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oO_wombat_Oo
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So what do I do r.e. substrates? What's the point?
#27009522 - 10/29/20 12:34 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
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The reason I'm asking all of this, is two-fold: 1) general cultivation knowledge; and 2) I've actually got several jars looking all good all at once, and I don't want to be growing a tonne of mushrooms all at once. I just want a small grow to start with. Could I just pour out the grain (or break up the brown rice - I have both) into the bottom of a tray, add a half inch casing layer of vermiculite, put that in the fruiting chamber and go from there?
What's the point of an intermediary step of moving the culture to another, different substrate anyway? If the mycellium is growing just fine on the grain/rice/whatever, am I correct in assuming that innoculating a substrate for the next step is simply a method of expanding the grow by taking one grain jar and using it to then inoculate multiple bags (or buckets or whatever) of substrate, thus getting a much bigger end yield from the one jar? Or does moving the culture to a substrate serve some other purpose as well?
For a small hobby home grow, I could just grow right off the medium I inoculated with at the start right?
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Pastywhyte
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Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
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Re: So what do I do r.e. substrates? What's the point? [Re: oO_wombat_Oo] 2
#27009531 - 10/29/20 12:51 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
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Grain has lots of nutrients but holds little water and provides a poor pinning surface. You can grow off of just grain if you case it but sometimes yields can suffer unless specific strategies are employed. By spawning to bulk we provide water for the mushrooms and humidity for the chamber. We spawn and expand the colony to get bigger yields.
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Roger Clemency
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Registered: 03/23/20
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Re: So what do I do r.e. substrates? What's the point? [Re: Pastywhyte]
#27009732 - 10/29/20 07:03 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
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When your starting out especially, you can’t always be sure every grow will make it or that they will have even a decent yield so I wouldn’t intentionally try to limit what you can get from your grain spawn. I’d spawn it to coir at a 1:1 ratio with a top layer. You’ll get fast colonization, and have enough water for a decent flush or two. Plus mush cult cannot get easier than spawning to a shoe box, giving the top layer a good misting, and then just waiting for mushrooms to be ready to pick.
-------------------- Sour grapes, sweet revenge Heaven starts right where hell ends
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travels_slightly
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Re: So what do I do r.e. substrates? What's the point? [Re: Roger Clemency]
#27009746 - 10/29/20 07:22 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
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Unwilling to initially hear the wisdom of the same forum I used to get me as far as having colonized grain my first few times, I sadly chose to act on the same thoughts... and yea, I managed to get grain to yield fruit...

there it is. the fruit(no plural) of my labor.
I doubt I have to mention, There was no second flush. Seriously, the reason people say the shit they say here,is because it works. It's like pulling teeth, trying to teach myself that same lesson, I'll be damned if I don't utfse, shake my head, say "nahhhh", do it my way, fail, rinse, repeat, break down and follow the same tek I read the first time but actually complete it as directed, succeed- it's a lot of wasted time and energy. This hobby already requires more time than I prefer to sit and wait, but if you have all the time in the world I suppose...
-------------------- General supporter of all things mystifying, specially when they happen to simultaneously be incriminating. ISO spores beyond my limited collection. I make and deal in many wares, perhaps we can exchange cool goodies
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oO_wombat_Oo
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Re: So what do I do r.e. substrates? What's the point? [Re: Roger Clemency]
#27010557 - 10/29/20 02:35 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
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Yeah, I did actually mention casing it with vermiculite. To be clear, one of the reasons I'm asking the question is that I inoculated a lot of odd-shaped jars containing semi-cooked brown rice, that I was planning on shaking up and pouring out. Only I guess it was too moist or something because it's all stuck together like a BRF cake and the narrow jar opening won't allow for it to slide out.
So I could dig it out with a spoon, but I was thinking I could just add a casing layer to the top of the jar and grow them directly out of the jar.
I don't really give a f-ck about yield from those jars as I have plenty of others on the go, plus the strain from a print a poster was kind enough to send me for free "preserved" on agar. I also have a couple of proper wide-mouthed jars full of proper grain that I can use to do a bigger grow later on down the track. 
It's just a matter of not wanting to "waste" the odd shaped jars full of clunked together brown rice. Haha. And I thought it would kind of look cool to just have mushrooms sprouting from the top of the jars. So any ideas in that regard? I think there's probably plenty of water in the rice grains (but I dunno), can I just add a casing layer to the top of the jars?
As far as the ones I actually have in proper, loose grain in proper, wide-mouthed canning jars...
Quote:
Roger Clemency said: I’d spawn it to coir at a 1:1 ratio with a top layer. You’ll get fast colonization, and have enough water for a decent flush or two. Plus mush cult cannot get easier than spawning to a shoe box, giving the top layer a good misting, and then just waiting for mushrooms to be ready to pick.
Spawning in a shoe box? I actually have a couple of large glass food boxes ready to go, I was planning on using them in a plastic tub "fruiting chamber" with moist perlite on the bottom to retain moisture and just manually airing it out a few times a day.
You mean 1:1 with the coir:grain and a casing layer of what exactly? Vermiculite? What do you mean, "a top layer"?
Thanks everyone for the help! Appreciated!
Edited by oO_wombat_Oo (10/29/20 02:36 PM)
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Roger Clemency
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Registered: 03/23/20
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Re: So what do I do r.e. substrates? What's the point? [Re: oO_wombat_Oo]
#27010695 - 10/29/20 03:47 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
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Whachu been reading on here since 2001 lol 
Really though if your rice is all clumped together it probably has enough water to put out a few cubes. I’d get some coir or a bag of coir/peat based potting soil without a bunch of fertilizer, something like jiffy mix if they have that down under. That’s just me though. Straight vermiculite seems like it has poor structure for the myc.
Shoe boxes is the name of the 6-7 qt plastic tubs. You’d mix 1:1.5 spawn to bulk sub by volume, using that extra .5 of your coir/verm mix as the top layer. I do my shoe boxes with 1 qt WBS, 1.5qt bulk sub Like in this thread https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26009662
When you grow bulk in a plastic tub your substrate provides the humidity so there’s no need for perlite or any kind of electronics. Just fill it up with grain and coir and let it rock.
-------------------- Sour grapes, sweet revenge Heaven starts right where hell ends
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oO_wombat_Oo
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Re: So what do I do r.e. substrates? What's the point? [Re: Roger Clemency]
#27011366 - 10/30/20 01:37 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Roger Clemency said: Whachu been reading on here since 2001 lol 
Really though if your rice is all clumped together it probably has enough water to put out a few cubes. I’d get some coir or a bag of coir/peat based potting soil without a bunch of fertilizer, something like jiffy mix if they have that down under. That’s just me though. Straight vermiculite seems like it has poor structure for the myc.
Shoe boxes is the name of the 6-7 qt plastic tubs. You’d mix 1:1.5 spawn to bulk sub by volume, using that extra .5 of your coir/verm mix as the top layer. I do my shoe boxes with 1 qt WBS, 1.5qt bulk sub Like in this thread https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26009662
When you grow bulk in a plastic tub your substrate provides the humidity so there’s no need for perlite or any kind of electronics. Just fill it up with grain and coir and let it rock.
Thanks for all that info. 
I joined in 2001 when I was in University (damn it really doesn't seem like 20 years ago!) and spent most of my time in Hunting & Gourment forums. Then I didn't post here for about 18 odd years. 
So that explains that ... even after all this time, and hundreds of hours in the forests and fields collecting mushrooms all over the world, I'm still a complete newb when it comes to cultivation.
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