|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do.
#26988098 - 10/16/20 09:11 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
The Government does not have the right to tell you what you can and can't put in your own body... Nor do they have the right to force you to wear a seltbelt, mask or compell you to speak to them, or show ID. No one has a higher moral authority over your life than you, but you do not have the right or moral authority to use Government to use arbitrary violence to push your will...
In other words, FUCK THE GOVERNMENT!!! Fuck Derp Jerp Terp, and fuck the rest of them... Their "Authority" is FICTIONAL, and they are nothing more than a protection racket for the Corporate Oligarchy that controls the World for resources and profits.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Kryptos
Stranger

Registered: 11/01/14
Posts: 12,262
Last seen: 56 minutes, 30 seconds
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 3
#26988108 - 10/16/20 09:16 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
If the government has no moral authority over my life, then the government cannot stop me from robbing you at gunpoint or killing you, and in fact, cannot take any actions to stop me from doing so, or punish me for doing so.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Kryptos]
#26988137 - 10/16/20 09:38 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Government wouldn't "stop" you anyway. Calling the cops and waiting 20 mins to an hour for them to show isn't going to stop you... You know what will stop you? Metal knuckles, guns, and fold out batons.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26988138 - 10/16/20 09:40 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
IE- What the cops use after the fact, when the crime has already been committed.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Kryptos
Stranger

Registered: 11/01/14
Posts: 12,262
Last seen: 56 minutes, 30 seconds
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 2
#26988139 - 10/16/20 09:42 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Under your premise, cops should not exist. Neither should the military.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Kryptos]
#26988142 - 10/16/20 09:46 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Indeed. The military is just the strong arm of the NWO. The Military-industrial complex is about making money... People are not all too different regardless of what arbitrary lines on the map they were born within. The Military has done nothing but forced banana republics, helped the oil industry and Halliburton with middle eastern domination... Even Vietnam was a fucked up war where we burned citizens homes and sprayed toxic chemicals on them AND our own troops, causing birth defects to this day... Tell me Kronos, how do you rectify support of such inhumane and endless violence that is the State?
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Sulfurshelfsean
Defender of Cubes


Registered: 07/29/10
Posts: 3,942
Last seen: 1 hour, 57 minutes
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Kryptos] 1
#26988146 - 10/16/20 09:49 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Youre right to an extent. Thats why its a social contract. We work and pay in for the protection. If the entity we the people have the contract with abuses that power or becomes corrupt, thays a different story.
--------------------
   Everything is better when it is done ON TOP OF A MOUNTAIN!
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Sulfurshelfsean]
#26988152 - 10/16/20 09:54 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Contracts by definition require consent. Forced contracts or contracts done under duress are not voluntary or consensual, therefore logically, there is no social contract.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Kryptos
Stranger

Registered: 11/01/14
Posts: 12,262
Last seen: 56 minutes, 30 seconds
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 2
#26988335 - 10/16/20 12:17 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Again, assuming no social contract, there is nothing stopping me from killing you. As a matter of fact, you bring up a number of good reasons *for* breaking into your house and shooting you in the middle of the night.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Kryptos]
#26988404 - 10/16/20 12:56 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Kryptos said: Again, assuming no social contract, there is nothing stopping me from killing you. As a matter of fact, you bring up a number of good reasons *for* breaking into your house and shooting you in the middle of the night.
Real nice, letting a political discussion dissolve into threats. As an observation, it is extremely telling that the State (and its' propagandists) can't defend their views with logic and therefore immediately resort to violence and threats of violence. Not much different than a protection racket like the Italian Mafia... You, sir, have proven my point exactly.
“Since mankind's dawn, a handful of oppressors have accepted the responsibility over our lives that we should have accepted for ourselves. By doing so, they took our power. By doing nothing, we gave it away. We've seen where their way leads, through camps and wars, towards the slaughterhouse.” ― Alan Moore, V for Vendetta
"The Individual has a soul, but as the state is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence".~Mahatma Ghandi
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
Edited by STPLSD25 (10/16/20 01:06 PM)
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26988407 - 10/16/20 12:59 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Falcon91Wolvrn03
Stranger



Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 32,557
Loc: California, US
Last seen: 4 months, 21 days
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26988429 - 10/16/20 01:06 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: Real nice, letting a political discussion dissolve into threats. You've admitted you're a State Propagandist so there is really no reason to carry on this conversation. But as an observation, it is extremely telling that the State (and its' propagandists) can't defend their views with logic and therefore immediately resort to violence and threats of violence.
I think you missed his point. He wasn't threatening you, he was explaining why we need laws to help ensure people DON'T rob and kill you.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#26988437 - 10/16/20 01:10 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
people rob and kill anyway, even though it's against the law... Just like people do drugs even though they're against the law. Laws do not change behaviors, and cops don't show up until after a crime has been committed. I am from New York... I understand there are "bad" people out there... But the thing is 95% are not robbing, raping and murdering people, and the other 5% are gang members (which make money SOLELY from the Drug wars, and other prohibited markets) and COPS who do MOST of the killing, especially the inhumane senseless killing. Robbing also, they have civil asset forfeiture laws where they can STEAL your property without proving you guilty of anything! These excuses are just nonsense when it comes to justifying giving one group of men the "authority" to kill, steal, rob, rape, exploit, kidnap etc etc.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
Edited by STPLSD25 (10/16/20 01:12 PM)
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26988444 - 10/16/20 01:14 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
And anyway, his argument was sort of nonsensical anyway because there's no much worse of a punishment than instant death. I'm sure most people would pick 5 years in a jail than instant death.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Tulipslave
Homo sapiens sapiens, lol

Registered: 07/25/17
Posts: 11,109
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 2
#26988450 - 10/16/20 01:18 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: And anyway, his argument was sort of nonsensical anyway because there's no much worse of a punishment than instant death. I'm sure most people would pick 5 years in a jail than instant death.
You should assess and reassess what you are sure of.
Sounds like you live in a very black-and-white world.
|
Falcon91Wolvrn03
Stranger



Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 32,557
Loc: California, US
Last seen: 4 months, 21 days
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 1
#26988458 - 10/16/20 01:25 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: Laws do not change behaviors...
I disagree. If I see a lot of people who live in the rich part of town are gangsters because there are no laws against it, I might be tempted to become a gangster myself so I can live in the rich part of town too.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Tulipslave]
#26988473 - 10/16/20 01:33 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
No, I live in the real world. Revolving door prisons of murderers, rapists and, petty drug users does not help the situation. In fact, they cause a lot of these problems they then convince you that you need their protection to protect you from. Alcohol prohibition created Alcohol Gangs, such as that of the notorious Al Capone... Just as drug prohibition created people like Pablo Escabar... But instead of admitting to their failure, they double down and say the problem is that we dont have a 100 ft wall around the country to protect you from from these big scary cartels, who Government basically funnels money, and sells guns to...
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
Edited by STPLSD25 (10/16/20 01:35 PM)
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26988483 - 10/16/20 01:38 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
We created Al Qaeda too... Bin Laden was a CIA asset , who was funded by our government from the 80's till about 1992...
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Falcon91Wolvrn03
Stranger



Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 32,557
Loc: California, US
Last seen: 4 months, 21 days
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 1
#26988513 - 10/16/20 01:52 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: No, I live in the real world. Revolving door prisons of murderers, rapists and, petty drug users does not help the situation. In fact, they cause a lot of these problems they then convince you that you need their protection to protect you from. Alcohol prohibition created Alcohol Gangs, such as that of the notorious Al Capone... Just as drug prohibition created people like Pablo Escabar... But instead of admitting to their failure, they double down and say the problem is that we dont have a 100 ft wall around the country to protect you from from these big scary cartels, who Government basically funnels money, and sells guns to... . . . We created Al Qaeda too... Bin Laden was a CIA asset , who was funded by our government from the 80's till about 1992...
I agree with every point you just made (except that YOU live in the real world, implying anyone who disagrees doesn't). I'm against drug/alcohol prohibition too, I think our prison system is totally corrupt, and I know we helped religious extremists in Afghanistan. But I think that's a lot different from saying if you steal or kill, the Government shouldn't do anything.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] 1
#26988529 - 10/16/20 02:00 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
That was a reply to the gentleman before you about living "in a black and white world," it was not my intention to subjugate others. And to your last point, I don't think the Government should exist to do anything, but on a communal level, I think people should and would do something. People aren't going to want a murderous, robbing house thief living in their neighborhood, or even city. The "wild west" actually had less murders per capita than we do today... So, it really wasn't all too "wild" when everyone took measures to defend themselves.It's scary, because as humans we want security, but imho it is more scary to continue to give the government the authority to do all the things we are afraid of happening... Including robbery, rape, theft, exploitation, forced labor, (prisons)and murder... I do believe we can adapt to find better means.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
Edited by STPLSD25 (10/16/20 02:02 PM)
|
Nonagon Infinity
Mycologist



Registered: 06/02/20
Posts: 756
Loc: Polygondwanaland
Last seen: 2 years, 11 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 1
#26988647 - 10/16/20 03:04 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
I agree that the state has a monopoly on violence, and I think that's a problem. However, I think comparing our present situation to the wild west is leaving out a lot of significant details. For example, assault rifles weren't available back in the wild west, making a mass shooting in a church, school, or theater far less likely to occur. My point is: the government isn't the only thing that changed over the years when it comes to violence.
-------------------- Nonagon Infinity Opens the Door
|
Psilynut2
Stranger

Registered: 04/28/17
Posts: 5,120
Last seen: 8 hours, 48 minutes
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26988650 - 10/16/20 03:05 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
If there are no police how will you go on vacation ? Are your neighbors going to shoot people for you ?
Edited by Psilynut2 (10/16/20 03:28 PM)
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Psilynut2]
#26988744 - 10/16/20 04:01 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
My neighbors probably would. But, there are other means of home defense as well, including cameras and in NY, they fence off closed stores anyway...It's more efficient then the cops evidentially in actually STOPPING the crime from occurring in the first place.
It seems like you guys don't really know what cops actually do.. You seem to be accepting the fictionalization that they're just out catching bad people... No, they are out harassing,arresting, raping and stealing from people over drug use... America has the most overcrowded prisons in the entire world.. HALF of the ENTIRE WORLDS prison population- and over half of those individuals are nonviolent drug users like all of you.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26988751 - 10/16/20 04:04 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
IE
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Kryptos
Stranger

Registered: 11/01/14
Posts: 12,262
Last seen: 56 minutes, 30 seconds
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26988767 - 10/16/20 04:12 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
I was just thinking...in a society with no social contract, there would be no laws against booby traps. We would be one stray cat poking around in one very overprotective individual's house while they're away from your city block turning into Baghdad.
|
Psilynut2
Stranger

Registered: 04/28/17
Posts: 5,120
Last seen: 8 hours, 48 minutes
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26988773 - 10/16/20 04:14 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
It seems like you guys don't really know what cops actually do.. You seem to be accepting the fictionalization that they're just out catching bad people...
There’s plenty of video evidence to support that they are .
|
Psilynut2
Stranger

Registered: 04/28/17
Posts: 5,120
Last seen: 8 hours, 48 minutes
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Psilynut2]
#26988806 - 10/16/20 04:26 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
But, there are other means of home defense as well, including cameras and in NY, they fence off closed stores anyway...It's more efficient then the cops evidentially in actually STOPPING the crime from occurring in the first place.
Those things only work because it’s slows criminals down long enough for cops to show up . If no one comes what’s to stop me ? I have shit in my garage that will easily cut a hole in that door . I have battery powered shit that will make that door irrelevant.
|
Tulipslave
Homo sapiens sapiens, lol

Registered: 07/25/17
Posts: 11,109
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 3
#26988840 - 10/16/20 04:45 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: My neighbors probably would. But, there are other means of home defense as well, including cameras and in NY, they fence off closed stores anyway...It's more efficient then the cops evidentially in actually STOPPING the crime from occurring in the first place.
It seems like you guys don't really know what cops actually do.. You seem to be accepting the fictionalization that they're just out catching bad people... No, they are out harassing,arresting, raping and stealing from people over drug use... America has the most overcrowded prisons in the entire world.. HALF of the ENTIRE WORLDS prison population- and over half of those individuals are nonviolent drug users like all of you.
You don't seem to understand the function of police in this country. Police aren't here to " stop crimes.". Rather they function as the enforcers of the judicial side. They facilitate and maintain the system as courts see fit.
Protect and serve is a myth that a minority of departments actually believe in or strive for. Not far-off from the myth of *pulling up your bootstraps." It's propaganda.
Channel your anger and frustration in less directions and in a more productive manner than spouting generalized anti-government buzz-phrases any college sophomore may be rattling off.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Tulipslave]
#26988901 - 10/16/20 05:23 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Avtually, no, because I had a friend whose house got robbed in NY, and the cops didn't want to do a damn thing. So, they're not some heroes running around stopping crimes. As a matter of fact, whereas you show 1 video of cops allegedly catching the bad guy, there are COUNTLESS videos of cops killing innocent, including mentally ill 16 year olds for having a knife.. Besides that, any teenager or black person who lives south of the mason dixon line can tell you cops spend their days harassing them for drugs, searching their cars and persons, and exercising their fictional "Authority" arbitrarily
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Tulipslave
Homo sapiens sapiens, lol

Registered: 07/25/17
Posts: 11,109
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 1
#26988903 - 10/16/20 05:27 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: Avtually, no, because I had a friend whose house got robbed in NY, and the cops didn't want to do a damn thing. So, they're not some heroes running around stopping crimes. As a matter of fact, whereas you show 1 video of cops allegedly catching the bad guy, there are COUNTLESS videos of cops killing innocent, including mentally ill 16 year olds for having a knife.. Besides that, any teenager or black person who lives south of the mason dixon line can tell youd cops spend their days harassing them for drugs, searching their cars and persons, and exercising their fictional "Authority" arbitrarily
Please re-read my words, as you did not understand them if this was your reply.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Tulipslave]
#26989659 - 10/17/20 07:03 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Idk how that replied to you, I was talking to the poster just before you. Government is a violent mafia, therefore it is only appropriate to take Government as a whole, not break it into tyrannical sections. The Police only enforce the arbitrary will of the State for money... We all need money to survive, and many times cops think they're doing the right thing... In other words, cops are victims of the Capitalist power structure like all of us are.. It is politicians and Government who pass laws, like the Drug War, which are solely made to go after dissidents and make the Prison industrial complex loads of money. There are structural problems that can't be resolved through police reform or "changing it from the inside." As long as prison labor is cheaper than free labor, the drug war, and by extension, our over populated revolving door prisons will exist. Furthermore, any time you give one group of men the "authority" to kill, steal, rape, rob, extort and kidnap, you can bet dollars to donuts they will abuse that power. That is to say, the Government is the problem.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Tulipslave]
#26989674 - 10/17/20 07:19 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Tulipslave said:
Please re-read my words, as you did not understand them if this was your reply.
Tulip... In your opinion,how does Government take an immoral action and turn it into a moral one?
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Tulipslave
Homo sapiens sapiens, lol

Registered: 07/25/17
Posts: 11,109
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 1
#26989730 - 10/17/20 08:32 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said:
Quote:
Tulipslave said:
Please re-read my words, as you did not understand them if this was your reply.
Tulip... In your opinion,how does Government take an immoral action and turn it into a moral one?
I don't hold delusions over inherent morality and right\wrong. Morality is up to the individual to figure out for themselves. "What's right with one is wrong with another" - Pete Seeger, "All Mixed Up"
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Tulipslave]
#26990288 - 10/17/20 04:05 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
But you would likely agree murder, rape and, theft are immoral, and presumably don't practice them (since you're here talking to me..) So if it is immoral as an individual, how is it okay to vote for people to institute such oppression?
I think your answer is really more of a deflection than an answer. I thought you would use a typical "Greater Good" excuse or something, but instead you just say there's no such thing as morality. There is a general consensus though of what is moral, immoral and even amoral, the people who have different opinions are probably the sociopaths you are all so scared of, you put them in charge to protect you from them... Yeeeaaaahhhhh, and you accuse ME of "delusions."
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Nonagon Infinity
Mycologist



Registered: 06/02/20
Posts: 756
Loc: Polygondwanaland
Last seen: 2 years, 11 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 2
#26990396 - 10/17/20 05:27 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: but instead you just say there's no such thing as morality.
I don't think that's a very fair representation of Tulip's argument.
He didn't argue that "there is no such thing as morality." He said that morality is up to the individual to figure out for themselves. In other words: he's arguing for the case that morality is subjective, rather than objective. Subjective morality is a significantly less controversial position, philosophically, than the absurd claim that morality doesn't exist.
-------------------- Nonagon Infinity Opens the Door
|
Kyngwhatt
presbyter


Registered: 02/05/20
Posts: 272
Loc: The pharcyde
Last seen: 2 years, 11 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 1
#26996440 - 10/21/20 01:42 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
if you don't know about Mark Passio he advocates for natural law and the end of slavery, exactly what you are talking about i agree with you 100 percent.check his lectures out and his website at whatonearthishappening.com
love and respect
--------------------
Whatt
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Nonagon Infinity]
#26999462 - 10/23/20 10:45 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Nonagon Infinity said:
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: but instead you just say there's no such thing as morality.
I don't think that's a very fair representation of Tulip's argument.
He didn't argue that "there is no such thing as morality." He said that morality is up to the individual to figure out for themselves. In other words: he's arguing for the case that morality is subjective, rather than objective. Subjective morality is a significantly less controversial position, philosophically, than the absurd claim that morality doesn't exist.
I apologize if I misrepresented his argument. Perhaps I was a bit too black-and-white. But my counter-argument still stands that there is a general consensus of morality... Just because some sociopath might think rape and murder is okay, doesn't mean the general public will or does. My solution to revolving door prisons is instant death for the active perpetrators in violent crimes and the abolishment of nonviolent "crimes" (Drug crimes and silly laws to extort money)and I think this would actually build a far safer society than giving one group of men the authority to kill, steal, rape and hope they can "solve" the crime after it occurred, while also making people wear their seatbelt, harassing teens and blacks to find drugs, fill the prisons for the prison industrial complex etc etc etc...
The thing is, we've tried things the Governments way, and it has been an utter failure.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Psilynut2
Stranger

Registered: 04/28/17
Posts: 5,120
Last seen: 8 hours, 48 minutes
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 1
#26999515 - 10/23/20 11:07 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Making people wear their seatbelts saves lives . It will keep you from leaving your vehicle and flying into mine like a ballistic missile . The seatbelt thing hasn’t been a failure at all . Can you demonstrate how it has ?
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Psilynut2]
#26999534 - 10/23/20 11:16 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Freedom doesn't mean you're only "free" to make good decisions. That's not really freedom. You're only free if you're free to make all choices, even bad ones. Pulling people over ticketing them (many times leading to illegal searches or other harassment) isn't what makes people wear their seatbelt. Yes, wearing your seatbelt is a good healthy choice... Just as not doing drugs or smoking cigarettes, but freedom is the ability of one to decide for themselves what to put in their body, and also safety measures they wish to employ to protect their bodies.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26999545 - 10/23/20 11:22 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
I don't want to go flying into your car anymore than you want me to, but Government can't protect people from themselves. People still don't wear seatbelts, even with the threat of extortion, and many government agents get away with it anyway. I saw it firsthand when my cousin who is in the Coastguard got out of a seatbelt ticket in NYC just because she worked for the Government. Hell, police cars have no seatbelts in the back seats, and neither do school buses... So I have examples now of Government forcing you not to protect yourself with seatbelts... You don't have a choice but to ride in a cop car, so you have no choice to wear a seatbelt.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Psilynut2
Stranger

Registered: 04/28/17
Posts: 5,120
Last seen: 8 hours, 48 minutes
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26999596 - 10/23/20 11:57 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Hell, police cars have no seatbelts in the back seats, and neither do school buses... So I have examples now of Government forcing you not to protect yourself with seatbelts... You don't have a choice but to ride in a cop car, so you have no choice to wear a seatbelt.
Allot of states don’t require adults to wear seatbelts in the back . Why would want it in the police car if the law doesn’t require it ? Isn’t that kinda what you want ? I’m not even sure what your mad about but I recognize the irony of being pulled over for not wearing a seatbelt and then going to jail over a drug warrant , in the back of a cop car unbelted . That would be annoying it’s not a good reason to adopt anarchy though .
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Psilynut2]
#26999623 - 10/23/20 12:14 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
No, I understand that what's legal is not always moral or right and visa versa. What if someone wants to wear a seatbelt in the back seat? Cops also arrest kids in schools and stuff, because that's the system we have now, I doubt they have special police cars for that.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#26999626 - 10/23/20 12:17 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
I want people to be free to make their own choices, not to follow their masters will to the T, you are misrepresenting my views now, as your own. I don't want redundant laws. I don't want a Mommy Government as Liberals do and I don't want a Daddy Government like Republicans do. All Government infringes on freedom and creates the same type of criminal empire you're all so afraid of Anarchy creating.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,494
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 4
#27000031 - 10/23/20 04:24 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: Freedom doesn't mean you're only "free" to make good decisions. That's not really freedom. You're only free if you're free to make all choices, even bad ones.
Whose freedom are we talking about? Yours? If that's all we're worried about, then it's easy. If, however, we're talking about maximizing freedom for everyone, then you're going to have to have a little less freedom. This is true, because your freedom to murder me is in direct contradiction to my freedom not to be murdered by you.
That's the purpose of law. It isn't to restrict freedom. It is to maximize freedom for everyone. Now, we can argue that some laws fail to do that and/or have the opposite effect, but to make blanket statements that drug laws or traffic laws are a restriction on freedom isn't necessarily useful. Any specific law may or may not result in an overall increase or decrease in freedom, but you can't really support the notion that every drug law or every traffic law does.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,494
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Psilynut2]
#27000035 - 10/23/20 04:26 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Psilynut2 said:
Quote:
Hell, police cars have no seatbelts in the back seats, and neither do school buses... So I have examples now of Government forcing you not to protect yourself with seatbelts... You don't have a choice but to ride in a cop car, so you have no choice to wear a seatbelt.
Allot of states don’t require adults to wear seatbelts in the back . Why would want it in the police car if the law doesn’t require it ? Isn’t that kinda what you want ? I’m not even sure what your mad about but I recognize the irony of being pulled over for not wearing a seatbelt and then going to jail over a drug warrant , in the back of a cop car unbelted . That would be annoying it’s not a good reason to adopt anarchy though .
Every police car I ever had the misfortune of riding in had belts and shoulder straps in the back, and the officers always buckled me in.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Enlil]
#27000239 - 10/23/20 06:38 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
So. let's give one group of men the "authority" to rape, kidnap, kill and steal so that people don't rape, kidnap, kill and steal. Sound logic there.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Ezuma
Gontish Wizard



Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 8,423
Loc: Roke
Last seen: 10 months, 20 days
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 1
#27000252 - 10/23/20 06:44 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: So. let's give one group of men the "authority" to rape, kidnap, kill and steal so that people don't rape, kidnap, kill and steal. Sound logic there.
at least in theory, that's not how its supposed to work. While there's been some level of corruption (often extensive) in any government we've conceived, I think Enlil's point stands that in order to have ensure some level of freedom, we need to suppress certain behaviors.
The fact we haven't realized a perfect system doesn't mean we have to throw up our hands and say "OK, freedom now just means whoever has the most guns (produced under the previous stable system) gets to live
In order to do that you will need some level of government -although you don't necessarily need a state- but in my opinion, even if we had anarchy, we would still have governments.
It's absurd to think that you could have billions of humans living without government. Not only would it not work, it isn't even possible, humans will form governments, if left to their own devices. That is after all, how this all started
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27000254 - 10/23/20 06:46 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Every drug law does indeed infringe on your freedom. The greater good is a poor excuse when so many are victimized over nonviolent "crimes."
The Government does not and can not protect people from themselves, again, laws do not change behavior... Do you know a single person that said "No, I can't hit that joint! It's against the law!!!" No? Well, rapists and murderers don't think that way either. People sick enough to perpetrate violent acts will do it with or without a law against it, just like drug users.
Calling the cops and waiting 20 minutes to an hour, is not going to protect you from bad people... And certainly, bad people (Government) wont defend you from bad people... Cops usually escalate violence, if and when they finally show up..
Besides that, the actual definition of terrorism is UNOFFICIAL political violence, but OFFICIAL political violence, well, that's just A-OK
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,494
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 2
#27000277 - 10/23/20 07:02 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: So. let's give one group of men the "authority" to rape, kidnap, kill and steal so that people don't rape, kidnap, kill and steal. Sound logic there.
Sounds like shit you're making up.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Ezuma]
#27000302 - 10/23/20 07:12 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Ezuma said:
It's absurd to think that you could have billions of humans living without government. Not only would it not work, it isn't even possible, humans will form governments, if left to their own devices. That is after all, how this all started
I've travelled extensively throughout the country, and I have never once required a cop to do business or interact with anyone, including in NYC.. Now, I did walk in on a burglary, by myself. The cops were already called (by my friends who owned the place.) I walk in- no weapons, I think I maybe grabbed something little like a wood stick. I yell in "Who's in there?" this guys comes out with his hands up and says "My name's Danny" barefoot, he had kicked the back door in.. Had TV's and everything stashed around the side of the house. (which I find out later.) Anyway, I tell him to wait that the cops were on their way, and although he looked like he wanted to run, he didn't... I kept him there.. Anyway, cops get there, and do nothing at all about it. Turned out the guy worked for the slumlord/landlord, and the cops were powerless to do anything because of that. I have many more stories like that in NY, where a weapon would've protected me a million more than the cops, who do virtually nothing.
We are beyond needing people to rule us. Anarchy is the next step in the evolution of man. It's scare tactics to say that it would be worse.. "But without Government, who would break into the homes of EMT's and murder them?"
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Enlil]
#27000317 - 10/23/20 07:22 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
STPLSD25 said: So. let's give one group of men the "authority" to rape, kidnap, kill and steal so that people don't rape, kidnap, kill and steal. Sound logic there.
Sounds like shit you're making up.
It'd really be nice if I was making it up, but no... Cops have stuck fingers in girls assholes looking for marijuana... That's rape.. Cops shot Breonna Taylor... And Devin Guildford... and sooo many others.. They steal under civil forfeiture laws, where if they so much as suspect property has been used in a crime they can steal it for their department. They stolen money that people have got from their parents to put a down payment on a house. You can be ignorant to what's going on if you want but don't accuse me of lying or "making shit up." Again, I'm from New York... Word is bond.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,494
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27000327 - 10/23/20 07:27 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
You're just talking nonsense rhetoric though. When you are hyperbolic like that, you lose credibility.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Enlil]
#27000344 - 10/23/20 07:35 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
It was exaggerated by any means, it was literal. No hyperbole. I'm sure if some guy stuck a finger in your ass you would call it rape to.. Non consensual sexual contact is rape. It's only that people like you make exceptions for them (being government.) That's only one case btw, there's other actual cases of rape by police, and some truly disgusting ones.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,494
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27000350 - 10/23/20 07:36 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Yeah, just bullshit. I'll save the energy for discussions with more rational people.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
Mycolorado
Hobbyist


Registered: 07/23/16
Posts: 8,529
Loc: Interdimensional Bootcamp
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27000351 - 10/23/20 07:36 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Wouldn’t all rapes be considered disgusting acts? 🧐
|
Ezuma
Gontish Wizard



Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 8,423
Loc: Roke
Last seen: 10 months, 20 days
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 1
#27000353 - 10/23/20 07:38 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said:
Quote:
Ezuma said:
It's absurd to think that you could have billions of humans living without government. Not only would it not work, it isn't even possible, humans will form governments, if left to their own devices. That is after all, how this all started
I've travelled extensively throughout the country, and I have never once required a cop to do business or interact with anyone, including in NYC.. Now, I did walk in on a burglary, by myself. The cops were already called (by my friends who owned the place.) I walk in- no weapons, I think I maybe grabbed something little like a wood stick. I yell in "Who's in there?" this guys comes out with his hands up and says "My name's Danny" barefoot, he had kicked the back door in.. Had TV's and everything stashed around the side of the house. (which I find out later.) Anyway, I tell him to wait that the cops were on their way, and although he looked like he wanted to run, he didn't... I kept him there.. Anyway, cops get there, and do nothing at all about it. Turned out the guy worked for the slumlord/landlord, and the cops were powerless to do anything because of that. I have many more stories like that in NY, where a weapon would've protected me a million more than the cops, who do virtually nothing.
We are beyond needing people to rule us. Anarchy is the next step in the evolution of man. It's scare tactics to say that it would be worse.. "But without Government, who would break into the homes of EMT's and murder them?"
I didn't say anything about cops or their effectiveness.
The social order maintained in part by government direction is a more subtle thing than simply being limited to the physical force exerted by officers. The very fact we have roads, health and safety standards, regulated electrics, public utilities, hospitals... so many aspects of society work to establish and maintain a semblance of order, beyond coercion and violence. Again, I didn't say we need the current version of states in order to have civilization, but I do think, no matter what political ideology is espoused, people will form governments, of some form (this is necessary on some level, whether its local governments in a broader coalition of self-determining counties or a top-down state, there will always be governments.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27000370 - 10/23/20 07:51 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
I see why you're so offended now, Enlil,you make your living off the law and all.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,494
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27000373 - 10/23/20 07:52 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Offended? Bored, maybe.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Ezuma]
#27000386 - 10/23/20 08:04 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Local and tribal hierarchies though are usually based on things like merit and courage, and people function better in smaller tribal settings. I don't know if that really represents a Government as we know them today.. That is to say, I think in a small tribal classless area a "Government" is possible, but being that Government today means taking the hard earned money of 313 million people and using that money to control and extort them... That Government, does not work.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Enlil]
#27000387 - 10/23/20 08:07 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Enlil said: Offended? Bored, maybe.
Oh, come on! Usually someone trying to put you out of a job is going to offend you. It's nothing personal though, I just see the State for the violent mafia it is.
“To be GOVERNED is to be watched, inspected, spied upon, directed, law-driven, numbered, regulated, enrolled, indoctrinated, preached at, controlled, checked, estimated, valued, censured, commanded, by creatures who have neither the right nor the wisdom nor the virtue to do so. To be GOVERNED is to be at every operation, at every transaction noted, registered, counted, taxed, stamped, measured, numbered, assessed, licensed, authorized, admonished, prevented, forbidden, reformed, corrected, punished. It is, under pretext of public utility, and in the name of the general interest, to be placed under contribution, drilled, fleeced, exploited, monopolized, extorted from, squeezed, hoaxed, robbed; then, at the slightest resistance, the first word of complaint, to be repressed, fined, vilified, harassed, hunted down, abused, clubbed, disarmed, bound, choked, imprisoned, judged, condemned, shot, deported, sacrificed, sold, betrayed; and to crown all, mocked, ridiculed, derided, outraged, dishonored. That is government; that is its justice; that is its morality.” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Mycolorado
Hobbyist


Registered: 07/23/16
Posts: 8,529
Loc: Interdimensional Bootcamp
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27000396 - 10/23/20 08:13 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
If one is wronged in an anarchist society do they have the right to wrong the wronger?
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,494
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Mycolorado]
#27000599 - 10/23/20 10:39 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
In an anarchist society, might is right.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
Psilynut2
Stranger

Registered: 04/28/17
Posts: 5,120
Last seen: 8 hours, 48 minutes
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Enlil] 1
#27000635 - 10/23/20 11:07 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Every police car I ever had the misfortune of riding in had belts and shoulder straps in the back, and the officers always buckled me in.
I was arrested by the Border Patrol once with a half pound of weed in NM . They let me ride in the front , buckled of course , due to a skin condition I suppose . It was about a month after Gary Jonson became governor on a legalize weed platform . It was cool I was in the front , I was able to look the guy right in the eye when I told him the public didn’t support what he was doing to me .
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Enlil]
#27000865 - 10/24/20 07:00 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Enlil said: In an anarchist society, might is right.
This is utter assumptions and scare tactics from a person who readily ignores rape, theft and, murder when it's perpetrated by police officers. Right now, might is right... Or rather, "Authority" is right... If you're a cop you can be the most psychotic sociopath you wish, and your worse possible punishment is losing your job. You wont go to jail, you wont be killed, you wont be hung in the street by disgusted people... Don't listen to Enlil, if the Government goes away, so does his funding...
“Anarchists did not try to carry out genocide against the Armenians in Turkey; they did not deliberately starve millions of Ukrainians; they did not create a system of death camps to kill Jews, gypsies, and Slavs in Europe; they did not fire-bomb scores of large German and Japanese cities and drop nuclear bombs on two of them; they did not carry out a ‘Great Leap Forward’ that killed scores of millions of Chinese; they did not attempt to kill everybody with any appreciable education in Cambodia; they did not launch one aggressive war after another; they did not implement trade sanctions that killed perhaps 500,000 Iraqi children.
In debates between anarchists and statists, the burden of proof clearly should rest on those who place their trust in the state. Anarchy’s mayhem is wholly conjectural; the state’s mayhem is undeniably, factually horrendous.” ― Robert Higgs
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27000892 - 10/24/20 07:31 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Mycolorado
Hobbyist


Registered: 07/23/16
Posts: 8,529
Loc: Interdimensional Bootcamp
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27000913 - 10/24/20 07:58 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Are you not answering my questions because you don’t know the answers or what? And why do you keep making baseless accusations about what others believe and feel? I put this all in bold so you’d know how serious and enraged I am.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Mycolorado]
#27000919 - 10/24/20 08:06 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Mycolorado said: Are you not answering my questions because you don’t know the answers or what? And why do you keep making baseless accusations about what others believe and feel? I put this all in bold so you’d know how serious and enraged I am.
I didn't answer your question because I am not an Authority on Anarchy and you didn't give me an exact scenario which makes me think you are just trying to vilify my views. Did this person use violence or force on you? Sure, you can do what you want, but there will be natural repercussions and consequences if you kill or use violence on someone because they say something you don't like on FB. Besides that, if everyone takes measures to defend themselves, you run the risk of getting shot, so retaliatory violence runs you that risk... Better be worth it...
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
Mycolorado
Hobbyist


Registered: 07/23/16
Posts: 8,529
Loc: Interdimensional Bootcamp
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 1
#27000934 - 10/24/20 08:17 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
I’m not trying to vilify your view, I’m trying to understand how you think anarchy works when it comes to individuals’ rights and used wronging as the scenario but was actually referring to crime. I guess that was too vague and should have specified whether I was referring to chauvinistic, economic or violent crime. Furthermore, I guess I was actually wondering about the rights of all individuals in scenarios and whether or not their rights would be infringed upon in some way depending on the outcome of say mitigation or arbitration by a publicly comprised tribunal.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Mycolorado]
#27000943 - 10/24/20 08:25 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Mycolorado said: I’m not trying to vilify your view, I’m trying to understand how you think anarchy works when it comes to individuals’ rights and used wronging as the scenario but was actually referring to crime. I guess that was too vague and should have specified whether I was referring to chauvinistic, economic or violent crime. Furthermore, I guess I was actually wondering about the rights of all individuals in scenarios and whether or not their rights would be infringed upon in some way depending on the outcome of say mitigation or arbitration by a publicly comprised tribunal.
People can seek retribution for anything, they already can... Me and my fiance got all types of threats over a video I made blowing my nose on the US flag... Anarchy isn't going to stop sick people from being sick.. But, if someone is shot in a violent act, they're not being sent to prison where they'll be out in 5 years to victimize again... Instant Death is more of a deterrent than revolving door prisons where murderers and rapists are fed and taken care of. Not to mention that over half of our prisoners are nonviolent drug users, who didn't hurt anyone.. That is individual rights being infringed upon by Government..I don't think mass hysteria would be the problem in was when mankind was still ignorant and stupid, in the 1800's... People wont be hanging witches or anything, society has changed and our morality has changed.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
Edited by STPLSD25 (10/24/20 08:26 AM)
|
Borne
Consulting Occultist


Registered: 09/20/20
Posts: 1
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Kryptos] 1
#27001001 - 10/24/20 09:06 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
I'm willing to say that a formal government degrades the social contract. Without government, that contract is made directly with your neighbors, but under government it's optional, since you're born into state bondage and the contract with the state is forced upon you.
Without the state, it looks like this: A) I do not want to live in fear of violence B) My neighbors don't either C) We agree not to rob, murder, rape, etc. and also to do all within our power to protect the others from outsiders who might rob, murder, rape, etc. (Living example in rural Rwanda, people have a moral obligation to take up the whooping call and to run to aid whenever they hear it. If you don't, everyone becomes suspicious of you. Did you stand to benefit from the crime? Is that why you didn't help?)
Max Stirner wrote about the "union of egoists" being a bunch of folks who recognize themselves as the greatest authority in their own lives, and decided to live near each other because community is more pleasant than hermitage.
If there's a government, they simply tell us not to do bad things or they will hurt us. Some people do bad things anyway, and some of them are found and harmed. This is justice under the state, to visit harm back upon those who do harm.
If one wanted to live in a society where one does murder and rob their neighbors (which sounds unpleasant to me) one could form that society but I don't think many folks would live there, plus if one does murder their neighbors for fun, only one will be left standing, and then that individual doesn't have neighbors anymore, so it's not a society.
I guess my short argument is "Please don't hurt me, I don't want that. In exchange I won't hurt you, and together we can better defend against outside forces that would hurt us, one or all," and it seems sound to me.
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,494
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Borne] 2
#27001012 - 10/24/20 09:17 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
That's a bit simplistic, though. Your formulation of the social contract applies to people here and competent now. The next generation must either be forced into that contract or somehow banished from society. That is, after all, what you call being "born into state bondage."
The social contract, when scaled to a large society, looks exactly like formal government.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
Mycolorado
Hobbyist


Registered: 07/23/16
Posts: 8,529
Loc: Interdimensional Bootcamp
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Enlil]
#27001041 - 10/24/20 09:37 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
But wouldn't an anarchist society still be susceptible to the same ills as any other social construct simply due to the fact that it is comprised of humans which are inherently flawed? You speak of morality, but who's to say the morality of the community isn't in fact flawed? I don't think that mankind was particularly ignorant or stupid in the 1800s (hanging witches actually took place in the previous century and was perpetrated by religious nuts who had the "moral" high ground) but even if they were and were doing something morally reprehensible by today's standards, wouldn't they still be doing what they believed at the time to be morally correct? If so, who's to say that an anarchist society wouldn't be carrying out amoral acts by other's ideas of what is right and wrong? What if those individuals who held different beliefs happen to be a part of said society and are punished for acts considered to be crimes by the majority or other individuals, even something as benign as wearing the color blue? Wouldn't that be an infringement upon an individual's pursuit of freedom and their rights? You keep talking about the government infringing on people's rights and raping them and stealing from them but wouldn't the same issues be possible under an anarchist society? After all, it's the community (we the people) who operate under a shared moral perspective, regardless of whether we elect officials to craft laws to support the greatest possible good or simply act in a way that achieves the same level of good. And if that good is in fact bad, wouldn't that be unjust? My point is, people are imperfect and thus so are their societal structures. It seems that you're envisioning an ideal that simply cannot exist as morality isn't static and an individual's pursuit of freedom might always be in conflict with another's pursuit of freedom. Passing judgement on one's actions, whether by randomly selected tribunal or by publicly elected official or enforcement of the judgement via mutual aid or by organized police is really all the same shit and there will always be people in those roles who don't have any good in mind.
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Enlil]
#27001122 - 10/24/20 11:25 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Enlil said: That's a bit simplistic, though. Your formulation of the social contract applies to people here and competent now. The next generation must either be forced into that contract or somehow banished from society. That is, after all, what you call being "born into state bondage."
The social contract, when scaled to a large society, looks exactly like formal government.
You're still missing the voluntary aspect, which is huge. Another solution to this hypothetical would be the next generation agrees on it's own moral standards. If modern Government was ANYTHING like this, weed would have been legal back in the 1970's when mass protests started against its' prohibition. The type of Government you're defending has no resemblance to the voluntary "governments" of which he speaks, you're talking about forced compliance to the arbitrary will of a few men, not a general consensus of right and wrong.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Mycolorado]
#27001135 - 10/24/20 11:41 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Mycolorado said: But wouldn't an anarchist society still be susceptible to the same ills as any other social construct simply due to the fact that it is comprised of humans which are inherently flawed? You speak of morality, but who's to say the morality of the community isn't in fact flawed? I don't think that mankind was particularly ignorant or stupid in the 1800s (hanging witches actually took place in the previous century and was perpetrated by religious nuts who had the "moral" high ground) but even if they were and were doing something morally reprehensible by today's standards, wouldn't they still be doing what they believed at the time to be morally correct? If so, who's to say that an anarchist society wouldn't be carrying out amoral acts by other's ideas of what is right and wrong? What if those individuals who held different beliefs happen to be a part of said society and are punished for acts considered to be crimes by the majority or other individuals, even something as benign as wearing the color blue? Wouldn't that be an infringement upon an individual's pursuit of freedom and their rights? You keep talking about the government infringing on people's rights and raping them and stealing from them but wouldn't the same issues be possible under an anarchist society? After all, it's the community (we the people) who operate under a shared moral perspective, regardless of whether we elect officials to craft laws to support the greatest possible good or simply act in a way that achieves the same level of good. And if that good is in fact bad, wouldn't that be unjust? My point is, people are imperfect and thus so are their societal structures. It seems that you're envisioning an ideal that simply cannot exist as morality isn't static and an individual's pursuit of freedom might always be in conflict with another's pursuit of freedom. Passing judgement on one's actions, whether by randomly selected tribunal or by publicly elected official or enforcement of the judgement via mutual aid or by organized police is really all the same shit and there will always be people in those roles who don't have any good in mind.
You pose a good and valid question. I have my own opinions on the subject, but I do believe it has been said better than I can...
"Anarchy is no guarantee that some people won’t kill, injure, kidnap, defraud, or steal from others. Government is a guarantee that some will." — Gustave de Molinari
The fact of the matter is, no society or Government can offer you safety, because (short of absolute tyranny) they are not always around to protect you. Indeed, there are bad people out there, but they can be handled better by good armed people on an individual level, than some uniformed group of thugs who come after a crime has been committed, but spend the rest of their time extorting people for the State, and kidnapping people for the Prison industrial complex.
I know that the thought is scary to many of you, but what's far more scary is the violence perpetrated daily by your Government. I mean, the rape of 14 year old BOYS by our troops in Afghanistan, in front of their mothers..The spraying of Agent Orange defoliant in Vietnam, causing birth defects (to this day) on the children of the inhabitants and even our troops children. The burning of homes in Vietnam... The murder of countless Iraqi Citizens... That's just overseas... At home they're starting a school to prison pipeline with cops in the schools, ticketing and arresting children. You have extrajudicial killings now being perpetrated to the DOJ... I mean, think logically about it, what do we have now but a group of rolling thugs running around killing, raping and stealing from people? Do a single one of you actually trust the Government?
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
Edited by STPLSD25 (10/24/20 11:45 AM)
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27001146 - 10/24/20 11:49 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Also, people would group up by their moral principles and the type of community they wish to live in. It's already like that, and it doesn't cause harm on anyone... I know Enlil is worried about the amish puppies but those people are being forced to participate in a capitalist system in which you need green paper to survive... Shh! No one tell him about factory farming (which capitalists do daily to maximize profits) it'll crush him.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
nooneman


Registered: 04/24/09
Posts: 14,555
Loc: Utah
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27001155 - 10/24/20 12:01 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,494
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27001182 - 10/24/20 12:21 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said:
Quote:
Enlil said: That's a bit simplistic, though. Your formulation of the social contract applies to people here and competent now. The next generation must either be forced into that contract or somehow banished from society. That is, after all, what you call being "born into state bondage."
The social contract, when scaled to a large society, looks exactly like formal government.
You're still missing the voluntary aspect, which is huge.
No, you're missing it. To the extent it's voluntary, some will opt out. Those people will need to be dealt with by force. The alternative is to have people exempt from the rules wreaking havoc to those who are following the rules.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Enlil]
#27004179 - 10/26/20 08:47 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
STPLSD25 said:
Quote:
Enlil said: That's a bit simplistic, though. Your formulation of the social contract applies to people here and competent now. The next generation must either be forced into that contract or somehow banished from society. That is, after all, what you call being "born into state bondage."
The social contract, when scaled to a large society, looks exactly like formal government.
You're still missing the voluntary aspect, which is huge.
No, you're missing it. To the extent it's voluntary, some will opt out. Those people will need to be dealt with by force. The alternative is to have people exempt from the rules wreaking havoc to those who are following the rules.
Sooo, let me get this straight... You're afraid of Anarchy because you think it will lead to exactly what we have now? Uhhh ok...
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: nooneman]
#27004186 - 10/26/20 08:53 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
nooneman said: OP getting pulled over:
"Sovereign Citizen" isn't a thing. THE UNITED STATES corporation decided long ago to call it's employees "citizens." Once you say "I'm a citizen" you're saying you're an employee of the UNITED STATES corporation.. That's why they have a PRESIDENT... Companies have presidents...
In other words, THE UNITED STATES is a corporation acting under Maritime Admiralty law.. That's why you're "Delivered" when you're "Birthed" and you go through the birth CANAL...
It's all a bunch of word games. Do you "UNDERSTAND?"
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27004192 - 10/26/20 08:57 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Enlil has special experience playing their games on the COURT.. With the RACKET... He sees people who get arrested and have to pay "Bail." (BAAL)
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
Edited by STPLSD25 (10/26/20 08:58 AM)
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27004201 - 10/26/20 09:10 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
The Judge sits at a BENCH which comes from the word BANK... A man representing the bank is the arbitrator to this game on the COURT... Why is that? Because you are a product of THE UNITED STATES corporation, complete with a UPC and everything.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25]
#27004210 - 10/26/20 09:21 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
You ever notice too the common defense is "my client can't go to jail, he's a productive member of society." that's another way of saying "My client is producing value for the bank, and you will lose that value if you send him to jail."
And we wonder why the rich seem to be above the law.. That's exactly why... They are producing value for the Bank, the bench- THE UNITED STATES CO.
Again, word games...
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
Edited by STPLSD25 (10/26/20 09:22 AM)
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,494
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: STPLSD25] 1
#27004484 - 10/26/20 11:42 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
STPLSD25 said:
"Sovereign Citizen" isn't a thing. THE UNITED STATES corporation decided long ago to call it's employees "citizens." Once you say "I'm a citizen" you're saying you're an employee of the UNITED STATES corporation.. That's why they have a PRESIDENT... Companies have presidents...
In other words, THE UNITED STATES is a corporation acting under Maritime Admiralty law.. That's why you're "Delivered" when you're "Birthed" and you go through the birth CANAL...
It's all a bunch of word games. Do you "UNDERSTAND?"
This is all bullshit conspiracy nutter shit. it doesn't belong in this forum. There is a forum dedicated to such wacky ideas.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
shivas.wisdom
בּ



Registered: 02/19/09
Posts: 13,428
Loc: Turtle Island
Last seen: 10 hours, 27 minutes
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Enlil] 2
#27004599 - 10/26/20 12:55 PM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Yeah, I'm as anti-state as they come but there's more to it than just learning a few magic phrases of legalese. That sort of thinking is the logic of cargo cults.
--------------------
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: Enlil]
#27005765 - 10/27/20 06:38 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Enlil said:
This is all bullshit conspiracy nutter shit. it doesn't belong in this forum. There is a forum dedicated to such wacky ideas.
Finally got something to warn me over... Good for you. You lived up to your "censoring opposing views" signature.. I was waiting for it..
Mod edit: removed conspiracy theory content. Please post that in the appropriate forum.
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
Edited by Enlil (10/27/20 07:20 AM)
|
STPLSD25
Shaman


Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 329
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
|
Re: The Government does NOT have a higher moral authority over your life than you do. [Re: shivas.wisdom]
#27005776 - 10/27/20 06:47 AM (3 years, 3 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
shivas.wisdom said: Yeah, I'm as anti-state as they come but there's more to it than just learning a few magic phrases of legalese. That sort of thinking is the logic of cargo cults.
I know.... You can't be a nonconformist if you don't drink coffee...
"Cargo cults.." uhhh ok, it's just me and my fiance, we are not a cult.. Just Anarchists
--------------------
"The State is a soulless machine, it can never be weaned from violence to which it owes its very existence"." ~Mahatma Ghandi “It is through separation that you will win: no representatives, and no candidates!” ― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
|
|