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OfflineScouserUK88
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P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis
    #27008626 - 10/28/20 03:04 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Dear Fellow Shroomeries,

I hope your well and that you're in a position to help me.

I have been reading a lot of articles, PDF's and chat room information but nearly all of the information seem to contradict everything else.


Firstly, I am looking to grow Psilocybe cyanescens (Wavey caps) from a spore print I am currently taking onto tinfoil, Could you please advise on the following in order for me to fruit fresh Psilocybe cyanescens mushrooms:

- Method of the stages from spore print to fruit
-Equipment I would need ( I am aware of the monotub method which I feel is best suited and I am confident in building)
-The Ingredients needed for growing the Celium on before introducing to the substrate
-The ingredients for establishing a prime and healthy Substrate for a monotub, in order to encourage fruiting

Any of the materials I would need, in which you sell, please let me know as I would like to make one large order.

Secondly, I am looking to grow some Cubensis mushrooms ( Penis Envy/Mazatapec ) from scratch, so I would like to establish whether its ideal to buy mushroom spore syringes and begin there?
Then again, Could you please advise on the following in order for me to fruit fresh Psilocybe cyanescens mushrooms:

- Method of the stages from spore syringes
-Equipment I would need ( I am aware of the monotub method which I feel is best suited and I am confident in building)
-The Ingredients needed for growing the Celium on before introducing to the substrate
-The ingredients for establishing a prime and healthy Substrate for a monotub, in order to encourage fruiting

I would like to add that that I greatly appreciate that I am asking a lot, but I am keen to move forward and make use of the fresh Psilocybe cyanescens I have.

Many thanks and much love!!!


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OfflineskOsH
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Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: ScouserUK88]
    #27008672 - 10/28/20 03:29 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Hey,

I don't know much about mushroom cultivation, but you'll want to take those spores from the spore print on the tin foil and put them in a large gauge syringe with water and inject them into substrate inside sterilized jars (heat the needle with lighter, then inject through the lid of the jars). Then when the mycelium completely covers the substrate, you officially have cakes.

Now put the cakes into a sealed container such as a plastic tub which also needs to be sterile. Using an air filter near the tub would help keep the air around it sterile. Mist the cakes with a spray bottle of water often until they start pinning.

There should be plenty of guides on here for help.

Good luck :smile:


Edited by skOsH (10/28/20 03:33 PM)


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OfflineScouserUK88
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Registered: 07/12/20
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Last seen: 2 years, 3 months
Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: skOsH]
    #27008682 - 10/28/20 03:37 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Thannk you!

I appreciate the information!

I have a good knowledge but its mainly the substrate and colonization of each type as I am aware that both of the 2 have different preferences to what I use to Colonize them and what I use to make the substrate for the monotub.

I want to make sure they have a happy life!

Many thanks


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OfflineAablmd82
Mushroom mushroom man
Registered: 04/26/20
Posts: 71
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: skOsH]
    #27008717 - 10/28/20 03:54 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

skOsH said:
Hey,

I don't know much about mushroom cultivation, but you'll want to take those spores from the spore print on the tin foil and put them in a large gauge syringe with water and inject them into substrate inside sterilized jars (heat the needle with lighter, then inject through the lid of the jars). Then when the mycelium completely covers the substrate, you officially have cakes.

Now put the cakes into a sealed container such as a plastic tub which also needs to be sterile. Using an air filter near the tub would help keep the air around it sterile. Mist the cakes with a spray bottle of water often until they start pinning.

There should be plenty of guides on here for help.

Good luck :smile:




This is a good starting point, but is a little outdated imo, plus OP said he feels comfortable with monos. I feel your sig though man, gl on the song.

OP, materials you’ll absolutely need are the following:
Tub
Coir
Grain (oat, wild bird seed, etc.)
Pressure cooker
Mason jars with lids that provide gas exchange - easiest way to do this is drill a hole at least 1/4” wide and stuff it with polyfil
Syringe

This gives you the ability to sterilize grain, inoculate it with a spore syringe, then spawn it to a tub. Spore syringes are inherently “dirty” though, so most people will recommend going from spore syringe to agar, then to grain.

For agar you will need:
Agar agar powder
Nutritional powder (light malt extract, etc. I use powdered dog food)
Containers (Petri dishes or reusable containers)
Sterile air box
Xacto or hobby knife
Torch
Isopropyl alcohol

I think that’s about it. A few other items are for convenience only. Look up bodhisatta’s TEKs for anything you need to know


--------------------
Clone -> agar -> UnBODified monotub (first attempt, left unattended a week before harvesting)


Thanks BOD 🙏


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Invisiblemind.at.large
Myconerd


Registered: 12/13/16
Posts: 1,218
Loc: Floating in liquid gardens
Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: ScouserUK88]
    #27008720 - 10/28/20 03:58 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Don’t waste your time trying to fruit cyanescens in a monotub. That sounds like a lesson in futility for a new grower. Monotubs are perfect for cubensis and a few other types of mushrooms, but definitely not cyanescens. If you wanna grow wavy caps, grow them outside. There’s loads of information here on woodlover teks so I would recommend doing some research, but the most simple way to do it is put spores to BRF/verm cakes, wait for colonization, then crumble and spawn to hardwood chips. I usually boil my wood chips for about an hour, drain, let cool, then mix with spawn in a small tub. Once that’s colonized, I’ll build a wood chip bed outside in a shaded spot and mix in the colonized wood chips. Soak it down with water then just wait. It can take up to a year to see any fruits but will be productive indefinitely as long as you continue to feed it fresh wood chips every year.

I’m also assuming you are in the correct climate for cyans.

Good luck!


--------------------
Mind's Easy Bag 2 Bag Grain Transfers


Endless Sub Tek


...the doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me...


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Offlinedirtybirdx
getting better
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Registered: 07/28/20
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Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: Aablmd82]
    #27008727 - 10/28/20 04:02 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Just to clarify:

You may be finding contradicting info because there’s some general confusion around ‘P.cyanescens’ because there is a Psiloscybe Cyanescens which you correctly identified as wavy caps, but there are also Panaeolus Cyanescens nicknamed Blue Meanies which are a different genus and not related to the wavy caps.

Pan Cyans call for some slightly different materials/methods than the wavy caps, so make sure this isn’t where some of your confusion is coming from.

Disregard if you’re already aware of this!


--------------------
Need help?




Edited by dirtybirdx (10/28/20 04:04 PM)


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Invisiblemind.at.large
Myconerd


Registered: 12/13/16
Posts: 1,218
Loc: Floating in liquid gardens
Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: dirtybirdx]
    #27008732 - 10/28/20 04:05 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

The OP is referring to Psilocybe cyanescens, common name wavy caps, which require way different parameters than Psilocybe cubensis or Panaeolus cyanescens. There is no cubensis that is called wavy caps, as far as I know. If there is, that needs to stop, because like I mentioned, those are two completely different species.


--------------------
Mind's Easy Bag 2 Bag Grain Transfers


Endless Sub Tek


...the doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me...


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OfflineScouserUK88
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Registered: 07/12/20
Posts: 8
Loc: England Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 3 months
Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: Aablmd82]
    #27008741 - 10/28/20 04:11 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

This is great, I have already got some good information so far!

I really do appreciate it, Now all I need is a strong method which I understand is basically asking someone to put it in black and white for me but I know my appreciation for the community and I am positive somebody will have these methods saved in a file.

I understand why Syringes may be viewed as dirty as when you in-pull and out-pull the syringe in order to bring up the spores into the distilled water, this draws in contaminants from the air which can affect the process.


Sorry, but I have more questions ...

If I were to go for the dirty method for the Psilocybe cyanescens (wavy cap), using syringes... could I begin with:
:
-Establishing the spores into the syringes
-injecting this into a sterilized Rye grain bag in order to begin colonization
-then inject via injection port into a premade sterilized hardwood substrate mix
- ensure moisture level are correct, then wait for fruiting to begin

Thats just for the first specie!

Then if I were to go for the dirty method for the Psilocybe cubensis (any strain), using syringes... could I begin with:
:
-Establishing the spores into the syringes
-injecting this into a sterilized Rye grain bag in order to begin colonization
-then inject via injection port into a premade sterilized manure substrate mix
- ensure moisture level are correct, then wait for fruiting to begin


Any readers, please add or recommend any information or steps to include or alter.

I cant stress enough, I appreciate the dedication and support


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OfflineScouserUK88
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Registered: 07/12/20
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Loc: England Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 3 months
Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: mind.at.large]
    #27008743 - 10/28/20 04:16 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Thank you!!

Funnily enough I had a thought of continuing them outdoor as I found them outdoor and i kept the woodchip and celium that was released from the fruit themselves. The added this to a damp and shaded spot to my garden and have already can seem some minor colonization which I was shocked with.

I will continue them outside and use your method!

Many thanks!


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InvisibleWall.E
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Registered: 06/05/20
Posts: 2,860
Loc: Fungal Void
Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: ScouserUK88]
    #27008745 - 10/28/20 04:17 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Best practice is to first put spores to agar to let the mycelium outgrow any other mold or bacteria that rode along with your cap. From there getting a good culture would be the next advisable thing.

But in the meantime I would check out the woodlovers thread and see what the pros have to say. Use the "search thread" function for grain prep and shit for cyanescens

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24673753/gonew/1#UNREAD

Good luck


--------------------
Life’s shit, but I’m loving it



Edited by Wall.E (10/28/20 04:17 PM)


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OfflineScouserUK88
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Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: mind.at.large]
    #27008747 - 10/28/20 04:18 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

So I have wavy caps ie Psilocybe cyanescens

This method you mentioned using the garden outdoors, is suitable for Psilocybe cyanescens IF the environment is suitable?


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OfflineScouserUK88
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Registered: 07/12/20
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Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: Wall.E]
    #27008756 - 10/28/20 04:22 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Perfect, thank you!

God I love these little beauties, and just talking tek is amazing!


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InvisibleWall.E
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Registered: 06/05/20
Posts: 2,860
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Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: ScouserUK88]
    #27008758 - 10/28/20 04:23 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

ScouserUK88 said:
So I have wavy caps ie Psilocybe cyanescens

This method you mentioned using the garden outdoors, is suitable for Psilocybe cyanescens IF the environment is suitable?




To my knowledge a lot of woodlovers fruit better outdoors than indoors


--------------------
Life’s shit, but I’m loving it



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OfflineScouserUK88
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Registered: 07/12/20
Posts: 8
Loc: England Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 3 months
Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: Wall.E]
    #27008760 - 10/28/20 04:24 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Thank you very much!


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Invisiblemind.at.large
Myconerd


Registered: 12/13/16
Posts: 1,218
Loc: Floating in liquid gardens
Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: mind.at.large]
    #27008762 - 10/28/20 04:25 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Yes, you are correct that spores are inherently dirty, but not just because of pulling in contamination into a syringe. Mushrooms grow in non sterile environments, which inevitably leads to contamination. Cyanescens will most assuredly have been grown outdoors, which means the spore print is probably loaded with contamination. Putting those spores to sterilized grains will just end up contaminating and failing. You should learn agar first, to clean up spores, and then put that to sterilized grains.

Sterilized grains are very contaminate prone and require clean mycelium in order to ensure proper colonization of the desired mycelium. However, BRF/verm cakes are a little more resistant to contamination (not fully) and can handle spore injections somewhat.

What I would recommend you do for cyanescens is:
Quote:

mind.at.large said:
put spores to BRF/verm cakes, wait for colonization, then crumble and spawn to hardwood chips. I usually boil my wood chips for about an hour, drain, let cool, then mix with spawn in a small tub. Once that’s colonized, I’ll build a wood chip bed outside in a shaded spot and mix in the colonized wood chips. Soak it down with water then just wait.





Another option for cyans, assuming you have been finding fresh cyans, is to take the stem butts, and put them on soaked/boiled cardboard. Once the mycelium colonizes the cardboard, put that to wood chips and basically do the rest of what I said above.


--------------------
Mind's Easy Bag 2 Bag Grain Transfers


Endless Sub Tek


...the doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me...


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Invisiblemind.at.large
Myconerd


Registered: 12/13/16
Posts: 1,218
Loc: Floating in liquid gardens
Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: ScouserUK88]
    #27008767 - 10/28/20 04:27 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

ScouserUK88 said:
Funnily enough I had a thought of continuing them outdoor as I found them outdoor and i kept the woodchip and celium that was released from the fruit themselves. The added this to a damp and shaded spot to my garden and have already can seem some minor colonization which I was shocked with.




This is a great way to easily propagate woodlovers! Just keep feeding it wood chips!


--------------------
Mind's Easy Bag 2 Bag Grain Transfers


Endless Sub Tek


...the doll's trying to kill me and the toaster's been laughing at me...


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OfflineScouserUK88
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Registered: 07/12/20
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Re: P.Cyanescens & P.Cubensis [Re: mind.at.large]
    #27008794 - 10/28/20 04:44 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Honestly, I am chuffed with the information!

I will certainly keep this thread posted on progress!

Many thanks Brother


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