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Offlinechromeleon
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Registered: 07/05/20
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Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [update]
    #26868079 - 08/07/20 10:27 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

For my second grow I tried shoeboxes for the first time. I followed teks and shredded BRF cakes into coir, and at the suggestion of another cultivator I made one shoebox with a liner to see how I like it compared to one without it. Apparently I did a shit job, so my only growth is still side pins and the sub has contracted unevenly so it's not cubed on the bottom. I thought my surface conditions looked good but I don't have any knots on top yet. Since I'll have to pull off the liner to harvest the fruits, should I just remove it now so it doesn't inhibit growth, or will the sub collapse without it since it's shaped funny? Could I fill in the bottom with more coir for support or will that guarantee contamination? Thanks in advance. Just trying to salvage this grow.

Cluster:



Surface:



Edited by chromeleon (08/19/20 05:03 PM)


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Invisiblecoversall
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: chromeleon]
    #26868084 - 08/07/20 10:30 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Flip it overrr.

:notgettingup:

Best gif I could find to match.


--------------------

..:: E V E R Y  ::..

..:: New? Start here. ::..
..:: How I Panaeolus. From Agar to Tea ::..


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Offlinechromeleon
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: coversall]
    #26868094 - 08/07/20 10:36 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

For real? That's not going to fuck anything up? The bottom definitely isn't level but the top is.


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Invisiblecoversall
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: chromeleon]
    #26868131 - 08/07/20 11:02 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I'm a long way from being an expert, or even knowledgeable, but imo the cake is telling you where it wants to fruit from. Flip it over, let the bottom flush finish. Or turn the whole thing onto one of the thin edges so both the bottom and the top can fruit ala:



--------------------

..:: E V E R Y  ::..

..:: New? Start here. ::..
..:: How I Panaeolus. From Agar to Tea ::..


Edited by coversall (08/07/20 11:03 AM)


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OfflineElViajero
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Registered: 08/16/18
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: coversall]
    #26868143 - 08/07/20 11:08 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

holy shit that pic is amazing


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Invisiblecoversall
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: ElViajero]
    #26868149 - 08/07/20 11:10 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Pretty awesome right? Not mine sadly, all credit to /u/jar-face on reddit.


--------------------

..:: E V E R Y  ::..

..:: New? Start here. ::..
..:: How I Panaeolus. From Agar to Tea ::..


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OfflineRagoo0192
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Registered: 06/21/19
Posts: 118
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: coversall]
    #26868153 - 08/07/20 11:12 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Side pins can happen no matter what, and in bottom. They will pin where conditions are optimal, using a liner can help some times I guess. But if you get your tub dialed in it’s not needed. I don’t use liners on any of my tubs and once you know what you’re looking for surface conditions it will cross out the chance of most of your pins being in the side or bottom. Sometimes can just be genetics too, they want to grow all over the place.
Didn’t have one pin on the bottom of this tub, had 3 or 4 on the side. No liner

Like someone said above you can flip it. I’ve flipped one of my first protects because it had barely any pins on top, so I flipped it. Your surface conditions look good though, should see pins very soon on top, keep those little drops of water everywhere.
I’ve also leaned a sub on the side of my Monotub to expose both top and bottom because of how many pins were on both and it did just fine.


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To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist that is all. -OW


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Offlinechromeleon
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: coversall]
    #26868162 - 08/07/20 11:18 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah I might have to do that just because that cluster is lifting up the corner and I'm mildly afraid of it breaking the sub if it keeps going. I've tried to keep my surface conditions right based of what I've seen but maybe I just dont have the hang of it yet. It's been 13 days since I spawned to the shoeboxes and I don't see ant knots yet, so hopefully tilting it will help me get something out of it.


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OfflineRagoo0192
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: chromeleon]
    #26868171 - 08/07/20 11:22 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I would honestly let it go, seeing how it’s only that one cluster in the corner. But that’s just me.
Your surface looks good. Any day it should be time to starting forming pins, I’d be worried my flush on top is gonna suffer worrying about the corner. I’d let them break veil pick them then wait. Could just be a small first flush coming from that cluster.


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To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist that is all. -OW


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Offlinechromeleon
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: Ragoo0192]
    #26868231 - 08/07/20 12:05 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I already turned it over to take a look and there are tons of knots & pins on the underside and edges, so I flipped it. There are 6 areas where they've started forming, but that was just the most obvious. Apparently when I made the liner it got all wrinkled up and made a bunch of creases in the bottom of the sub and there were a bunch of gaps. That cluster might be ready in the next few days, so I can flip it back if I need to. Luckily with the way the shoebox is shaped, it's only pressing on a small area of the surface to hold up the sub, so 95% of it is fine and still covered in dew, just upside down.


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OfflineRagoo0192
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Registered: 06/21/19
Posts: 118
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: chromeleon]
    #26868334 - 08/07/20 01:07 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Nice good work, sounds like you’re handling it just fine. And good thing you flipped it then.
Keep updating pics on how it’s goes next few days. 🤞👌👍


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To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist that is all. -OW


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InvisibleRoger Clemency
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: Ragoo0192] * 1
    #26868400 - 08/07/20 01:38 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Check this thread out for the next batch of shoe boxes. https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26009662

Focusing on getting the coir a little under field capacity and making sure you build them with care as far as leveling out your substrate and tamping down the edges before the final heavy misting of the top layer. 

I get no side pins really on the first flush. One or two I’ve seen but they were high up still. No bottom pins either. You’ll usually get some little sideys on subsequent flushes but still almost all up top.



These were all just MS grows following the method in that link.


--------------------
Sour grapes, sweet revenge
Heaven starts right where hell ends


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Offlinechromeleon
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: Roger Clemency]
    #26868617 - 08/07/20 03:28 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks for sharing. I actually found this tek a little after I had already made these and plan to follow it for next time. I think my field capacity was pretty close based on the videos I've seen and i had the surface pretty level, but the liner was a total mess. I'll make sure to place extra attention on those points next time to make sure they don't cause problems though. I want to get into agar between now and the grow when I try out the shoebox tek you shared but haven't decided if I want to buy some premade plates for the first attempt to take away a variable I can screw up.


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InvisibleGoatrider
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Registered: 04/08/20
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: chromeleon]
    #26868684 - 08/07/20 04:06 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I'm always with a liner, but more for harvesting.
A tip for proper liners:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26557987
You can also reuse them.


                  :cookiemonster:


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Invisiblecoversall
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: Roger Clemency]
    #26868689 - 08/07/20 04:07 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

How hard are you tamping? And any idea how compact the sub has to be before it starts to inhibit myc growth?


--------------------

..:: E V E R Y  ::..

..:: New? Start here. ::..
..:: How I Panaeolus. From Agar to Tea ::..


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InvisibleRoger Clemency
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: chromeleon]
    #26868693 - 08/07/20 04:08 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I’ve never bought pre made plates but those are the one mush cult item I’d consider letting someone else do. I like pouring plates though so I do it myself.

It’s really simple and I’ve probably had 5-6 plates total where I messed up the pour somehow and got mold/bac before inoculation, even my first go at that went smoothly. Just build a comfortable sized SAB, a 110qt tub is nice if you have the space. Look up bodhisatta’s videos he has one of pouring plates in that list of teks.

I’d check the math on how much it costs pre made vs pouring your own. If there’s a decent difference I’d just order a few sleeves and some powdered agar and light malt extract and get rolling. It’s really the coolest part of the hobby I think, working with agar.

Spray the SAB walls with water and I set a little grippy mat on the floor of it so my plates don’t slide around and then you just do whatever you have to do smoothly and don’t bump the sides or hover your hands/arms above your work and you’ll be good to go. It’s pretty amazing actually how sterile you can be with a simple SAB.


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Sour grapes, sweet revenge
Heaven starts right where hell ends


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InvisibleGoatrider
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: coversall]
    #26868701 - 08/07/20 04:14 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

coversall said:
How hard are you tamping? And any idea how compact the sub has to be before it starts to inhibit myc growth?




You shouldn't tamp hard.
Just distribute the substrate, especially to the corners,
and even it out with slightly tamping.
Personally i tamp down the sides a bit more.


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Offlinechromeleon
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Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: Roger Clemency]
    #26869218 - 08/07/20 10:00 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I've been doing my inoculation and spore prints in a SAB, I just need to make bigger arm holes so I can use it a little more easily. Somehow a large coffee can has been tough to find.

I am really looking forward to getting into agar and it seems easy enough to make my own. I only have an instant pot rather than a big PC, so that's why I was thinking I might buy a few to start just so I can figure out what I'm doing to start. Once I have some samples I can transfer from plates I know were prepared correctly I can move them to ones I've made with instant pot agar to see if it works. My space is semi-limited so I'm trying to see if I can get away with just adjusting all the PC stuff for my instant pot, but I'll get another PC if the instant pot experiments don't work.


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Offlinechromeleon
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: Goatrider]
    #26869222 - 08/07/20 10:03 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I might do more side-by-side shoeboxes with and without liners until I decide for sure which I like better, so I'll look up that sheeting. Where do you get it? It looks like it would make bottom-watering much easier. What's the point of tamping it down beyond just getting the surface level?


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InvisibleGoatrider
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Re: 2nd grow; Shoebox repair? [Re: chromeleon]
    #26869288 - 08/07/20 11:04 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

chromeleon said:
What's the point of tamping it down beyond just getting the surface level?




Think of it as a concrete box.
You take a compressor to get the air bubbles out, and compact it.
So you compact your substrate to get an evenly colonization.


Quote:

chromeleon said:
I might do more side-by-side shoeboxes with and without liners until I decide for sure which I like better, so I'll look up that sheeting. Where do you get it? It looks like it would make bottom-watering much easier. What's the point of tamping it down beyond just getting the surface level?




Once more the link:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26557987
Works great all the time.

To me, a liner has the most benefit due to heavy condensation.
Sometimes i get lots of condensation, and water runs down the sides,
building up perfect microclimate there.
With a liner slightly pulled from the walls,
and sticking to the substrate, it`s running to the bottom of the box,
and gets poured out at harvest time.


                      :cookiemonster:


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