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OfflineGuyBuddyFriend
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Mushrooms and making sense of things * 2
    #26894440 - 08/22/20 10:24 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Having gone through a couple handfuls of mushroom trips over the past decade or so, most recently being today, there does seem to be one message that I take away consistently from them. That being that no matter what we do everything will happen the way it is meant to be and there is nothing we can do to change that, even if we tried to change the way we think things were meant to be that would be meant to be as well. I do believe in determinism and never had a problem with it because having the illusion of free will is fine by me, since I never worried about whether or not I choose to do anything before I figure why start now. But I guess what I get out of the trip usually is the cliche that everything is connected and working together to produce an outcome that could be no other way, and we are just here to enjoy this brief ride during our eternal journey without beginning nor end. It’s so beautiful and yet terrifying, always amazed at how hardcore my range of emotion is throughout a good trip, never 100% good or bad, just perfectly the way it should be and always has been.

Thanks for reading if you did. Either way it was meant to be :wink:


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Offlinerickomalley238
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: GuyBuddyFriend]
    #26894622 - 08/23/20 12:09 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

I feel like maybe I could be much less stressed if I could believe such determinism; and in-fact, one trip of mine I swore it was meant to be a part of my life.

But how do you truly, truly believe this? Do you believe that there is an ultimate goal? Because if there is, then that could explain determinism, but without an ultimate goal, it seems completely illogical.

I've had fucked up things happen to me in my life, random things, and I really question everything often.

I'm just curious for your logic.

Thanks, man


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OfflineForresterM
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: rickomalley238]
    #26894697 - 08/23/20 02:24 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

GuyBuddyFriend said:
Having gone through a couple handfuls of mushroom trips over the past decade or so, most recently being today, there does seem to be one message that I take away consistently from them. That being that no matter what we do everything will happen the way it is meant to be and there is nothing we can do to change that, even if we tried to change the way we think things were meant to be that would be meant to be as well. I do believe in determinism and never had a problem with it because having the illusion of free will is fine by me, since I never worried about whether or not I choose to do anything before I figure why start now. But I guess what I get out of the trip usually is the cliche that everything is connected and working together to produce an outcome that could be no other way, and we are just here to enjoy this brief ride during our eternal journey without beginning nor end. It’s so beautiful and yet terrifying, always amazed at how hardcore my range of emotion is throughout a good trip, never 100% good or bad, just perfectly the way it should be and always has been.




I've gone through a lot of different life philosophies, questioning and reassessing them all, and it always comes back to this.  Still have to agree there :peace:

Although there is a caveat with the "free will is an illusion" thing - maybe what we do isn't so much free will, but what we think about things/people always is.  We can go through life judging things (especially people and their actions) against how we think they should be, or we can go through life accepting things (and especially people) as they are - and which way we choose will greatly affect our experience, and happiness.  So there is a choice.

Quote:

rickomalley238 said:
I've had fucked up things happen to me in my life, random things, and I really question everything often.




Everything that happens to you in life, everything - is to teach you something.  Always.  If you can spin it in a positive way and learn to let stuff roll of your shoulder and not get to you, you may find these lessons stop repeating.  You can't change what happens, but you can always change your mind about it.


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.


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OfflineGuyBuddyFriend
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: Forrester]
    #26894851 - 08/23/20 06:55 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

rickomalley238 said:
But how do you truly, truly believe this? Do you believe that there is an ultimate goal? Because if there is, then that could explain determinism, but without an ultimate goal, it seems completely illogical.



I don’t know about the ultimate goal or if there is one, I moreso get the impression that everything is unsolvable complex mathematics that none of us are meant to fully understand. If there is a beginning or end or an ultimate goal, it isn’t something that can be understood for what it truly is while we are here so it isn’t worth dwelling on. Maybe my logic is flawed and I’m using it as an excuse to simplify things that I can’t wrap my head around, but I’m cool with that until proven otherwise.

Quote:

Forrester said:
Although there is a caveat with the "free will is an illusion" thing - maybe what we do isn't so much free will, but what we think about things/people always is.  We can go through life judging things (especially people and their actions) against how we think they should be, or we can go through life accepting things (and especially people) as they are - and which way we choose will greatly affect our experience, and happiness.  So there is a choice.
.



I see your point and it’s hard to argue that we aren’t forming our own thoughts about the world. It’s just that all of those thoughts could have come about as a result of the sum of all past experiences, meaning that you may think you are coming up with a brand new idea of your own accord but actually you were always led down the road of doing so therefore was never actually your choice. As mentioned before though, it’s not worth stressing about if we really don’t have “free will” because our brains don’t have the capacity to think otherwise (at least mine doesn’t). Like even if my next thought can be figured out mathematically somehow, its not something I would personally ever figure out so it’s safe to assume it was me who thought it using my illusion of free will.

Hope that makes sense. Cheers!


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Offlinerickomalley238
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: GuyBuddyFriend]
    #26895141 - 08/23/20 10:29 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

I still don't quite understand but I'm trying. Yes, I do believe everything is interconnected; what you put out is what you receive. There seems to be a form of higher consciousness/intelligence which is almost objective per se, nothing we can be close to comprehending but only seeing fragments of it if we're lucky.

Maybe that's off topic, but I put that out there because that's how I understand things. In terms of determinism, I fell on a walk yesterday slipping on mud, was I meant to fall? That was the point? If I just stepped a little differently, I wouldn't have fell, and that would have been entirely possible then.

Perhaps if an automated bot called my phone 2 seconds before I fell, I would have looked at my phone and stepped differently, but this breaches determinism doesn't it?

Can you clarify a bit


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Offlinerickomalley238
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: Forrester]
    #26895156 - 08/23/20 10:41 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Forrester said:
Quote:

rickomalley238 said:
I've had fucked up things happen to me in my life, random things, and I really question everything often.




Everything that happens to you in life, everything - is to teach you something.  Always.  If you can spin it in a positive way and learn to let stuff roll of your shoulder and not get to you, you may find these lessons stop repeating.  You can't change what happens, but you can always change your mind about it.




This is very interesting and compelling. Thoughts and negative cycles repeat to teach lessons; yes I've understood this before, but it's almost as if learning the lesson requires one to stop thinking or ruminating about it. Like, wisdom is gained in the heart/soul, not in the mind/intelligence, if this makes sense..

Is this what you mean by chance?

edit: also, how do you explain cynical thoughts?


Edited by rickomalley238 (08/23/20 10:42 AM)


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OfflineForresterM
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: rickomalley238]
    #26895462 - 08/23/20 01:57 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

rickomalley238 said:
This is very interesting and compelling. Thoughts and negative cycles repeat to teach lessons; yes I've understood this before, but it's almost as if learning the lesson requires one to stop thinking or ruminating about it. Like, wisdom is gained in the heart/soul, not in the mind/intelligence, if this makes sense..

Is this what you mean by chance?

edit: also, how do you explain cynical thoughts?




Thoughts are waveforms, just frequencies like tv or radio only a bit more difficult for machines to read.  You know when you forget what you had thought of, and so you have to go back to the room where you thought of it?  And there it is right there, you remember!  :lol:  But seriously thoughts are just that.  Sometimes we pick them up in the air, some are positive and some are negative.  So I think cynical or other negative thoughts in general may just go through our heads at random, and are entirely meaningless unless we catch on, feed them and give the thought more energy, now transmitting more negativity and increasing it.  I think that's how people so often get in these negative cycles of thoughts, each one increases the last and even attracts other people of the same negative energy when it's what you're broadcasting out.

So I find the best thing I've ever done is to just start ignoring the negative ones entirely and dismissing them as the meaningless passersby that they are.  I found that after a while they rarely even show up anymore, and if they do I just let them go and they have no power.

It sounds cliche as fuck, but filling your mindspace with only positivity seriously has, for me at least, attracted only that.  At least a lot more of it.  And negative stuff, rudeness from other people, anger, whatever, I barely even seem to notice when it does come around.


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.


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OfflineGuyBuddyFriend
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: rickomalley238]
    #26895755 - 08/23/20 05:38 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

rickomalley238 said:
I still don't quite understand but I'm trying. Yes, I do believe everything is interconnected; what you put out is what you receive. There seems to be a form of higher consciousness/intelligence which is almost objective per se, nothing we can be close to comprehending but only seeing fragments of it if we're lucky.

Maybe that's off topic, but I put that out there because that's how I understand things. In terms of determinism, I fell on a walk yesterday slipping on mud, was I meant to fall? That was the point? If I just stepped a little differently, I wouldn't have fell, and that would have been entirely possible then.

Perhaps if an automated bot called my phone 2 seconds before I fell, I would have looked at my phone and stepped differently, but this breaches determinism doesn't it?

Can you clarify a bit



Well falling in the mud could have been a result of you being distracted by something else going on in your life, and all that was connected by something previous. Also if you weren’t distracted and the mud was something you didn’t see coming it was unavoidable anyway. It still could be deterministic if you think about it that way, but I’m not saying I’m definitely right. Just something I picked up from the mushroom.


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Onlinetryptkaloids
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: rickomalley238]
    #26896134 - 08/23/20 10:43 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

rickomalley238 said:
I feel like maybe I could be much less stressed if I could believe such determinism; and in-fact, one trip of mine I swore it was meant to be a part of my life.

But how do you truly, truly believe this? Do you believe that there is an ultimate goal? Because if there is, then that could explain determinism, but without an ultimate goal, it seems completely illogical.

I've had fucked up things happen to me in my life, random things, and I really question everything often.

I'm just curious for your logic.

Thanks, man



some guy in a space group i follow keeps urging everyone that the purpose is for matter to be converted to energy.


--------------------
"Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
Flowchart for Recommended plan of action.
Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms
Use the Damn search engine
After you know what you're doing, take a break 
Pick a book, Make some chips!
Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
 


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: tryptkaloids]
    #26896448 - 08/24/20 05:54 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

so you think the mind is a kind of radio?


--------------------
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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26896490 - 08/24/20 07:11 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Yes, in a way sort of.  There is organic radio / or something like it happening all the time.  That medium & media is experienced intersubjectively as vision, sound, tastes, smells, touch, and thought (Mind / Imagination).  Like a transceiver of an organic nature.  With memory are organic hard drive & ram, dna, inter-webbed & networked and online/ “on the air”.


--------------------
Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps


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Invisiblepur3bind
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: GuyBuddyFriend]
    #26896559 - 08/24/20 08:13 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

I don't know if this has been already added here yet.
But honestly, yes, hallucinogens can make you see the interconnectivity of all things, but there are other powerful experiences in life that bring you up close and personal with that truth.


--------------------
"There are times— and this would be a great study for somebody to do—there have been periods in English when there were emotions that don't exist anymore, because the words have been lost. There are colors that don't exist anymore because the words have been lost." — Terence McKenna (The Archaic Revival: 1991)



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OfflineForresterM
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26897306 - 08/24/20 02:54 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
so you think the mind is a kind of radio?




I think it's possible that something like that is the case.  Paramahansa Yogananda insists on it in his autobiography and when I read it, it struck me as possible that it could be literally true.  Who knows?


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.


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Onlinetryptkaloids
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: Forrester]
    #26897319 - 08/24/20 03:01 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Its actually an idea that's more than twice as old as the bible. Consciousness isn't the person, it is just shown through the person


--------------------
"Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
Flowchart for Recommended plan of action.
Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms
Use the Damn search engine
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OfflineGuyBuddyFriend
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: tryptkaloids]
    #26897560 - 08/24/20 05:38 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

A little while ago I read a CIA Document about Project Gateway that talked about all matter being energy and it said something along the lines of your statement “Consciousness isn't the person, it is just shown through the person“. From what I recall it describes a process to control brain waves in order to access information from an infinite energy source detached from time and space. I’m no expert but has anyone else heard of this paper from the CIA website and If so what do you think?


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Onlinetryptkaloids
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: GuyBuddyFriend]
    #26897735 - 08/24/20 07:30 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

I started to read it. But it was a lot to swallow for the time i had. Its just a confirmation of ancient lessons.

The information network discribed is referred to as the akashic records. Its what einstein and tesla tapped into


--------------------
"Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
Flowchart for Recommended plan of action.
Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms
Use the Damn search engine
After you know what you're doing, take a break 
Pick a book, Make some chips!
Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
 


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OfflineNemo98
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: GuyBuddyFriend]
    #26897828 - 08/24/20 08:36 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

What if they are lying?


Edited by Nemo98 (08/24/20 08:37 PM)


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Onlinetryptkaloids
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: Nemo98]
    #26897996 - 08/25/20 01:07 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Who cares? Fuck around and find out


--------------------
"Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
Flowchart for Recommended plan of action.
Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms
Use the Damn search engine
After you know what you're doing, take a break 
Pick a book, Make some chips!
Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
 


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: tryptkaloids]
    #26898508 - 08/25/20 10:54 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

there may be something like a radio capability, but your thoughts are really your thoughts not the thoughts of some entity or generalized force of the universe or anything from another dimension.

everything that happens in your senses reaches your brain and resonates together with what is there at the same time.

this cotemporaneous resonance becomes a memory frame, a slice of time that links together all those sensations and thoughts at that moment.

when something similar happens or if you remember that time, then the totality of it can be recalled.

NO RADIO in any of that!!!!

99% of what happens in the mind is what I just described, experiencing life and creating and reliving memories that have been experienced.

amidst the 1% that remains may be included a radio like transmission and reception of something which I have no exact theories about:  the complexity of electrical fields in the brain could possibly be coordinated to transmit or receive something that is not ordinarily sensed.


--------------------
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OfflineForresterM
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Re: Mushrooms and making sense of things [Re: redgreenvines]
    #26898833 - 08/25/20 01:43 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
there may be something like a radio capability, but your thoughts are really your thoughts not the thoughts of some entity or generalized force of the universe or anything from another dimension.




That's the common belief, but you really have to way to prove it.

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
99% of what happens in the mind is what I just described, experiencing life and creating and reliving memories that have been experienced.

amidst the 1% that remains may be included a radio like transmission and reception of something which I have no exact theories about:  the complexity of electrical fields in the brain could possibly be coordinated to transmit or receive something that is not ordinarily sensed.




What type of equipment did you use to gather these statistics?  :wink:

I'm just saying, maybe the 1% "exception to the rule" sometimes should just tell us the rule is wrong and should be reassessed.


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.


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