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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: lowbrow]
    #26941342 - 09/17/20 08:51 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

I'm confused about the scenario christopera is picturing. Rosenbaum asks Rittenhouse to kill him and Rittenhouse just obliges? No chase scene I guess? Or was the suicide attempt chasing Rittenhouse down to make him fear for his safety and react by firing on Rosenbaum?


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Offlinechristopera
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: psi]
    #26941349 - 09/17/20 08:54 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

You're confused because it was hyperbole and it went over your head.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: christopera]
    #26941353 - 09/17/20 08:57 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Maybe you can just directly make the point you were attempting to make then. How, in your view, does suicide relate to the events that actually happened?


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Offlinechristopera
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: psi] * 1
    #26941355 - 09/17/20 09:00 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

It doesn't relate. I already said that it was hyperbole.

Self defense is hyperbole too, the gun masturbators fail to admit as much though.


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Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.

A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.

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Invisiblebudmanman
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: christopera]
    #26941359 - 09/17/20 09:03 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Shooting someone chasing and attacking you is hyperbole


--------------------
Everything I have ever said is total bogus bs I am full of crud therefore everything I say should never be taken literal.

And I am mentally unstable.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: christopera]
    #26941363 - 09/17/20 09:04 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

So you have no interest in discussing how things actually played out. Got it.


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Offlinechristopera
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: budmanman] * 1
    #26941371 - 09/17/20 09:07 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

I never said that. Those are basically facts at this point.

The hyperbole is that Kyle was performing self defense. Just because you feel bad for him, that doesn't mean he wasn't there as an aggressor or illegally. To proclaim that this scenario is possible self defense is like saying soldiers kill people in Afghanistan in self defense. Not only does it belie the reality of the laws, it ignores all of the other factors involed.

But like I said, the gun masturbators will never admit as much. Kyle was not a responsible gun owner, or even a gun owner at all, and he will pay the price for it. It's a shame that so many think they are free to do with their gun whatever they please. It makes responsible gun owners look bad.


--------------------
Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.

A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.

Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things

I’m sorry it had to be me.


Edited by christopera (09/17/20 09:09 PM)


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Offlinechristopera
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: psi]
    #26941372 - 09/17/20 09:08 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

psi said:
So you have no interest in discussing how things actually played out. Got it.




That rebuts nothing I have said.


--------------------
Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.

A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.

Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things

I’m sorry it had to be me.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: christopera]
    #26941385 - 09/17/20 09:17 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

christopera said:
Quote:

psi said:
So you have no interest in discussing how things actually played out. Got it.




That rebuts nothing I have said.




What should have I been rebutting, your hyperbole about suicide?

You've stated that it's hyperbolic to suggest it was self defense. But the rationale you just gave does not seem to make much direct reference to the sequence of events in the story we're discussing. Say, for example, the part where Rosenbaum was chasing Rittenhouse. What's your take on that part?

Quote:

christopera said:
I never said that. Those are basically facts at this point.

The hyperbole is that Kyle was performing self defense. Just because you feel bad for him, that doesn't mean he wasn't there as an aggressor or illegally. To proclaim that this scenario is possible self defense is like saying soldiers kill people in Afghanistan in self defense. Not only does it belie the reality of the laws, it ignores all of the other factors involed.

But like I said, the gun masturbators will never admit as much. Kyle was not a responsible gun owner, or even a gun owner at all, and he will pay the price for it. It's a shame that so many think they are free to do with their gun whatever they please. It makes responsible gun owners look bad.




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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: psi]
    #26941396 - 09/17/20 09:25 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Could Rittenhouse have reasonably believed that Rosenbaum meant to do him immediate physical harm?


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Offlinechristopera
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: psi] * 1
    #26941399 - 09/17/20 09:29 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

It's still over your head.

If an aggressor shows up carrying a gun and kills people, it's hyperbolic to claim self defense. He arrived willing to kill.

If a person shows up ready to chase a person with a gun, are they attempting suicide? No, that was hyperbolic. They were likely aggressors too.

But when an aggressor goes against another aggressor on a city street during an unlawful scenario, and one aggressor kills two other aggressors through the use of gun, that doesn't suddenly exempt the killer based on self defense. The scenario has already moved past that point. There's no hyperbole in that statement. If you bring a gun to a gun fight and kill somebody, it is murder.


--------------------
Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.

A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.

Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things

I’m sorry it had to be me.


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Invisiblebudmanman
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: christopera] * 1
    #26941403 - 09/17/20 09:32 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Aggressor? He was there all day not shooting anyone. It seems you have no idea what happened.


--------------------
Everything I have ever said is total bogus bs I am full of crud therefore everything I say should never be taken literal.

And I am mentally unstable.


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Offlinelowbrow
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: psi]
    #26941404 - 09/17/20 09:33 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

christopera said:
How many people go to jail for being dead?

You guys are jerking yourselves off so hard over this case that you are willing to claim the dead people committed the crime. It’s hilarious to watch.


They did commit the crime.
Quote:

psi said:
I'm confused about the scenario christopera is picturing. Rosenbaum asks Rittenhouse to kill him and Rittenhouse just obliges? No chase scene I guess? Or was the suicide attempt chasing Rittenhouse down to make him fear for his safety and react by firing on Rosenbaum?




He got bored with moving the goal posts and decided to just make new ones.


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Amanita86 said:
Sui is trying to mod right now.  Kinda like a newborn calf tryin ta stand fer the first time ain’t it..


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Invisiblebudmanman
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: budmanman]
    #26941406 - 09/17/20 09:33 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Imagine being so aggressive that you run but then someone shoots of a gun behind you.


--------------------
Everything I have ever said is total bogus bs I am full of crud therefore everything I say should never be taken literal.

And I am mentally unstable.


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Offlinechristopera
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: budmanman]
    #26941408 - 09/17/20 09:35 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

budmanman said:
Aggressor? He was there all day not shooting anyone. It seems you have no idea what happened.




He was there illegally, or so the prosecution has charged.


--------------------
Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.

A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.

Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things

I’m sorry it had to be me.


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Offlinechristopera
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: lowbrow]
    #26941410 - 09/17/20 09:37 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

lowbrow said:
Quote:

christopera said:
How many people go to jail for being dead?

You guys are jerking yourselves off so hard over this case that you are willing to claim the dead people committed the crime. It’s hilarious to watch.


They did commit the crime.
Quote:

psi said:
I'm confused about the scenario christopera is picturing. Rosenbaum asks Rittenhouse to kill him and Rittenhouse just obliges? No chase scene I guess? Or was the suicide attempt chasing Rittenhouse down to make him fear for his safety and react by firing on Rosenbaum?




He got bored with moving the goal posts and decided to just make new ones.




What crime are they being prosecuted for?

You guys are the kings of moving the goal posts. That's why I took my hyperbolic stance in the first place. The argument went from self defense to the angry mob deserved it. There is a difference in there, but I bet you guys can't pick it out.


--------------------
Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.

A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.

Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things

I’m sorry it had to be me.


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Offlinechristopera
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: budmanman]
    #26941412 - 09/17/20 09:39 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

budmanman said:
Imagine being so aggressive that you run but then someone shoots of a gun behind you.




Imagine being so aggressive that you think you can protect somebody's property (not yours) with a borrowed gun. Oh wait, we don't have to. Two people died as a result.


--------------------
Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.

A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.

Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things

I’m sorry it had to be me.


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InvisibleJokeshopbeard
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: christopera] * 3
    #26941413 - 09/17/20 09:40 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

christopera said:
You guys are jerking yourselves off so hard over this case



LOL. I love that. There's definitely a few here that are committing some serious mental masturbation over this shit. "He was standing up for his rights as an American!!"

I wonder - for those that take this stance - is your cum red, white and blue when you ejaculate?


--------------------
Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe


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Invisiblebudmanman
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: christopera]
    #26941419 - 09/17/20 09:46 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

christopera said:
Quote:

budmanman said:
Imagine being so aggressive that you run but then someone shoots of a gun behind you.




Imagine being so aggressive that you think you can protect somebody's property (not yours) with a borrowed gun. Oh wait, we don't have to. Two people died as a result.





But he wasn't even at that property, the police wouldn't let him even go to it because the rioters became so dangerous the police made a blockade letting no one through so Kyle was forced to walk towards the rioters and pass through them to leave.

Then he was attacked since he was alone and vulnerable the rioters felt emboldened.


--------------------
Everything I have ever said is total bogus bs I am full of crud therefore everything I say should never be taken literal.

And I am mentally unstable.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Kyle Rittenhouse's official initial defense statement. [Re: christopera]
    #26941420 - 09/17/20 09:47 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

So your position is that once Rittenhouse was on the scene with the rifle, nothing he did after that could be self defense, regardless of what threats he might face. I'm no expert on Wisconsin law but I guess we will see how the court case plays out. Should be pretty quick if the sequence of events, and whether or not Rittenhouse reasonably feared for his safety etc, are mostly moot points.



A lot of people found a self-defense argument pretty hyperbolic in the Zimmerman/Martin case (and/or found the not guilty verdict surprising). If Zimmerman hadn't been armed and playing pretend cop, Martin surely would not have been killed. But the evidence indicated that in Martin's final moments before being shot, he was on top of Zimmerman and beating his head into the pavement.


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