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Offlinekoods
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #26878077 - 08/13/20 08:49 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

natedawgnow said:
Please supply evidence that anybody ever claimed that the cop WANTED to murder guigino.



Here you said "I can get murder charges for punching you in the face if you go down and crack your dome and die."

Wikipedia says "All three crimes above (First-degree murder, Second-degree murder, and Voluntary manslaughter feature an intent to kill, whereas involuntary manslaughter is unintentional".



You still haven’t shown evidence that someone claimed the cop tried to murder him, as you suggested. Are you going to show us evidence or was this just make believe?



So natedawgnow just brought up murder for no reason?  It had nothing to do with the discussion the rest of us were having?

:whateveryousayfreak:




Seems like he believed you could get charged with murder for hitting someone in a way that ended killing them. Nowhere does he say anything about trying to kill someone. You’re just playing this stupid fucking game with words again. None of this is relevant to the conversation, where you pushed the fake news line that he might have been using his phone nefariously. You just waste people’s time.


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


Edited by koods (08/13/20 08:50 AM)


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: koods]
    #26878134 - 08/13/20 09:32 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Seems like he believed you could get charged with murder for hitting someone in a way that ended killing them.



Why do you think that point is relevant in a in a discussion about the police pushing Martin Gugino?

Quote:

koods said:
Nowhere does he say anything about trying to kill someone.



Me and Magic mush BOTH pointed out that murder requires intent to kill.  Do you disagree?

Quote:

koods said:
You’re just playing this stupid fucking game with words again. None of this is relevant to the conversation



I'm looking at the context of the discussion, you're not.

Quote:

koods said:
You pushed the fake news line that he might have been using his phone nefariously. You just waste people’s time.



Source, or make believe?  I pushed the real news line that he got his hands too close to the cops for their comfort.

If I looked at other possibilities, it's because I actually care about understanding what happened, I don't just make believe whatever I want.  You should try it sometime.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #26878146 - 08/13/20 09:40 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Fal you have now crossed the line into seriously fucked up dishonest discussion.

Dude i never said the cop wanted to murder guigino. I said one can get murder charges
for a one punch homicide. I fucked up and used the wrong word, we've discussed this at length.

Seriously dude, fuck you.  Why is this not considered trolling?

Please show evidence where I said the cop WANTED to murder guigino.
Fucking make believing bot


--------------------


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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: natedawgnow]
    #26878153 - 08/13/20 09:43 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

natedawgnow said:
I can get murder charges for punching you in the face if you go down and
crack your dome and die. It's called one punch homicide. I didnt intend to kill
you but it happens.

That cop shoved an elderly man. What if I pushed your grandma and she fell and bust a hip?
Would you say that I didn't actually push her that hard?

Old people have a hard time with balance and what not already, that cop is a piece of shit
and everybody but you seems to get that.




Why didnt you post the quote? I specifically said he probably didnt intend to hurt
him, but if he had died it would be murder. I USED THE WRONG WORD. Quit being dishonest dude it's disgusting


--------------------


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: natedawgnow]
    #26878168 - 08/13/20 09:49 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

natedawgnow said:
Fal you have now crossed the line into seriously fucked up dishonest discussion.

Dude i never said the cop wanted to murder guigino. I said one can get murder charges
for a one punch homicide. I fucked up and used the wrong word.

I specifically said he probably didnt intend to hurt him, but if he had died it would be murder. I USED THE WRONG WORD.



I don't recall you admitting murder was the wrong word before, but now that you have, I'll let this go.  Easy peasy.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #26878175 - 08/13/20 09:53 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Then you're being intentionally dishonest again.

Seriously dude you are an ass hole. I get this place is about debate, but you cant
debate in good faith for even a single page. You call everybody else out on perceived bullshit,
but you behave like you're above it.

Not even sure why i replied to you, honestly. Should have expected some bullshit from you


--------------------


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Offlinekoods
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: natedawgnow] * 1
    #26878177 - 08/13/20 09:54 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

The exact meaning of words becomes very important to him when it suits his needs. Yet, we still can’t determine the true meaning of “I wish her well.”

Total hypocrite


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: koods]
    #26878199 - 08/13/20 10:14 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
The exact meaning of words becomes very important to him when it suits his needs. Yet, we still can’t determine the true meaning of “I wish her well.”

Total hypocrite



The intent of words in context is what's important to me.  You're getting stuck on the exact meaning of words, which is why you were proven wrong about your interpretation here.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #26878524 - 08/13/20 01:14 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Yes I want evidence for your mske believe, and flattery won't stop me from pressing you.

I want you to link to some of the specific arguments that you have seen vahn make. Direct links.



I already gave it to you right here.  Or do you not know what an OP is?  Maybe I'm not understanding your question?



Edit:  Here's the OP of the thread in question.




The OP contains nothing but a definition of terrorism and baseless conjecture (aka make believe) that includes: "the result of Antifa having all the power right now would mean an immediate return to a caste system with black people at the very top and white people at the very bottom", "we'd likely see executions in the street", "we'd look like Venezuela in 6 months", "assuming China doesn't nut so hard over far leftists after they finish sucking its dick that it claims us as their own". You consider that to be defending their position?

Let's recap one of your claims that I called out as 'make believe':

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

natedawgnow said:
That antifa is an organized domestic terror group



That's his opinion.  Though I disagree, he's done a much better job defending his position than others have in attacking it.




Source, or make believe.





It's odd that an OP absolutely riddled with make believe not only managed to avoid any criticism from you, but it's actually been singled out as an example of Vahn421 doing a "much better job of defending his position". Especially considering, if you skip the several posts that choose to ridicule a ridiculous hypothetical, this is one of the first responses you'll see.

Try again please. Where has Vahn421 defended their assertion that Antifa™ is an organized domestic terror group? Source, or make believe.


--------------------


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: shivas.wisdom] * 1
    #26878990 - 08/13/20 05:52 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Let's recap one of your claims that I called out as 'make believe':
Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

natedawgnow said:
That antifa is an organized domestic terror group



That's his opinion.  Though I disagree, he's done a much better job defending his position than others have in attacking it.



Source, or make believe.



It's odd that an OP absolutely riddled with make believe not only managed to avoid any criticism from you, but it's actually been singled out as an example of Vahn421 doing a "much better job of defending his position".



As I told Vahn "You laid out a definition of terrorism in your OP to include "The use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, especially for political purposes", and I've seen your videos (and I'm guessing he has too) where you allege they do just that."

Here's a few of those videos for reference:




Did I see evidence of violence and threats to intimidate?  Yes.
Did that prove Vahn's position beyond a doubt.  No, of course not.

My claim was "he's done a much better job defending his position than others have in attacking it."

Let's look at the first 5 rebuttals, in order:
Quote:

:hahthatsrich:

The pants-wetting by far-right extremists over these protests gets more hilarious by the day.  Imagine building this world inside your head and then living in it 24/7.  I guess when one is an authoritarian POS, it's easy to imagine that everyone else is equally depraved.




Quote:

Cry harder




Quote:

So far, you've proven yourself to be little more than a collection of bumper stickers and slogans.




Quote:

Were we debating?  I thought we were laughing at an outlandish assertion you had made.




Quote:

You need to stop hitting that Alex Jones pipe dude .




Again, the question was if Vahn is doing a "better job defending his position than others have in attacking it"  I would say yes.


I realize you take exception, because you yourself had a better response than others (as usual).  But an an unscientific poll showed most people here believe the attacks against the truck were wrong, even though you disagree.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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OfflineVahn421
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #26879011 - 08/13/20 06:05 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I totally stand by what I said. I wasn't looking to "prove" that original claim, anyway. I was sharing my opinion on how I view it and I wanted to see how others viewed it as well. Not all political discussions are contingent on evidence. Some things are predictions or hypothetical assumptions. You may call them ridiculous, but I find them to be quite grounded in reality relative to what has happened historically in other countries if you just study history a little bit.

Mobs are mindless. You have no idea how bad it all can get. The only thing keeping these people in check IS the law and society.

As those things crumble, the mob is going to go insane, with Antifa leading the charge. Best be prepared, it's one step at a time.

Here's the next step into total chaos far leftists want to take, with Antifa supporting them I'm sure.





Edited by Vahn421 (08/13/20 06:11 PM)


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OfflineSirTripAlot
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26879086 - 08/13/20 06:52 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Vahn421 said:
The only thing keeping these people in check IS the law and society.






Only, in the singular sense? You gave two examples: law and society. Those are two big things. Definitely more than one reason....US is still not close, to an all out revolt.


--------------------
“I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”


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Offlineshivas.wisdom
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #26879258 - 08/13/20 09:22 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Again, the question was if Vahn is doing a "better job defending his position than others have in attacking it"  I would say yes.


I realize you take exception, because you yourself had a better response than others (as usual).  But an an unscientific poll showed most people here believe the attacks against the truck were wrong, even though you disagree.



I take exception because what you apparently meant was "[excluding the times where he didn't,] he's done a much better job defending his position than others have in attacking it" which seems like some pretty dishonest phrasing - especially considering you used that statement as a defence for why you don't criticize Vahn421 for their ridiculous make believe about Antifa™. Does every poster have to provide a proper rebuttal to Vahn421's make believe before you'll call it out? What happened to this:

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
I just hate it when people make believe.  Call it a flaw in my personality if you want, but I'm here for honest discussion.





How can you truthfully say that, when you link to this make believe riddled OP as a defence for the assertion that Antifa™ is an organized domestic terror group. Do you really believe that a definition for terrorism and an assortment of youtube videos (including one that identifies the protesters as "peaceful Antifa BLM" despite nothing in the video providing for such an identification, and a second video by serial liars Project Veritas) constitutes a quality argument for the existence of an organized domestic terror group?

Why is someone who claims to hate make believe amplifying what is obviously make believe?


--------------------


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OfflineVahn421
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: shivas.wisdom]
    #26879300 - 08/13/20 09:58 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

A member of Antifa can't see the harm Antifa is doing in the same way a Christian can't see the harm Christians are doing.

This isn't to say that they aren't reasonable people when you get them individually, but we're far closer again to, "she's a witch, burn her!" Then people fuckin' realize. All it takes is a mob and something or someone new to be angry about when the suffering gets bad enough. Group think is a plague, and in the case of Antifa which has a very loose structure of organization, very powerful people with excellent skills of manipulation likely infiltrated in the beginning. People with power want control and the far left and far right are the easiest group to psychologically fuck with right now.

Antifa is made up of mostly pawns who have found a way to circle jerk their egos pretending to be heroes while their LARP fucks with the rest of us. It's not cool.




--------------------


Edited by Vahn421 (08/13/20 10:03 PM)


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: shivas.wisdom] * 2
    #26879311 - 08/13/20 10:10 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I think you're confusing make believe with personal opinion.

Make believe is saying something that happened is true without evidence, while Vahn's OP was primarily his prediction of a future state run by antifa, with a lot of question marks thrown in and him being clear he was expressing his personal opinion for discussion.

Admittedly, I disagree with Vahn's opinion, but after seeing the first few replies, I was rather disappointed with the discourse here.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: Vahn421] * 1
    #26879459 - 08/14/20 01:28 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Vahn421 said:
A member of Antifa can't see the harm Antifa is doing in the same way a Christian can't see the harm Christians are doing.

This isn't to say that they aren't reasonable people when you get them individually, but we're far closer again to, "she's a witch, burn her!" Then people fuckin' realize. All it takes is a mob and something or someone new to be angry about when the suffering gets bad enough. Group think is a plague, and in the case of Antifa which has a very loose structure of organization, very powerful people with excellent skills of manipulation likely infiltrated in the beginning. People with power want control and the far left and far right are the easiest group to psychologically fuck with right now.

Antifa is made up of mostly pawns who have found a way to circle jerk their egos pretending to be heroes while their LARP fucks with the rest of us. It's not cool.






You say antifa are the ones screaming witch, yet you have argued that anyone wearing black in
the vicinity of rioters should be arrested upon suspicion of complicity.

You're basically saying "they must be antifa! Get em!"

McCarthyism alive and well


--------------------


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Offlinekoods
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: natedawgnow]
    #26879510 - 08/14/20 03:22 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

This is a completely batshit crazy paragraph. It just needs to be said.

Quote:

This isn't to say that they aren't reasonable people when you get them individually, but we're far closer again to, "she's a witch, burn her!" Then people fuckin' realize. All it takes is a mob and something or someone new to be angry about when the suffering gets bad enough. Group think is a plague, and in the case of Antifa which has a very loose structure of organization, very powerful people with excellent skills of manipulation likely infiltrated in the beginning. People with power want control and the far left and far right are the easiest group to psychologically fuck with right now.




--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


Edited by koods (08/14/20 03:28 AM)


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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: shivas.wisdom] * 1
    #26879733 - 08/14/20 08:16 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
I think you're confusing make believe with personal opinion.

Make believe is saying something that happened is true without evidence, while Vahn's OP was primarily his prediction of a future state run by antifa, with a lot of question marks thrown in and him being clear he was expressing his personal opinion for discussion.

Admittedly, I disagree with Vahn's opinion, but after seeing the first few replies, I was rather disappointed with the discourse here.



Earlier posts you weren't claiming it to be personal opinion. In fact, here's where you said that Vahn421 provided video evidence as defence for their claim:

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:As I told Vahn "You laid out a definition of terrorism in your OP to include "The use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, especially for political purposes", and I've seen your videos (and I'm guessing he has too) where you allege they do just that."




allege: to assert without proof or before proving
Make believe: saying something that happened is true without evidence



Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Here's a few of those videos for reference:








One that identifies the protesters as "peaceful Antifa BLM" despite nothing in the video providing for such an identification, and a second video by serial liars Project Veritas. Why did you hold those videos up as good examples, instead of calling out the make believe in them?

Why is someone who claims to hate make believe amplifying what is obviously make believe?


--------------------


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OfflineVahn421
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: natedawgnow] * 1
    #26879758 - 08/14/20 08:50 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

natedawgnow said:
Quote:

Vahn421 said:
A member of Antifa can't see the harm Antifa is doing in the same way a Christian can't see the harm Christians are doing.

This isn't to say that they aren't reasonable people when you get them individually, but we're far closer again to, "she's a witch, burn her!" Then people fuckin' realize. All it takes is a mob and something or someone new to be angry about when the suffering gets bad enough. Group think is a plague, and in the case of Antifa which has a very loose structure of organization, very powerful people with excellent skills of manipulation likely infiltrated in the beginning. People with power want control and the far left and far right are the easiest group to psychologically fuck with right now.

Antifa is made up of mostly pawns who have found a way to circle jerk their egos pretending to be heroes while their LARP fucks with the rest of us. It's not cool.






You say antifa are the ones screaming witch, yet you have argued that anyone wearing black in
the vicinity of rioters should be arrested upon suspicion of complicity.

You're basically saying "they must be antifa! Get em!"

McCarthyism alive and well




This is a twisting of my actual position.

Do you care to know the truth of it or do you just like being smug and feeling like you won even though you've misrepresented me?


--------------------


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OfflineVahn421
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Re: Is there ANY good argument for blocking traffic? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26879760 - 08/14/20 08:53 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

and a second video by serial liars Project Veritas.




This really shows Shiva's true colors. The point of Project Veritas is to infiltrate and expose and let people just talk and then show the world what they say.

What LIES? Everything I listen to on Project Veritas is just, "Here. Watch this video. Listen to what people in the actual organization have to say about it."

Calling them serial liars makes no rational sense, let alone moral sense.

Shiva must have me on ignore. How amusing.


--------------------


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