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Phony Phone

Registered: 09/19/20
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Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE)
#26943843 - 09/19/20 10:34 AM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Hello, a friend of mine is growing and they want to know if the stalled growth they are facing is a result of too much water (Compaction) disabling the mycelium to colonize forward or contam.
They are also wondering if in the case of bacterial contam can scrape the uncolonized part of the BRF and fruit this way.
This jar, really stalled, a big area. Will not colonize since days. Safe to birth, scrape uncolonized brf and fruit in case of contam? And what is the spiderweb like thing between the verm barrier and the cake? :

These 2 are mild cases:


Compacted cake preventing mycelium to grow or contam case?
Edited by Phony Phone (09/19/20 10:35 AM)
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Socrateshroom
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Phony Phone]
#26943855 - 09/19/20 10:42 AM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Looks way too wet.
I'd say there's a pretty big chance it's contaminated. If you can post some better pictures (clearer and showing all of the sides of each jar) it might be easier to diagnose.
I'd need to see the entire jar to get an idea if I'd even attempt to birth it, although I'm always on the overly cautious side and would probably dump that.
Also, always wait for a second opinion.
Also, no need to say your friend is growing. We know it's you and that's all right, we're all growing too
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Phony Phone

Registered: 09/19/20
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Socrateshroom]
#26943933 - 09/19/20 11:24 AM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Sure, i will post some later. Telling you now that the rest of the jars looking good, rhizomorphic growth and all then again i might be wrong and there is stuff i cant spot in there so pics will come l8r and let you guys judge.
If the contam area is scraped and discarded and healthy myc is left to do work during fruiting, does that pose dangers? The plan is to leave the suspicious cake isolated from the rest anyway
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Phony Phone

Registered: 09/19/20
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Phony Phone]
#26944457 - 09/19/20 03:57 PM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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This one is fully colonized

This one is fully colonized except for some small spot down left (It's in the OP too)

This one appears colonized too. Pic 2 is its bottom

This is the stalled one that is in the OP too. Particulary wondering what's up down in the corner between the wall and the bottom (3rd pic)

These ones lookin good

Opinions? plan is to salvage the stalled cake if possible. The water quantity ratio was messed up so they ended up wet. If thats the only problem the cake is fine, ye?
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Socrateshroom
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Phony Phone]
#26944552 - 09/19/20 04:50 PM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Ok those pictures tell a more complete story.
So they obviously all look too wet, as you mentioned your ratio was off. Excess moisture generally leads to contamination. Usually they end up bacterial (which most cakes from ms syringes are anyway).
The stalled cake doesn’t look good. When you go to birth the cakes, be aware of the odors. Read up on the different kinds of odors associated with common contams. If the smells are off, chuck them or shred them to an outdoor patch or to a pot outside with some coir.
Sometimes people remove uncolonized parts and try to fruit. Sometimes they’ll get a flush or two before more serious contams set in.
Are you birthing as cakes to a fruiting chamber or shredding to bulk?
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Phony Phone

Registered: 09/19/20
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Socrateshroom]
#26944610 - 09/19/20 05:32 PM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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yep ill keep in mind the odors. its going in isolation anyway. the bad part will be butchered and fingers crossed for the better side to give something nice if the fruit looks fine, is it also fine to eat? does the mycelium digest the gunk from bacteria and thus you eat it through the shroom? its going in an FC yes. how is the so called "mushroom smell" of the myc? is it for example similar to the smell of white button shrooms or other cullinary edibles? itll be fine if it gives any flushes at all, i know its case is a tough one
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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Phony Phone]
#26944652 - 09/19/20 06:00 PM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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All of those jars are fully colonized (except the stalled one) just scrape off anything that isn't colonized and fruit as normal. Looking good btw choice of FC will probably be crucial when it comes to producing normal healthy flushes. Look for alternatives with as balanced climate as possible with (very little maintenence = less chances of fucking it up with constantly needing to compensate for a harsh climate that's far from ideal
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
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Phony Phone

Registered: 09/19/20
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Mateja]
#26944667 - 09/19/20 06:17 PM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Thank you. the idea for the FC is an SGFC. The microclimate in it is promising. do you have any other recomendation for an FC?
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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Phony Phone]
#26944686 - 09/19/20 06:28 PM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Phony Phone said: the idea for the FC is an SGFC. The microclimate in it is promising.
SGFC unfortunately doesn't have adjustable FAE and is therfore far from optimal climate for tropical mushrooms. It's a pain in the ass to construct and eventually you end up with something that is very far away from optimal for fruiting brf cakes. The Water Tub Tek or HC create almost identical climate as the natural environment and this statement is supported by the fact that a HC setup has minimal maintenence. Link in my signature gl
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
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Phony Phone

Registered: 09/19/20
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Mateja]
#26945779 - 09/20/20 09:12 AM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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alright will check the WTT, how is the aeriation in it, does it compare to sgfc? higher chance for things to mold maybe? what is your failure rate with it if any? is it fine for cubes too?
also here is another pic of the problem jar, more clarity. it will be birthed anyway, now about contams lets see how the smell is. if it smells horrid it might just get dumped but im optimistic. could be just overly wet but how does it look to you from this angle?
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Mateja


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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Phony Phone]
#26945790 - 09/20/20 09:16 AM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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The WT is just a HC with water in it instead of wet coir, like a HC but even simpler. And of course with adjustable FAE because a HC is basically just an unmodified tub or a shoebox when it comes to the climate that it generates
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
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Phony Phone

Registered: 09/19/20
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Phony Phone]
#26945807 - 09/20/20 09:24 AM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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wont contams fall easily to the water depending on the openings of the lid? if i wanted higher FAE that means the water and cakes would be more exposed to tams. is this wrong?
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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Mateja]
#26945820 - 09/20/20 09:29 AM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Also here is how my cakes fruited after I dug out the uncolonized center of evey cake with a tea spoon, I did it in no time as well so I wasn't concerned about being gentle or anything, just rinsed them off with tap water while I carved them out. While you're at it, zoom in the pics to check out the unique surface conditions that are producing these pinsets (I create this micro climate once with the spray bottle as I place them in the HC and those surface conditions are then maintained by the HC without me needing to do much more except mist gently a couple of times a week if needed) also water and wet coir doesn't contaminate if exposed to open air and contaminant spores 
       
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
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Phony Phone

Registered: 09/19/20
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Mateja]
#26945852 - 09/20/20 09:47 AM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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thank u, good information. gotta say it looks goood. are there disadvantages compared to sgfc and vice versa?
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Mateja


Registered: 07/14/16
Posts: 7,948
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Phony Phone]
#26945887 - 09/20/20 10:08 AM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Phony Phone said: are there disadvantages compared to sgfc and vice versa?
Having adjustable FAE sure makes things easier, but practically every FC has some kind of adjustable FAE, I've experimented with taping up some of the holes on my old SGFC when humidity is too low.
-------------------- Cakes inside Water Tub
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Socrateshroom
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Mateja]
#26945912 - 09/20/20 10:23 AM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Looks like Mateah's got you covered 
I'll just add that the SGFC can be very effective, depending on your environment. FAE can be somewhat adjusted as Mateah mentioned (by taping up some of the holes) but it's difficult to tinker with and a pain. It would be much better to just shred them to coir and fruit bulk because that SGFC will be completely useless in your future endeavors. The Humidity Chamber is a goo choice, although I haven't had much luck with it personally.
Also you asked if they will be safe to eat. AFAIK, so long as there are no visible contams on the mushroom itself, they should be safe to eat. People eat mushrooms from contaminated substrate all of the time and if you eat wild mushrooms, you've eaten something that comes from a substrate will all types of other molds and or bacteria. When in doubt, boil them to make a tea and discard the material.
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Phony Phone

Registered: 09/19/20
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Re: Is this bacteria or just compaction? (BRF CAKE) [Re: Mateja]
#26946111 - 09/20/20 12:15 PM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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thank you both.
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