|
John in WI
Neo-Luddite


Registered: 12/18/13
Posts: 357
Loc: On a hippy trail head ful...
Last seen: 2 months, 3 days
|
Mixed mycellium LC--Interesting results
#26893830 - 08/22/20 04:19 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
I've been messing around with needle-biopsying agar to make LCs. A couple weeks ago, for the hell of it, I transferred a biopsy from 6 plates--2 each of B+, Huautla, and Rust Spore. I added them to the same 3% LC. The LC seemed to colonize quickly, everything looked good.
I then messed around with essentially Pan Cakes. I used Ziploc containers, with a substrate pretty much like MacMerdin's. I inoculated all of the 12 Ziplocs with the same solution. Everything colonized quickly. One of the cakes was fruiting in the container. But these two, while slightly slower, show excellent cluster formation and heavy pinning. They really are by far the best of the 12.


So I'm wondering now--how would I go about isolating this? I'm not certain what exactly the strain is. Possibly a 2 or 3 way mix.
If the idea was to produce some kind of hybrid, I'm guessing the smartest thing would be to repeat the process. Take spores from some of these mushrooms, grow them out on agar, and recombine in an LC?
Alternatively, I could make a mixed spore solution, using several of these caps, and shoot them in to a PF jar?
The original idea was to produce a kind of mutt. Larger fruits, but with a better pinset than the B+ have been giving me.
I wouldn't dare call this "breeding". Mushroom breeding is a delicate and complicated business. This project is more like my chicken flock--crossing some mixed breed hens with whatever mixed breed rooster I can borrow a few days. Don't really care about pedigree or anything. Just a strain that gives a good pinset and respectable sized fruits.
Any thoughts? How would you guy put these in the genetic blender? I fully realize this is a completely haphazard process I'm describing. Just playing the genetic lottery. I'm cool with that--even the "failures" still get the job done.
|
MolecularConcept
Old School Back Again



Registered: 05/24/10
Posts: 147
Loc: Denver, Co
Last seen: 8 months, 29 days
|
Re: Mixed mycellium LC--Interesting results [Re: John in WI]
#26895924 - 08/23/20 07:58 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
From what I remember. The hyphea don't mate like that. Although what I think is cooler is statistical problem of what fruited how they co-mingled and live with each other
|
John in WI
Neo-Luddite


Registered: 12/18/13
Posts: 357
Loc: On a hippy trail head ful...
Last seen: 2 months, 3 days
|
|
I think that's essentially my question. In the process of anastomosis, compatible strains can fuse and fruit. I think that's the reason why when cloning mature fruits, you don't necessarily end up with a true monoculture on agar. The idea was to (more or less randomly) select mycellium for the LC, let them grow out and fruit, then take spores, germinate them, let them grow out and fruit...
It seems like germinating mixed spores would result in monokaryons fusing like normal, producing some mixed strains. I agree--it's a completely statistical process. Some strains would fuse with themselves, some with each other... But also, in successive generations, things should tend toward some genetic average. Something like the "founder effect" in ecology. Like, for example, those feral chickens that live in LA. Some mixed lot of chickens got free, and bred and bred, resulting in a unique landrace. They are still chickens, of course, but they are really an average of the original great grandparents.
The plan was to generate a very large number of strains (as you would expect, whenever you start from spores), then carefully observe them at all stages. How they perform on agar, how quickly they go on grain, and finally how well they have a pinset, fruit size, etc. I realize it's not a true "breeding" project. Isolating spores, crossing them, etc. But by a third or 4th generation one should start to see something that's more or less an average of the inputs.
|
A.k.a
Stranger



Registered: 10/27/19
Posts: 16,782
Loc: Gaming the system
Last seen: 7 hours, 30 minutes
|
Re: Mixed mycellium LC--Interesting results [Re: John in WI]
#26896608 - 08/24/20 08:46 AM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
People have gotten crosses from all kinds of stuff. Mixing spores or mixing spawn.
There’s actually a thread started by gizmo a couple months ago where he mixed 11 varieties of cube spores into syringes and sent them out with the idea being each person would knock up a plate and pass it on.
Somehow it died out I think I’m the only person to actually grow them out.
All you can really do is clone those and see if you get what you wanted.
--------------------
LAGM2020     
|
John in WI
Neo-Luddite


Registered: 12/18/13
Posts: 357
Loc: On a hippy trail head ful...
Last seen: 2 months, 3 days
|
Re: Mixed mycellium LC--Interesting results [Re: A.k.a]
#26896856 - 08/24/20 10:57 AM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Thanks for that info. I'm going to see if I can find it.
This project was spawned really from sloppy bookkeeping. I moved, some things got misplaced... I know the strains I started with, and in the LC tried to incorporate all of it. "A cube is a cube" as they say--their is no real reason not to do it. It's more work, of course, but it's not a huge pain to make a syringe, knock up some PF jars, and see what does well.
thanks again for the info. I need to read up. I'd rather not reinvent the wheel, if someone has done some ground work.
|
A.k.a
Stranger



Registered: 10/27/19
Posts: 16,782
Loc: Gaming the system
Last seen: 7 hours, 30 minutes
|
Re: Mixed mycellium LC--Interesting results [Re: John in WI]
#26897272 - 08/24/20 02:33 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Well pasty’s thread about making rusty whyte is the most educational for sure.
But eat made Whyte Gold on accident by mixing up spawn jars too. Sockadin made an aa+ treasure coast cross I think it was that looked cool.
My first run with the 11 variety syringe colonized really quickly but put out tiny fruits.
--------------------
LAGM2020     
|
John in WI
Neo-Luddite


Registered: 12/18/13
Posts: 357
Loc: On a hippy trail head ful...
Last seen: 2 months, 3 days
|
Re: Mixed mycellium LC--Interesting results [Re: A.k.a]
#26897603 - 08/24/20 06:04 PM (3 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Thanks again for the info. Do you have a grow log for the 11x cross project?
Anyone offering microscopy specimens of gen 1? :-)
I seriously think this will be fun. I have a similar project going with a small back yard chicken flock. So far, I'm on ~ gen 4, and am in the process of selecting my breeding flock. By now, the birds are 4-8x crosses from 8 separate breeds. You end up with some weird stuff--but sometimes some very cool stuff. A complete genetic lottery.
|
|