotCircusBoy (01/04/21 08:23 PM)


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: IdiotCircusBoy]
    #27127059 - 01/04/21 10:35 PM (1 month, 27 days ago)

My best advice would be worry less and mess with it less than that. It's colonizing great as far as I can see and the surface looks near perfect.


If it's drying that quickly with the lid closed that you've needed to mist it more than a couple times, I'd be cautious of cracking the lid for fear of drying too quickly.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27127289 - 01/05/21 02:02 AM (1 month, 26 days ago)

Quote:

IdiotCircusBoy said:
:whathesaid:

strat - other than those few areas that haven't colonized yet, I think it's lookin good.  You want beads of water all over it and ya got beads of water all over it.  You can probably put that shit into fruiting.  How many days in are you?  It sounds like you are getting a feel for it.  Just FYI you may get more responses from a new post.  I think we're way past the "Check out my agar, please" phase.  Damn, so stoked for you.




hey buddy! thanks man, I'm pretty amped, myself! I am about 1 week in.  man, I gotta say.. that spawn just started fuckin ripping thru the coir, almost immediately. I was very curious to see what it'd do, because it definitely looked kinda weak in the jars.. my personal theory is the oats weren't perfect - I actually opened a few up when I put it to coir, and the insides were a little dry/brittle.. but anyway, who gives a fuck haha, we're past that now, brother!

just in the few hours since my last post, both boxes are now just about fully colonized.. fuck, I'm excited.. hopefully it all works out dude.. still biting my nails, tho..

Quote:

karri0n said:
My best advice would be worry less and mess with it less than that. It's colonizing great as far as I can see and the surface looks near perfect.


If it's drying that quickly with the lid closed that you've needed to mist it more than a couple times, I'd be cautious of cracking the lid for fear of drying too quickly.




yea dude -- for sure wanna just leave it alone..

I only cracked the lids when I panicked for a few mins, then made that other post, and got advice super quick, then closed em back up. some moisture has indeed evaporated,  but we still got a full field of water droplets.

thanks bud.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27129936 - 01/06/21 11:41 AM (1 month, 25 days ago)

Hey man you should post a link to your shoebox thread for folks who want to follow along


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: karri0n]
    #27131123 - 01/06/21 07:37 PM (1 month, 25 days ago)

Ah, good idea mate!

From the studio that brought you the first installment of a noobs saga, Ep. 1: Check out my agar, please?...

comes its not-at-all-whatsoever anticipated sequel ---

Check out my shoeboxes, please?

:thumbup: :thumbup:


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: black strat]
    #27146971 - 01/14/21 03:50 AM (1 month, 17 days ago)

Your grains may be under hydrated. If a jar is not colonized it is because of
1- bacteria
2-lack of gas exchange
3-lack of moisture

There are more complicated  things to worry about, but not here in your case. Good luck.


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: scarabaeus]
    #27146992 - 01/14/21 04:31 AM (1 month, 17 days ago)

I'm not new to growing monotub B+ shrooms, but I am colorblind,and this is my first Golden Teacher monotub. I know you guys get asked this alot,but if the pictures actually post (4 strokes also,so not the sharpess knife in the drawer.) Let me know please if all looks well. I see some brown spots according to my colorblind app.https://files.shroomery.org/files/21-002/061653431-PicsArt_01-14-03.25.12.jpg][/url]


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: CueBaII]
    #27147014 - 01/14/21 05:05 AM (1 month, 17 days ago)

Yes I'm a noob, like most of you were at a time. So like I siad,I'm colorblind, but have been fortunate enough with B+. I'm 54 and use this to help my depression which for me,it does help. I did Spravato and quickly learned that the trip was part of the healing. This is why my switch to Golden Teacher.  So be easy on the old man. Peace,CueBaII


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: CueBaII]
    #27148067 - 01/14/21 06:19 PM (1 month, 17 days ago)

I think you had an issue attaching your file to the post. I cannot click on it and blow it up to a larger size, so I really cannot tell much. Can you repost?


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Re: Check out my agar, please? [Re: CueBaII]
    #27150716 - 01/16/21 01:30 AM (1 month, 16 days ago)

Hellow cueball. I can't zoom in on your pic, but from what I CAN see it looks like you are on your way to a harvest. If you have near proper moisture and a bit of air exchange, you should get something. Once you have this grow under your belt, the next one should be even better. Just don't make radical changes. Remember what got you this far and tweek a bit here, a bit there.

I sympathize with your situation (I am a health care professional). Normally I would ask you to PM me so I could walk you through the process as best as I can. But this covid thing is a bitch. I just registered to help mass inoculate the populace at a state designated site; in this case a Sears store that went out of business. This on top of my normal day job.

This doesn't mean I forget about peeps like you as I wish you well. But there are many other growers here who are just as capable or even more so than I to help you with your growing concerns.  Shrooms for healing? I'm all in. Can somebody in this community throw this guy a life-line?


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* Hey guys, plus questions DeadCriteria 87 6 01/16/21 01:15 AM
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