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szubsa
Stranger
Registered: 08/15/20
Posts: 24
Last seen: 2 years, 5 months
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: Magenta]
#26893221 - 08/22/20 10:10 AM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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if you mean me, nobody is pulling my strings. I'm new in this forum, but not new to mushrooms. Since I'm growing them a long time, saw a lot of grows and heard all questions and the answers to them over and over, in time I lost interest in reading all these posts or participating in forums.
I do however post on Reddit for quite some time:
https://www.reddit.com/user/szubsa
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jimi



Registered: 11/20/99
Posts: 98
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: kmn594]
#26894254 - 08/22/20 08:20 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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Ok, since the op is gone, here's another example of what's going on now that you guys can do:
https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT03537014
You'll see these MDMA ones popping up a lot more soon.
And the psilocybin ones, some are recruiting now:
https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/results?cond=&term=Psilocybin&cntry=&state=&city=&dist=#
Edited by jimi (08/26/20 02:09 PM)
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PrimalSoup
hyperspatial illuminations



Registered: 11/17/09
Posts: 13,568
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: jimi]
#26894337 - 08/22/20 09:29 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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The OP hasn't been back since the original post. But in the survey there is contact info.
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if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat youPrimal's simple tested teks and projects: Wheat Prep 2.0 Acidic Tea Tek Potency Project!
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lowbrow
Paddy Time!!!!


Registered: 09/12/08
Posts: 9,711
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: jimi]
#26894504 - 08/22/20 10:58 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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This is a site-wide thread, not just OTD.
-------------------- Amanita86 said: Sui is trying to mod right now. Kinda like a newborn calf tryin ta stand fer the first time ain’t it..
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Honeheke
Happy little fella

Registered: 06/11/19
Posts: 39
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: captainkirk1993]
#26894731 - 08/23/20 03:38 AM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
captainkirk1993 said: This is a very interesting read and I'm only a few pages in. Thanks for the link I think I'm going to look into some of this meditation techniques for my own issues with pain and not being able to relax very well.
I agree I read through the document and was really impressed how it was layed out from basic mechanisms through to outer body experiences.
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dothedew69
Relearning



Registered: 08/27/08
Posts: 624
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: Honeheke]
#26894821 - 08/23/20 06:25 AM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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Alright after reading so many long posts it seems like there’s a negative attitude towards using Psilocybe for medicinal/therapeutic purposes. I literally started growing again just for that reason. Years ago I get mushrooms just because I wanted to trip, that’s it. But what happened I learned so much about myself, how I relate to the world, and my connection to everyone. I was a super shy person, suffered from extreme anxiety. After doing a lot of mushrooms I reflected on my issues and I’m way better off (more social, less depressed, and it helped reduce my anxiety a lot). Again I’m out on a 6 week leave due to sever anxiety, panic, and terror. I’m growing again to defeat it. Now don’t blast me for it, I have an AMAZING psychiatrist and therapist. I so cognitive behavioral therapy and group therapy (CBT) three times a week. Think about it, the way we think effects how we feel, our physical condition, and everything About who we are. You can fix illness simply with correcting your thought process. So what do mushrooms do for me? It allows me to think, it destroys my ego and in essence it’s a form of CBT therapy. I’m seriously curious about asking my therapist if we can do a session while I’m on Psilocybe. These studies will help so many people out. Don’t knock it because it may kill the spirituality of mushrooms and old time traditions. There’s millions of people who can benefit from this without having to take 8mg klonopin, lexapro, Zoloft, you pick any ssri, and the list of medications goes on and on (yes I take a shit ton of medications right now to feel normal). Mushrooms are a gift, they have REAL MEDICINAL VALUE. Study on researches, study on. I thank you from the bottom of my heart.
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szubsa
Stranger
Registered: 08/15/20
Posts: 24
Last seen: 2 years, 5 months
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: dothedew69]
#26895154 - 08/23/20 10:40 AM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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It's not about killing the spirituality of mushrooms or breaking with old time traditions. I don't even believe you can kill the spirituality.
In your casw, you say you used them and it helped you. So I guess there's no problem when it comes to you.
But not everybody's the same. People report to have had life changing experiences. Doctors want to cure their patients from mental disorders, they don't want to change their belief system. I think they would regard this as unwanted side effects.
Personally I don't believe mushrooms teached my something harmful or bad, but the people you relate with might no longer understand what you are talking about and people may lose a lot of their friends,for instance. If your spiritual experiences had a deep impact on you and you keep talking about them that could irritate a lot of people.
I'm using mushrooms for over 20 years and they still have something new to teach me. You never reach a point where you know everything. And a lot of things I believed I understood years ago were misinterpretations of my earlier experiences. So, at least for some time, I was wrong about certain things. These things can fuck up your life. Not for everybody but that may depend on people's character. Some people get obsessed with things while others don't.
What I mean is that the spiritual aspect is the main effect of magic mushrooms, while positive effects on depressions are the side effect. Magic mushrooms teach us things and information is spirit. Unlike animals, that never change their behavior over thousands of years, humans are taken over by ideas/spirits whose servants they become. And shrooms can open doors to either good or bad ideas/spirits.
I don't believe these doctors really understand shrooms/psilocybin like shamans know the psychedelics they use. And I doubt they know what they are really getting into. And, with eventually many thousands of patients, who knows what will happen.
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Honeheke
Happy little fella

Registered: 06/11/19
Posts: 39
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: dothedew69]
#26895701 - 08/23/20 04:54 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
dothedew69 said: Alright after reading so many long posts it seems like there’s a negative attitude towards using Psilocybe for medicinal/therapeutic purposes. I literally started growing again just for that reason. Years ago I get mushrooms just because I wanted to trip, that’s it. But what happened I learned so much about myself, how I relate to the world, and my connection to everyone. I was a super shy person, suffered from extreme anxiety. After doing a lot of mushrooms I reflected on my issues and I’m way better off (more social, less depressed, and it helped reduce my anxiety a lot). Again I’m out on a 6 week leave due to sever anxiety, panic, and terror. I’m growing again to defeat it. Now don’t blast me for it, I have an AMAZING psychiatrist and therapist. I so cognitive behavioral therapy and group therapy (CBT) three times a week. Think about it, the way we think effects how we feel, our physical condition, and everything About who we are. You can fix illness simply with correcting your thought process. So what do mushrooms do for me? It allows me to think, it destroys my ego and in essence it’s a form of CBT therapy. I’m seriously curious about asking my therapist if we can do a session while I’m on Psilocybe. These studies will help so many people out. Don’t knock it because it may kill the spirituality of mushrooms and old time traditions. There’s millions of people who can benefit from this without having to take 8mg klonopin, lexapro, Zoloft, you pick any ssri, and the list of medications goes on and on (yes I take a shit ton of medications right now to feel normal). Mushrooms are a gift, they have REAL MEDICINAL VALUE. Study on researches, study on. I thank you from the bottom of my heart.
Hey dothedew,
I really like your post.
My next door neighbour is a psychologist and when I talk with her, she always goes back to the fact that mushrooms on their own are one thing but when combined with a process that encompasses teachings on mushrooms and without mushrooms is where the real benefits lye.
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Clownologist
Stranger

Registered: 04/21/20
Posts: 22
Last seen: 8 months, 30 days
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: szubsa]
#26896445 - 08/24/20 05:49 AM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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I was going to participate in the survey then it dawned on me, a "real" scientist would put themselves through the experience while carefully and methodically documenting the experience from an inquisitive and scientifically trained perspective.
But you really.. REALLY!... lost me when your scientific study asked my gender, and there were more than two acceptable answers.
If you have no respect for the field of science, then I cannot bring myself to participate.
Regards.
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dothedew69
Relearning



Registered: 08/27/08
Posts: 624
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: Honeheke]
#26898814 - 08/25/20 01:28 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Honeheke said:
Quote:
dothedew69 said: Alright after reading so many long posts it seems like there’s a negative attitude towards using Psilocybe for medicinal/therapeutic purposes. I literally started growing again just for that reason. Years ago I get mushrooms just because I wanted to trip, that’s it. But what happened I learned so much about myself, how I relate to the world, and my connection to everyone. I was a super shy person, suffered from extreme anxiety. After doing a lot of mushrooms I reflected on my issues and I’m way better off (more social, less depressed, and it helped reduce my anxiety a lot). Again I’m out on a 6 week leave due to sever anxiety, panic, and terror. I’m growing again to defeat it. Now don’t blast me for it, I have an AMAZING psychiatrist and therapist. I so cognitive behavioral therapy and group therapy (CBT) three times a week. Think about it, the way we think effects how we feel, our physical condition, and everything About who we are. You can fix illness simply with correcting your thought process. So what do mushrooms do for me? It allows me to think, it destroys my ego and in essence it’s a form of CBT therapy. I’m seriously curious about asking my therapist if we can do a session while I’m on Psilocybe. These studies will help so many people out. Don’t knock it because it may kill the spirituality of mushrooms and old time traditions. There’s millions of people who can benefit from this without having to take 8mg klonopin, lexapro, Zoloft, you pick any ssri, and the list of medications goes on and on (yes I take a shit ton of medications right now to feel normal). Mushrooms are a gift, they have REAL MEDICINAL VALUE. Study on researches, study on. I thank you from the bottom of my heart.
Hey dothedew,
I really like your post.
My next door neighbour is a psychologist and when I talk with her, she always goes back to the fact that mushrooms on their own are one thing but when combined with a process that encompasses teachings on mushrooms and without mushrooms is where the real benefits lye.
Thank you, I know a lot of medical professionals are getting curious about Psilocybe again and for good reasons. So many of these outlawed medications could have tremendous benefits to people in need. The key thing is testing, designing the proper treatment, it’s science it takes time and people to work with to establish procedures. I will never shy away from my use but I believe in my heart that it helps me medicinally. Along with my actual cognitive behavioral therapy and my psychiatrist I believe I will beat my demons. I’ve never been a visual tripper. By nature I’m an extremely deep thinker (half my problem) so it just opens my eyes to understanding myself and who I am. Face my fears and question why do I fear them in the first place. Don’t legalize for daily use but please god allow trained medical professionals use this for medicine to treated people with severe mental illness.
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Ice9
3X Ban Lotto Champion



Registered: 03/20/14
Posts: 11,319
Loc: daterapeville,USA
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: dothedew69]
#26904522 - 08/28/20 04:04 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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I made a post in this thread a while back that appears to have been deleted, unless I am mistaken. I was asking about the inherent bias one is likely to get due to self-selection of respondents on this topic from a site like this and how one statistically justifies that in the methodology. I feel this is fair question as the respondents are likely only or mostly to be those with positive experiences that helped then change some aspect of their life (and how do you prove a self-reported change is not exaggerated or an outright lie. especially from a group that clearly favors legalization in any form.
An answer to this question would be beneficial, I have copied this to word and will also directly email the PI of the study to see what he has to say on the topics I brought up.
-------------------- The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man. -- George Brenard Shaw
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badchad
Mad Scientist

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 13,373
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: Ice9]
#26905792 - 08/29/20 10:17 AM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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For sure, there are clear limitations to the study results due to participant selection. It's just something to bear in mind when interpreting the data. One might say something like: "Of regular users, XX% report an experience like this, with this particular characteristic etc."
Stated differently, the results may not be applicable to one-time users, or drug naive individuals, but they may describe the experiences of regular users, which may be valuable.
-------------------- ...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge. It is an indellible experience; it is forever known. I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did. Smith, P. Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27. ...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely. Osmond, H. Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436
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PrimalSoup
hyperspatial illuminations



Registered: 11/17/09
Posts: 13,568
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: badchad]
#26905905 - 08/29/20 11:55 AM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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The survey is however oriented toward the "one and done" philosophy. God forbid people would want to dose repeatedly.
--------------------
if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat youPrimal's simple tested teks and projects: Wheat Prep 2.0 Acidic Tea Tek Potency Project!
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Honeheke
Happy little fella

Registered: 06/11/19
Posts: 39
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: dothedew69]
#26907085 - 08/30/20 04:16 AM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
dothedew69 said:
Quote:
Honeheke said:
Quote:
dothedew69 said: Alright after reading so many long posts it seems like there’s a negative attitude towards using Psilocybe for medicinal/therapeutic purposes. I literally started growing again just for that reason. Years ago I get mushrooms just because I wanted to trip, that’s it. But what happened I learned so much about myself, how I relate to the world, and my connection to everyone. I was a super shy person, suffered from extreme anxiety. After doing a lot of mushrooms I reflected on my issues and I’m way better off (more social, less depressed, and it helped reduce my anxiety a lot). Again I’m out on a 6 week leave due to sever anxiety, panic, and terror. I’m growing again to defeat it. Now don’t blast me for it, I have an AMAZING psychiatrist and therapist. I so cognitive behavioral therapy and group therapy (CBT) three times a week. Think about it, the way we think effects how we feel, our physical condition, and everything About who we are. You can fix illness simply with correcting your thought process. So what do mushrooms do for me? It allows me to think, it destroys my ego and in essence it’s a form of CBT therapy. I’m seriously curious about asking my therapist if we can do a session while I’m on Psilocybe. These studies will help so many people out. Don’t knock it because it may kill the spirituality of mushrooms and old time traditions. There’s millions of people who can benefit from this without having to take 8mg klonopin, lexapro, Zoloft, you pick any ssri, and the list of medications goes on and on (yes I take a shit ton of medications right now to feel normal). Mushrooms are a gift, they have REAL MEDICINAL VALUE. Study on researches, study on. I thank you from the bottom of my heart.
Hey dothedew,
I really like your post.
My next door neighbour is a psychologist and when I talk with her, she always goes back to the fact that mushrooms on their own are one thing but when combined with a process that encompasses teachings on mushrooms and without mushrooms is where the real benefits lye.
Thank you, I know a lot of medical professionals are getting curious about Psilocybe again and for good reasons. So many of these outlawed medications could have tremendous benefits to people in need. The key thing is testing, designing the proper treatment, it’s science it takes time and people to work with to establish procedures. I will never shy away from my use but I believe in my heart that it helps me medicinally. Along with my actual cognitive behavioral therapy and my psychiatrist I believe I will beat my demons. I’ve never been a visual tripper. By nature I’m an extremely deep thinker (half my problem) so it just opens my eyes to understanding myself and who I am. Face my fears and question why do I fear them in the first place. Don’t legalize for daily use but please god allow trained medical professionals use this for medicine to treated people with severe mental illness.
Hey dothedew ... When I think about it, I believe that legalizing is a way to make drugs safe, backed by education. I absolutely agree that there is soo much to benefit from this gift from mother nature.
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Galaxytripper
ExpertNovice


Registered: 09/08/13
Posts: 362
Loc: Pacific NorthWest
Last seen: 6 months, 14 days
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: PrimalSoup]
#26907857 - 08/30/20 01:03 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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Yeah. Good points. Scientists try to organize the shit out of everything, to homogenize and rationalize, reduce and formularize it. This is not a formula. It's magic. Hence magic mushrooms. The mushroom experience goes beyond the rational mind and opens up the heart chakra so that you are open to intuition and then insights can come flooding in.
Scientists try to understand everything by being apart from it. Shroomers do so by being at one with it. You need openness. Step one, dear scientists. Try magic mushrooms, then talk, and quit looking at everything like it's an object. They count everything physical in room but don't see or even recognize the elephant in the room - their own consciousness, on which every perception depends, and without which their wouldn't be a science or an external world. Truth vibrations.
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dothedew69
Relearning



Registered: 08/27/08
Posts: 624
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: Galaxytripper]
#26907918 - 08/30/20 01:31 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Galaxytripper said: Yeah. Good points. Scientists try to organize the shit out of everything, to homogenize and rationalize, reduce and formularize it. This is not a formula. It's magic. Hence magic mushrooms. The mushroom experience goes beyond the rational mind and opens up the heart chakra so that you are open to intuition and then insights can come flooding in.
Scientists try to understand everything by being apart from it. Shroomers do so by being at one with it. You need openness. Step one, dear scientists. Try magic mushrooms, then talk, and quit looking at everything like it's an object. They count everything physical in room but don't see or even recognize the elephant in the room - their own consciousness, on which every perception depends, and without which their wouldn't be a science or an external world. Truth vibrations.
I’m not necessarily promoting legalization while I wouldn’t mind it, but I truly do believe that scientists and medical practitioners need to be heavily involved if it were to be used in treatments. I just don’t want my message to be taken wrongly. I believe Psilocybe with proper medical treatment could have amazing benefits. I’ve said it before but in my case of severe social anxiety, panic disorder and phobias, the combination of cognitive behavioral therapy would be amplified by introduction of psilocybin. We all know it’s a safe drug to use, but with improper use it can have undesirable effects. In addition you’re talking quality control. There has to be study to design methods to create proper medical treatment plans it’s just how it works. I’m going out on the limb and trying my own “therapy” which could have completely adverse side effects. Just from my experiences of completely opening my mind to though and destroying my ego, I just see major medicinal purpose to this type of treatment for my mental illness. Again I support the scientists, medical practitioners, and psychologists who are taking the proper precautions to create an actual treatment. It takes time and a lot of research. My views may ruffle some feathers but it’s just how it works. But until then I have my own choice of growing my own and testing on myself.
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NightWqtchman
Interdimensional.



Registered: 08/15/20
Posts: 47
Loc: Omnipresent.
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: Magenta]
#26937164 - 09/15/20 02:02 PM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Magenta said: Lotsa noobs make an appearance all of a sudden during a promotion. Gotta wonder who the fuck is pulling the strings. 
I seriously made an account organically on this day lol. Who do you think is pulling the strings?
-------------------- There are two kinds of people in this world: Mushroom people, and mold people. Their mycelium looks almost identical. However, one bears fruit , the other does not. (Both kinds of people are contained within you, it's your choice which one you become.)
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Rhizomorph
Psychedelic Researcher



Registered: 04/24/20
Posts: 786
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: szubsa]
#26939285 - 09/16/20 03:21 PM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
szubsa said:I'm using shrooms for over 20 years and truly believe, without a doubt, that they are magical. Meaning they arent't just some kind of a drug that you can administer to a large enough group of participants, ask everybody about their experiences and assume the drug will have the same effect on the rest of the population. Like you would do with a drug against high blood pressure for instance.
Magic isn't democratic, where the majority is considered to be right. It's about the old ways/arts. There's an intelligence with a certain intend behind these experiences. And this intelligence doesn't show everything to everybody. If it thinks you are an asshole (excuse my rudeness but this is often the best way to make something clear)they will not tell you anything. Deep insights aren't just a question of dosage, they are granted. One must work his way up to get them. That's why lots of users don't believe of them as really magical. They talk about heroic doses, which shrooms give them crazy visuals, use them with a myriad of other drugs and so on. These kind of people usually don't get anything meaningful and how many of them you may interview about their experiences, you only get a lot of BS.
About deprssions: Are all depresions the same? And can be cured with the same drug? There are may theories about the cause of depressions. An imbalance in the brain chemicals,inflammation in the brain and so on. What if those claiming to be cured from their depressions weren't actually really ill but only got into a loop of negative thoughts caused by negative experiences in their lifes. Shrooms opened a door to something new, added new information to their neural network, made them think about new things that destroyed the loop and they no longer felt depressed. Curing their depressions would then only be a by-product of their experiences. Magic mushrooms aren't anti-depressants and if you try to use them to help patients you have no idea whose help you're asking. An intelligence that is, in most eyes, highly controversial and politically incorrect.
Generalization in statistics I don't think you understand how generalization works in statistics... Having external validity in a research design doesn't mean it works for everyone like you are implying the study is trying to do. It just means it likely helps for a significant amount of the population. In this case, exponentially more than previous clinical interventions (many psychedelics have shown to be 2x as effective as conventional interventions)
Just imagine if twice as many people were feeling relief from depression... yeah it doesn't cover everyone but it's better than what we had before and the results are promising. No single treatment has ever worked for everyone and clinical psychology openly acknowledges this
I don't mean to be rude but I really wish people like you would actually learn about research methods and design before making broad criticisms that really suggests nothing about the actual study and more about your ignorance surrounding science & statistical validity.
All your arguments apply to traditional antidepressants as well. Take B. Caapi for example, which has the ability to cause complex hallucinations & out of body experiences. It is a MAOI, which are commonly prescribed as antidepressants to treat a variety of mental disorders. Should we apply the same arguments to it since it does both? Drugs are not that simple.
The magic argument You're free to believe that mushrooms truly are magic and transcend science. But, if that is true, science doesn't care. Science is only concerned with what is empirically measurable (or what can be inferred through empirical observations reliably). If mushrooms connect us to some higher power (or whatever you believe), that doesn't exclude them from being observed empirically or being used in a clinical setting - they're not mutually exclusive. They are just mutually misunderstood by each other according to your argument.
As much as I am skeptical towards the "magic" claim, if the claim is right then how are we expected to work with it? It's not reasonable to say we shouldn't work with it at all just because we don't understand that claim (if it transcends human observation it is impossible to understand with certainty). The only method we can approach it from is the scientific one in this case. And moreover if the aspects of it that we can explain (through science) show VERY significant results, why wouldn't we explore that?
The "magic" argument is like saying "There are forces we don't understand so the ones we do understand are wrong". Unless you are trying to say that you do understand these forces... In which case please provide proof. If you cannot provide proof but still know it to be true then don't expect others to realize your truth because clearly that path to that truth is obscured by whatever personal experience you have had that is out of others' reach. Otherwise I will side with the experts on the philosophy of religion and believe that although magic is possible, we currently have no reason to believe it.
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Rhizomorph
Psychedelic Researcher



Registered: 04/24/20
Posts: 786
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Re: Univ. of Wollongong Research Study - Investigating Meaningful Psychedelic Experiences [Re: Clownologist]
#26939313 - 09/16/20 03:39 PM (3 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Clownologist said: a "real" scientist would put themselves through the experience while carefully and methodically documenting the experience from an inquisitive and scientifically trained perspective.
But you really.. REALLY!... lost me when your scientific study asked my gender, and there were more than two acceptable answers.
A "real" scientist who studies psychedelics would recognize that doing what you suggested would provide inconsistent results since failure to randomly assign subjects, mixed with the low number of participants (this is essentially a case study) would bias the results by completely ruining any chances of having statistical power.
Also the meaning of gender has changed over time (as language has always done when culture changes & science makes new discoveries). Gender nowadays is a way of identifying and sex involves chromosomes, hormones, & other biological markers. The confusion comes from the fact that in the 1900s we used gender interchangeably for both our identity and our sex. However, that was not only a sign of the culture at the time but also science's tendency to ignore subjective experiences and only document things from biological and behavioral perspectives (known as behaviorism). With the cognitive revolution, social sciences acknowledged that identity, although influenced by our biology, is not the same as our biology, and so now we run into the dilemma where people are arguing over the definition of gender as the western zeitgeist catches up with science.
Because alternative gender identities have been oppressed for so long (as a result of sciences that did not acknowledge subjective identity, and the corresponding negative attitudes towards out-group members), I think it is fair that we allow them to determine the definition of gender and refer to what was previously "biological gender" as sex.
Edited by Rhizomorph (09/16/20 03:41 PM)
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