Home | Community | Message Board

Kratom Eye
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale, Red Vein Kratom

Jump to first unread post Pages: < First | < Back | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | Next > | Last >
Onlinechristopera
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/17
Posts: 14,201
Last seen: 40 seconds
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26981945 - 10/12/20 05:12 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I found it alright, and it’s in China. The same place it’s been for 40 years. They are the only place that grinds the tooling I need. I know it’s hard to believe for people that don’t source tooling, but it is in fact the case. I’m not the only one. There is a gigantic collection of people running machine tooling that are in the same boat.


--------------------
Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.

A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.

Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things

I’m sorry it had to be me.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineBANANA.MAN
Turd Ferguson
Male
Registered: 01/11/15
Posts: 7,474
Loc: Ontario Canada
Last seen: 6 months, 1 day
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: Nonagon Infinity] * 1
    #26981986 - 10/12/20 05:34 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Nonagon Infinity said:
Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
white supremecists have very little political power in the USA or anywhere in the world these days.




That's not true at all. White supremacy has been a huge part of American politics since the foundation of the country. Slavery -> Segregation -> Jim Crow laws -> Redlining and mass incarceration -> Police Brutality. Our government has consistently favored white Christians for about as long as America has been a country, and it's a problem with an ever-changing face.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
antifa on the other hand gets swept under the rug by the media and mainstream politicians.




False. Check out this article from the Atlantic. The Atlantic is a mainstream media source, and the article is called "The Rise of the Violent Left." The author is highly critical of the violence of Antifa activists. Your narrative that everyone is ignoring Antifa is false. Lots of politicians and media sources are aware of Antifa and are willing to talk about them (even critically).

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
there are legit organizations of people who target what they deem to be "facists"




And I'm saying that Antifa isn't one of them. Antifa isn't an organization, which is a point I already explained previously. If you want to change topics and talk about an extremist leftist group, then that's fine, but if so, then we're not talking about Antifa anymore.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
that study includes only things that are considered attacks. but a whole night of giant groups of left wingers coming together fighting/ attacking people/ destroying property dont get counted.




The study I linked studied the demographics for politically-motivated murders. The study shows, beyond a reasonable doubt, that right-wing extremist groups are way more likely to commit a politically-motivated murder than left-wing extremist groups. You're changing the subject from politically-motivated murder to fighting, nonlethal attacks, and destroying property.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
left winged violence has been way more prevalent than white supremecist violence.




Citation Needed

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
there are people in the past who have done bad things. the starues aren't nessecarily there to commemorate the bad things they did. they are there to commemorate the good things that they had done. I mean the celebrate ghengis khan in Mongolia. he was very influential. this view that there werent any good people until like the 1960s is ridiculous. in 100 years maybe they will decide we were all bad people and discount anything good that was done by anyone alive today.




I never said that there "weren't any good people until like the 1960's". You're imagining that this is a narrative that anyone actually holds. I never said that everyone who was ever a part of this country was a bad person. All I said is that there are statues of right-wing white supremacists, but that there aren't statues of leftist, anarchist activists.


Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
every great person in history has been a flawed hero. everyone. celebrating a flawed hero doesn't mean celebrating flaws.




This isn't about being a good or bad person, though. Obviously, everyone does some good and some bad. Obviously. We are discussing whether or not it's fair to compare Antifa to white supremacist groups.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
trump disavowed Bannon. the alt right gets no white house support.




It doesn't matter if he disavowed Bannon later on. He was endorsed before and during the beginning of the Trump administration, which legitimized his alt-right narrative media source. A lot of people still go to Breitbart as a media source, and that's largely because of Trump's original endorsement. The damage has already been done.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
on the other hand the leftwimged media and political establishment just brushes left winged violence under the rug.




Could you give us all a specific example of a left-leaning media source or a left-wing politician brushing left-wing violence under the rug?

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
see the fact that you are saying "trump and his supporters need to stop being fascist" shows you are just drowning in confirmation bias. what fascist policies has donald trump pursued? they aren't fighting fascists they are larping. give me a break.




I don't think you understand what fascism is...

There is no such thing as a fascist policy. Fascism isn't a political party or a form of government. Fascism is a philosophy that asserts there is a hierarchy that must be preserved. Historically, this hierarchy is typically spelled out in racial terms. For example, the Nazis (the token example of fascists) believed that Aryans were the supreme human beings (that they were at the top of the hierarchy), and that the Aryans should have power over all other races.

When it comes to government, fascists don't give a shit about how the ruling group achieves their power over everyone else. Musselini's fascist regime seized power in Italy in the early 20's via a violent coup, but that doesn't mean that fascists have to use violence to achieve power. Hitler was elected via the German democratic system. Fascists don't care how the hierarchy comes into place, so long as it does. If they need to use violence, they will, but if they can better achieve power by playing by the rules of a broken system (as they are in the USA right now), they will do that as well. So, the definition of a "fascist policy" is just whatever policy helps fascists seize more power. This could mean a wildly different set of policies depending on the full context of the situation.

You see, fascism doesn't show itself as public policy (at least not at the beginning). Fascism shows itself as rhetoric. When Trump refers to Mexican immigrants and says "they're not sending their best. They're bringing drugs. They're rapists," he's using fascist rhetoric. When Trump says there were "good people on both sides" of the unite-the-right rally in Charlottesville, where people were marching through the streets with torches chanting "JEWS WILL NOT REPLACE US," he's using fascist rhetoric. When Trump said that we ought to start keeping a database of Muslims in the US, he's using fascist rhetoric. Trump is a fascist, and the only way my opinion about that is going to change is if he stops using fascist rhetoric and stops endorsing (or "refusing to condemn") fascists like the Proud Boys or the Oath Keepers. White supremacy is the contemporary form of American fascism, and we need to be able to call it what it is.


Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
the militia groups that clash with rioters are there as a response to the rioters and looters. I can say that too.




That's not always the case, though. Look into footage of the most recent Proud Boys rally in Portland, OR. They aren't protecting any buildings or people from rioters. They are attacking press, flashing white supremacist hand signals and sybmolism, and spreading their rhetoric.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
look at it this way, I agree white suprmecy is bad. so does trump. Id never defend white supremecists or downplay their awfulness.




Trump is a white supremacist, though...

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
you and Biden on the other hand are 1. pretending they aren't a big deal and arent a real organization anyway so who cares 2. taking the fact they they are truly fighting "fascism" at face value 3. blaming trump for causing the response.




1. Did you ignore the entire paragraph I devoted in my last comment to explaining how I think that Antifa violence actually is a serious problem? I gave three different reasons that Antifa violence is a problem. Antifa violence is a problem. My claim is that Antifa violence is not comparable to white supremacist violence. They are different by an order of degrees.
2. I think I can disagree here, since you've already demonstrated that you don't actually understand what fascism is.
3. My biggest problem with Trump when it comes to this discussion is the double standard he applies to Antifa. He engages in the same narrative that you do: comparing Antifa violence to the violence of white supremacists, which I'm claiming is complete bullshit.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
BLM is also another group I dont support so idgaf if they work with BLM. BLM is super radical and not  ery accepting of people who don't share a very specific view and their platform is total garbage.




I'm not at all surprised that you don't support BLM. I have two questions:
1. Could you explain how BLM is "super radical?"
2. Could you explain what this "very specific view" is? What is the vision of BLM, according to you?


Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
not a fan of the proud boys but they arent a white supremecist group and to use yo own logic if left wingers weren't in the street rioting they wouldnt be there.




The Proud Boys are 100% a white supremacist group. They flash "white power" symbols at one another at all of their rallies and their leadership consistently talks about how the US form of government (read as: predominantly white christians holding all the power) is something to be proud of (implying it's supreme over other nations or forms of government). There is footage of Proud Boys physically attacking unarmed journalists at their own rallies.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
you can't just go around labeling everything you dont like white supremecist with no evidence. all it does is further prove that you're just rooting for your team.




Antifa isn't "my team," dude. I've already been quite clear that I'm critical of Antifa, especially when it comes to violence. My claim is just that comparing Antifa violence to white supremacist violence isn't a fair comparison at all.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
imagine I had just defended white supremecists as being better than antifa like the opposite of whatou just did. I'd rightfully never hear the end of it. fuck white supremacist loser, crazy people who attack minorities. fuck violent, destructive, theiving Marxists who use intimidation to get what they want and occupy city streets infringing upon the rights of the residents.




Oh, you're so oppressed :rolleyes:



dude America was not founded for the purpose of creating a racist state. the founding ideology and history go a lot deeper than that. I'm sorry but I'm not going to explain why comparing slavery and Jim crow (acctual racist laws, indicative of a racist system) to police brutality (which does not indicate racism systemic or even nessecarily individual) not because i dont think it would be a valuable conversation but because its too much man. this wasn't meant to a history thread it was really mostly about people saying trump didn't denounce white supremacy when he clearly and blatantly did.

the founding ideology of the usa was about freedom/justice. and that wasn't truly realized from the beggining.  but the story of american history is full of incremental steps by great but flawed men who were a product of a flawed time to expand the values outlined in the declaration of independence and the legal protections outlined in the constitution to those who should have been included from the beggining.

honestly man I barely read any of that post. when you are comparing the super small number of unarmed black people shot by police every year to slavery, saying trump is a white supremacist with no evidence and plenty of counter evidence its clear this is pointless. your arguments originate from all sorts of false assumptions that im not going to bother to debunk. you literally just say whatever you want to be true with no evidence no matter how much counter evidence there is. the proud boys and trump denounce white supremacy doesn't matter you can claim whatever you want.

the version of blm im talking about is the one outlined on their website. defund the police, "destroy the western prescribed nuclear family" (wtf?), free Palestine.  its a stupid they make a radical group with this insane platform then try to pretend if you dont support them you dont think black loves matter.

and aside from their policy prescriptions I dont agree with the narriative that the usa is systemically racist or that all inequity is the result of injustice.

see say whatever you want but when you just take antifas claim of being antifascust at face value and just pretend trump is a fascist its clear whose team you are on.

i don't go around defending white supremacists because they arent my team. you came into this thread specifically to downplay left winged violence.

your main problem was that they made your side look worse. I didnt ignore that part. you literally said they arent an organization like biden so don't pretend im mischaracterizing you. he doesnt apply a double standard to antifa. you do. trump says its all bad and should all be denouned. you are basically saying one is not even worth denouncing.

loooooooool. fascism is about public policy. you have to point to the fascist policy you are fighting if you want to claim to be fighting fascism.

trump didn't say all Mexicans were rapists. it is true that many women who are brought over the border are raped by the coyotes who bring them because they are criminal prices of garbage who rape women.

trump specifically said he wasnt talking about white supremacists when he said good people. he thought it was like a rally just for the statue that some people wanted down and some people wanted to leave up. he was wrong it was s a white supremasist rally. but the reason for it being there  was because of the statue controversey. trump was talking about people on both sides of that disagreement. but he was wrong. it was a white supremacist rally but he wasnt talking about white supremacists when he referred to good people.

look if you want to call people fascists and have that mean anything to anyone you have to define your terms.  you cant just define fascism as this vague thing that has no real definition and have it be an effective club. you're basically just comparing trump to hitler for no valid reason.

look man go back and read the thread more because I'm not going to keep addressing the same point twice. I read like half your post and between the blatant falsehoods with no justification, the assumptions on which all your points rest which I have not adopted and the duplicate points that have been addressed in this thread already i cant do it bro.


didn't claim to be oppressed at all. Just saying I would never defend white supremacists or make excuses for them the way you defended antifa.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinechristopera
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/17
Posts: 14,201
Last seen: 40 seconds
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: BANANA.MAN]
    #26982207 - 10/12/20 07:36 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

^

Did anybody read that? I couldn't get through the first three sentences with the improper capitalization.


--------------------
Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.

A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.

Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things

I’m sorry it had to be me.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineBANANA.MAN
Turd Ferguson
Male
Registered: 01/11/15
Posts: 7,474
Loc: Ontario Canada
Last seen: 6 months, 1 day
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: christopera] * 1
    #26982224 - 10/12/20 07:42 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

christopera said:
^

Did anybody read that? I couldn't get through the first three sentences with the improper capitalization.



Oh no I'm typing informally in an informal setting.

like I get how paragraphs or even spelling or grammar could make it hard to read things but you can't read something unless the two versions of the same symbol with the same meaning are in the right places? thats a little silly imo and I have a lot of weird habits and preferences.

People around here complain about linguistic informalities and mistakes way too much imo. especially when they use it as a way to make someone look bad without ever addressing their arguments.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineNonagon Infinity
Mycologist
 User Gallery


Registered: 06/02/20
Posts: 756
Loc: Polygondwanaland
Last seen: 2 years, 11 months
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: BANANA.MAN]
    #26982228 - 10/12/20 07:43 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
dude America was not founded for the purpose of creating a racist state.




I never said that it was... ?

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
I'm sorry but I'm not going to explain why comparing slavery and Jim crow (acctual racist laws, indicative of a racist system) to police brutality (which does not indicate racism systemic or even nessecarily individual) not because i dont think it would be a valuable conversation but because its too much man. this wasn't meant to a history thread it was really mostly about people saying trump didn't denounce white supremacy when he clearly and blatantly did.




But that's not what you made this thread about at all. You clearly wanted to compare Trump's denouncement to Biden's lack of denouncement to Antifa, and if we're going to talk about Antifa, we need to talk about white supremacy, and if we're going to talk about white supremacy, we need to talk about American history. These issues are all interconnected, and if you want to just dismiss the whole discussion because it's "too much," then that's fine, but it isn't a rebuttal to anything that I've said, so I guess others who might read this discussion will see my arguments and make decisions for themselves.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
the founding ideology of the usa was about freedom/justice.




I'd say that's really only one piece of the picture. Freedom? Yes, if you're talking about independence from the English government. That was a founding principle. However, there were others as well. America has a very puritan background, so puritan christian values are a large part of the "founding ideology" as well (it was also used to justify the slaughter of the natives). Another founding principle is capitalism and the belief in owning private property (another point used to justify the slaughter of the natives). Look, Banana, I'm not saying that America is evil or anything like that. Nothing in life is that simple, and the idea that there are people who are strictly good or strictly evil is a very puritan idea, funnily enough. All I'm saying is that it's very complicated, and that white (particularly white christian) supremacy has been a factor in American politics since the beginning. Yes, independence from the tyranny of England was also a part of American politics since the beginning, but that's definitely not the whole picture.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
honestly man I barely read any of that post.




That's not an argument against any of my points, though. If anything, it just shows that you
A) have no response, OR
B) don't actually care about this topic enough to debate about it, OR
C) don't like having your beliefs challenged, OR
D) don't have the attention span to read a few short paragraphs.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
when you are comparing the super small number of unarmed black people shot by police every year to slavery, saying trump is a white supremacist with no evidence and plenty of counter evidence its clear this is pointless. your arguments originate from all sorts of false assumptions that im not going to bother to debunk.




Police brutality is a problem that disproportionately affects black Americans compared to white Americans. In that regard, it is comparable to slavery in that it is an example of systemic racism. Additionally, police brutality is just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to systemic racism (it's definitely the one that's easiest to see, though): you're forgetting about poverty, lack of education, redlining, and mass incarceration, all of which are still problems that disproportionately affect black Americans.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
you literally just say whatever you want to be true with no evidence no matter how much counter evidence there is.




I have provided sources for many of my claims and you have provided none, so where is all this "counter evidence" that you're talking about?

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
the proud boys and trump denounce white supremacy doesn't matter you can claim whatever you want.




The Proud Boys are literally a white supremacist group. Saying you "denounce white supremacy" doesn't mean jack shit when your actions contradict that denouncement. Check out this article from the Southern Poverty Law Center (a hate group watchdog organization in the US - they're basically the equivalent of the Anti-Defamation League, but for racial minorities in America). It provides mountains of evidence that the Proud Boys are a white supremacist (or white nationalist, if you prefer that) group. Then again, if you didn't take the time to read my post, I doubt you'll take the time to read this article. But I hope this shows that your repeated dismissal of me having "no evidence" is complete bullshit. I have evidence. Lots of it.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
the version of blm im talking about is the one outlined on their website. defund the police, "destroy the western prescribed nuclear family" (wtf?), free Palestine.  its a stupid they make a radical group with this insane platform then try to pretend if you dont support them you dont think black loves matter.




Maybe I'm looking at the wrong BLM website. Do you have a source for any of those quotes? When I went to their website, this was all I found under their "About" section:
Quote:

#BlackLivesMatter was founded in 2013 in response to the acquittal of Trayvon Martin’s murderer. Black Lives Matter Foundation, Inc is a global organization in the US, UK, and Canada, whose mission is to eradicate white supremacy and build local power to intervene in violence inflicted on Black communities by the state and vigilantes. By combating and countering acts of violence, creating space for Black imagination and innovation, and centering Black joy, we are winning immediate improvements in our lives.




Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
and aside from their policy prescriptions I dont agree with the narriative that the usa is systemically racist or that all inequity is the result of injustice.




Again, color me unsurprised. I guess I'll just say that the claim that the USA is systemically racist is not a "narrative," it's a fact, and it's a fact supported by lots of evidence. This article shows 26 different examples of systemic racism that are all supported by hard data.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
see say whatever you want but when you just take antifas claim of being antifascust at face value and just pretend trump is a fascist its clear whose team you are on.




Trump is a fascist, and a lot of his supporters are, too. I've already explained why I believe this.

As for "which team I'm on," (interesting choice of words, by the way) I'd say I'm on team marginalized groups. I care about protecting the most vulnerable people in modern society right now: women, racial minorities, disabled people, LGBT+ people, religious minorities, immigrants, and refugees. These are the people who need our help the most right now, and Trump is not an ally to any of them.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
i don't go around defending white supremacists because they arent my team. you came into this thread specifically to downplay left winged violence.




That's an unfair characterization of my position, Banana. I didn't come here to downplay left-wing violence. Quite contrary, I've criticized left-wing violence multiple times in this thread and linked media sources criticizing left-wing violence, a point that you continue to ignore. I came to this thread to point out that the comparison between white supremacist violence and Antifa violence is complete bullshit. They are different by an order of degrees, even though both of them are fucked up. They're both fucked up, but they're not equally fucked up

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
your main problem was that they made your side look worse. I didnt ignore that part.




Actually, the first point I made about violence is that I'm a pacifist, and that I believe violence is wrong. You're painting an inaccurate picture of my position to make it easier to attack. Some people like to call that a strawman fallacy.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
you literally said they arent an organization like biden so don't pretend im mischaracterizing you. he doesnt apply a double standard to antifa. you do. trump says its all bad and should all be denouned. you are basically saying one is not even worth denouncing.




That's not what I'm saying at all. I made three points about comparing Antifa to white supremacist groups:
1. Antifa is not an organization (you're aware of this one, but you keep dismissing it without making an argument).
2. White supremacist groups commit way more violence than Antifa does. I provided evidence, and you have provided no counter-evidence.
3. White supremacist groups are more capable of making their goals a reality than Antifa is due to systemic racism, political endorsement, and American history.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
loooooooool. fascism is about public policy.




It's not about any specific public policy. Fascist politicians will enact whatever policies secure more power for the ones they believe ought to be in charge. What that means specifically will vary depending on geographical and cultural context.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
you have to point to the fascist policy you are fighting if you want to claim to be fighting fascism.




No, fighting fascism is about exposing fascist rhetoric and empowering the people who fascists would like to suppress (usually racial or religious minorities, usually women, and almost always LGBT+ people and disabled people). The fight against fascism doesn't necessarily happen with guns and swords. It's primarily a battle of ideas.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
trump didn't say all Mexicans were rapists.




Yeah, just some. Guess I was wrong about it being a fascist rhetoric, then. Guys, we got it all wrong! He only said some Mexican immigrants were rapists! See? Clearly not an effort to dehumanize or demonize Mexican immigrants. Just Trump "telling it like it is" or whatever. /sarcasm

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
trump specifically said he wasnt talking about white supremacists when he said good people. he thought it was like a rally just for the statue that some people wanted down and some people wanted to leave up. he was wrong it was s a white supremasist rally. but the reason for it being there  was because of the statue controversey. trump was talking about people on both sides of that disagreement. but he was wrong. it was a white supremacist rally but he wasnt talking about white supremacists when he referred to good people.




That rally was organized by white supremacists, though. To my knowledge, the two conflicting "sides" were white supremacists and Antifa counter-protestors, so the claim that there were "good people on both sides" necessarily implies an endorsement of white supremacists (Fun side-fact: the white supremacists murdered a woman at that rally).


Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
look if you want to call people fascists and have that mean anything to anyone you have to define your terms.  you cant just define fascism as this vague thing that has no real definition and have it be an effective club.




Actually, I did provide a clear (meaning not-vague) definition of fascism. To repeat, I defined it as a philosophy that is concerned with preserving a hierarchy of power at any cost. Typically, it shows itself as staunch ultra-nationalism on the surface. You haven't given any argument rejecting this definition, and instead are just claiming that I'm using it as a pejorative term to dismiss people I don't like. I've given multiple examples of Trump using fascist rhetoric by applying this definition, and you only responded to one of them (poorly).


Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
you're basically just comparing trump to hitler for no valid reason.




I think both of them are fascists, but that's probably the most significant similarity between them. There are a lot of significant differences between Trump and Hitler, so I'm definitely not trying to push the (obviously false) idea that they're basically the same person.

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
look man go back and read the thread more because I'm not going to keep addressing the same point twice. I read like half your post and between the blatant falsehoods with no justification, the assumptions on which all your points rest which I have not adopted and the duplicate points that have been addressed in this thread already i cant do it bro.




Okay, you don't have to engage in discussion with me if you don't want to. Probably better for my mental health that way, tbh.

You're a baby.


--------------------
Nonagon Infinity Opens the Door


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinechristopera
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/17
Posts: 14,201
Last seen: 40 seconds
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: BANANA.MAN]
    #26982244 - 10/12/20 07:48 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

BANANA.MAN said:
Quote:

christopera said:
^

Did anybody read that? I couldn't get through the first three sentences with the improper capitalization.



Oh no I'm typing informally in an informal setting.




Not trying to be a dick, but my eye literally can't follow the text. I have to reread each line because my eyes get lost. The capital letters literally aid the reading of the text, but without them I just gave up. I have no idea what your point was as a result.


--------------------
Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.

A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.

Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things

I’m sorry it had to be me.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineqman
Stranger

Registered: 12/06/06
Posts: 34,927
Last seen: 1 day, 8 hours
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: christopera] * 1
    #26982277 - 10/12/20 07:59 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

christopera said:
You are totally ignorant, clearly. 25% decrease of sales isn’t equal to a 25% tariff.

You can argue that tooling should be made domestically all you want, it isn’t, and it hasn’t been made here in 40 years. The tariffs simply punished Americans. Nobody else. Not the Chinese or otherwise. Now my business is filled by people who aren’t subject to Trumps retardation. MAGA!




Where am I ignorant?  Where did I correlate a 25% tariff with 25% loss in sales?

I also agree that the tariffs were a joke and highly ineffective, so why the continued disagreement on the issue?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineqman
Stranger

Registered: 12/06/06
Posts: 34,927
Last seen: 1 day, 8 hours
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: qman] * 1
    #26982304 - 10/12/20 08:10 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I think when anyone labels Donald Trump a former New York City real estate tycoon with a popular TV show as a 'white supremacist', you not only dilute the word, but you also lose most of the people in the political center. I'm not saying Trump hasn't done racist acts in the past, but so have most people as well.

My point is that you're not going to win many arguments if you just try to redefine terms for your own benefit. Most people do NOT recognize Trump as any type of 'white supremacist. If one were to apply that label to Trump, then the same would apply to Biden and also tens of millions of regular US citizens.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinechristopera
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/13/17
Posts: 14,201
Last seen: 40 seconds
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: qman]
    #26982318 - 10/12/20 08:16 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I guess because the quality was good, the prices were good, and realistically, the amount of labor that it requires to make these tools is almost zero. It's almost all automated at this point. So they still out compete the US, and thus are the only supplier of my specific tooling.

That means the tariffs were basically nothing but posturing in the first place.

So, it wrecked a good portion of my business in the name of paying greater taxes for literally no benefit to the American people. In fact, it hurt my ability to hire. If we saw a legit benefit for the American people, I'd have no issue with that tax. Where did that money go? Certainly not to the deficit. "Fiscal conservatives" at work...

I told this same story years ago, back when you were all "Trump 2020". It would be nice if you could acknowledge as much.


--------------------
Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.

A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.

Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things

I’m sorry it had to be me.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineNonagon Infinity
Mycologist
 User Gallery


Registered: 06/02/20
Posts: 756
Loc: Polygondwanaland
Last seen: 2 years, 11 months
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: qman]
    #26982352 - 10/12/20 08:26 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
I think when anyone labels Donald Trump a former New York City real estate tycoon with a popular TV show as a 'white supremacist', you not only dilute the word, but you also lose most of the people in the political center. I'm not saying Trump hasn't done racist acts in the past, but so have most people as well.

My point is that you're not going to win many arguments if you just try to redefine terms for your own benefit. Most people do NOT recognize Trump as any type of 'white supremacist. If one were to apply that label to Trump, then the same would apply to Biden and also tens of millions of regular US citizens.



The reason I call Trump a white supremacist is because being a "white supremacist" and being a "white supremacist sympathizer" have exactly the same consequences.

I don't think that the label applies to Biden. I'm still critical of Biden when it comes to race. The most generous interpretation of his career paints him as a politician who is complicit with systemic racism, and a less charitable interpretation paints him as a politician who is responsible for the perpetuation of systemic racism. However, even if I agreed with you that the label also applies to Joe Biden, that's not a counter-argument to the claim that the label applies to Trump.

The idea that tens of millions of regular US citizens are white supremacists (or maybe just white supremacist sympathizers or allies) isn't really that absurd, actually. White supremacy is becoming more and more mainstream by the day.


--------------------
Nonagon Infinity Opens the Door


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
Stranger
Male User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 32,557
Loc: California, US Flag
Last seen: 4 months, 21 days
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #26982405 - 10/12/20 08:48 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

qman said:
Fal turned out to be correct about Russiagate not because he's a fan of Trump, but because he questioned the MSM narrative.



He didn't turn out to be right,  though.  He just moved the goalposts.



Do tell.  :popcorn:



***Crickets***
.
.
.
***More crickets***



Here again is a claim of Enlil saying I moved the goal posts, but he refuses to explain how.  I'd like to ask that he either explain, or stop lying about me.  Others are starting to believe him.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineqman
Stranger

Registered: 12/06/06
Posts: 34,927
Last seen: 1 day, 8 hours
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: Nonagon Infinity] * 2
    #26982411 - 10/12/20 08:51 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I really don't think that's a line of reasoning you really want to use to make your points. Most people associate white supremacists with organizations that basically represent themselves as white supremacists, they don't associate them with old white males that are racist assholes. If you conflate the two, you're just going to lose the vast majority of the people you're attempting to win over. In other words, your entire credibility on the issue goes right out the window. :shrug:

It's very important not to label people out of anger, convenience and for political points. Label Trump for what he really is and you're going to have so much more success in getting your point across to so many more people.

The fact that the term 'white supremacy' is becoming more mainstream does NOT mean that improves your rational for misusing the term. In fact, what meaning does the term 'racist' even have today?  Many years ago, it was a horrible label to have, today most people don't even care because the term has been so diluted. So go ahead and jump on the bandwagon and make another serious term completely meaningless in nature and see what happens to the true white supremacists in our society. Guess what? They're laughing at it because they come out the winner.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineNonagon Infinity
Mycologist
 User Gallery


Registered: 06/02/20
Posts: 756
Loc: Polygondwanaland
Last seen: 2 years, 11 months
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: qman] * 1
    #26982470 - 10/12/20 09:46 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
I really don't think that's a line of reasoning you really want to use to make your points. Most people associate white supremacists with organizations that basically represent themselves as white supremacists, they don't associate them with old white males that are racist assholes. If you conflate the two, you're just going to lose the vast majority of the people you're attempting to win over. In other words, your entire credibility on the issue goes right out the window. :shrug:




I've given multiple examples of Trump using white supremacist, fascist rhetoric. Is that not enough evidence? When do we get to call a politician a white supremacist?

Besides, I think you're creating a false equivalence between Trump and Biden here. They're not just "old white males that are racist assholes." That's true, but there's definitely more to the picture. One of them drafted policy which, while not overtly racist, wound up disproportionately reducing the quality of life of black Americans. The other one drafted similar policies and also frequently refers to Mexican immigrants as drug dealing rapists who are here to steal our jobs, suggested that we start keeping a database of Muslims in the US, openly mocks disabled people, openly endorsed white supremacists, and defended white supremacist groups multiple times. There's clearly a difference when it comes to rhetoric. If all of those actions don't make Trump a white supremacist or a fascist, what label do you suggest we use to differentiate him from Biden, the candidate who does not use such rhetoric?

Quote:

qman said:
It's very important not to label people out of anger, convenience and for political points.




I'm not angry - maybe a little frightened and anxious, but definitely not angry. I'm just pointing out that Trump uses fascist rhetoric to pander to his white supremacist fanbase. It has nothing to do with my emotions and everything to do with his actions and language. I'm definitely not applying such labels because of convenience. I sincerely wish this wasn't happening right now. I sincerely wish that our president wasn't using this type of rhetoric, and I sincerely wish that he didn't have millions of supporters who buy into that rhetoric. There was a part of me that believed Trump was a fascist for a long time, and the main thing that kept me from pointing it out publicly was that I was worried more moderate people were going to challenge me on it. I'm not really worried about that anymore, because the cost of not being able to voice my concerns seems to great at this point (and because I've been doing more research on fascism, so I know I can back up my claims).

I know fascism isn't the easiest term to define (especially because it's often used for purely pejorative reasons), but we have to draw the line somewhere, and I believe Trump has already crossed that line. How many more fascist talking points does he have to scream at his rallies before we can reasonably call him a fascist? What exactly are we waiting for? Are we waiting for him to start enacting authoritarian policies that pose physical harm to Mexican immigrants and Muslims? Are we waiting for him to start reducing women's rights and the rights of LGBT+ people? Are we waiting for him to cast doubt on the American democratic system, securing his power and influence? News flash: these things are already happening under his rule.

I know that the terms "fascist," "white supremacist," and "racist" have all been used pejoratively and had their definitions diluted, but that doesn't mean we can't call it out when we see it. The first step towards resolving a problem is always admitting that we have a problem, and I'm seeing the writing on the wall. If the history of fascist regimes has taught us anything, it's that things are about to get very bad for disabled people, poor people, racial minorities, religious minorities, women, LGBT+ people, immigrants, and refugees in America (and elsewhere, considering the influence the US has all around the world). Trump is not an ally to any of these marginalized groups. His administration has repeatedly enacted policies that put them at further disadvantages, and he dehumanizes them with his combative, sensationalist rhetoric. How many of the people from those marginalized groups need to be harmed or have their rights revoked before I can start calling it all fascism?


--------------------
Nonagon Infinity Opens the Door


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMach z 800
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/04/15
Posts: 1,580
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: Nonagon Infinity]
    #26982698 - 10/13/20 01:32 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I got my bag of pop corn 🤣


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMach z 800
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/04/15
Posts: 1,580
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: Nonagon Infinity] * 1
    #26982708 - 10/13/20 01:45 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Nonagon Infinity said:
Quote:

qman said:
I really don't think that's a line of reasoning you really want to use to make your points. Most people associate white supremacists with organizations that basically represent themselves as white supremacists, they don't associate them with old white males that are racist assholes. If you conflate the two, you're just going to lose the vast majority of the people you're attempting to win over. In other words, your entire credibility on the issue goes right out the window. :shrug:




I've given multiple examples of Trump using white supremacist, fascist rhetoric. Is that not enough evidence? When do we get to call a politician a white supremacist?

Besides, I think you're creating a false equivalence between Trump and Biden here. They're not just "old white males that are racist assholes." That's true, but there's definitely more to the picture. One of them drafted policy which, while not overtly racist, wound up disproportionately reducing the quality of life of black Americans. The other one drafted similar policies and also frequently refers to Mexican immigrants as drug dealing rapists who are here to steal our jobs, suggested that we start keeping a database of Muslims in the US, openly mocks disabled people, openly endorsed white supremacists, and defended white supremacist groups multiple times. There's clearly a difference when it comes to rhetoric. If all of those actions don't make Trump a white supremacist or a fascist, what label do you suggest we use to differentiate him from Biden, the candidate who does not use such rhetoric?

Quote:

qman said:
It's very important not to label people out of anger, convenience and for political points.




I'm not angry - maybe a little frightened and anxious, but definitely not angry. I'm just pointing out that Trump uses fascist rhetoric to pander to his white supremacist fanbase. It has nothing to do with my emotions and everything to do with his actions and language. I'm definitely not applying such labels because of convenience. I sincerely wish this wasn't happening right now. I sincerely wish that our president wasn't using this type of rhetoric, and I sincerely wish that he didn't have millions of supporters who buy into that rhetoric. There was a part of me that believed Trump was a fascist for a long time, and the main thing that kept me from pointing it out publicly was that I was worried more moderate people were going to challenge me on it. I'm not really worried about that anymore, because the cost of not being able to voice my concerns seems to great at this point (and because I've been doing more research on fascism, so I know I can back up my claims).

I know fascism isn't the easiest term to define (especially because it's often used for purely pejorative reasons), but we have to draw the line somewhere, and I believe Trump has already crossed that line. How many more fascist talking points does he have to scream at his rallies before we can reasonably call him a fascist? What exactly are we waiting for? Are we waiting for him to start enacting authoritarian policies that pose physical harm to Mexican immigrants and Muslims? Are we waiting for him to start reducing women's rights and the rights of LGBT+ people? Are we waiting for him to cast doubt on the American democratic system, securing his power and influence? News flash: these things are already happening under his rule.

I know that the terms "fascist," "white supremacist," and "racist" have all been used pejoratively and had their definitions diluted, but that doesn't mean we can't call it out when we see it. The first step towards resolving a problem is always admitting that we have a problem, and I'm seeing the writing on the wall. If the history of fascist regimes has taught us anything, it's that things are about to get very bad for disabled people, poor people, racial minorities, religious minorities, women, LGBT+ people, immigrants, and refugees in America (and elsewhere, considering the influence the US has all around the world). Trump is not an ally to any of these marginalized groups. His administration has repeatedly enacted policies that put them at further disadvantages, and he dehumanizes them with his combative, sensationalist rhetoric. How many of the people from those marginalized groups need to be harmed or have their rights revoked before I can start calling it all fascism?


jeez you crack me up 😂😂😂 you make it sound like trump is the next comming of hitler or something 😂🤣. But your totally fine with sleepy creepy joe behinde the wheel who says you aint black unless you vote for him?  Your fine with that? Are we going to do the double standards card?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineNonagon Infinity
Mycologist
 User Gallery


Registered: 06/02/20
Posts: 756
Loc: Polygondwanaland
Last seen: 2 years, 11 months
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: Mach z 800]
    #26982732 - 10/13/20 02:57 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Mach z 800 said:
jeez you crack me up 😂😂😂




I'm glad I could bring a smile to your face, but remember that fascism is no joke :frown:

Quote:

Mach z 800 said:
you make it sound like trump is the next comming of hitler or something 😂🤣.




Nah, he's not the next coming of Hitler. That's absurd. Trump definitely spouts a lot of fascist rhetoric, though, and Hitler spouted a bunch of fascist rhetoric during his time, but those are just about the only similarities. My claim is that Trump is a fascist, not that Trump is Hitler. Hitler wasn't the only fascist, obviously. Fascism takes on different faces depending on cultural and geographical context, as I've explained multiple times in this thread already.

Quote:

Mach z 800 said:
But your totally fine with sleepy creepy joe behinde the wheel who says you aint black unless you vote for him?




No, I'm not "totally fine" with Joe Biden. If you actually had read the comment you're responding to, you would have seen that I called him an old white male racist asshole. My top choice out of all the mainstream candidates at the beginning of this election was Bernie Sanders, who is not a racist asshole, and I'm actually really sad that the DNC nominated Joe Biden. Just because I criticize Trump doesn't mean that I'm "totally fine" with Biden. Do you actually think the world is that simplistic?


--------------------
Nonagon Infinity Opens the Door


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineqman
Stranger

Registered: 12/06/06
Posts: 34,927
Last seen: 1 day, 8 hours
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: Nonagon Infinity] * 2
    #26983074 - 10/13/20 09:56 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Trump is NOT a fascist, come on now, you're destroying another term. Trump's trolling and bigoted rhetoric isn't fascism. He's purposely trying to antagonize people to appeal to his base. The key point here is that it's just empty talk that nobody takes seriously.

Did Trump eliminate free speech, shut down the media or internet?  NO.

Did Trump eliminate due process and charge his political opponents with baseless crimes? NO.

Did his political opponents ever accuse him of fascism acts? NO.

Did his political opponents pass all the important legislation proposed by Trump?  YES. 

I'm sorry, but being highly critical of illegal immigration policies isn't fascism. Either is reducing travel from certain areas of the world. Either is making fun of disabled people. Either is pissing on poor people which has been happening for over 50 years in this nation.

If Trump did authoritarian acts and suspended the Constitution you would a case, but that didn't happen. If he illegally silenced and imprisoned his political opponents without due process, you would have a case. If Trump used government force to implement unconstitutional laws, you would have a case.

Again, you're not going to convince people if you continue to exaggerate and misuse these very important terms. You're in a very small minority with your current perspective on these issues. You're more concerned about what could happen, as opposed to what has actually happened. That's a very dangerous slippy slope you're going down and it doesn't serve much purpose in my opinion.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblenatedawgnow
Rocky mountain hood rat
 User Gallery


Registered: 02/09/15
Posts: 8,939
Loc: ation
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: qman] * 3
    #26983155 - 10/13/20 10:45 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Trump is a baby fascist. Everything on your list above, trump has proposed doing.

He proposed banning tiktok and regulating other social media platforms.

When talking about guns and people who are accused of violent crime, trump said:
"I like to take the guns early, go through due process later"

He sent federal agents to infringe on state issues and arrest people exercising their 1st ammendment rights without reading their rights.

He also recently said he would lock up hillary after the election. Obviously it's
a ploy to appeal to mindless voters, but the rhetoric was stated.

So regardless of whether or not he actually does these things, he's still spewing
the rhetoric and his base eats it up. He is turning half the country towards acceptance
of fascist rhetoric regardless of whether or not he does it.


--------------------


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineshivas.wisdom
בּ
 User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 02/19/09
Posts: 13,428
Loc: Turtle Island
Last seen: 10 hours, 58 minutes
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: qman] * 1
    #26983167 - 10/13/20 10:53 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Did Trump eliminate due process and charge his political opponents with baseless crimes? NO.

[...]

If Trump did authoritarian acts and suspended the Constitution you would a case, but that didn't happen. If he illegally silenced and imprisoned his political opponents without due process, you would have a case. If Trump used government force to implement unconstitutional laws, you would have a case.




There is one very recent and blatant example of Trump treating an antifascist as guilty without trial, and celebrating the extrajudicial killing as a necessary act of "retribution" that "took care of business". Both quotes suggest that this was the active result of an order Trump gave.

"I put out, 'When are you going to go get him?' And the U.S. Marshals went in to get [Michael Forest Reinoehl]. This guy was a violent criminal, and the U.S. Marshals killed him. And I'll tell you something - that's the way it has to be. There has to be retribution."

"I sent in the U.S. Marshals to get the killer of a young man in the middle of the street and they shot him. For three days Portland didn’t do anything. I sent in the U.S. Marshals, they took care of business."

'There Has to Be Retribution': Trump Openly Endorses Extrajudicial Killings of Suspects by Law Enforcement

The Federal Killing of a Protester Should Alarm Us All


Contrast it with his comments on Kyle Rittenhouse:
"That was an interesting situation. You saw the same tape as I saw. And he was trying to get away from them. I guess it looks like he fell and then they very violently attacked him. And it was something that we’re looking at right now, and it’s under investigation. But I guess he was in very big trouble. He would have been — probably would have been killed, but it’s under investigation."

Trump’s illuminating defense of Kyle Rittenhouse




Is there a specific number of people who must be killed in this way before we can identify it as the mentality of right-wing death squads?


--------------------


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Re: Trump Again Disavows White Supremacists while Biden Wont Disavow Antifa [Re: shivas.wisdom]
    #26983196 - 10/13/20 11:14 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Trump is hopefully the red cunt hair that breaks the camel's back. Mini fascist sure, but its been this way for a long time anyway.
People horrified about Trump let all this slide for years.

Quote:


Total Collapse Of Democracy So Horrifying America Decides It Hasn’t Happened Yet
WASHINGTON—As citizens across the nation sought to insulate themselves from mounting evidence to the contrary, several reports indicated Monday that the idea of the total collapse of democracy was so horrifying that America decided it hadn’t happened yet. “We can’t let them take away our democracy,” said Prescott, AZ insurance agent Daniel Cross, echoing the concerns of a terrified American populace that imagined a future in which the nation’s democratic ideals were hopelessly compromised, and determined that in the meantime, the Electoral College, U.S. Senate, unelected Supreme Court, increased power concentrated in the presidency, lack of universal suffrage, frequent executive overrides of decisions that had majority support of the American populace, the manipulation of voting boundaries on the federal, state, and local levels, a strict two-party system that used legislative means to effectively prevent additional parties from gaining traction, widespread voter suppression, corporate control of the media, massive lobbying sector, outsourcing of public services to profit-driven private firms, concentration of power among a few wealthy individuals, complex legal labyrinths designed to prevent regular people from exercising their basic rights, deregulation that led to widespread health, environmental, and economic hardship, unfettered campaign donations, effective legal immunity on the basis of status, wealth, or membership in a state police force, legal and economic obstacles to free assembly and free speech, poor education in both critical thinking and democratic ideas, unelected local councils and boards with significant influence over the distribution of public resources without fair notice or inclusion of the general populace, and the repeated efforts by the United States to undermine democracy in foreign countries at the expense of undermining its own democratic processes at home didn’t currently exist. “This election is a make-or-break moment for our democracy. It’s the most important election of our lifetimes.” Additional reports suggested that the prospects of a badly compromised political system in the United States were so disturbing to contemplate that Americans decided that real democracy had at some point actually existed.





Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: < First | < Back | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | Next > | Last >

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale, Red Vein Kratom


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* TRUMP 2024
( 1 2 3 4 ... 1202 1203 )
XUL 285,143 24,050 01/28/24 07:03 PM
by Enlil
* The Trump Phenomenon
( 1 2 3 4 ... 50 51 )
Count of Sabugosa 40,158 1,006 01/27/16 02:53 PM
by zappaisgod
* So Trump started off badly but he's making more sense every day...
( 1 2 3 4 ... 82 83 )
Patlal 59,099 1,645 09/19/15 03:20 PM
by Bigbadwooof
* Trump tells BLM's Protester to get the hell out
( 1 2 3 4 ... 17 18 )
qman 12,838 355 12/03/15 04:36 PM
by airclay
* Official Hillary vs Trump Debate Thread.
( 1 2 3 4 ... 53 54 )
amp244 22,427 1,077 11/15/16 03:01 PM
by ballsalsa
* Trump
( 1 2 3 4 ... 131 132 )
DividedQuantumM 76,246 2,635 01/19/21 07:19 AM
by STPLSD25
* ANTIFA
( 1 2 3 4 ... 61 62 )
mescalator 24,181 1,230 10/14/17 06:14 AM
by Mad_Larkin
* biden .."[romney/ryan] will put y´all back in chains"... Annapurna1 1,211 19 08/18/12 11:16 AM
by SWEDEN

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Enlil, ballsalsa
14,835 topic views. 5 members, 3 guests and 1 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.031 seconds spending 0.008 seconds on 15 queries.