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Invisiblebebop
Registered: 07/04/20
Posts: 125
Loc: nt.here_
Small skinny fruit, veil breaking fast - how to fix? (pics)
    #26957422 - 09/27/20 12:57 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Super noob here, getting my first fruits now but some have come out looking weird and others have the veil breaking while they're small, about 3 days after pins.

I've got a brick from an all-in-one bag (colonized brick of grain and coco) fruiting in a monotub on perlite/foil, started pinning 3 days ago and I picked these last night: ~4g wet


Woke up and there are more with the veils broken yet still small:


I've been misting 2-3 times a day and I fanned once right before pinning but confused as to why the veils are breaking so quickly? Or is this normal? If there's something I can be doing better to help the shrooms grow, I'll do it. These are GT from an MS

The brick has been lit for 12 hours/day by a window and with a little 15W LED which is mainly for just looking at them.

I moved it to a corner of the room with a Smart LED bulb set to Daylight and the yield has gotten worse.

Updates below


Edited by bebop (10/01/20 12:07 PM)


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Invisiblebebop
Registered: 07/04/20
Posts: 125
Loc: nt.here_
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: bebop]
    #26957481 - 09/27/20 01:44 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Sorry for the double post but any idea what I'm doing wrong? Or am I overreacting? I appreciate your experienced eyes on this. If anything isn't clear, let me know and I'll clarify.

Right now I'm thinking lighting is the blame?

I can have the little white Presto dehydrator here tomorrow, or order a better one to get here in a couple days

:frown: anybody have any advice?


Edited by bebop (09/27/20 02:16 PM)


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OfflinePoisonedSnow
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Registered: 08/21/20
Posts: 3
Last seen: 3 years, 1 month
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: bebop] * 1
    #26957605 - 09/27/20 03:32 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Hey man, first time growe here too and a very similar thing happened to me on the second flush of my shoebox. I believe it could be related to not enough FAE as the mushrooms could be rushing to grow up as they believe there is not enough oxygen. I could be wrong though, very new in this hobby.


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Offline1kldude
Stuntzii Lover
I'm a teapot


Registered: 05/15/08
Posts: 501
Loc: Somewhere
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: PoisonedSnow] * 1
    #26957677 - 09/27/20 04:23 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Mushrooms dont need much light. How much moisture do they have? Could be too much or not enough im unsure. Also could just come down to genetics.
Is this a multi spore grow?


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<<-----|||1kldude|||----->>

<<<----------|||1 knowledgeable dude|||---------->>>

<<<<----Any post I make is purely fictional and for informational purposes only---->>>>


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Invisiblebebop
Registered: 07/04/20
Posts: 125
Loc: nt.here_
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: 1kldude]
    #26957725 - 09/27/20 04:52 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

I put them in front of a Smart LED set to Daylight and tried to allow more FAE. Using an unmodified tub with the lid upside down.  I mist when the sides of the tub start to lose condensation and the coco looks dry but it's hard to get the lower part of the brick as the tub is only 32qt. There's only about 2 inches of perlite, I was planning on adding more and replacing the foil after first flush.

It's from an MS syringe from a sponsor here, GT. No nasty smells, just the smell of dirt/coir and a hint of mushrooms sometimes. It's warm inside when I go to mist and the mushrooms I've picked were damp to the touch.

I've picked 3 today, 5 total, that had the veils break. Looking now and there are 3 more I'm about to pick, all small. Last one was 0.4 wet :frown:


Edited by bebop (09/27/20 04:59 PM)


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Offline1kldude
Stuntzii Lover
I'm a teapot


Registered: 05/15/08
Posts: 501
Loc: Somewhere
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: bebop] * 1
    #26957738 - 09/27/20 04:58 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah multi spore grows are kind of a crap shoot with genetics.
They might be trying to mature fast for some reason. Just thought about that.
When i had too direct of light mine were fruiting/growing very fast and were tiny. So i raised the light about 2.5 to 3 feet and they started growing thicker.


--------------------
<<-----|||1kldude|||----->>

<<<----------|||1 knowledgeable dude|||---------->>>

<<<<----Any post I make is purely fictional and for informational purposes only---->>>>


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Invisiblebebop
Registered: 07/04/20
Posts: 125
Loc: nt.here_
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: 1kldude]
    #26957759 - 09/27/20 05:07 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Maybe the 15W LED could've caused that as the first one to break was right under the light. The other is moved further back. About 10g wet total now lol.

Think I'm cool to keep them in the fridge in paper towels for 2 days before getting a dehydrator?


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Invisiblebebop
Registered: 07/04/20
Posts: 125
Loc: nt.here_
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: bebop]
    #26959464 - 09/28/20 09:18 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)



Bruised stem, fuzzy white base, pale caps...lack of FAE?

It's in an unmodified 32qt Sterilite tub with the lid upside down. On a layer of ~2 inches of perlite and foil.

How would I improve FAE? Fanning doesn't seem to be recommended.


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Invisiblebebop
Registered: 07/04/20
Posts: 125
Loc: nt.here_
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: bebop]
    #26962058 - 09/30/20 01:23 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

any ideas? producing about 5g wet a day at this point. Small, skinny fruits still. I'm worried about fanning, not sure what to do. Worried about when to dunk also. Pins keep growing


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Offlinetrubblesome
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Female


Registered: 11/09/19
Posts: 406
Last seen: 10 months, 17 days
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: bebop] * 1
    #26962132 - 09/30/20 01:56 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

trim that foil down to the size of the brick

edit: wait am i reading this right that there are no holes in that? in that case I'd ditch the perlite and just set this on the bottom of the tub, with the lid upside down, and maybe set at an angle to increase the FAE. mist as needed. do you have a fan moving air around in the room this is in?


Edited by trubblesome (09/30/20 02:00 PM)


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Invisiblebebop
Registered: 07/04/20
Posts: 125
Loc: nt.here_
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: trubblesome]
    #26962178 - 09/30/20 02:25 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Ended up replacing the foil. Yeah, there are no holes aside from the gaps made by the lid being upside down. Would removing the perlite help with FAE? When I lifted the brick to cut the foil, I noticed holes in the foil and just replaced it with a smaller piece.

I also noticed the brick felt drier and looked drier when right under the light I set it next to. It is very dry here fyi. There is very little to no condensation on the tub after 6-8 hours.

I'm in a 500sq ft. space, there is a fan in the room for general air circulation, but about 20 ft. away. There's a window AC unit as well. I have a smaller fan I can put anywhere if it'll help. I'll try anything lol. The fruit's I'm producing now are much smaller than the ~4g fruit that I started this thread about..

Thanks for the help


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Invisiblebebop
Registered: 07/04/20
Posts: 125
Loc: nt.here_
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: bebop]
    #26963732 - 10/01/20 12:01 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

After picking 2.5g wet of small fruits this morning:

There's a little yellow on the top part of the brick, not sure what that points to but I've been watching it, it was there before any fruits were and hasn't grown.

One of the fruits I picked from the bottom of the brick was slimy. No bad smells anywhere though.

I'd even be happy to get back to that initial picture with the 4g individual fruits.

Due to lack of new pins, I'm thinking it's ready to dunk once these are more mature?

Also noticed what may be bruising? Again points to lack of FAE but I'm in total confusion as to how to improve it. Due to the massive amounts of conflicting info, I have absolutely no clue if I should be fanning, using a fan near, or anything at all.




Any and all advice is appreciated!!! I'm pulling my hair out over here


Edited by bebop (10/01/20 12:18 PM)


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Invisiblebebop
Registered: 07/04/20
Posts: 125
Loc: nt.here_
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: bebop]
    #26963852 - 10/01/20 01:16 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

:confused: :confused:

At this point I feel like I'm even asking/explaining wrong.

If anything is unclear, let me know and I will clarify.


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Offlinelookintolearn
Stranger becoming Strangest
I'm a teapot User Gallery


Registered: 06/02/20
Posts: 574
Loc: Up in the Cut
Last seen: 1 month, 18 days
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: bebop] * 1
    #26963937 - 10/01/20 01:55 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

To me it seems like you have mixed a monotub and a SGFC. Unmodified is more for bulk and you are using perlite which is specifically for use in a SGFC. For this in particular the long skinny fruits seem to be looking for more FAE.

The unmodified works great for bulk but not so much for what you are doing. But that also depends on where you live. I live in the south and the unmodified didn't work so hot for me but then used pastywhytes ez dialed and it works much better.

You should add holes to this fruiting chamber if you want better results. Or maybe even leave the lid off for awhile if you can babysit it. Also if you are doing any kind of grow in a SGFC it helps to put alot more cakes/bags to help retain the microclimate. Just having that one in the middle is making it hard for the conditions to be correct all around it.


--------------------
Don't be afraid of feeling the feelings

Lookin to LAGM 2021



Looking to start growing? Read through Bod's Introduction to Everything
Looking to start agar? Start with Alien's Holy Grail
Looking to perfect your transfers? Start with D3monic's Perfect Transfers
Looking for easiest prep to Coir ever? Eat's UNBUCKET Tek
Looking to start LC? Try LI first! Munch's super easy Blenderless LI


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Offlinetrubblesome
Stranger
Female


Registered: 11/09/19
Posts: 406
Last seen: 10 months, 17 days
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: lookintolearn] * 1
    #26963993 - 10/01/20 02:26 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

the other thing you should do is make prints

so you can start from scratch on your own. pick a tek and stick to it rather than trying to adapt a kit to other teks


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OfflineThe Mycologist
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Registered: 05/06/16
Posts: 3,024
Last seen: 29 days, 7 hours
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: bebop] * 1
    #26964044 - 10/01/20 02:44 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Your spawn wasnt all clean.


At least you got some shroomies.

I predict it will green out at some point.


--------------------
"That you are here—that life exists, and identity;
That the powerful play goes on, and you will contribute a verse.”
― Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass
:acidfire::tmckenna:


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Invisiblebebop
Registered: 07/04/20
Posts: 125
Loc: nt.here_
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: trubblesome]
    #26965068 - 10/02/20 12:00 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

lookintolearn said:
To me it seems like you have mixed a monotub and a SGFC. Unmodified is more for bulk and you are using perlite which is specifically for use in a SGFC. For this in particular the long skinny fruits seem to be looking for more FAE.

The unmodified works great for bulk but not so much for what you are doing. But that also depends on where you live. I live in the south and the unmodified didn't work so hot for me but then used pastywhytes ez dialed and it works much better.

You should add holes to this fruiting chamber if you want better results. Or maybe even leave the lid off for awhile if you can babysit it. Also if you are doing any kind of grow in a SGFC it helps to put alot more cakes/bags to help retain the microclimate. Just having that one in the middle is making it hard for the conditions to be correct all around it.




Many thanks! Next time I mess with bags I won't bother birthing the cake this way, and I haven't made holes in the tub because as soon as this is done I'll be using the tub following bod's tek to the letter. Good info to have about pasty's dialed-in as I may have the same issue, I'll bookmark that thread too.

I've been leaving the lid off periodically today and misting when it gets dry, hopefully will see some results tomorrow. I've got brf cakes in jars that I would set in, but they've been producing huge fruits compared to this and I'm worried about contams.

Grey pins now? I still think this is bruising but there's slime? This is after a misting, and added a pic of the yellow that's always been there.

look at the base of the fruit in this


Quote:

The Mycologist said:
Your spawn wasnt all clean.


At least you got some shroomies.

I predict it will green out at some point.



Totally possible, considering the flower pot method when that happens. Judging from the pics could it be a different contam than trich? Bacterial?

Quote:

trubblesome said:
the other thing you should do is make prints

so you can start from scratch on your own. pick a tek and stick to it rather than trying to adapt a kit to other teks



I've got a print :grin: It's been working well with agar & MS to BRF/another AIO bag that I'll fruit in the bag. If I didn't start this bag it'd be weeks before I see fruits as I started gathering materials for bulk at the same time & still at the agar stage there.

Wasn't expecting much from this exactly but would've been satisfied with a dry oz :crazy:

I appreciate the input for sure


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Offlineseand04
It is what it is
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Registered: 12/02/13
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Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: bebop] * 1
    #26965071 - 10/02/20 12:05 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

The best thing I have learned here is Spore to agar, agar to grains, grains to coir. I was lost for a long time in all kinds of crazy grow methods.


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Offlinelookintolearn
Stranger becoming Strangest
I'm a teapot User Gallery


Registered: 06/02/20
Posts: 574
Loc: Up in the Cut
Last seen: 1 month, 18 days
Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: seand04] * 1
    #26965087 - 10/02/20 12:15 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

:whathesaid:

Agar to grains is the savior.

Honestly though spores are great for BRF cakes and then shredding BRF to coir. Highest chance of getting spores to produce something viable besides shitty ole SGFC. That's been my method to produce at least a couple viable mushrooms to clone then save the agar for later use with grains.

Here is an example of my BRF to bulk that I got some nice clones from that have since then been put to oats:



As far as what you have going right now though just try to maintain surface conditions best you can and if you get a viable fruit clone that sucka and clean the agar up nice to put it to your favorite grain.


--------------------
Don't be afraid of feeling the feelings

Lookin to LAGM 2021



Looking to start growing? Read through Bod's Introduction to Everything
Looking to start agar? Start with Alien's Holy Grail
Looking to perfect your transfers? Start with D3monic's Perfect Transfers
Looking for easiest prep to Coir ever? Eat's UNBUCKET Tek
Looking to start LC? Try LI first! Munch's super easy Blenderless LI


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OfflineNibs
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Registered: 02/17/20
Posts: 39
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Re: First fruits look weird, veil breaking fast w/ pics [Re: lookintolearn] * 1
    #26965283 - 10/02/20 04:45 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Tall skinny stems is a classic lack of FAE issue. Dialing in a tub properly is how you fix that. Fanning is generally not recommended to increase FAE either because most people do not have a high enough RH to get away with it without over drying your sub.


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