Home | Community | Message Board

Magic-Mushrooms-Shop.com
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   North Spore Bulk Substrate   Mushroom-Hut Grow Bags   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Capsules   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Amanita Muscaria Store Amanita Extract

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8  [ show all ]
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED*
    #26962164 - 09/30/20 02:15 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleTormatoMFacebookDiscordReddit
The Goddess Kali Meh 😛
I'm a teapot User Gallery


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 07/01/17
Posts: 6,067
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie] * 4
    #26962218 - 09/30/20 02:49 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

An air filter might help a little, but honestly it really comes down to your sterile procedure. :shrug:


--------------------
Helpful Threads

The Shroomery Store

Tormato's Q&A Thread Post Questions Here or PM me!

"Lately it occurs to me what a long, strange trip it's been." ~ Grateful Dead

Before you start...Do you have a Pressure Cooker and a Dehydrator? I highly recommend getting both!


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Tormato]
    #26984481 - 10/14/20 04:18 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie] * 4
    #26984500 - 10/14/20 05:04 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Fix your spawn. You can grow monotubs outside lol. The sporeload out there is huge. Your room isn't the issue unless the walls are growing mold. Even then its probably not an issue.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleJosex
#cheat_code
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/13/15
Posts: 8,995
Loc: Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie] * 2
    #26984517 - 10/14/20 05:27 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie said:
I’m going to toss the 5th monotub in a row due to Trich.

I have a flow hood. I made 132 pieces of sterile agar petri dishes that are 100% clean after spending weeks at room temperature. I PCed all the coir I used. The colonized jars all looked healthy.

So, instead of blaming my sterile procedure, would someone please tell me how to sanitize a room without chemicals?




It's your spawn dude, the sooner you learn this the better. I don't know if your sterile technique is good or not but I know your grain prep is garbage, fix that.


Quote:

Josex said:
I used to grow in a moldy apartment without furniture. I didn't live there, just grew. There were mold on the walls, ceilings, wardrobes, doors.... I even had to seal some windows because the boxes where the blinds go were rotting away with mold.

I cleaned the place like crazy several times, bleached everything, vacuum everything... to no avail.

My success rate with agar in a SAB went from virtually 100% to 30%. Many sterilized plastic containers (as small as 100ml and as big as 1 litre) molded away without even opening them.

The only shit I was always able to get clean were my LC's and had to switch to syringes instead of pouring the LC, because pouring gave me lots of mold too.




Quote:

Josex said:
The thing is, if my spawn was clean my tubs would not contaminate in that moldy af apartment no matter what. That's why I remain a little skeptical every time I see someone blaming a moldy place when their tubs go green. I'm open to it being a possibility for some, but it just wasn't my case at all.




Edited by Josex (10/14/20 05:55 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Josex]
    #26984560 - 10/14/20 06:32 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

It's not just unclean spawn that leads to contaminated tubs and I keep seeing that parroted over and over that it's the spawn because people took "Trich has a hard time germinating on coir" to extremes. Anecdotal evidence is evidence of nothing.

Mold can grow on any surface when the air is stagnant and humid. Any surface. Do you honestly think disaster remediation folks look at the interior of a moldy car or basement and tell the average homeowner "Fuck bruh, looks like you need to address your spawn"

"Every house has mold spores"

No shit. There is however a huge difference between having growing mold sporulating actively and having what people would consider to be normal acceptable levels of airborne mold.

While I might not hold a TC tag I have worked in disaster remediation for over a decade and if someone from this community wants to tell me that coir is somehow more contamination resistant than metal ductwork, car upholstery or other non-organic surfaces then I'll ask them if they understand what cognitive dissonance means.

A monotub is the perfect environment for mold to flourish because the air IS relatively stagnant comparatively AND it's incredibly humid. If the air becomes saturated enough with mold spore I don't give a hoot how resistant you think your coir is or how clean your spawn is. You're going to develop mold on your substrate at some point and this chance scales with the amount of airborne contaminates.

I'll point again to having zero problems with contamination over a couple hundred monotubs this year UNTIL one went bad in a basement of 40+ and I was unable to remove it due to being hospitalized. I didn't address the tub when I had the chance and with the humid stagnant air in the basement there was no tubs uncontaminated. In the span of less than a week the walls, floor joists, some pipe, ductwork, hot water heater etc etc were covered in mold. There was spore in the air prior to this but nowhere near what there was once that bad tub had gone off.

If someone is having no problems with their grain jars but is having problems when spawning to bulk they should absolutely look at the air quality within their home because there is existence outside of cultivating mushrooms.

Bod, that monotub outside v.s. mold spores outside thing is.. what? Mold does not flourish when exposed to that much fresh air and UV from sunlight. That's specious reasoning.

Anyway, mold grows on any surface if the conditions are right and the spore load is high. Coir can grow mold just fine and dandy in warm, dark, stagnant air and if anyone tells you it can't ask them how in the everlivingfuck coir is more mold resistant than metal ductwork.





Edited by starbones (10/14/20 06:43 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineThe Mycologist
Explorer

Registered: 05/06/16
Posts: 3,024
Last seen: 29 days, 8 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones] * 1
    #26984566 - 10/14/20 06:38 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Coir doesnt allow any spores to germinate. But once spores germinate mold can grow onto coir and the things you mentioned.

I have had wet bags of coir for more than a year that didn't grow mold.

The mold has to germinate somewhere, and since coir isn't possible, it would be your spawn.


--------------------
"That you are here—that life exists, and identity;
That the powerful play goes on, and you will contribute a verse.”
― Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass
:acidfire::tmckenna:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: The Mycologist]
    #26984572 - 10/14/20 06:46 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Mycologist said:
Coir doesnt allow any spores to germinate. But once spores germinate mold can grow onto coir and the things you mentioned.

I have had wet bags of coir for more than a year that didn't grow mold.

The mold has to germinate somewhere, and since coir isn't possible, it would be your spawn.




Prove this. We've gone from
"Mold has a hard time germinating on coir"
to
"Mold germination on coir isn't possible"

Yet it's possible on rubber, metal, concrete and otherwise? Mold doesn't give a shit that it's coir it's looking for surface moisture to call home and it's absolutely not picky about what it will grow on.

If someones having mold issues they should look at their damned environment with as much scrutiny as their spawn because again, life exists outside of cultivating mushrooms. Your health and your home are worth thinking about first and foremost.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOne of Us
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 1,140
Last seen: 6 days, 16 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26984630 - 10/14/20 07:51 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I am pretty sure that a lot of coir bricks have added trich spores, but I can't say I have used any. I always use pet bedding, which I hear does not have added spores.

Here is some more really recent anecdotal evidence for the "grow room spore load doesn't matter" claim: Embracing the Trich

Gotta say I have similar experience as smartattack.  I am extremely lazy, and have had many tubs go solid green before finally tossing them out. But I haven't noticed it affecting my grows


--------------------
LAGM 2021
LAGM 2020
Trade List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26984641 - 10/14/20 07:59 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie said:

So, instead of blaming my sterile procedure, would someone please tell me how to sanitize a room without chemicals?




Before you start your clean you need to figure out how to remove the conditions that mold requires in your home. Increase your fresh air, lower your relative humidity, let more light in if possible.

If your home is more on the modern side and the HVAC is well designed consider a whole-home dehumidifier. If not then size a dehumidifier to your sqft. Does your kitchen have a vent over the stove? Bathroom(s) have vents? Stuff to think about.

As for chemicals well that's up to you but avoid things like bleach which will only make things worse. I know you don't want to go a chemical route but there's no getting away from it if things are bad. The best route of attack is a mold fogger and something like Concrobium which isn't at all scary. It's sodium carbonate, sodium triphosphate and I can't remember what else but it works well especially on porous surfaces. Moldex for spot treating.

Trying to keep airborne contaminates out of a home is a losing game the goal is to minimize them and keep them minimized by removing humidity, pockets of stagnant air and if possible allowing more sunlight in. You'll find on Shroomery some people will use false equivalencies to handwave someones growing space as not being a reason for failures. They're comparing a lit cigarette burning some blades of grass in a backyard to a full on grass fire and judging the grass fire not to be a problem because the lit cigarette isn't. If that makes sense. A few bees hanging around your porch ain't a problem but if there's a few thousand of the fuckers you're more likely gonna get a nest.

Putting the cultivating of mushrooms aside having clean air in your home is good for your body. Nobody needs to be walking around with some mildly inflamed airways if they've got mold issues and someone on the internet told them household mold wasn't an issue. That's an issue that only gets worse over time and you don't want to be sixty with lungs full of scar tissue.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleJosex
#cheat_code
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/13/15
Posts: 8,995
Loc: Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26984680 - 10/14/20 08:19 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Lol


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleJosex
#cheat_code
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/13/15
Posts: 8,995
Loc: Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Josex] * 2
    #26984695 - 10/14/20 08:33 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

And I'm not even going to bother explaining why I lol'd. This shit ain't worth my time. Will see myself out, thanks.

:shitdude:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineGan
Wielder of Narya
Male


Registered: 08/26/19
Posts: 927
Loc: Valinor
Last seen: 5 months, 27 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones] * 1
    #26984708 - 10/14/20 08:46 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

starbones said:

If someone is having no problems with their grain jars but is having problems when spawning to bulk they should absolutely look at the air quality within their home because there is existence outside of cultivating mushrooms.





To be fair, often times the issue is people think they have no issues with their grain jars, but in reality they're not 100% clean and they just dont see it. In their mind, they were perfect jars, so "it must be something else... it can't be my spawn."


Quote:

starbones said:

If someones having mold issues they should look at their damned environment with as much scrutiny as their spawn because again, life exists outside of cultivating mushrooms. Your health and your home are worth thinking about first and foremost.




In a cultivation sense, I dont think I agree with looking at the environment with as much scrutiny as the spawn.

100% healthy spawn + moldy environment = 1 flush... maybe 2.

Dirty ass spawn + perfectly clean room = contamed out before 50% colonization.

However, as it pertains to health benefits, then yeah I agree. Dont skimp out on your lungs.


--------------------



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Josex]
    #26984715 - 10/14/20 08:51 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Just listen to josex then, contamination comes only from unclean spawn. Mold does not grow on inorganic and organic surfaces in a home unless it somehow involves grain spawn. Had a banana go south on me the other day, those assholes at Dole better work on their spawn.

Once had to clean a basement full of mold because a hoarder kept putting her deceased cats down there and I fuckin' told her next time to make sure those cats were stuffed with CLEAN oats.

Use your head instead of being dismissive josex. Monotubs do not mold only from shit spawn, nobody is saying it doesn't cause it but to claim it is the only way makes about as much sense as a duck in crotchless panties.

There is nothing fuckin wrong with minimizing mold in a home and I keep repeating to put mushroom cultivation to the side on this point. Do not live in filth and do your best to minimize the amount of mold spore you inhale in a day. Why is health and cleanliness a point of contention with you folks?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26984726 - 10/14/20 08:59 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Gan my problem isn't with the birds claiming bad spawn leads to contamination it is with the stupid fucking replies like..

"It's your spawn" that is constantly repeated. Like fuck me it the guy wants to clean his home at the same time. What kind of assbackwards logic is that yknow?

Speaking in such an absolute that it is the spawn makes no fucking sense to me. It is just a dumb parroted meme at this point and as I pointed out earlier in this thread it leads to very stupid statements like trich cannot germinate on coir which is now the progression from people saying it has a difficult time. So which is it? Difficult or impossible? I mean fuck the way the chinese telephone game works around here with this stuff it will go from..

Trich has a hard time germinating on coir.
To
Trich cannot germinate on coir (We are here)
To
Trich doesn't exist.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineCanebrake
Stranger
Registered: 05/01/20
Posts: 96
Last seen: 5 months, 12 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26984727 - 10/14/20 09:00 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I don't know if it helps but I do run a hepa filter in my grow room. I run it for about an hour before I do anything in there and I turn the A/C off at the same time. Since doing so My trich contam has reduced. Maybe it  helped maybe by procedures got better. Either way I/'m going to keep doing it.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOne of Us
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 1,140
Last seen: 6 days, 16 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Canebrake] * 1
    #26984744 - 10/14/20 09:12 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I use coir to germ my vegetable seedlings in the late winter.  Some of the superhot peppers I grow have taken longer than 2 months just to germ. Thats two months of perfectly moist coir in a domed seedling tray, so humidity is there as well. And that's not considering the time they stay in that same coir until transplant.
I have never had mold problems with those. I also germ my seeds in my cult room. So plenty of spores in there

I don't think anyone is arguing that a substantial spore load can be detrimental to your own health though.


--------------------
LAGM 2021
LAGM 2020
Trade List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: One of Us]
    #26984766 - 10/14/20 09:27 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Which is completely fair but from my own experience I've had coir go bugshit with mold when I tried to store it in a sealed Home Depot bucket after I made too much, after that I started leaving it in a cooler with the lid wide open and never had that issue again. Now I can't do anything with this information because it's anecdotal and not scientific.

I do know for me as I've written in a post about cleaning my basement that I will not use iffy coir anymore and I won't spawn anything remotely questionable from grain. I've never said that bad spawn won't cause mold issues, I believe entirely it WILL but I do know that I won't take the chance of having one contaminate from ANY source and keep it where I grow. I've been down this road. Once the spore load in the air gets high enough things will contaminate regardless of how clean your spawn is. It's the height of ignorance and stupidity for people to claim that somehow coir will be immune if your spawn is clean while simultaneously mold is growing on metal ductwork in the same room.

We'd all be better off, especially those newer to this if people would stop just slamdunking "It's your spawn". We can't say to check two things?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: starbones]
    #26984855 - 10/14/20 10:36 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/14/20 11:25 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineGan
Wielder of Narya
Male


Registered: 08/26/19
Posts: 927
Loc: Valinor
Last seen: 5 months, 27 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie] * 1
    #26984933 - 10/14/20 11:24 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie said:






You can say it's not your spawn, but none of those jars look ideal or 100% clean.

Are they fine to spawn to a tub? I would IF I had no other available spawn. But I'd also expect them to contam out pretty quick. So if the jars you are spawning look like that, then that is one of your main problems.

That may not be what you're showing with the pictures and if I'm assuming wrong then my b.

I'm just saying if all your spawn looks similar to those picture then I'd start there.


--------------------



Edited by Gan (10/14/20 11:30 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleJosex
#cheat_code
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/13/15
Posts: 8,995
Loc: Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26984939 - 10/14/20 11:27 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie



It’s the air.







No, it's not. It's your spawn. Those jars are thoroughly fucked right left and center. You spawn those and you cultivate mold, guaranteed.

Thank god you have starbones to give you some confirmation bias, so you can keep deluding yourself... :facepalm:

Quote:

Josex said:


It's your spawn dude, the sooner you learn this the better. I don't know if your sterile technique is good or not but I know your grain prep is garbage, fix that.




:whathesaid:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Gan]
    #26984941 - 10/14/20 11:28 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/14/20 11:32 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleJosex
#cheat_code
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/13/15
Posts: 8,995
Loc: Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26984953 - 10/14/20 11:35 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

That's an English idiom (left,right and center) meaning "totally/completely". Those three jars are garbage.

Listen, the sooner you learn/admit you're a noob and need help the sooner you'll say goodbye to all those problems you're having.

All your posts make me cringe all over because of your attitude.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleJosex
#cheat_code
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/13/15
Posts: 8,995
Loc: Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Josex]
    #26984958 - 10/14/20 11:38 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Also, what's up with the filter on those jars. Please tell me that's not cotton I'm seeing.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOne of Us
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 1,140
Last seen: 6 days, 16 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Gan]
    #26984964 - 10/14/20 11:41 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Yep.

Bacterial spawn leads to mold in tubs. Trich is a parasitic mold that grows on other fungus, this is the reason coir is so resistant to trich; it needs another fungus to grow.

Bacterial spawn causes the mycelium to grow weakly, giving trich a chance to strike.  100% healthy spawn will never be vulnerable to trich, until after a flush or two when it is less vigorous.

Maybe you had success in the beginning because there were no trich spores to take advantage of the weak bacterial mycelium. Trich is mostly found in houses where people cult. I've never seen it until I started growing (months after I started actually). Now that you have introduced trich into your household, the bacterial spawn has a much, much lower chance of success. At least, that's my theory. The same kinda thing happened to me until I REALLY dialed in my grain prep


--------------------
LAGM 2021
LAGM 2020
Trade List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Josex]
    #26984980 - 10/14/20 11:49 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/14/20 11:53 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemeowjinx
Stranger
Male
Registered: 05/20/19
Posts: 492
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26984985 - 10/14/20 11:54 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I think parasitic molds like Trich would have a much better shot of growing on "clean spawn" than non-parasitic molds

There are a lot of species of mold, it's impossible to say that NO species of mold spore can germinate on hydrated, non-pasteurized coir

Anecdotal evidence is great for mushroom cultivators, but it's not the same thing as actual scientific consensus. If mold spores can germinate on coir and the mold mycelium can parasitize the spawn mycelium, I don't see it as impossible for some molds, under certain circumstances, to contaminate a grow w/ clean spawn

Has anyone actually inoculated Bucket Tek coir w/ conidia of EVERY Trich species, of which there are dozens, and verified that there was no germination?

It would be much harder for non-parasitic molds to take over a tub in the same circumstances. It would be merely competing for nutrients w/ the cubes, not actively feeding on the cubes. If spawn is legit clean then it would be extremely hard for these types of molds to do much even if they could germinate on coir. The germinated spores would just die of starvation or something


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: meowjinx]
    #26985002 - 10/14/20 12:06 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleJosex
#cheat_code
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/13/15
Posts: 8,995
Loc: Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26985004 - 10/14/20 12:07 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie said:
Quote:

Josex said:
Listen, the sooner you learn/admit you're a noob and need help the sooner you'll say goodbye to all those problems you're having.

All your posts make me cringe all over because of your attitude.




Except for you didn’t write anything helpful and didn’t answer my question but went personal, your post was so amazing and helpful.

Quote:

Josex said:
Also, what's up with the filter on those jars. Please tell me that's not cotton I'm seeing.




It’s called the polyfill. You can google for it. People use it for pillows and mushroom cultivation.

Quote:

One of Us said:
Bacterial spawn leads to mold in tubs. Trich is a parasitic mold that grows on other fungus, this is the reason coir is so resistant to trich; it needs another fungus to grow.

Bacterial spawn causes the mycelium to grow weakly, giving trich a chance to strike.  100% healthy spawn will never be vulnerable to trich, until after a flush or two when it is less vigorous.

Maybe you had success in the beginning because there were no trich spores to take advantage of the weak bacterial mycelium.




You are right about most of what you wrote. I used to have bacteria issues, and it still happens, but I think it’s easy to recognize it by look and smell. The smell comes through the filter.

Although I don’t see the problem with the last three jars on the photo, I uploaded it because I’m open to learn. What’s wrong with them?





I use polyfil for my jars, that's why I asked. That doesn't look like polyfil.

I didn't answer your question because it's built upon bullshit assumptions, that "it's the air".

My answer to you was to address the real problem: your spawn.
The fact that you can't see my answer as helpful only goes to show that you are one hell of a deluded noob and certainly "beyond repair", like you said to someone that one time...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOne of Us
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 1,140
Last seen: 6 days, 16 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26985024 - 10/14/20 12:15 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie said:

Although I don’t see the problem with the last three jars on the photo, I uploaded it because I’m open to learn. What’s wrong with them?




They have kind of a wet look to them, some of the infamous wet grains pressed against the side. There is also some gel looking stuff.

Also, not all bacteria stinks.  In fact, most of the bacteria I experience has a sweet,  honeysuckle like smell. This can be hard to differentiate from regular myc smell sometimes.


--------------------
LAGM 2021
LAGM 2020
Trade List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Josex]
    #26985025 - 10/14/20 12:17 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleJHOVA
Post whore
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/17/17
Posts: 4,727
Loc: Flag
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie] * 1
    #26985038 - 10/14/20 12:23 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Your jars are fucked by bacteria. Relook at grain prep, and sterile technique. Your polyfil looks looser than a Tijuana hooker. Stuff it tight and folded over.


--------------------
🅃 🄴 🄰 🄼    🄲 🄻 🄸 🄽 🄶 🅆 🅁 🄰 🄿


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineseand04
It is what it is
 User Gallery


Registered: 12/02/13
Posts: 1,457
Last seen: 15 hours, 29 minutes
Re: Room air purification [Re: The Mycologist]
    #26985043 - 10/14/20 12:26 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Mycologist said:
Coir doesnt allow any spores to germinate. But once spores germinate mold can grow onto coir and the things you mentioned.

I have had wet bags of coir for more than a year that didn't grow mold.

The mold has to germinate somewhere, and since coir isn't possible, it would be your spawn.



Exacto,  I have had prepared coir in a bucket for months and it dosent grow anything


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: One of Us]
    #26985051 - 10/14/20 12:30 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Josex]
    #26985060 - 10/14/20 12:36 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Josex said:

All your posts make me cringe all over because of your attitude.




Why are you giving him shit about his attitude when you're so completely oblivious to yours? I thought you walked away from this thread like a damned child earlier in some passive aggressive way?

Again, contamination in monotubs does not stem solely from bad spawn because josex believes in his heart of hearts that it does. I don't know how much further I can dumb it down or use analogy to explain this to you. Nobody is saying bad spawn doesn't cause contamination but it's ignorant to say it's always the source of contamination. You completely gloss over things like pointing out that mold on coir happens regardless of your personal beliefs and that you're willfully ignorant to think that coir cannot grow mold when mold itself is perfectly capable of germinating on porous inorganic matter, sheet metal etc.

Is his a case of bad spawn? The probability is high if that's the spawn he uses but that's not purely an evidence based conclusion. It's conjecture.  Is everyone's problems due to bad spawn? No, not only no but fuck no josex.

Coir growing moldy is nothing new to anyone who has used it as hydroponic media for cannabis cultivation.

It's disingenuous to the pursuit of knowledge to keep parroting "Spawn, spawn, spawn" as the be all, end all source of mold in a monotub. Did anyone say it's not a factor? Of course it is. Does that mean that EVERY SINGLE MONOTUB contaminates due to bad spawn? Are you that completely out to lunch on your own personal beliefs?

Again, going back to the attitude thing. You've got one helluva short stool to stand on throwing around claims others have bad attitudes.

Stop. Back up, go smoke a joint and take a nap if you need to because OP or anyone else in this thread did nothing for you to be on the attack. If he wants to clean his fucking home there is no problem with that. Absolutely none. If it doesn't work well that's something he'll have to deal with at that juncture and worst case scenario he cleaned his home. Why the fuck is it taboo with you parrots to mention having a clean home is a good idea to? Put all this damnable effort into cultivating mushrooms and tolerate living in a home where the fucking blinds are rotting off. Madness.

My fucking god.

Edit: And again there's another claim that mold cannot germinate on coir. Wasn't it RR that said that it has a difficult time? Cannot and difficult are not the same fucking thing. However now that one person has said it, another agreed it now becomes fact to someone reading it for the first time.

Mold can germinate on coir. I have no doubt that coir does possess a modicum of anti-fungal properties but nothing absolutely bulletproof. Do you look at a water-resistant camera and think it's the same was water-proof? Madness.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleJosex
#cheat_code
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/13/15
Posts: 8,995
Loc: Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie] * 1
    #26985080 - 10/14/20 12:45 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie

If you can’t recognize polyfill on the photo, it might be pointless to ask you to tell me what’s wrong with the jars.





Lol, keep making up stupid correlations. Nobody makes poly filters that loose, that's why it's easy to mistake it for something else in a pic with a white wall behind.

Those jars are trash, and any person that has any kind of experience growing mushrooms could easily tell.
You deserve to grow mold. I'm out.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleJosex
#cheat_code
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/13/15
Posts: 8,995
Loc: Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Josex] * 3
    #26985088 - 10/14/20 12:49 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Starnoob, I'm not gonna read that outrageous wall of text full of crap. Fuck you too.
:highfive:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineCamera93
We got dicks like Jesus
I'm a teapot


Registered: 08/15/18
Posts: 3,220
Last seen: 10 days, 11 hours
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Josex] * 1
    #26985093 - 10/14/20 12:54 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Starbone***, are you implying that clean spawn, spawned to bulk has the potential to succumb to mold from an areas spore load?

the appearing "wetter" is condensation created from the heat that myc produces, in jar or on plate

**again, sorry for this misnaming.


--------------------
All I need are some tasty waves, a cool buzz, and I’m fine.

Whatever you decide won’t really impact our survival
Close your eyes, and do the best that you can



Edited by Camera93 (10/14/20 01:42 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineCamera93
We got dicks like Jesus
I'm a teapot


Registered: 08/15/18
Posts: 3,220
Last seen: 10 days, 11 hours
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie] * 1
    #26985106 - 10/14/20 01:01 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie said:
In my experience, the source of the bacteria is the shaking. Yes, the too wet grain is a paradise for them, there is no doubt about that.

They usually appeared after shaking. I think they can get through the filter if the shaking is strong. Recently, I either not shake it. or I do it gently. Also, I wait until the top of the grain gets colonized.




The bacteria is not "getting in" and appearing after shaking. If there is bacteria present (either from insufficient sterilization, ridding along the culture, or poor sterile technique) its being spread after shaking making it much more noticeable


--------------------
All I need are some tasty waves, a cool buzz, and I’m fine.

Whatever you decide won’t really impact our survival
Close your eyes, and do the best that you can



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinefootpath
ὕδωρχοίρος

Registered: 07/16/19
Posts: 1,367
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: Camera93] * 5
    #26985114 - 10/14/20 01:06 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

starbones said:
Does that mean that EVERY SINGLE MONOTUB contaminates due to bad spawn?




The way that we grow says, essentially, yes.
We're not preventing contamination of the substrate, we're promoting a desired culture's ability to out-compete other cultures in the colonization of the substrate.
That requires axenic spawn of said desired culture.

Until you apply that concept, you're only shadowboxing.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Camera93]
    #26985117 - 10/14/20 01:09 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Camera93 said:
Starnoob, are you implying that clean spawn, spawned to bulk has the potential to succumb to mold from an areas spore load?

the appearing "wetter" is condensation created from the heat that myc produces, in jar or on plate




Starting off with an insult is pretty awful of you.

I'm absolutely stating this yes because coir is not mold proof, it's mold resistant and you're playing a game of numbers at all times. When those numbers wander upwards you're increasing the chance for coir to mold. To say coir does not mold is a fallacy. We've gone from, and I'm really putting emphasis on this here we've gone FROM someone like RR stating things like trichoderma has a hard time germinating to people claiming that it simply doesn't. So who is right? RR.

Mold spore will germinate on damp surfaces if the conditions are correct. To say coir is more mold resistant than sheet metal, ABS plastic or concrete is borderline mental illness.

I'm astounded the logical leaps people are making here to think that I somehow don't believe bad spawn causes contamination when I have said outright it does, fullstop. I'm saying it's not the only reason and again, why is cleaning your fucking home so taboo around here?

If your home has a mold problem fucking fix it, who gives a piss about mushroom cultivation? You don't breathe that shit long term without severe consequences. I'm on Montelukast, Pulmicort, Atrovent, Salbutamol and supplemental oxygen to keep what's left of my lungs functioning because I worked dealing with that shit for over a decade.

Clean spawn, clean home. Those sound like two tastes that go great together.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: starbones]
    #26985125 - 10/14/20 01:14 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/14/20 01:20 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26985136 - 10/14/20 01:19 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Don't know, most bacteria is easy enough to spot and I'll toss those jars before I do anything with them. Bacteria can hide in mycellium though there's a really good thread on it I can't find where a fella was working on agar and showing how things can "piggyback" mycellium.

I'm not disagreeing with anyone here about your spawn being a culprit so please don't take anything I've written to be validation it's anything else. I'm trying to defend the fuckin basic act of cleaning someones home from mold.

All I can tell you is coir is a not mold-proof, beyond that it's up to other people to fill you in. I do know when you buy coir you're not getting 100% husk material and there are other inclusions. I've found all sorts of shit in Beats Peat and like bod says, these things are made with very little quality control. (He was referring to weight but you get the idea).

If you got a house full of mold clean that regardless of what you do as a hobby.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOne of Us
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 1,140
Last seen: 6 days, 16 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones] * 2
    #26985138 - 10/14/20 01:20 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Mold can grow on concrete and sheet metal because of the dust on them. If those areas were clean, mold wouldn't grow on them.

Mold grows on coir in hydroponic systems because: 1 the coir used for hydro is supplemented with extra trich spores, because 2 it grows on the roots and benefits the root system. It is mycorrhizal. It is parasitic to other fungi but beneficial to plants. Pure coir is very resistant to trich. The trich either grows on other myc or on plant roots in the case of ponics.


--------------------
LAGM 2021
LAGM 2020
Trade List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineCamera93
We got dicks like Jesus
I'm a teapot


Registered: 08/15/18
Posts: 3,220
Last seen: 10 days, 11 hours
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26985145 - 10/14/20 01:23 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

starbones said:
Quote:

Camera93 said:
Starnoob, are you implying that clean spawn, spawned to bulk has the potential to succumb to mold from an areas spore load?

the appearing "wetter" is condensation created from the heat that myc produces, in jar or on plate




Starting off with an insult is pretty awful of you.





:lolwut:

I didn't insult anyone, I just stated a question

Quote:

starbones said:

I'm absolutely stating this yes because coir is not mold proof, it's mold resistant and you're playing a game of numbers at all times. When those numbers wander upwards you're increasing the chance for coir to mold.




Hence the importance of clean spawn...

its just odd, you would think the boards would have loads of documented experiences of otherwise healthy subs giving way to mold

what I have seen on the boards are example of tubs and bags side by side with 1 triched out and the other flushing along nicely :

Quote:

Boogieman47 said:


Another reason I love these bags .. notice anything?? Second flush




No one is trying to argue against living in a healthy environment, but this is mush cult not Physical and Mental Well-Being the focus here is rainbow farming.


--------------------
All I need are some tasty waves, a cool buzz, and I’m fine.

Whatever you decide won’t really impact our survival
Close your eyes, and do the best that you can



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemeowjinx
Stranger
Male
Registered: 05/20/19
Posts: 492
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: One of Us]
    #26985148 - 10/14/20 01:24 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Camera93 said:
Starnoob, are you implying that clean spawn, spawned to bulk has the potential to succumb to mold from an areas spore load?

the appearing "wetter" is condensation created from the heat that myc produces, in jar or on plate




This could be tested experimentally. Get a moldy, sporulating monotub and lay down fully-colonized pastyplates (or any form of agar plate) and place them inside the monotub w/ FAE allowed between the agar plate and the sporulating mold tub. You could add a small amount coir to the top of the colonized agar too. Only hitch is that you would need to be sure the agar plate is actually clean

As long as there's no physical contact between the mold and the mycelium then we can be sure that it's the mold's spores germinating and not the mold mycelium itself. It would be sort of like putting BRF cakes inside a SGFC. Except it would be agar plates inside of a moldy tub

Not that I actually think anyone will ever attempt such a weirdass experiment. Just saying that if we're all gonna call what we do "mycology" and not just mushroom-growing then we should use the scientific method to answer specific questions


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: starbones]
    #26985152 - 10/14/20 01:26 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/14/20 01:31 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Camera93]
    #26985169 - 10/14/20 01:37 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Camera93 said:

:lolwut:

I didn't insult anyone, I just stated a question





Quote:

Camera93 said:
Starnoob, "





:rolleyes:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineCamera93
We got dicks like Jesus
I'm a teapot


Registered: 08/15/18
Posts: 3,220
Last seen: 10 days, 11 hours
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26985174 - 10/14/20 01:40 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

starbones said:
Quote:

Camera93 said:

:lolwut:

I didn't insult anyone, I just stated a question





Quote:

Camera93 said:
Starnoob, "





:rolleyes:





I honestly apologize for that! The post above me had your name as such and I didn't scroll up higher to see your post with name :facepalm3:  and it went over my head that it was an insult
I am sorry :crazy:


--------------------
All I need are some tasty waves, a cool buzz, and I’m fine.

Whatever you decide won’t really impact our survival
Close your eyes, and do the best that you can



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Camera93]
    #26985198 - 10/14/20 01:52 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

All good now you see why I gave josex the rating I did. I have no doubt he's a smart person but his attitude and insults are the most elitist head-up-ass-ignorant garbage. He gas-lit the OP about the OPs apparent attitude while simultaneously having an absolutely rancid one himself. Nothing but dismissive, passive aggressive and insulting towards the OP, myself and I'm sure if he hadn't picked up his ball and gone home for the second time now someone else would be on the receiving end of it.

I really fucking need to reiterate that I'm not claiming mold in monotub does not originate from unclean spawn. I'm saying that claims are being made in this thread that aren't true. That coir is mold-proof, that airborne spores cannot be a source of contamination etc.

If people really want to die on this hill that coir is now completely contaminate proof from airborne mold I'll take that bet and the next time I get a jar of green I'll fill three shoeboxes and place them in an 86qt monotub. One shoebox with nothing but contaminated oats, one shoebox with clean spawned mixed with coir and one shoebox with nothing but coir.

I guarantee you inside of a week it's all completely fucked.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinefootpath
ὕδωρχοίρος

Registered: 07/16/19
Posts: 1,367
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones] * 1
    #26985206 - 10/14/20 01:55 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie said:

And what about the parasitic species that cannot be out-competed since they grow on the desired mycelium?

Let me note it again that six of seven Amazonian, fully colonized, already fruiting PF-cakes developed Trich and green mold. The Trich came first.




Why would something that grows on a specific host be growing on something other than the specific host?
Sure, it could have spores or endospores in/on any given media, but the idea is that you grow out your culture before it can germinate/replicate enough to impede your culture. Just like every other contamination.

You're almost 100% guaranteed to not have clean spawn with PF-Tek because you most likely used a spore syringe, which is nothing remotely close to the process of culturing and eliminating competition to ensure clean spawn.
Your source had whatever presented itself later in the substrate. You saying, 'the trich came first', just means you had "trich" in with your spore solution... which is nothing new at all.

I believe the persistence of your issue is that you are not adequately cleaning your cultures on agar before adding them to grain. As the majority has said.

Of course a clean, more-mold-free house is nice and more habitable. But it is not the root cause of your issue.

Ultimately, you have to remove and replace any building materials that are mold-compromised to really do an adequate job of remediation.
But, to keep them at bay...
• Do a borax rub - mix enough water with enough borax to make a paste and spread it on the infected areas.
• Add dehumidifiers to those compromised areas - don't skimp on this... consumer-grade dehumidifiers are only so effective. You'll want industrial from a brand like Santa Fe to really be sure that it's performing adequately.
• Once the borax-rubbed areas have sufficiently dried, cover them with a mold-resistant paint like Zinsser (Kilz is water-based, so I tend to not recommend it.)
• If necessary (in areas such as unfinished crawl spaces), you'll want to encapsulate your area in a thick (12mm) poly-film with a moisture felt underneath.
Adequate airflow, low RH%, and light usually are your best friends in keeping mold from growing/sporulating. Otherwise, to do it right - rip shit out.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOne of Us
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 1,140
Last seen: 6 days, 16 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26985211 - 10/14/20 01:58 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

One of Us said:
It is parasitic to other fungi but beneficial to plants. Pure coir is very resistant to trich. The trich either grows on other myc or on plant roots in the case of ponics.





That’s why it makes no sense to blindly shout "It’s your spawn!" when the contamination is parasitic.

100% colonization may even help it grow.




Not if it was healthy. Healthy myc can fight it off.

If the myc in the spawn is growing weakly due to bacteria as I mentioned earlier, then the trich can take over.

Similarly, with clean spawn, the trich doesn't show up until after later flushes when the myc is less vigorous.

Clean air is good, but not necessary for one or two flushes ,where most of the yield is anyway. If you want 4-6 flushes then maybe you should look at cleaning your air.

Also, less spores is better for your health


--------------------
LAGM 2021
LAGM 2020
Trade List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: footpath]
    #26985266 - 10/14/20 02:26 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/14/20 02:36 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26985293 - 10/14/20 02:40 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Cleaning the carpet is one idea but removing carpet is a much better one. I don't mean because of your situation I mean in general.

Carpets are bullshit in general. Just a breeding ground for dust mites and all sorts of other breathable garbage. This is a conversation for the DIY/Home Improvement section though.

Fuck me I once removed carpet from an unsealed basement slab and it had become so infested with all sorts of nasty shit that while rolling it up to bag this black ooze of decomposing/decomposing organic material was seeping out of it. That ended up being a gut job all the way to the foundation.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineGan
Wielder of Narya
Male


Registered: 08/26/19
Posts: 927
Loc: Valinor
Last seen: 5 months, 27 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Gan]
    #26985326 - 10/14/20 02:53 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I'll quote again something I said earlier in the thread, as it is more relevant now even than when I first said it.

Quote:


To be fair, often times the issue is people think they have no issues with their grain jars, but in reality they're not 100% clean and they just dont see it. In their mind, they were perfect jars, so "it must be something else... it can't be my spawn."




The reason I said this was not meant to be an insult of any kind. It's just the truth and part of learning the hobby. The reason why you will see me saying "check your spawn" on posts like this is simply due to the fact that the majority of the time that is where the primary problem (notice the underline) is. And once again, that rings true with this post as it does seem that your spawn is less than ideal.

You were asking for how myself and others can tell so that you can learn:
Quote:






  • The amount of moisture is the most obvious clue with these jars. As you've said, myc does indeed cause a little condensation as it colonizes and that is to be expected. However, when there is as much moisture as is seen in these pictures it can mean a bacterial infection is present. Additionally, grain that is that wet will not foster an optimal environment so your myc may colonize it but it won't be as healthy as it should be nor will it be as vigorous as you would like. This lack of health can cause it to be more vulnerable to contaminants.
  • For the middle jar, the thickness of the myc is concerning to me. The fact that I can't see any of the individual grains at all and that there is no "texture" to the jar. Almost just a large glob of mycelium, instead of a sheet of myc draped over the grains, still allowing you to see some individual grains and the nooks and crannies between the grains. I hope that makes sense. Although, with WBS I will say that myc typically engulfs the individual grains more than it does with larger grain sizes, so it can look a little thicker. Also, how it's shrinking and receding from the edges of the jars is not ideal.
  • Conversely, the thin looking feature of the myc on the left and right jars let me know that the myc isn't nearly as strong and healthy as it should be. Once again, this could have a lot to do with the amount of moisture. Let your grains dry out a lot. Especially with oats. You will not lose your moisture on the inside of your grain (and that's where it matters), but you will allow the outside to dry off a lot.


There obviously are many other factors but I can't type a book. You'll learn them as you go.

Honestly, the jar you posted of the rye looks much better. I couldn't say if it is clean without a picture of it once it hits full colonization, cause sometimes nasties can hide until the end.

As odd as it may sound, some extra mold spores in your grow space may actually be causing you problems because your spawn isn't clean and healthy enough to fight it off like it should be able to. Get your cultures cleaned up and I think you'll notice a world of difference. It took me a while to train my eye to spot clean growth and I still have stuff slip by me all the time. Either due to laziness, lack of observance, or having no prior experience with that issue.

I say "check your spawn" not because there aren't other factors that can cause problems, but because good spawn is the foundation. Once you dial that in, you may notice 90% of your contam problems go away (unless you are fruiting in a real shit place). Then you can focus on the final 10% to perfect everything. In the meantime, sure grab an air filter. Even if it doesn't help your grow, it'll help your lungs and peace of mind.

Good luck and stick with it


--------------------



Edited by Gan (10/14/20 03:09 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOne of Us
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 1,140
Last seen: 6 days, 16 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26985351 - 10/14/20 03:07 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

And if time is money, you would realize it is much more efficient use of space and time to toss a tub after 2-3 flushes, because this is like 90%+ of you yield. True efficiency is replacing those tubs after 2-3 flushes and replacing with other fresh tubs ready for their first flush.  If you spawn every week, you'll eventually be harvesting every week. If you spawn every day you'll eventually be harvesting every day, etc.

Tossing jars is a waste of time, but it can be completely avoided if your grain prep and sterile technique are perfected.

I used to have a situation similar to josex's. My porch/entry room had a terrible leak (literally like a waterfall when it rained). The walls were always moist and literally every square inch was covered in sporulating mold. Mushrooms grew from the floorboards. 

Now I didn't cult in this room, but I did have to walk through it every time I entered the house, bringing spores with me on my clothes. I was worried about that room preventing me from cultivating, but never lost a tub without a flush first. That is, until I first introduced trich into my house, but I fixed my grain prep and rusty jar lids that wouldn't twist on more than a quarter inch, and now that is a thing of the past. Before that, I lost EVERY SINGLE TUB to trich during or before the first flush.

Also, you don't have to toss the jars completely. You can spawn them to their own shoeboxes in a 1:1 ratio and still get some fruits. This is what I did until I figured out my errors.


--------------------
LAGM 2021
LAGM 2020
Trade List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Gan]
    #26985370 - 10/14/20 03:20 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/14/20 03:31 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: One of Us]
    #26985389 - 10/14/20 03:31 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26985403 - 10/14/20 03:40 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Any monotub tek says dial it in. You did the teks wrong if your tubs get too much FAE. Which is the easiest problem to fix. Restrict the holes


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinefootpath
ὕδωρχοίρος

Registered: 07/16/19
Posts: 1,367
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26985407 - 10/14/20 03:42 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I dunno where you live, but, in a lot of places, it's illegal to rent out moldy housing... Rather, landowners have the legal obligation to remediate mold as part of Use and Occupancy laws.
I know drawing in your landlord/lady is generally the last thing you want to do when engaging in the illicit, but it could be a way to remedy your air quality situation at no cost to you. Although, depending on the owner, a lot of them will just say, 'fuck it, I'll rent to someone who doesn't complain me into $1000's in mold remediation.'
Just a thought. It could be as simple as postponing your cultivation for a couple months. But it could jeopardize your stability.

Obviously, giving reason for your landlord/lady to scrutinize your living in their property isn't always the best, but, depending on the individual... they might have the incentive or decency to work with you.
But, if your main concern is growing, keep quiet and work on that clean spawn.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: footpath] * 3
    #26985410 - 10/14/20 03:45 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Make a clean area inside your house to grow in. Like a monotub


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleBecky G. Spot
Good Necky Becky

Registered: 10/12/20
Posts: 111
Loc: The Sunny Side
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie] * 1
    #26985428 - 10/14/20 03:54 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I was a little scared to jump into this very aggressive love fest boys. Just sayin'... Anyways. Kisses all around, line up.

Quote:

Vylie said:
the source of the bacteria is the shaking.




Gotta disagree on this one...

:iloveyou:

:heart:XOXOX:heart:


--------------------
- Becky G.

Ditch the double standards boys. Girls like to have fun as much as you do.





Sisters if you find yourself hating, read my bio.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineahlexiahh.432
smurf
Female

Registered: 10/14/20
Posts: 1
Loc: cloud 108, big sky countr... Flag
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: Gan]
    #26985499 - 10/14/20 04:28 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Such good info wowza :blush: once you brush past all the sensitivity and misinterpretation in this thread..... magnificent information appears! lmao ;p *jokes*


--------------------
the past does not define who I am inside :heart:
.
*
:mushroom2:
.
*
NOOBIE NATION :confused: lol


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleSmartattack
C'mon man
 User Gallery


Registered: 12/21/18
Posts: 3,775
Loc: A thought
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: ahlexiahh.432] * 1
    #26986029 - 10/14/20 09:10 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Apparently while I was off making my own thread about farming trich on purpose I missed out on all this fun. The irony that I started this thread yesterday. Im not here to argue with anybody because I dont care about anyone else's point of view enough to do so but Ill just leave this here as my personal experiment that was months long.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26986012/vc/1#26986012


--------------------
* Smarts videos :teacher:
* :thumbup: Planet of the APES:thumbup:
 
I'm a fungal white supremacist.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleBecky G. Spot
Good Necky Becky

Registered: 10/12/20
Posts: 111
Loc: The Sunny Side
Re: Room air purification [Re: Smartattack]
    #26986033 - 10/14/20 09:13 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Smartattack said:
Im not here to argue with anybody because I dont care about anyone else's point of view enough to do so




It's nice to know you care :lol:

:heart:XOXOX:heart:

P.S. - Just looked at that planet of apes! :thumbup:


--------------------
- Becky G.

Ditch the double standards boys. Girls like to have fun as much as you do.





Sisters if you find yourself hating, read my bio.


Edited by Becky G. Spot (10/14/20 09:16 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleSmartattack
C'mon man
 User Gallery


Registered: 12/21/18
Posts: 3,775
Loc: A thought
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Becky G. Spot]
    #26986043 - 10/14/20 09:18 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I really dont mean that like a dick.


--------------------
* Smarts videos :teacher:
* :thumbup: Planet of the APES:thumbup:
 
I'm a fungal white supremacist.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleBecky G. Spot
Good Necky Becky

Registered: 10/12/20
Posts: 111
Loc: The Sunny Side
Re: Room air purification [Re: Smartattack]
    #26986069 - 10/14/20 09:32 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I totally believe you I was just having a laugh.

My brother is the same way, talking smack is his love language :lol:


--------------------
- Becky G.

Ditch the double standards boys. Girls like to have fun as much as you do.





Sisters if you find yourself hating, read my bio.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female
Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Camera93]
    #26986353 - 10/15/20 02:11 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/15/20 02:18 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26986446 - 10/15/20 04:58 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Heated carpet. Sounds like something that should be a code violation


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26986487 - 10/15/20 06:06 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/15/20 06:14 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie] * 1
    #26986573 - 10/15/20 07:51 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

They learned that millions of years ago. They do an excellent job surviving and growing in conditions suitable for them


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemeowjinx
Stranger
Male
Registered: 05/20/19
Posts: 492
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: footpath]
    #26986760 - 10/15/20 10:20 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

footpath said:
Quote:

Vylie said:

And what about the parasitic species that cannot be out-competed since they grow on the desired mycelium?

Let me note it again that six of seven Amazonian, fully colonized, already fruiting PF-cakes developed Trich and green mold. The Trich came first.




Why would something that grows on a specific host be growing on something other than the specific host?





This is sort of outside of the subject of this thread, but Trich isn't a parasite in the same sense as, say, a virus is. Which has a very specific type of host cell, or at least range of cells and can somewhat co-exist with its host without killing it (most of the time)

Trich behaves more like a predator when it comes to attacking other fungi. It's been tested against many different species of fungi and has fucked most of them up. It produces a lot of enzymes called Chitinases, which degrade the polyer Chitin. Chitin is what makes up the cell wall of pretty much all fungal cells. Since all  species of fungus depend on some form of Chitin to exist, Trich has an extremely wide range of fungal species it can attack. Basically grows over and in between the host's mycelium, excreting these cell wall-degrading enzymes

A traditional parasite would maybe not be as vicious as Trich is w/ other fungi, because it would depend on its host surviving in order for itself to survive. But with Trich it's already living symbiotically with plant roots, which provide it nutrients. It can fuck up other fungi and it just provides more nutrients for the plant roots, which in turn is good for the Trich

Honestly, I started reading up on Trich just to be able to eliminate it as a contam, but I kept reading papers on it and it is a pretty interesting genus of fungus, aside from its role as a grow ruiner. It's basically the darling of the agricultural world. Fuck plants


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: meowjinx]
    #26986771 - 10/15/20 10:25 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/15/20 10:29 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemeowjinx
Stranger
Male
Registered: 05/20/19
Posts: 492
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26986804 - 10/15/20 10:40 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie said:
Quote:

meowjinx said:
Honestly, I started reading up on Trich just to be able to eliminate it as a contam, but ...




When I was reading it, I thought you wrote: "Honestly, I started reading up on Trich just to be able to eliminate it as a contam, but now I’m a worshipper. We must make a Trich church."


What we need are two E.coli varieties that produce DMT and psilocybin.

Or maybe someone should patch a Polypore’s DNA to make these.




Pretty much. A part of me admires it, I could start a Church of the Trichoderma

And yeah, I look at psilocybin as a form of medicine. So whatever allows us to mass-produce it the easiest has my approval. Mushroom growing is a fine craft, but if E. Coli can help us flood the world with Psilocybin so that maybe some day if it is legalized people will have easy access to it. Cheap edibles, standardized microdosing so that it has more mainstream accessibility...that's what I hope the future will look like


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinefootpath
ὕδωρχοίρος

Registered: 07/16/19
Posts: 1,367
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: meowjinx]
    #26986816 - 10/15/20 10:49 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Predatory, parasitic, a squirrel digging up the soil, whatever... it's still held to the same principle of any other thing competing for the substrate - to win the race.
The reason I put "trich" in quotes is because it's kind of irrelevant as to what the invasive culture is. Not to mention, trich is usually not even the mold that people are dealing with, especially in early colonization.


Edited by footpath (10/15/20 11:24 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: footpath]
    #26986877 - 10/15/20 11:25 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

When I had the basement go fucky during my hospital stay I had all sorts of weird shit growing all over the subs in every colour of the rainbow. Lots of greens in varying shades from near teal to neon, grey, brown some blue. Pencillin, aspergillus all sorts of shit. Brown, lots of brown.

Mushrooms that had turned into black jelly. Lots of brown mold growing on the ductwork, concrete, joists etc. Still dealing with it on the joists but it's not like I can rip those out and that damn wood is like a sponge even with the RH at ~40%


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinefootpath
ὕδωρχοίρος

Registered: 07/16/19
Posts: 1,367
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26986921 - 10/15/20 11:54 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah, the only joke about 'properly' remediating mold is that it's still there.
But, for people with systemic health issues due to mycotoxin sensitivities or allergies, adequately reducing the population does, indeed, help reduce their symptoms.
So... there is something to be gained from the painstaking and expensive task of doing the job proper.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: footpath]
    #26986975 - 10/15/20 12:27 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Like I said earlier in the thread, three inhalers, a pill and supplemental oxygen. The longer you're exposed to mold spore the worse off you are and mushroom cultivation aside it's something everyone should be working on. The damage airborne contaminates do to your airways be they dander, dust mites, mold spore or otherwise only has a cumulative effect.

One day you might be the unlucky fuck that wakes up having developed a severe intolerance to these things and efforts to mitigate lung damage are your new normal. If someones going to put in the effort for this hobby they should learn to keep their house as clean as possible and learn that leaning over monotubs full of cubensis spore is going to have consequences as well. You can only put so much of this crap in your lungs before you face the real chance of developing a hypersensitivity and find yourself on medication for life.

Or you can listen to a retard that tells you to embrace the trich and thinks it's a good idea to keep even more sporulating garbage in your home. Don't keep moldy shit around folks. Go ask a respiratory therapist their thoughts on something so foolish.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: meowjinx]
    #26986979 - 10/15/20 12:29 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemeowjinx
Stranger
Male
Registered: 05/20/19
Posts: 492
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26987002 - 10/15/20 12:35 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie said:
Quote:

meowjinx said:
Pretty much. A part of me admires it, I could start a Church of the Trichoderma

And yeah, I look at psilocybin as a form of medicine. So whatever allows us to mass-produce it the easiest has my approval. Mushroom growing is a fine craft, but if E. Coli can help us flood the world with Psilocybin so that maybe some day if it is legalized people will have easy access to it. Cheap edibles, standardized microdosing so that it has more mainstream accessibility...that's what I hope the future will look like




I have the magicmushroom.church, salviadivinorum.church, and cactus.church domains. Unfortunately, the ayahuasca.church was taken. I’ll try to get it.

As a first step, I want to provide legal protection to people. It won’t work in every country, but it will work in many. You can join the church(es) if you agree with the statement. Then, any time you can get a certification from the website(s) that you are a member. From that point, anyone who has any problem with your mushroom/salvia/san pedro/aya usage is trying to prevent you from practicing your religion and should go to hell.

Although they will be international, I’ll register the churches in my country to make it clear they are real.

The websites are 20% done. I have no idea when I can finish them.

The mushrooms and the DMT helped me more than ten (or a hundred) years of therapy could. And that’s only the psychological part. The real thing is on another level.

I trip every second day. Today, I will do it. Sometimes I meet entities who have a head and limbs. Most of them don’t.

Cheers.




Oh wow, I thought you were just joking. That's amazing that you would even try to do that. Sounds like it would be hella hard to do, but if you could, with that registered church dupe, help even a few people gain regular access to psilocybin that would be a real noble thing. Kudos


Edited by meowjinx (10/15/20 12:36 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: starbones]
    #26987003 - 10/15/20 12:36 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26987019 - 10/15/20 12:45 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

It's in reference to a different, asinine thread where someone proudly proclaims they just shove monotubs of mold to the side and leave them there to keep piling up. Wanting to keep tubs of sporulating mold in your home because you're lazy is one thing but being proud of the fact is mental illness.

Like, fuck me I hope it's not a rental unit.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: meowjinx]
    #26987020 - 10/15/20 12:47 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/15/20 12:58 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Vylie]
    #26987030 - 10/15/20 12:52 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemeowjinx
Stranger
Male
Registered: 05/20/19
Posts: 492
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26987070 - 10/15/20 01:13 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

footpath said:
Predatory, parasitic, a squirrel digging up the soil, whatever... it's still held to the same principle of any other thing competing for the substrate - to win the race.
The reason I put "trich" in quotes is because it's kind of irrelevant as to what the invasive culture is. Not to mention, trich is usually not even the mold that people are dealing with, especially in early colonization.




The distinction matters. You asked why spores of a parasitic mold would germinate outside of its host organism. In this case meaning why would mold spores germinate on coir

But different molds will behave differently. It's not always just about competing for substrate. A mold like Trich does not need to compete for space with cubes because it can just hydrolyze its competitor, whilst its competitor cannot directly fight back

That distinction might mean fuck all to most cultivators, because a moldy tub is a moldy tub and those kinds of details are often just academic when it comes to growing in bulk. But to me that attitude totally lacking in scientific curiosity, which is one that is promoted by some of the experienced growers on here and then enforced by the parrots sucking up to them is a very boring one

Real research on cubes is scarce, obviously due to its legality issues around the world. Mushroom cultivators are pretty much the ones who know the organism better than any other group in the world. Ideally it should be on growers to promote a culture that is more willing to ask questions, all kinds of questions, even ones that seem ridiculous like "will spores germinate on coir"

Lord Kelvin (the guy who the Kelvin temp scale is named after) is infamous now for having tried to calculate the age of the Earth and coming up with several millions. He attacked the notion that it could be much, much older, and he was one of the most respected and admire physicists in the world. We later determined, of course, that his estimate was off by a few billions of years


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: footpath]
    #26987109 - 10/15/20 01:43 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

It's relatively common knowledge here since the RR days that outside grows have less problem with mold and why, but even people who are pretty knowledgeable somehow manage to say, ahem, mediocre-at-best stuff on this topic like "you can grow mushrooms outside and the spore load there is really high."
Oh? Could there be something about indoor conditions that *increases* the risk of mold that is somehow magically a separate factor from whether or not your spawn was clean? /sarcasm
We know a lot of relevant things about this statement, such as that air outside is consistently much fresher and exchanges far more which reduces co2 near the mycelia, humidity is more likely to fluctuate, and that Mother Nature cleans up spores outside with rain far more often and more effectively than humans do in their buildings.

Nobody's consistent luck eliminates the reality of possibilities that they supposedly are not experiencing, but luck definitely could contribute to their delusions of skill and topical authority.

In short, "That doesn't happen to me here so it's impossible for everyone everywhere" is a dumb statement no matter how otherwise smart the people saying it may act.



Here are some of my points:

1, FUCKING PAUL FUCKING STAMETS in "Growing Gourmet & Medicinal Mushrooms" states that if you rehydrate shiitake blocks for another flush and then put them right back in a humidified fruiting chamber that you WILL get green mold. These are otherwise healthy blocks that are PRACTICALLY GUARANTEED TO GET MOLD IF A CONDITION ALLOWS according to someone smarter and more experienced than virtually everyone on this forum (with some exceptions, don't @me). You have to have humidity fluctuations if you don't want healthy blocks to mold in a mushroom farm. Making sure spawn is clean is an early troubleshooting step but apparently to this forum it's the ONLY one?

(I'd like to point out that local air filtration is not a real solution to that problem either. I know that's originally what this thread asked about, but my only comment on that specifically is agreement with starbones, it's imperative to have air filtration in mushroom cultivation in general but this isn't really why, although running a flow hood in your grow environment could only help never hurt. As a gourmet mushroom cultivator, I assure you you don't want to grow many of them in your home without extra filtration, and mold is even worse.)

2, Open-air spawning and monotubs are 110% a vector for contamination and then provide absolutely all of the conditions that mold love. Even detractors wouldn't dare claim against that, so why they're not a bit more open-minded would baffle me if my expectations weren't already so low.

3, "Healthy mycelium fight off mold" is an absolute statement, but mycelia and their behavior/success are not absolute, and this forum kinda automatically concludes that uncontaminated spawn means a sure victory against mold. "uncontaminated grains" and "healthy mycelium" are not the same thing lmao. You can absolutely have a weak as fuck mycelium successfully colonize a jar of well-sterilized grains and end up with failure and contamination. One mycelium culture is different from the next, and even one mold spore is different from the next, and one condition can be different from the next. Nobody here can prove with anything credible that it's impossible for clean grains to result in a contaminated bulk substrate for other reasons so it's just strong words from know-it-all forum tryhards.

4, "Coir won't grow mold" is a lie, spoken by people seemingly lucky enough to have not seen it. Mold can grow on nearly anything if the conditions are right and stable long enough. "I've never had mold grow on coir" gets a thousand thumbs up here while "I've had mold grow on coir" gets completely ignored and dismissed. It happened right here, even - ya'll got ma boy starbones fucked up.

5, That^ forum environment then has more people saying these kinds of things when they don't get failures and *automatically assuming* it was their spawn when they do, so honestly even the anecdotal evidence probably isn't evidence since much of it is considered "evidence" due to circular reasoning. Yes unclean spawn absolutely WILL result in further contamination, but the attitude around here is that ONLY bad spawn can do it and that's nothing more than the unscientific self-assuredness of an internet forum. You need to have a little doubt, it's healthy y'all I promise.

6, People have different environments and seldom truly know the relevant details of their own environments much less how they compare to others. Short yet big point. I get a bit of a kick out of seeing people smugly presume their commentary will be universal on this basis alone.



Personal experience points:

When in the swing of things I have typically had a super high clean rate in my grains, agars, etc. Brag-worthy rates. I don't get random mold growth on my grain cakes, period, a stark difference than from what sometimes happens on my bulk subs when not in sterile conditions.

I have done thousands of "Lipa's tek" hot-water hydration of hardwood sawdust pellets followed by open-air spawning in a handful of different locations/environments, and the exact same procedures in different areas (mostly within one 30-mile radius, mind you) have yielded different contamination rates, some of those locations having rates that were absolutely unacceptable and/or often noticeably worsening with time, so even though I don't think local contaminant load is a massive deal I can't discount it entirely either. What eliminated nearly all pre-flush contaminations *for me* in each and every case was swapping to inoculating only sterile media in sterile conditions, just like when I originally stopped growing monotubs and trays (but still grew with bulk subs!), so assertions my sterile technique is to blame have always been weak AF seeing as apparently my sterile technique is about all I could rely on for assured success.


I honestly don't like talking about this very much because my years on this forum have told me that people reject experiences unlike theirs when it comes to these topics, but there's my 2¢ anyway.
I've even had people - some of them respected around here - message me talking about how they refused to share their experience on this forum because of how people treat others who speak out against this forum's rigid clique-like mindset about it. Some of the posters right here are great examples of that. We're almost all fuckin amateurs so the people with the gall to say it can ONLY EVER be dirty spawn disgust me, especially when they pair it with undeserved disrespectful mockery and insults.

Wanna tell them that bacterial spawn or hidden mold in spawn is the most likely source, at least in your experience? Fuckin go for it, I'd sign off on that. But y'all go too far.

inb4 someone comes rabidly to the defense of this forum's shortcomings.

Hey, at least I haven't seen anybody talk about how they don't get moldy subs despite all the *DOGS* in their house so this conversation has improved at least that little bit since the days of FrankHorrigan :toast: I will never not laugh at the memory of that person lol


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Edited by Violet (10/15/20 02:22 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Violet]
    #26987110 - 10/15/20 01:46 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Frank had ferrets not dogs. Cron and I were the dog people.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987112 - 10/15/20 01:47 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Coulda sworn it was dogs, been so long I guess, but fortunately for my point ferrets don't produce mold either lol.

Hi pasty!


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Violet]
    #26987125 - 10/15/20 01:52 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

True, CFU’s are the source of contams, not dogs, vibration, or water. Shaking a can of paint won’t magically fill it with bacteria. Same with spawn jars. The bacteria is either there or it’s not. You either sterilized the spawn enough or you didn’t. You either prepped the grain properly or you didn’t. You either give it conditions to thrive or you don’t. All vectors can be traced with enough control.

Hey Violet, hope you’re well :wave:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Violet]
    #26987131 - 10/15/20 01:55 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Violet said:
It's relatively common knowledge here since the RR days that outside grows have less problem with mold and why, but even people who are pretty knowledgeable somehow manage to say, ahem, mediocre-at-best stuff on this topic like "you can grow mushrooms outside and the spore load there is really high."
Oh? Could there be something about indoor conditions that *increases* the risk of mold that is somehow magically a separate factor from whether or not your spawn was clean? /sarcasm
We know a lot of relevant things about this statement, such as that air outside is consistently much fresher and exchanges far more which reduces co2 near the mycelia, humidity is more likely to fluctuate, and that Mother Nature cleans up spores outside with rain far more often and more effectively than humans do in their buildings.

Nobody's consistent luck eliminates the reality of possibilities that they supposedly are not experiencing, but luck definitely could contribute to their delusions of skill and topical authority.

In short, "That doesn't happen to me here so it's impossible for everyone everywhere" is a dumb statement no matter how otherwise smart the people saying it may act.



Here are some of my points:

1, FUCKING PAUL FUCKING STAMETS in "Growing Gourmet & Medicinal Mushrooms" states that if you rehydrate shiitake blocks for another flush and then put them right back in a humidified fruiting chamber that you WILL get green mold. These are otherwise healthy blocks that are PRACTICALLY GUARANTEED TO GET MOLD IF A CONDITION ALLOWS according to someone smarter and more experienced than virtually everyone on this forum (with some exceptions, don't @me). You have to have humidity fluctuations if you don't want healthy blocks to mold in a mushroom farm. Making sure spawn is clean is an early troubleshooting step but apparently to this forum it's the ONLY one?

(I'd like to point out that local air filtration is not a real solution to that problem either. I know that's originally what this thread asked about, but my only comment on that specifically is agreement with starborn, it's imperative to have air filtration in mushroom cultivation in general but this isn't really why, although running a flow hood in your grow environment could only help never hurt. As a gourmet mushroom cultivator, I assure you you don't want to grow many of them in your home without extra filtration, and mold is even worse.)

2, Open-air spawning and monotubs are 110% a vector for contamination and then provide absolutely all of the conditions that mold love. Even detractors wouldn't dare claim against that, so why they're not a bit more open-minded would baffle me if my expectations weren't already so low.

3, "Healthy mycelium fight off mold" is an absolute statement, but mycelia and their behavior/success are not absolute, and this forum kinda automatically concludes that uncontaminated spawn means a sure victory against mold. "uncontaminated grains" and "healthy mycelium" are not the same thing lmao. You can absolutely have a weak as fuck mycelium successfully colonize a jar of well-sterilized grains and end up with failure and contamination. One mycelium culture is different from the next, and even one mold spore is different from the next, and one condition can be different from the next. Nobody here can prove with anything credible that it's impossible for clean grains to result in a contaminated bulk substrate for other reasons so it's just strong words from know-it-all forum tryhards.

4, "Coir won't grow mold" is a lie, spoken by people seemingly lucky enough to have not seen it. Mold can grow on nearly anything if the conditions are right and stable long enough. "I've never had mold grow on coir" gets a thousand thumbs up here while "I've had mold grow on coir" gets completely ignored and dismissed. It happened right here, even - ya'll got ma boy starborn fucked up.

5, That^ forum environment then has more people saying these kinds of things when they don't get failures and *automatically assuming* it was their spawn when they do, so honestly even the anecdotal evidence probably isn't evidence since much of it is considered "evidence" due to circular reasoning. Yes unclean spawn absolutely WILL result in further contamination, but the attitude around here is that ONLY bad spawn can do it and that's nothing more than the unscientific self-assuredness of an internet forum. You need to have a little doubt, it's healthy y'all I promise.

6, People have different environments and seldom truly know the relevant details of their own environments much less how they compare to others. Short yet big point. I get a bit a kick out of seeing people smugly presume their commentary will be universal on this basis alone.



Personal experience points:

When in the swing of things I have typically had a super high clean rate in my grains, agars, etc. Brag-worthy rates. I don't get random mold growth on my grain cakes, period, a stark difference than from what sometimes happens on my bulk subs when not in sterile conditions.

I have done thousands of "Lipa's tek" hot-water hydration of hardwood sawdust pellets followed by open-air spawning in a handful of different locations/environments, and the exact same procedures in different areas (mostly within one 30-mile radius, mind you) have yielded different contamination rates, some of those locations having rates that were absolutely unacceptable and/or often noticeably worsening with time, so even though I don't think local contaminant load is a massive deal I can't discount it entirely either. What eliminated nearly all contaminations *for me* in each and every case was swapping to inoculating only sterile media in sterile conditions, just like when I originally stopped growing monotubs and trays (but still grew with bulk subs!), so assertions my sterile technique is to blame has always been weak AF seeing as apparently my sterile technique is about all I could rely on for assured success.


I honestly don't like talking about this very much because my years on this forum have told me that people reject experiences unlike theirs when it comes to these topics, but there's my 2¢ anyway.
I've even had people - some of them respected around here - message me talking about how they refused to share their experience on this forum because of how people treat others who speak out against this forum's rigid clique-like mindset about it. Some of the posters right here are great examples of that. We're almost all fuckin amateurs so the people with the gall to say it can ONLY EVER be dirty spawn disgust me, especially when they pair it with undeserved disrespectful mockery and insults.

Wanna tell them that bacterial spawn or hidden mold in spawn is the most likely source, at least in your experience? Fuckin go for it, I'd sign off on that. But y'all go too far.

inb4 someone comes rabidly to the defense of this forum's shortcomings.

Hey, at least I haven't seen anybody talk about how they don't get moldy subs despite all the *DOGS* in their house so this conversation has improved at least that little bit since the days of FrankHorrigan :toast: I will never not laugh at the memory of that person lol




I love you.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinefootpath
ὕδωρχοίρος

Registered: 07/16/19
Posts: 1,367
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987137 - 10/15/20 02:02 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

meowjinx said:
Quote:

footpath said:
Predatory, parasitic, a squirrel digging up the soil, whatever... it's still held to the same principle of any other thing competing for the substrate - to win the race.
The reason I put "trich" in quotes is because it's kind of irrelevant as to what the invasive culture is. Not to mention, trich is usually not even the mold that people are dealing with, especially in early colonization.




The distinction matters. You asked why spores of a parasitic mold would germinate outside of its host organism. In this case meaning why would mold spores germinate on coir

But different molds will behave differently. It's not always just about competing for substrate. A mold like Trich does not need to compete for space with cubes because it can just hydrolyze its competitor, whilst its competitor cannot directly fight back

That distinction might mean fuck all to most cultivators, because a moldy tub is a moldy tub and those kinds of details are often just academic when it comes to growing in bulk. But to me that attitude totally lacking in scientific curiosity, which is one that is promoted by some of the experienced growers on here and then enforced by the parrots sucking up to them is a very boring one

Real research on cubes is scarce, obviously due to its legality issues around the world. Mushroom cultivators are pretty much the ones who know the organism better than any other group in the world. Ideally it should be on growers to promote a culture that is more willing to ask questions, all kinds of questions, even ones that seem ridiculous like "will spores germinate on coir"

Lord Kelvin (the guy who the Kelvin temp scale is named after) is infamous now for having tried to calculate the age of the Earth and coming up with several millions. He attacked the notion that it could be much, much older, and he was one of the most respected and admire physicists in the world. We later determined, of course, that his estimate was off by a few billions of years




I try to write very deliberately (not to imply that what I'm saying is factual or without err). And that's why I entered this thread with, "The way that we grow". "We" pertaining to the majority of people on this forum. "The way" pertaining to monotubs with a mold-resistant, low-nutrient growing media like coir and vermiculite inoculated with an axenic culture.
The fact of the matter is that a variety of methods have been, to some extent, through the process of the scientific method and the one that showed the most success in a practical setting is the one that everyone squawks.
There's plenty of merit to the idea that you absolutely are inhibiting the growth of contaminant cultures (including trichoderma) by promoting your culture to fully colonize a substrate at the fastest rate (among all present cultures) and, quite frankly, the method wouldn't work so well if that were not the case.

That's not to say that growing in a near-sterile environment on a near-sterile substrate tailor-made for the explicit demands of a given species doesn't have its merit, but it certainly isn't practical by means of the methods people have presented thus far.

With the method I've been referencing, "the way that we grow", if you start deconstructing the method and seeking to root out specific vectors, you start to lose the systemic approach that the method is based on and transition into a symptom-based method. Like removing a pathogen from your environment vs potentiating the immune system... sure, some pathogens are most effectively addressed by removal, but having a thriving immune system will better your chances of responding to all of the common ones in your environment.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemeowjinx
Stranger
Male
Registered: 05/20/19
Posts: 492
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: footpath]
    #26987233 - 10/15/20 02:47 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

footpath said:
Quote:

meowjinx said:
Quote:

footpath said:
Predatory, parasitic, a squirrel digging up the soil, whatever... it's still held to the same principle of any other thing competing for the substrate - to win the race.
The reason I put "trich" in quotes is because it's kind of irrelevant as to what the invasive culture is. Not to mention, trich is usually not even the mold that people are dealing with, especially in early colonization.




The distinction matters. You asked why spores of a parasitic mold would germinate outside of its host organism. In this case meaning why would mold spores germinate on coir

But different molds will behave differently. It's not always just about competing for substrate. A mold like Trich does not need to compete for space with cubes because it can just hydrolyze its competitor, whilst its competitor cannot directly fight back

That distinction might mean fuck all to most cultivators, because a moldy tub is a moldy tub and those kinds of details are often just academic when it comes to growing in bulk. But to me that attitude totally lacking in scientific curiosity, which is one that is promoted by some of the experienced growers on here and then enforced by the parrots sucking up to them is a very boring one

Real research on cubes is scarce, obviously due to its legality issues around the world. Mushroom cultivators are pretty much the ones who know the organism better than any other group in the world. Ideally it should be on growers to promote a culture that is more willing to ask questions, all kinds of questions, even ones that seem ridiculous like "will spores germinate on coir"

Lord Kelvin (the guy who the Kelvin temp scale is named after) is infamous now for having tried to calculate the age of the Earth and coming up with several millions. He attacked the notion that it could be much, much older, and he was one of the most respected and admire physicists in the world. We later determined, of course, that his estimate was off by a few billions of years




I try to write very deliberately (not to imply that what I'm saying is factual or without err). And that's why I entered this thread with, "The way that we grow". "We" pertaining to the majority of people on this forum. "The way" pertaining to monotubs with a mold-resistant, low-nutrient growing media like coir and vermiculite inoculated with an axenic culture.
The fact of the matter is that a variety of methods have been, to some extent, through the process of the scientific method and the one that showed the most success in a practical setting is the one that everyone squawks.
There's plenty of merit to the idea that you absolutely are inhibiting the growth of contaminant cultures (including trichoderma) by promoting your culture to fully colonize a substrate at the fastest rate (among all present cultures) and, quite frankly, the method wouldn't work so well if that were not the case.

That's not to say that growing in a near-sterile environment on a near-sterile substrate tailor-made for the explicit demands of a given species doesn't have its merit, but it certainly isn't practical by means of the methods people have presented thus far.

With the method I've been referencing, "the way that we grow", if you start deconstructing the method and seeking to root out specific vectors, you start to lose the systemic approach that the method is based on and transition into a symptom-based method. Like removing a pathogen from your environment vs potentiating the immune system... sure, some pathogens are most effectively addressed by removal, but having a thriving immune system will better your chances of responding to all of the common ones in your environment.




I agree with you almost completely. And if we could all, as a community acknowledge that this is a functional approach that we take because it works extremely well, then I wouldn't have bothered to comment in this thread at all. But one side of the "debate" was being unfairly ridiculed because what was once a general rule of thumb has practically become a dogmatic pillar of truth and as long as you parrot this truth you're allowed to be as toxic as you want

I remember once in another thread I brought up the possibility of intracellular contams and an experienced user (who I hadn't even been addressing) just replied with a laughing gif. Apparently the notion of viruses that could infect cubes existing seemed laughable to them for some reason. There's no real record of such a contam existing, but that's for practical reasons. Viruses don't just grow into lumps of cells on agar the way bacteria and mold do

I know that has absolutely nothing to do with the topic of this thread, I guess my point is just that it seems that the community places more value on showing off flushes or inventing gimmicky new teks over working together to really understand this organism that we all ostensibly love so much


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: meowjinx] * 1
    #26987375 - 10/15/20 04:24 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I’ve been following this mess for a while. I see a lot of intransigence on both sides. Obviously things like super high sporeload, weak culture (though if you’re using agar this shouldn’t be a persistent issue, the second it’s recognized the culture is tossed), drastic environmental changes all contribute to contams getting a foothold. But in my limited experience, these issues are rare.

I had an environmental issue once. I took on a partner for a short time and at one point everything triched out. For weeks I tested my cultures and ran separate grows. I decided my spawn was clean and so barring all other options I paid a visit to the grow area. Turns out they had a giant garbage can full of sporulating trich right next to the tubs. It was likely 150 quarts of pure mold. I flipped my shit and that was that.

So if you have 150 quarts of sporulating mold in your grow space, you will likely see a very high fail rate. But barring something that extreme, then the most likely vector for a bulk coir grow is the spawn. Not saying the only one but it’s definitely the most likely.

If this all makes me some kind of political shill in the eyes of the ultra woke I don’t really give a shit. At the end of the day it’s not my grow so I don’t really care what someone does.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987426 - 10/15/20 05:21 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/15/20 05:22 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26987442 - 10/15/20 05:36 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Good shit Pasty. Just acknowledging the possibility of environmental contams hopefully could go a long way with some of these folks.

I'm obviously on a "side" here but I don't really see intransigence in mine because nobody in favor of considering any reality to this issue is saying dirty spawn isn't or can't be the problem, just that it can't be as simple as always one problem as certain people appear so sure of. I don't think being unwilling to agree that there's definitely only one cause of a contaminated bulk sub mix makes me intransigent. Maybe if they had more to back it up than tubs that didn't contam and I refused to acknowledge it, but as it is I'm simply asserting with good reason why we should be open to there being more than one way.


Also to pull in a statement from the other thread:

Quote:

Munchauzen said:
Just to add to this... trich will aerosolize mycelium particles along with the spores. In fact, there may be as much as 390 times the amount of mycelium versus spores in the air if you've got some green growing. And living fragments latch on and grow much more readily than spores. Just some additional info I was reading in the research paper "Fungal Fragments as Indoor Air Biocontaminates."




That's a hell of a lot more objective than people who are sure there's just the ONE cause that they say it is.

It lends massive amounts of validation to the notion that we should be more concerned with *optional* living mold in our work areas than the *inevitable* ambient spores.

If the speed and veracity of inoculating jars with living mycelium compared to spores is any clue, living airborne mycelium would be an exponentially greater threat than spores, especially if there really are hundreds of times as much.

At a minimum it makes it CLEAR that people talking exclusively about "spore load" in regards to environmental contams were somewhat ignorant, including me.


BTW that makes me think that some of smelling mold might be breathing in living mold myc  :puke:


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Violet]
    #26987466 - 10/15/20 05:55 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I’ve long said that live trich mycelium is a far greater danger than the spores. It’s why I speak out against cutting mold out, it’s far worse than just leaving it IMO.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987468 - 10/15/20 05:58 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

As far as I knew previously the reasoning for that was about disturbing spores and kicking them into the air, but regardless, we certainly have that much more reason now.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Violet]
    #26987476 - 10/15/20 06:06 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

To put this more on topic I’m not against the idea of people running hepas, scrubbing their area out and generally being cleaner. It’s never going to hurt. But it’s not a cure all and if the root truly is the spawn and not; a bad batch of coir, dirty walls and carpet, a huge mound of trich in the room, etc, none of these little things are going to solve it.

Spawn production is the hardest part in the hobby, it’s why most commercial farms buy their spawn and not make it themselves. But when I see people constantly swearing that they did the hard part perfect and the reason for their failings is all the easy stuff, it makes me question how well they can apply control to their grow in order to narrow the vector. It sounds like corner cutting and excuses to me.

Maybe I’m totally off base here. Perhaps the new account with a lot of reddit knowledge really has perfect spawn and a HEPA filter in the room and a little bleach is all that’s needed. But I wouldn’t bet money on that horse.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte] * 1
    #26987485 - 10/15/20 06:24 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

You’re totally right of course, which is why I’ll clarify that none of us have said we actually believe environmental mold is surely OP’s problem and not the spawn, simply contesting a questionable absolute made by others frequently on the forum.

I went and looked at what Reddit had going for mushcult precisely one time lol.


Also, I went and found the study Munchausen referenced. It’s pretty good shit so far, just from the abstract at least.

Here it is for anyone interested.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC126767/


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26987486 - 10/15/20 06:25 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

How did political shilling come into this?

Also that's the third nickname I have been given in this thread but I will take starborn over some dismissive garbage like "starnoob".

Like I said, theres no point in not addressing an environment as well, there is absolutely no harm and the benefits reach far beyond mushroom cultivation. People can either accept that coir can be susceptible to airborne contaminates or they can carry on believing this dumb meme that got horridly warped into the belief that it is invulnerable.

You will NEVER achieve clean room levels of cleanliness but you can clean your home and air filtration with HEPA is nothing new. A well built home with a modern HVAC system should be filtering your air through your furnaces fan mode.

Also anyone keeping a garbage can full of mold around should be given a large spoon and told to eat their fill. One thing if its just them but whole nother ball of wax if any other human being is going to be in that space.

After reading some of what I have read here today especially about mycellium being aersolized I am working my tubs with a respirator now. I know already that harvesting a tub with a huge spore dump is hell on my lungs but I will be damned if I want to push my luck further.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26987489 - 10/15/20 06:28 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah sorry about misnaming you, I went back earlier and changed that.

It might be time to be generally nicer now though.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOne of Us
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 1,140
Last seen: 6 days, 16 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987490 - 10/15/20 06:28 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Also, just to point out as I did in the other thread, the fact that there may be aerosolized mycelium in the air does not change the results of actual experiences of most people here.

Experimental data (experience)is much more valuable than theoretical ideas.

In theory, you would think aerosolized mycelium will definitely affect a grow, but that doesn't change the actual experience people like pasty and many others have had.

Also, trich wasn't specially mentioned in that paper. Not saying it doesn't aerosolize, it most likely does,  but it isn't exactly truth to say it does


--------------------
LAGM 2021
LAGM 2020
Trade List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: One of Us]
    #26987497 - 10/15/20 06:31 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

What it did mention specifically was aspergillis versicolor, the main mold I struggled with.

My point about not everyone having those same experiences is apparently worth repeating as well.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Violet]
    #26987515 - 10/15/20 06:47 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Don't be sorry man/ma'am I know you weren't doing it to get my goat.

As for aersolized or not I just won't take risks with my lungs anymore. Respirator filters cost nothing and it syncs with my belief about cleanliness in a home. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. I would not like this to be twisted into me saying people should wear respirators as a rule. I just know how FUBAR my lungs are and wish back a decade and a half ago I wore proper PPE instead of dust masks when dealing with all the lovely shit that grows in the dark.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Violet]
    #26987524 - 10/15/20 06:54 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Violet said:
You’re totally right of course, which is why I’ll clarify that none of us have said we actually believe environmental mold is surely OP’s problem and not the spawn, simply contesting a questionable absolute made by others frequently on the forum.

I went and looked at what Reddit had going for mushcult precisely one time lol.


Also, I went and found the study Munchausen referenced. It’s pretty good shit so far, just from the abstract at least.

Here it is for anyone interested.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC126767/




I’m definitely interested, thanks


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOne of Us
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 1,140
Last seen: 6 days, 16 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987570 - 10/15/20 07:27 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Violet said:
What it did mention specifically was aspergillis versicolor, the main mold I struggled with.

My point about not everyone having those same experiences is apparently worth repeating as well.




I understand people have other experiences. I personally have no experience with aspergillis, so I can't comment on that.

I do have plenty of experience with trich and all of my posts in both these threads were with regards to my experience and knowledge of trich. Trich is the topic of both threads and definitely the most common contam experienced here.

I never new aspergillis could be so pervasive. Asp. outbreaks are rarely talked about here, so thank you for opening my mind to that fact.  I always see crazy colors in new peoples first grows, but I honestly had no idea that experienced growers had major problems with mold other than trich. I feel it is important to emphasize that I consider you an experienced grower, not a noob. I mean no disrespect, I honestly just never heard of someone with experience really struggling with something other than trich (probably because its so relatively rare). Please excuse my ignorance


--------------------
LAGM 2021
LAGM 2020
Trade List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: One of Us]
    #26987597 - 10/15/20 08:06 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I'd say there's a major overrepresentation of "trichoderma" when it comes to people and their experiences with contamination.
Plenty of molds out their common to the household that people could believe was trich when it's really not because a second opinion wasn't chased after and in their minds mold=trich.

Trichoderma is the Kleenex of the mushroom cultivation world now.

I keep a cabinet full of horrors and here are some of the latest to join the family. Keep in mind I juggle 244-380 jars at a time so it's not common I get these but when I do they fascinate me.  Only reason I keep them around.



I got some weird fuckers too. Jars where the oats turned jet black, agar plates with red ooze. Couldn't begin to tell you what any of them are.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26987599 - 10/15/20 08:09 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

It's totally cool of course One Of Us :thumbup:

I misremembered a bit. I definitely dealt with one variety or another of Aspergillus now and then, but I'm thinking now that my more consistent problem was actually Penicillium. I'm glad it has been long enough since I had the consistent issues for me to forget.

It was also mentioned in the study too.


And I agree with starbones that "trich" sometimes ends up said as a catch-all here for mold contam.


I went and pulled this since you mentioned not being familiar with Asp. as a contaminant mold in mush cult
Quote:

Kizzle said:
Aspergillus
Odors: Musty, Oily
Sources: Soil, Wood, Dust, Air

Also very common indoor air, like Penicillium, Aspergillus species produce tiny spores which can travel relatively large distances before settling. Many species which are common contaminants of mushroom substrates. Mycelium is usually light grey with linear threadlike growth and may be mistaken for mushroom mycelium. Some colonies may appear ringlike with denser mycelium near the edges. Aspergillus produces it's spores on large sporophores which change color as they mature. Color and size of sporophores varies by species and substrate with yellow, black, green, blue and grey all being common, making it easy to mistake with other mold species. Aspergillus is a common contaminant of grain spawn and can be recognized by it's very grainy appearance as spore production begins.



Known contaminant species include:
A. flavus, a yellow to green mold, can produce large amounts of toxins
A. niger, dark brown pins on a white-yellow mycelium
A. fumigatus, blue/grey to green/grey, highly pathogenic to people with suppressed immune systems
A. versicolor, produces a wide a variety of colors




--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Violet]
    #26987607 - 10/15/20 08:12 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Oh I recognize that bright green shit right there, oh boy do I ever because that's the rotten shit that was growing on 1/2-3/4 of the 40+ tubs I lost during my hiatus from my basement. Greys, browns, every flavour of the rainbow but that neon green is burned into my eyebones.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOne of Us
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 1,140
Last seen: 6 days, 16 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26987616 - 10/15/20 08:21 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Yea, penicilium is much more common. I see it all the time on my plates. I don't see it in my tubs tho.

Haven't experienced aspergillis tho. Maybe on my petris, but if I did I tossed the plate before it sporulated


--------------------
LAGM 2021
LAGM 2020
Trade List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26987779 - 10/15/20 11:34 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Why not use bags if you’re juggling 300 quart jars?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987795 - 10/16/20 12:01 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I have 500 of the XL 0.5 micron unicorn bags but despite my best efforts thus far I have not been able to have consistent success. Same LC I use in my jars, tests clean on agar. The majority of my bags go to shit, some don't but even those I don't trust and I bag fruit those.



At first it was mentioned to me that I could be getting a bad seal due to a sealer having trouble going through the folded gussets so I moved over to a larger sealer so I could expand the gussets. Kept my oats dry. These bags sat un-inoculated for weeks and didn't seem to have any issues. A week into being knocked up and well.. always the same. Haven't figured out what I'm doing wrong and didn't want to bother anyone here with it. I keep plugging away at them though.

But yeah, same LC which tests clean. Dryer than normal oats, rolled to get the air out prior to pc. Sealed, PC vented for 10 minutes then bags are placed accordion folded with jar ring spacers to make sure as much steam gets on them as possible. Filter patches always come out dry. I tried moving from 3 hours to 4 hours per run but I'm sure the failure mode here is something I'm doing wrong during inoculation/colonizing. Each bag gets a fresh 18g needle, poked above the grains and given a 10ml spritz, all done infront of the flowhood I do plates and agar to LC's.

I'll figure out where I'm going wrong eventually, I doubt it's the 0.5 micron patch as many Shroomery users claim to have no problems with those. The odd bag or two I'll find the plastic went super thin during PCing in a spot or two and who knows maybe they're drawing in air just enough through a pinhole.

All that aside jars are really pretty.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26987800 - 10/16/20 12:12 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

If you’re using a flowhood poking a needle through the bag is ham fisted IMO. I wouldn’t even use a needle for LC with bags, just pour a bit in like G2G if I had use of a flowhood. I used to make up a bunch of small LCs and let them get thick. Then I would just pour it right into the bags, seal (I use zip ties to seal) and bam! Lots of the time the poured LC recovers far faster than when it’s shredded by the needle.

Course I also make LC very differently than most people and use more complex nute sources. It gives an edge to the pour method.



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987806 - 10/16/20 12:18 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

^^^^ I was about to say nearly the same thing.
If you have sterile airflow, don't seal your bags before sterilizing them, just be careful with the tops until you close them! Put reusable tyvek suit pieces in the tops of the bags from nearly sub level to out the top so that no vacuums are created, let them cool with them in, and pull the pieces out immediately before inoculation.  Even when I might use a needle to draw up LC I still just squirt it down the bag's opening. I also don't bother using a sealer - I just zip-tie the top, usually around a fold, careful to close the top in a way that won't let spores get in first.

I couldn't say for sure that your terrible contams all come from fresh needles through fresh sterilized inoc ports pulled into sterile airflow, and I'm a bit curious about the reason for your contams too, but that's definitely something you could do regardless and it might make a difference for you.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987815 - 10/16/20 12:26 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I will have to give that a try might start with G2G or squirt it in a hole. I seal my bags before PC so I assume there's no problems to cut them open in front of the flowhood with a sterile blade then just make a neck and zip-tie the shit out of it like you did?

Can they be zip-tied before PCing? My brain is telling me that shouldn't be a problem because I use zip-ties that sit next to piss-red hot diesel exhaust manifolds but better to ask.

I'll give it a shot because more spawn more better. Thanks a bunch.

No inoculation ports on these bags, I mark where I aim to poke with a sharpie, clean it with 70% iso, throw on a fresh needle and squirt then cover the hole with tape. I've tried everything from electrical tape to tuck tape to masking tape. Mystifies me as well because in the same inoculation run I could do 6 or so bags followed up by 50 jars and won't lose a jar but will lose 5/6 bags. Electric stove not gas because I read folks had a problem with gas melting bags.

Is that a definite no-go on pre-sealing? Shroomery informations all over the map but the most current information I could find is that 0.5 micron patches were fine for pre-sealing. Even if I could get away with a zip tie I'd feel oodles better if I knew it was like one of my jars coming out of the PC, sterile (as we can get them) until I fuck with it. The accordion shennigans just felt like something I'd fuck up since I'm a visual learner not so handy with the word learnin'


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones] * 1
    #26987816 - 10/16/20 12:29 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I only ever tried presealing once. Didn’t like it, felt impossible to get a decent plenum.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987819 - 10/16/20 12:32 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

+1

(also had some bursts)


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Violet]
    #26987833 - 10/16/20 12:51 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Shit on a shingle well I guess come morning I will attempt to source tyvek (sleeves?) and dig deep for a pictorial on their usage so I can comprehend their usage.

Gracias.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26987868 - 10/16/20 01:32 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I’ve used aluminum foil instead of sleeves myself and actually prefer that to tyvek. I’m mostly just looking to prevent the bag from basically melting shut. You just need a barrier, not filtration material despite RR’s claims otherwise.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987869 - 10/16/20 01:35 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah I figured it's not a filter so much as something to prevent a de facto seal that could create a pressure difference. Never thought about aluminum though! I'll remember that, because my tyvek pieces don't look so hot these days lmao


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Violet]
    #26987872 - 10/16/20 01:36 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Blindingleaf turned me on to foil years back and it’s great. I fold it dull side out and it tends to come out super clean and easy.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26987972 - 10/16/20 05:53 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/16/20 06:38 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26988177 - 10/16/20 10:19 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The story of the monotub I just tossed was:

1. Good looking spawn (for me)
2. Amazing colonization of coir with beautiful mycelium (I was sure it would be a decent mono)
3. Mycelium pee appeared on the top everywhere in an amount I never saw before. It was not present in the jar and not present during coir colonization
4. The mycelium slowly changed its look, the pins stopped growing, Trich/mold took over

Common sense is telling me it was airborne. Bacteria might have been present in the spawn that made the mycelium weaker. I don’t know. But the infection likely came from the top.




This sounds pretty much exactly like bacterial spawn to me, high-key suspect that was the problem there.


You definitely should harvest before spores drop, for quality's sake.  People wait too long for those photos but the like how the canopies look. People really cream over those canopy photos, but no it's not ideal.

Lots of mold start out white or nearly white before they start sporulating and changing colors and quite of few of the most common of them are green when that color starts showing.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Violet]
    #26988198 - 10/16/20 10:40 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26988214 - 10/16/20 10:50 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Yes it's possible for contamination to hide on agar. There is a really good thread about it around here I can't seem to find at the moment.

One user shows how well mold can intertwine with mycellium that it's nearly impossible to truly distinguish them at first blush.

Here is a fun read as well.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22020260/fpart/1/vc/1

I really like the train of thought that was mentioned earlier in this thread that we can never truly prevent contamination we can only outrun it. Minimizing it as much as possible. That's why certain teks while keen as balls fell by the wayside because they introduced further vectors that could introduce contaminate. There was a GLC tek that was abandoned for this reason. Worked but introduced a window of contamination not present in another method so the evolution of the hobby leaned towards the one with the best success rate.

Sorry for being so vague. I have a decade or more of this forum memorized but my brain is a clapped out old lawnmower engine so half of what I remember I don't remember where I remember it from.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26988219 - 10/16/20 10:55 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I’m usually looking to get em just as the veils pop, mainly because of the nature of my main projects over much of my time in the hobby. I need to confirm that there is both spore production and the correct colour of spores is there as well. If I’m printing it’s even more likely I’m gonna let em open up a fair bit.

I like to harvest at this point:




But sometimes things get away on me:




PE is a nice option for those who hate spores, it generally doesn’t eject them and you can still get a canopy with it, this was only 3 quarts of spawn:



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26988224 - 10/16/20 10:58 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

A real canopy is one before the caps open anyway like pastys pics.

But i also usually get to them after they open a bit





No room for another shroom tm


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26988229 - 10/16/20 11:02 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

RW
:dogpipe:

Last run of genetics I did I couldn't have 1/4 of that many caps open without everything turning black as fuck. It's like it sits in the good place between dumping spore so prints can be taken and not dumping too much spore. I said it before if there are variants that drop few spore then the inverse has to be true and some must be fucking prolific.

Then bod posts that and triggers my PTSD. Hours upon hours of cleaning caps. :justkillmenow:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26988285 - 10/16/20 11:38 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I don’t get why people clean the spores. They don’t taste like much really and if you make tea/chocolates/jello/capsules/peanutbuttersandwich/etc you won’t notice them at all. It seems like such an odd thing to get hung up on. I feel like you’re overthinking most of the aspects of this hobby and it’s not helping you much.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleViolet
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26988293 - 10/16/20 11:43 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

For sure. I certainly don't bother cleaning them, my personal choice to trim the dirty bottoms is already tedious enough.  But I definitely prefer harvesting before veils break. I think they look better, they definitely hold up in storage better IME (far fewer thin caps having edges chip off or coming off altogether) and they *might* even taste better but frankly I think substrate probably influences that more if much at all


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinefootpath
ὕδωρχοίρος

Registered: 07/16/19
Posts: 1,367
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
Re: Room air purification [Re: meowjinx]
    #26988319 - 10/16/20 12:06 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

meowjinx said:

I agree with you almost completely. And if we could all, as a community acknowledge that this is a functional approach that we take because it works extremely well, then I wouldn't have bothered to comment in this thread at all. But one side of the "debate" was being unfairly ridiculed because what was once a general rule of thumb has practically become a dogmatic pillar of truth and as long as you parrot this truth you're allowed to be as toxic as you want

I remember once in another thread I brought up the possibility of intracellular contams and an experienced user (who I hadn't even been addressing) just replied with a laughing gif. Apparently the notion of viruses that could infect cubes existing seemed laughable to them for some reason. There's no real record of such a contam existing, but that's for practical reasons. Viruses don't just grow into lumps of cells on agar the way bacteria and mold do

I know that has absolutely nothing to do with the topic of this thread, I guess my point is just that it seems that the community places more value on showing off flushes or inventing gimmicky new teks over working together to really understand this organism that we all ostensibly love so much




I completely agree about the common rhetoric around here... it can be pretty dismissive and rejective and it requires a certain amount of objectivity and scrutiny when asking for advice or presenting unconventional ideas...
However, people are typically asking for advice pertinent to the common method, so the advice they receive is going to be pertinent to the common method.
Part of giving advice is giving the evidence necessary to support the claim.
Queue the dense canopy porn, variations on a theme, and idolatrous rabble from those who've achieved the same results from the common method, whether aware of the fundamental principles or not. The rabblers don't need to know those fundamentals, per se, because the common method has been refined and formatted in such a way that simply following its process is means enough to achieve its efficacy. Therefore, the process itself becomes, incomprehensively, the mechanism of its action and is then incessantly harmonized by the choir who've been graced by its prolificacy.

It's definitely refreshing and promotes a healthier community mentality to see people present and succeed with different methods or elaborate differently on fundamental principles. But, when comparing them to the accessibility, efficacy, and productivity of the common method that gives you all that canopy porn, it's pretty clear that other methods mostly come up short. I'm not the one to tell you what the qualitative differences are between pre- and post-sporulated mushrooms or mushrooms grown with a specific nutrient profile, but, as far as production goes, those canopies tell themselves a pretty good story either way.

I'll go on to say that most of those who are well-qualified and experienced tend to take a more neutral alignment when addressing a discussion. They may come off as aggressive or absolutist, but it's usually just a means to cut through the bullshit (like what I'm typing) and to the point. I don't think any of them reject progression or unconventional ideas, I think they just demand the most basic requirement of a proposition - evidence. They already have their evidence and ever-increasing droves of exhibits to support it. Comparatively, unconventional methods are a drop in the pond at this point - even the ones that are proposed or tested by those experienced and well-qualified in the fundamental principles.

Sorry to drag this point out, but the sociology of the community seemed to be a secondary theme here (and all over the mushcult forum.:uhoh:)
In most any society, the droves don't accurately represent their foundation because there's a distortion of fanaticism. The requirement of a bullshit filter is more necessary than ever... in all directions.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26988320 - 10/16/20 12:07 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Pastywhyte said:
I don’t get why people clean the spores. They don’t taste like much really and if you make tea/chocolates/jello/capsules/peanutbuttersandwich/etc you won’t notice them at all. It seems like such an odd thing to get hung up on. I feel like you’re overthinking most of the aspects of this hobby and it’s not helping you much.




They taste and smell bad. Look bad too but that's my opinion. I grow a LOT and it's not all for me. Friends, family and a very large portion to a compassion club in Quebec that helped me out when I was at my wits end battling depression and chronic pain. It's a chore but I guess more of a labour of love. I just whine a lot.

Same thing we used to do with pot. Grow it and make sure those that needed it had it and it was something we were proud of. I guess taste and smell are subjective but to me I really do enjoy my mushrooms tasting like popcorn/tater chips when I shake em up with the good stuff.



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleSmartattack
C'mon man
 User Gallery


Registered: 12/21/18
Posts: 3,775
Loc: A thought
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26988326 - 10/16/20 12:10 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I feel like worrying about spore flavor would be like me worrying about the ink stain on my underwear I wore while shitting my pants. Some turds can't be sufficiently polished.


--------------------
* Smarts videos :teacher:
* :thumbup: Planet of the APES:thumbup:
 
I'm a fungal white supremacist.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Smartattack]
    #26988342 - 10/16/20 12:20 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Personal taste is subjective. Cilantro, black licorice and otherwise.
I don't want to tell somebody else they should snack on something I wouldn't do myself. That's just being a decent human being and all it costs me is time.

Again, labour of love for people that use these to try and do things like face another day in the world. I'll gladly take shit from ya'll for trying to be good to people.

I caught a whole pile of shit the month prior too in the general discussion thread for tossing a monotub of fruit after a sporesplosion. A single monotub means beans. I ain't changing one iota on this. I'm a simple farmer trying to do my best for folks.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: starbones]
    #26988399 - 10/16/20 12:52 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/16/20 01:06 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie] * 3
    #26988433 - 10/16/20 01:07 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I like to think this place is very accepting of unconventional approaches and new ideas so long as they are not promoted as something it’s not or full of potential vectors. I’ve done shit that is fucking ridiculous and retarded however, I’ve rarely been given much flack for it. I wasn’t always a TC and a mod yet when I started pushing the envelope I feel I generally got some support from the community, I was one of the first people to sterilize coir and spawn it in open air. I argued vehemently against the need to properly pasteurize coir, all against the dogma of the day. Hell I even grew cubes on a bath towel for fucks sake and people were all like :rockon:

I’m not blind to the partisanship of some members but I like to think the wider community is much more than that. This place is one of the best IMO. If anyone disagrees that’s their right too. I have little energy to argue with people much these days.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineOne of Us
Stranger
 User Gallery


Registered: 03/12/12
Posts: 1,140
Last seen: 6 days, 16 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26988455 - 10/16/20 01:22 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Like you kinda mentioned already, the contam didn't have to come from your agar culture. It is possible that the grain wasn't fully "sterilized" I put that in quotes because our grain isn't sterile after a pc cycle. Most is, and it gives us a window of opportunity, in which our cultures will out compete the remaining bacterial endospores.  Some bags contain more endospores than others, it seems. I had a bag that wouldn't couldn't prep and pc without bacteria showing up, until I started PC-ing for 3.5 hours. It was just that one bag and longer pc time def fixed the issue.

Here's this threadwith a heated conversation about this topic. It seems this topic is kinda controversial as well.


--------------------
LAGM 2021
LAGM 2020
Trade List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26988456 - 10/16/20 01:24 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I want to see the bath towel. I believe the bath towel I just want to see the bath towel.

I like this place but it's on the polar opposite of the spectrum from other places like Reddit, where as with Reddit you get some dinglefuck taping a furnace filter to a box can to get a "broke boi" flowhood with a hundred people applauding here you get the opposite. (We know this won't work and we know the WHY) An ingrained idea with parroted meme as this thread has illustrated and Violent pointed out. When an idea becomes twisted like I kept mentioning about coir and mold being resistant v.s. proof it becomes ape law here. I mean fuck me if coconut oil was capable of mold proofing we'd be coating dimensional lumber in the stuff before it was sold on the Gulf Coast. I don't think anyone can fault my frustration here in this thread at seeing people claiming mold CANNOT germinate on coir when it was said by others that it had a difficult time.

I like this place because it challenges you and only by challenging the norm is progress made in an unscientific environment. We're at simplicity here only because of people who did shit like neglect teks and otherwise. I've stated before when I took an interest in this back in the day people were jury-rigging power supplies to put PC fans in their monotubs and were making LC spin plates out what was left over. Innovative sure but things have moved beyond that.

I just want to scream at people that if someone had mentioned using coir instead of straw/dung etc as a bulk substrate a decade or a decade and a half ago they'd be met with mockery not unlike you see now.

I dunno where I was going with this because I'm lemon tekking some clone candidates but there is good, solid information on Shroomery that goes against the parroted chinese telephone game memes that DOESN'T involve someone claiming ejaculating on their grains leads to faster colonization ALA reddit.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26988459 - 10/16/20 01:25 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/16/20 01:33 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26988494 - 10/16/20 01:45 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I didn’t get many good pics of the towel, I also cut it into strips as well. Here is it pre first flush but I just wasn’t able to get the first flush pics. Third flush neglect pics I did get though.






It was just a small aside project from a larger mess.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25638606


Though I did see okay results on polar fleece. Cased with coir verm and fruited in a mono.




It wasn’t my best work but it was at least a little interesting.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte] * 1
    #26988590 - 10/16/20 02:37 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I think the older shroomery may have been against experimentation. But since ive been here a lot has changed. Heck someone just tried gelatin instead of agar. The old hands would say it just dissolves and is completely useless but it worked in a pinch for someone looking to clone in a hurry


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinekarri0n
Mind Traveller
Male User Gallery


Registered: 08/29/20
Posts: 698
Last seen: 15 days, 8 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26988843 - 10/16/20 04:47 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

starbones said:
mold




I am quite sure you know this as a cleaning professional but mold doesn't eat metal or car seat foam, it's likely eating the dust and dead skin from humans that had been in the area.

I'd bet mold would have an easier time eating coconut husk than galvanized metal though.


--------------------

Panaeolus Bisporus


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: karri0n]
    #26988870 - 10/16/20 05:04 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

karri0n said:
Quote:

starbones said:
mold




I am quite sure you know this as a cleaning professional but mold doesn't eat metal or car seat foam, it's likely eating the dust and dead skin from humans that had been in the area.

I'd bet mold would have an easier time eating coconut husk than galvanized metal though.




It's not that it is eating the metal at all but germinating in the moisture with a modicum of food and spreading from there. Just like it could on coir. Good munch on some dust mites and it's off. We did a recovery on a Jaguar XJ and it was weird. Some of the seat foam was normal but the majority had turned to jelly. I am sure there's gotta be some crazyballs molds out there that excrete enzymes that break down things like wood cellulouse now though.


--------------------
Listen, I'm steel fisted with the iron lung
Heavy metal ballads out the guitar where lions run.




Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinestarbones
I'm an alien, I eat uranium.
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/04/20
Posts: 1,131
Last seen: 2 months, 17 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26988883 - 10/16/20 05:12 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
I think the older shroomery may have been against experimentation. But since ive been here a lot has changed. Heck someone just tried gelatin instead of agar. The old hands would say it just dissolves and is completely useless but it worked in a pinch for someone looking to clone in a hurry




Bod here is someone I point out a LOT to people I know to try to show the black/white difference between what was known to what is now.

I'm not saying it's neglect-tek shit but it still makes me giggle that there was so SO much effort with SO MANY people trying things from vaccuum cleaners partnered with cool mist humidifiers to people doing PC fans and a power supply and then..

"Just throw it in the tub and go do something else"

It's really hard to explain to anyone who did not have a decade break in cultivation. It was a movement though.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblemushboyMDiscord
modboy
 User Gallery


Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,274
Loc: where?
Trusted Cultivator
OG Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: starbones]
    #26988981 - 10/16/20 06:29 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I think it's always been go throw it in a tub and do something else. Then people got bored and did all that noob shit for years just to come back around at the throw it in a tub mentality. At least that's my take..

And now we've come full circle.
:god2:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: mushboy]
    #26989297 - 10/16/20 11:12 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Vylie (10/16/20 11:20 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinekarri0n
Mind Traveller
Male User Gallery


Registered: 08/29/20
Posts: 698
Last seen: 15 days, 8 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26989307 - 10/16/20 11:22 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

This tends to be the most recommended as far as I know. There might be something significantly newer, but this is quite extensive.

https://www.amazon.com/Growing-Gourmet-Medicinal-Mushrooms-Stamets/dp/1580081754


--------------------

Panaeolus Bisporus


Edited by karri0n (10/16/20 11:24 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: karri0n]
    #26989310 - 10/16/20 11:24 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineGan
Wielder of Narya
Male


Registered: 08/26/19
Posts: 927
Loc: Valinor
Last seen: 5 months, 27 days
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26989325 - 10/16/20 11:40 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I also know that Southwest Mushrooms has a lot of videos that some members around here seem to vouch for in some cases and for certain techniques/teks.

I haven't watched too many of them and I have almost zero knowledge of growing edibles other than a few grows here and there over the years, so just double check if those videos are a decent resource.


--------------------



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineVylie
The more you know
Female

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 2 years, 4 months
Re: Room air purification *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26989352 - 10/17/20 12:11 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Vylie

Reason for deletion: ...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinekarri0n
Mind Traveller
Male User Gallery


Registered: 08/29/20
Posts: 698
Last seen: 15 days, 8 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26989387 - 10/17/20 12:47 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie said:
Quote:

karri0n said:
https://www.amazon.com/Growing-Gourmet-Medicinal-Mushrooms-Stamets/dp/1580081754




Thank you. It’s cool they have it as an e-book. The ID books seem to have only the paperback editions.





Taking this full circle and dangerously back On-Topic, one of the first things that Paul Stamets talks about in Growing Gourmet and Medicinal Mushrooms is, in fact, air filtration for the mushroom growing laboratory and in fact the whole farm.


--------------------

Panaeolus Bisporus


Edited by karri0n (10/17/20 12:48 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26989709 - 10/17/20 08:03 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Vylie said:
Quote:

bodhisatta said:
Heck someone just tried gelatin instead of agar.




Ouch. Someone should tell them gelatin is made of pork. Who knows? Maybe it’s still not too late.

You could also add this info to the F.A.Q. Or maybe a sticky thread with a warning emoji would be better.




Why the fuck does it matter if it’s made from pork? Are the fungi Jewish or Muslim?

:smbfacepalm:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinekarri0n
Mind Traveller
Male User Gallery


Registered: 08/29/20
Posts: 698
Last seen: 15 days, 8 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26990411 - 10/17/20 05:44 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Pastywhyte said:
Quote:

Vylie said:
Quote:

bodhisatta said:
Heck someone just tried gelatin instead of agar.




Ouch. Someone should tell them gelatin is made of pork. Who knows? Maybe it’s still not too late.

You could also add this info to the F.A.Q. Or maybe a sticky thread with a warning emoji would be better.




Why the fuck does it matter if it’s made from pork? Are the fungi Jewish or Muslim?

:smbfacepalm:




It's worse man, they're vegan :eek:


--------------------

Panaeolus Bisporus


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblePastywhyteMDiscord
Say hello to my little friend
Male User Gallery


Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,809
Loc: Canada Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: karri0n]
    #26990450 - 10/17/20 06:18 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I made dog food agar once and my shiitake 3782 that I had at the time loved the extra protein (it probably didn’t but it sure could run fast on it).


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinekarri0n
Mind Traveller
Male User Gallery


Registered: 08/29/20
Posts: 698
Last seen: 15 days, 8 hours
Re: Room air purification [Re: Pastywhyte]
    #26990542 - 10/17/20 07:19 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Yes please don't think I am saying they are actually vegan. You can get a mycelium casket to consume your corpse. They aren't.


--------------------

Panaeolus Bisporus


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
Smurf real estate agent
 User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,889
Loc: Milky way
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Room air purification [Re: Vylie]
    #26991085 - 10/18/20 07:27 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

This thread has been closed.

Reason:
This thread has ran its course


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8  [ show all ]

Shop: PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   North Spore Bulk Substrate   Mushroom-Hut Grow Bags   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Capsules   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Amanita Muscaria Store Amanita Extract


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* experimental air purification stinkbuttdog 562 5 04/24/07 02:18 PM
by RoachMan
* water purification? dressel11 484 2 01/04/05 02:59 PM
by KaptKid
* Grass Clippings Instead of Rice Flower cen_tex_looker 1,246 1 07/21/02 10:00 AM
by Anno
* Using spores instead of spawn for dung Land_Crab 1,226 9 04/06/05 11:34 PM
by scatmanrav
* just an airstone and a jar of water? (instead of perlite) tokey666 871 5 09/15/05 05:38 PM
by Pixie1420
* brf cakes spawned to bulk instead of birdseed shroomer68 1,664 4 12/01/05 10:30 AM
by kungpow
* Using pint jars instead of half Juice7 454 2 04/30/03 10:41 PM
by Skikid16
* Perilite instead of verm in brf cakes?
( 1 2 all )
habitat0789 2,319 25 01/08/07 09:46 PM
by Implosive

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Shroomism, george castanza, RogerRabbit, veggie, mushboy, fahtster, LogicaL Chaos, 13shrooms, Stipe-n Cap, Pastywhyte, bodhisatta, Tormato, Land Trout, A.k.a
2,401 topic views. 18 members, 182 guests and 44 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.088 seconds spending 0.014 seconds on 14 queries.