Home | Community | Message Board

Sporeworks
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   North Spore Boomr Bag   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   PhytoExtractum Kratom Powder for Sale

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1
OfflineShroomboofer
Stranger


Registered: 06/05/20
Posts: 100
Last seen: 6 months, 17 days
How to treat cactus seed contamination while germinating
    #26913035 - 09/02/20 12:53 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

I sterilized some soil: 50% peet moss, 50% perlite and put in san pedro and bolivian torch seeds on 8/26.  Its 9/1 now and there's visible white mold and what looks like green forest mold.  The seeds look like they have yet to germinate.  How could I treat this to kill the mold and save the seeds?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDancingWolf
FluffButt
I'm a teapot


Registered: 08/31/19
Posts: 797
Last seen: 2 days, 2 hours
Re: How to treat cactus seed contamination while germinating [Re: Shroomboofer]
    #26913394 - 09/02/20 08:58 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Dry them out or transplant anything that pops up ASAP. Fungicide would work, maybe.

Six parts vermiculite, four parts COCO COIR, and one part top soil from a forest floor (sifted of course) is a good starting mix. I also use two parts top soil, two parts coir, and one part vermiculite. Very rarely will I have a mold problem with this mix and its usually something that colonized coco coir and is harmless.

Growing cactus from seed is trial and error.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineShroomboofer
Stranger


Registered: 06/05/20
Posts: 100
Last seen: 6 months, 17 days
Re: How to treat cactus seed contamination while germinating [Re: DancingWolf]
    #26913710 - 09/02/20 12:38 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

I misted it last night with hydrogen peroxide and just took off the lids per your recommendation.  For the soil preparation, I used a 10 PSI pressure cooker and pressure cooked for 30 minutes or so...  I suppose I need to do it longer or perhaps three times over three days.  I also wasn't terribly careful about doing things in a super sterile environment as it seemed like it wouldn't be necessary from san pedro mastery's videos...  Perhaps I also should wash the seeds in dilute H2O2?  San pedro mastery also says not to use vermiculite because it holds onto too much water, coir has too much salt, and perlite can't be pressure cooked because it falls apart I guess?


Edited by Shroomboofer (09/02/20 12:38 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDancingWolf
FluffButt
I'm a teapot


Registered: 08/31/19
Posts: 797
Last seen: 2 days, 2 hours
Re: How to treat cactus seed contamination while germinating [Re: Shroomboofer]
    #26913830 - 09/02/20 02:07 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

I don't pasteurize my soil. Pasteurization kills off the good microbes / fungi, as well as the bad; it makes it easier to colonize with bad stuff. I literally scrap up the top soil out of my local forest, mix it with relatively inert coir or coir based potting mix, vermiculite, and that is my general purpose mix. Since you are working with seedlings, they prefer to have moisture. Adult plants may vary with what they like, bridgesii should get more gravel and generic Pachanois / San Pedro won't mind this mix as long as you let them dry out for a fair amount of time.

I sometimes add gavel depending on the plant but since it's the dead of summer and 100*F right now, it's too much effort to collect any. The general mix works well for cactus seeds and common cactus, but mammillarias, Octillo, and desert cactus want more gravel. Trichocereus are not desert cactus but are closer to mountainous / temperate cactus.

A healthy soil isn't going to need cooking or pasteurization. I hypothesize that soil from a forest will be loaded with good fungi and microbes, and very little, if anything, that would harm cactus since so few cactus grow on the forest floor in deep shade.

Part of the fungal issue is a lack of UV light. I'm germinating my latest seeds under 40% shade cloth. Too much light will nuke the seedlings, too little helps mold and fungus develop. It's a real fussy business to get started with but once you find the sweet spot, you will have more cactus than you know what to do with. Expect lots of losses while learning what works in your area. I would get a 1,000 pack of seeds and experiment.

Some of these pictures have some perlite, the last doesn't. I used to use it with annuals for root anchorage but I find it to be a waste of money unless the plant specifically requires it. The second picture is dirt from a productive cactus tray, the last is what I have been transplanting into.

Disposable casserole dishes are best IMHO, they are clear and let in the most light, no opaque walls.



Edited by DancingWolf (09/02/20 02:36 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisiblecoAsTal
Friend
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/04/06
Posts: 2,970
Loc: 8a
Re: How to treat cactus seed contamination while germinating [Re: DancingWolf]
    #26914025 - 09/02/20 04:06 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Fixed your post for you
Quote:

DancingWolf said:
I don't pasteurize sterilize my soil. Pasteurization Sterilization kills off the good microbes / fungi, as well as the bad; it makes it easier to colonize with bad stuff. I literally scrap up the top soil out of my local forest, mix it with relatively inert coir or coir based potting mix, vermiculite, and that is my general purpose mix. Since you are working with seedlings, they prefer to have moisture. Adult plants may vary with what they like, bridgesii should get more gravel and generic Pachanois / San Pedro won't mind this mix as long as you let them dry out for a fair amount of time.

I sometimes add gavel depending on the plant but since it's the dead of summer and 100*F right now, it's too much effort to collect any. The general mix works well for cactus seeds and common cactus, but mammillarias, Octillo, and desert cactus want more gravel. Trichocereus are not desert cactus but are closer to mountainous / temperate cactus.

A healthy soil isn't going to need cooking or pasteurization. I hypothesize that soil from a forest will be loaded with good fungi and microbes, and very little, if anything, that would harm cactus since so few cactus grow on the forest floor in deep shade.

Part of the fungal issue is a lack of UV light. I'm germinating my latest seeds under 40% shade cloth. Too much light will nuke the seedlings, too little helps mold and fungus develop. It's a real fussy business to get started with but once you find the sweet spot, you will have more cactus than you know what to do with. Expect lots of losses while learning what works in your area. I would get a 1,000 pack of seeds and experiment.

Some of these pictures have some perlite, the last doesn't. I used to use it with annuals for root anchorage but I find it to be a waste of money unless the plant specifically requires it. The second picture is dirt from a productive cactus tray, the last is what I have been transplanting into.

Disposable casserole dishes are best IMHO, they are clear and let in the most light, no opaque walls.






--------------------
I am certain of nothing but the holiness of the Heart's affections and the truth of Imagination--  John Keats

Spore Trading List


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDancingWolf
FluffButt
I'm a teapot


Registered: 08/31/19
Posts: 797
Last seen: 2 days, 2 hours
Re: How to treat cactus seed contamination while germinating [Re: coAsTal]
    #26914351 - 09/02/20 06:43 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

There was nothing to fix, pressure cooking soil one time doesn't kill everything in it and it won't be sterile, which is why I chose to use pasteurization. Spores and some bacteria are very difficult to destroy and it takes several trips with a pressure cooker at high temps 80-120C+ to get a medium "sterile". The process is great for mushrooms, not so great for cactus seeds.

Even if you sterilized the soil, containers aren't air tight and seeds may still have pathogens on them despite being rinsed in H2O2 or a quick bleach rinse if you dare. Once the container is exposed to air, it's also exposed to all the gunk in the air as well. I suppose you could rinse all the containers as well and do this in a clean room, but it's simply easier and more effective to use healthy soil.

If you decided to go the cooking/sterile/pasteurization route, let the soil cool back down to room temp thoroughly so don't cook the seeds by putting them on hot dirt. Ask me how I know this one. :P Soaking seeds in plain water for 48 hours prior to planting will speed germination rates.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineGlazedHazels
Reality Outran Apprehension

Registered: 08/12/11
Posts: 205
Last seen: 5 hours, 38 minutes
Re: How to treat cactus seed contamination while germinating [Re: DancingWolf]
    #26914649 - 09/02/20 09:52 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

After experiencing this problem I got some organic copper spray fungicide and all my cobweb went away. Hydrogen peroxide is a bandaid fix because it decays into hydrogen and oxygen, but the copper gradually accumulates until the mold stops regrowing.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineShroomboofer
Stranger


Registered: 06/05/20
Posts: 100
Last seen: 6 months, 17 days
Re: How to treat cactus seed contamination while germinating [Re: GlazedHazels]
    #26918497 - 09/05/20 12:55 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Oh sweet I have some liquid copper fungicide from souther ag on hand!  Sweet!


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineShroomboofer
Stranger


Registered: 06/05/20
Posts: 100
Last seen: 6 months, 17 days
Re: How to treat cactus seed contamination while germinating [Re: DancingWolf]
    #26918512 - 09/05/20 01:10 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

DancingWolf said:
I don't pasteurize my soil. Pasteurization kills off the good microbes / fungi, as well as the bad; it makes it easier to colonize with bad stuff. I literally scrap up the top soil out of my local forest, mix it with relatively inert coir or coir based potting mix, vermiculite, and that is my general purpose mix. Since you are working with seedlings, they prefer to have moisture. Adult plants may vary with what they like, bridgesii should get more gravel and generic Pachanois / San Pedro won't mind this mix as long as you let them dry out for a fair amount of time.



I think I'm going to give this a shot for the next round of seeds, I live near a forest. 

So here's my proposed plan:  35% "sterile" peat moss, 50% perlite, 15% shaded forest soil.  First put the seeds in a lightly wet paper towel for a 2 days before planting.  Have it in a clean tupperware covered with suran wrap, and gradually start opening it after ten days.  What do you think?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDancingWolf
FluffButt
I'm a teapot


Registered: 08/31/19
Posts: 797
Last seen: 2 days, 2 hours
Re: How to treat cactus seed contamination while germinating [Re: Shroomboofer] * 1
    #26919467 - 09/05/20 02:25 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Avoid peat moss, it binds up, is hard to re-wet, rots easier, etc. I know a lot of people use it with cactus but I find it rots cactus easily. I usually order coco-coir bricks online, they are easier to store and can be expanded with fertilizer. I use a coir based potting mix when I can get it locally but it's almost pure coir and needs to be treated as such. Plantonix is the brand I use for bricks and the previous two pack I ordered came with a coupon.

I can't comment on how well perlite will work, you can try it. Coir / vermiculite / top soil is what I use. The coir keeps the top soil from compacting, going hydrophobic or turning into mud, the vermiculite keeps it from sticking together and helps the mix flow easier, also preventing compaction. I have included some perlite in the past when I still kept it around, I can't comment on if it had any benefit.



Container time: I leave containers closed for upwards of 8-12+ months. Cactus seeds love moisture but they don't want to be drowned either.

Fungus:  A lack of bright sunlight is part of what helps fungus to grow. Seedlings are easily burned or nuked and it can be scary when they are in bright light. (No direct sunlight in the summer, it always needs some kind of shade cloth, opaque plastic, partial shade between tables, something.) I still get mycelium colonizing coco-coir from time to time and it makes it go hydrophobic but it doesn't seem to be harmful to cactus.

Soaking: It's is not necessary but it will speed germination if you want to do it, 1-2 days tops. When I soaked seeds, it was in small clear plastic containers. The seeds can be a little more annoying to plant and its extra steps drying them off before planting. Since I'm planting in large quantities, I sprinkle them in dry. It's purely optional since the seeds will soak in the tray anyway.

Planting technique: First, wet the dirt in your tray, tap it flat but don't mash it down. You can use a little stick, pencil, label, etc, to make a tiny 1/4th - 1/8th inch deep hole on the surface. Drop 1-2 seeds in the hole, it will keep them moist and the dirt will eventually fill in around the roots giving them a better anchor. You can mist the surface after planting so bits of sand and dirt wash down to the seeds, but this is optional.

I'll see if I can round up some pictures later today of what conditions I keep seeds in, tools I use, soil components, etc. A picture is worth a thousand words, or more.

Here ya go, this might prove useful as to materials and dirt texture. I think its a toss up between trays and disposable bake pans. Heavy duty aluminum casserole dishes work great. You might get success with your ratio, you might not, seed growing is trial and error.



I didn't have any pure forest dirt left so the "dirt" in the ratio picture is obviously an already mixed up place holder. I dumped it back into my bucket after mixing and scooped up some 2:2:1 mixture which is what I usually use. I have used 4:6:1-2 and it works great as well but I haven't had any fungal issues with a heavier mix. Purely inert mix like 4:6 coco coir: Vermiculite will result in seeds that have nothing to grow with, but if you are going straight to grafting then that may be acceptable.


Edited by DancingWolf (09/05/20 05:55 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1

Shop: Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   North Spore Boomr Bag   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   PhytoExtractum Kratom Powder for Sale


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* WOOHOO! My seeds have germinated! fjbk47985 1,122 17 04/24/03 07:30 PM
by fjbk47985
* peyote graph from seeds Anonymous 2,938 17 01/25/04 09:09 PM
by Anonymous
* Psychotria veridis germination Egyn 2,045 8 04/27/05 06:41 AM
by myndreach
* san pedro from seeds supercollider 1,646 4 01/08/02 09:57 AM
by Pinhead
* Sida Cordifolia from seed? *Update* SalviaEngland 9,528 16 03/27/08 05:12 AM
by royer
* san pedro seeds-help krispyfi 1,614 4 03/05/09 09:51 AM
by ethnoguy
* Can I start cacti from seed in this sand/soil compost T0aD 1,320 5 03/13/03 09:07 PM
by T0aD
* Sceletium tortuosum from seed SalviaEngland 3,819 10 10/09/02 03:38 PM
by whiterasta

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Mostly_Harmless, A.k.a
549 topic views. 4 members, 6 guests and 6 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.02 seconds spending 0.005 seconds on 12 queries.