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OfflineKwyjibo
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Registered: 07/31/18
Posts: 453
Loc: California Flag
Last seen: 5 hours, 38 minutes
Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: HamHead]
    #26857609 - 08/01/20 05:46 PM (5 days, 14 hours ago)

Quote:

HamHead said:
Quote:

Ice9 said:
I tried to play along nicely, but here goes. It might be a bit long winded but please, take all the time you need to read it.

I have a nephew with cerebral palsy.  He is smart enough to function normally, writes on the internet and comments, but there exists a great many things he cannot comprehend.  He has an IQ of @82(average of several tests.)

I suspect much like my nephew, you too fall in the lower percentiles of IQ.  Thus, you are incapable of understanding what people respond to you with.

What I mean to say son is, you're a moron.  There is little worth in trying to talk to you, as your self-identity is so wrapped up in something, that for that something to be false, you yourself become false, this is not true, but you believe it.  You are incapable of not believing, because you do not have the mental capacity to separate self from outside ideas.

Don't feel bad, 50% of all people fail, to varying degrees in that same population, so you have plenty of company.

P.S. I reiterate, you are not smart, you are not privy to special information, you are not even average. 

Keep posting, it's like I get Sunday comics everyday I read your posts.  Have a pleasant life, please do not breed.




There you go, fixed it for ya!!



You didn't even do that right.  :laugh2:


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OfflineHamHead
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: Kwyjibo]
    #26857628 - 08/01/20 06:07 PM (5 days, 14 hours ago)

Quote:

Kwyjibo said:
Quote:

HamHead said:
Quote:

Ice9 said:
I tried to play along nicely, but here goes. It might be a bit long winded but please, take all the time you need to read it.

I have a nephew with cerebral palsy.  He is smart enough to function normally, writes on the internet and comments, but there exists a great many things he cannot comprehend.  He has an IQ of @82(average of several tests.)

I suspect much like my nephew, you too fall in the lower percentiles of IQ.  Thus, you are incapable of understanding what people respond to you with.

What I mean to say son is, you're a moron.  There is little worth in trying to talk to you, as your self-identity is so wrapped up in something, that for that something to be false, you yourself become false, this is not true, but you believe it.  You are incapable of not believing, because you do not have the mental capacity to separate self from outside ideas.

Don't feel bad, 50% of all people fail, to varying degrees in that same population, so you have plenty of company.

P.S. I reiterate, you are not smart, you are not privy to special information, you are not even average. 

Keep posting, it's like I get Sunday comics everyday I read your posts.  Have a pleasant life, please do not breed.




There you go, fixed it for ya!!



You didn't even do that right.  :laugh2:




Then draft it again, if you know right.

It's been copied so I can go back to see what has been changed.


--------------------
Jokeshopbeard said:
I like that I rustled your jimmies though. That brings me joy.
InfiniteDreams said:
You realize emotion doesn't have a place in  mathematics?
koods said:
Asshole.
Jokeshopbeard said:
And also no; science, research, and peer reveiwed bollocks means very little to me.
Such things belong in the realm of intellect, not of reason, wisdom, and common sense.


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OfflineKwyjibo
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Last seen: 5 hours, 38 minutes
Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: HamHead]
    #26857636 - 08/01/20 06:12 PM (5 days, 14 hours ago)

Quote:

HamHead said:


Then draft it again, if you know right.

It's been copied so I can go back to see what has been changed.



).

I didn't go over the entire post  but that jumped out immediately.


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OfflineHamHead
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: Kwyjibo]
    #26857642 - 08/01/20 06:15 PM (5 days, 14 hours ago)

Quote:

Kwyjibo said:
Quote:

HamHead said:


Then draft it again, if you know right.

It's been copied so I can go back to see what has been changed.



).

I didn't go over the entire post  but that jumped out immediately.




I do all this copy/paste/edit stuff from a smartphone. It can be difficult to get that damn cursor where I want it.

Good eye.

:youthemandawg:


Edited by HamHead (08/01/20 06:31 PM)


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OfflineIce9
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Registered: 03/20/14
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: HamHead]
    #26857655 - 08/01/20 06:29 PM (5 days, 14 hours ago)

:rofl2: I did not read his "corrected post", but what he Failed to correct jumped out at me to after reading it. :stevolmao: :ruggedwink:

Kwyjibo has it copied, so we can see what changed.


Edited by Ice9 (08/01/20 06:33 PM)


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OfflineHamHead
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: Ice9]
    #26857660 - 08/01/20 06:34 PM (5 days, 14 hours ago)

Quote:

Ice9 said:
:rofl2: I did not read his "corrected post", but what he Failed to correct jumped out at me to after reading it. :stevolmao: :ruggedwink:




Which is?

Other than that misplaced period? Which is yours, I was simply closing off those () and didn't consider that period in its context.

And why are you laughing, you're being corrected here.

 

Are commas up for debate? Those can give me troubles, sometimes.


--------------------
Jokeshopbeard said:
I like that I rustled your jimmies though. That brings me joy.
InfiniteDreams said:
You realize emotion doesn't have a place in  mathematics?
koods said:
Asshole.
Jokeshopbeard said:
And also no; science, research, and peer reveiwed bollocks means very little to me.
Such things belong in the realm of intellect, not of reason, wisdom, and common sense.


Edited by HamHead (08/01/20 06:39 PM)


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OfflineKwyjibo
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Posts: 453
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Last seen: 5 hours, 38 minutes
Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: HamHead]
    #26857666 - 08/01/20 06:38 PM (5 days, 13 hours ago)

Quote:

HamHead said:



And why are you laughing, you're being corrected here.





Can you really call it being corrected if the corrections are also incorrect?


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OfflineIce9
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: HamHead]
    #26857676 - 08/01/20 06:46 PM (5 days, 13 hours ago)

I don't place a high emphasis on correct grammatical sentences on the shroomery, so being correctd is I don't give a fuck territory.  You, using it to score a point on me, and Failing  is fucking hilarious. :canthelpbutlaugh:


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OfflineHamHead
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: Kwyjibo]
    #26857691 - 08/01/20 07:01 PM (5 days, 13 hours ago)

Yeah, fucking hilarious we're having to correct your drunk ass.

Back on topic then.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12272-020-01258-7

Review
Published: 01 August 2020
Hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine: a potential and controversial treatment for COVID-19
Li Zou, Lijun Dai, […]Zhentao Zhang
Archives of Pharmacal Research (2020)Cite this article

Metrics

"Abstract
A novel coronavirus, later named SARS-CoV-2, was first reported in China in December 2019 and subsequently widely identified in the United States, Japan, South Korea, France, India, and other countries. The disease caused by SARS-CoV-2 infection was called COVID-19. The high fatality and morbidity rates of COVID-19 make it the third largest global epidemic in this century. However, there are currently no approved antiviral drugs for the COVID-19 treatment. Recently, two old antimalarial drugs, hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine, have been found to exert anti-SARS-CoV-2 effects both in vitro and in vivo. Preliminary clinical evidence suggests these drugs may have an effect on the treatment of COVID-19. Herein, we review the pharmacokinetics characteristics and antiviral effects of these drugs, in addition to their side effects and clinical evidence of their use for the COVID-19 treatment.

Conclusion and suggestions
In summary, HCQ and CQ were found to have exert anti-SARS-CoV-2 effects both in vitro and in vivo, and represent potential treatment options for COVID-19 (Fig. 1). However, the clinical evidence of their effects is from some single-center clinical trials. Evidence from multi-center clinical trials is still lacking. In accordance with the pharmacological and toxicological effects of CQ and HCQ discussed here, the authors of this review recommend the following: (1) Multicenter randomized controlled clinical trials are needed to clarify the CQ and HCQ efficiency and safety in the COVID-19 treatment; (2) Considering their ocular, cardiac and neuro toxicities, CQ and HCQ should not be recommended as preventive drugs for the COVID-19 pandemic; (3) Follow-up of patients who received CQ or HCQ treatment is necessary to access their long-term effects and side effects; (4) The CQ and HCQ dosage and their combination regimen with other drugs in clinical trials should be appropriately adjusted."


--------------------
Jokeshopbeard said:
I like that I rustled your jimmies though. That brings me joy.
InfiniteDreams said:
You realize emotion doesn't have a place in  mathematics?
koods said:
Asshole.
Jokeshopbeard said:
And also no; science, research, and peer reveiwed bollocks means very little to me.
Such things belong in the realm of intellect, not of reason, wisdom, and common sense.


Edited by HamHead (08/01/20 07:07 PM)


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: HamHead]
    #26857774 - 08/01/20 08:02 PM (5 days, 12 hours ago)

The fact that you posted a lit review containing zero new information demonstrates how little you understand about reading and interpreting scientific lit for actual understanding. It added nothing beyond what is already known.  Particuarly in east asia, sheer quantity of publication, regardless of quality, is the ticket to professorships and tenure.


Edited by morrowasted (08/01/20 08:09 PM)


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OfflineHamHead
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: morrowasted]
    #26857806 - 08/01/20 08:34 PM (5 days, 12 hours ago)

Quote:

morrowasted said:
The fact that you posted a lit review containing zero new information demonstrates how little you understand about reading and interpreting scientific lit for actual understanding. It added nothing beyond what is already known.  Particuarly in east asia, sheer quantity of publication, regardless of quality, is the ticket to professorships and tenure.




What's your point?

Or are you just saying I'm wrong again?

You can say HCQ doesn't work all you want. Other people who use HCQ on a regular basis in treating paitents are saying different.

Perhaps those people you care for are too far gone for HCQ to be effective.

It is best used as a prophylactic at first onset of symptoms.


--------------------
Jokeshopbeard said:
I like that I rustled your jimmies though. That brings me joy.
InfiniteDreams said:
You realize emotion doesn't have a place in  mathematics?
koods said:
Asshole.
Jokeshopbeard said:
And also no; science, research, and peer reveiwed bollocks means very little to me.
Such things belong in the realm of intellect, not of reason, wisdom, and common sense.


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Offlinefeevers
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: HamHead]
    #26857814 - 08/01/20 08:39 PM (5 days, 11 hours ago)

Quote:

HamHead said:
(2) Considering their ocular, cardiac and neuro toxicities, CQ and HCQ should not be recommended as preventive drugs for the COVID-19 pandemic




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OfflineHamHead
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: feevers]
    #26857822 - 08/01/20 08:42 PM (5 days, 11 hours ago)

Quote:

feevers said:
Quote:

HamHead said:
(2) Considering their ocular, cardiac and neuro toxicities, CQ and HCQ should not be recommended as preventive drugs for the COVID-19 pandemic







(3) Follow-up of patients who received CQ or HCQ treatment is necessary to access their long-term effects and side effect


--------------------
Jokeshopbeard said:
I like that I rustled your jimmies though. That brings me joy.
InfiniteDreams said:
You realize emotion doesn't have a place in  mathematics?
koods said:
Asshole.
Jokeshopbeard said:
And also no; science, research, and peer reveiwed bollocks means very little to me.
Such things belong in the realm of intellect, not of reason, wisdom, and common sense.


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Offlinefeevers
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: HamHead] * 2
    #26857830 - 08/01/20 08:47 PM (5 days, 11 hours ago)

You specifically said to use it as a prophylactic, which is a preventative. You can't pick the parts of an article that you like and disregard the ones you don't. But that seems to be all you're capable of.


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OfflineHamHead
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: feevers]
    #26857835 - 08/01/20 08:53 PM (5 days, 11 hours ago)

Quote:

feevers said:
You specifically said to use it as a prophylactic, which is a preventative. You can't pick the parts of an article that you like and disregard the ones you don't. But that seems to be all you're capable of.




Nope, still stand by prophylactics.

That does not discount a need for follow up studies.

:derp:

Then, those studies have got to be peer reviewed, or else they are absolutely useless and should not be recommended to anyone.

Regardless if people are trying to save lives or not.

And who cares about frontline workers using HCQ as prescribed and seeing positive results. They have zero experience treating paitents.


Edited by HamHead (08/01/20 08:58 PM)


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Offlinemorrowasted
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: feevers] * 3
    #26857838 - 08/01/20 08:55 PM (5 days, 11 hours ago)

Quote:


It is best used as a prophylactic at first onset of symptoms.



:rofl: omg dude you are doubling down in quite possibly the dumbest way imaginable. the exact same article you're defending says not to use it as one because patients taking it need to be on EKG monitors


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Offlinefeevers
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: HamHead]
    #26857845 - 08/01/20 08:59 PM (5 days, 11 hours ago)


Quote:

HamHead said:
Quote:

feevers said:
You specifically said to use it as a prophylactic, which is a preventative. You can't pick the parts of an article that you like and disregard the ones you don't. But that seems to be all you're capable of.




Nope, still stand by prophylactics.

That does not discount a need for follow up studies.

:derp:





So you stand by doing the thing that your article explicitly says not to do, and think that the fact that the drug is so dangerous that people who use it require long-term health monitoring helps to prove your point?


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OfflineIce9
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: feevers] * 3
    #26857848 - 08/01/20 09:00 PM (5 days, 11 hours ago)

HamHead is a stunning display of the Dunning-Kruger effect.  It is really spectacular tp witness.



Let he who stands on mount stupid be henceforth known as Ham Head.


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Offlinefeevers
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: Ice9]
    #26857858 - 08/01/20 09:07 PM (5 days, 11 hours ago)

Yet for some reason we keep responding


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OfflineHamHead
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Re: Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [Re: morrowasted]
    #26857882 - 08/01/20 09:31 PM (5 days, 11 hours ago)

However, an international vote of 6227 doctors from 30 countries and regions released by the global medical voting company Sermo found that of the 15 treatment alternatives, 37% of doctors rated HCQ as “the most effective treatment for COVID-19” (Sermo.com 2020). Therefore, evidence from large multi-center randomized controlled clinical trials is required to confirm these results and to determine the duration and dose to achieve individualized medication. Clinical trials should find a more appropriate populational size or endpoint indicator that is most appropriate to evaluate the CQ/HCQ (and all other drugs) effect on clinical feasibility and the assessment of reduced the mortality rates in severe or critical illness patients (Chen et al. 2020a). It is important to note that some COVID-19 patients have several comorbidities, and some are pregnant women and children. Thus, a special attention should be given to these patients when considering CQ and HCQ treatment.

Toxicology
Both HCQ and CQ have good safety records and display mild side effects. Gastrointestinal reactions, such as vomiting and diarrhea are the most common side effects of these drugs. Other side effects include dizziness, headache, dazzling, tinnitus, disturbances of taste and smell, seizures, psychosis, and irritability. These side effects are usually mild and can disappear after stopping treatment (Al-Bari 2015; Srinivasa et al. 2017).

On the other hand, patients who took these drugs for long periods experienced toxic effects, such as retinopathy, circular defects (or bull’s eye maculopathy), and retinal diameter defects, which are generally irreversible, mainly due to drug accumulation in the eye (Schrezenmeier and Dörner 2020). Among toxic effects, retinopathy is the more serious clinical problem that can cause irreversible damage to vision, and even blindness. The American Academy of Ophthalmology determined the risk factors for retinopathy due to HCQ use, which include a time of use greater than 5 years, a high daily drug dosage (HCQ > 5.0 mg/kg lean body mass; CQ > 2.3 mg/kg lean body mass), renal or liver disease patient, high body fat levels, use of concomitant drugs similar to tamoxifen, macular disease and age over 60 years (Marmor et al. 2016). Remarkably, the daily dose and duration of use are the main risk factors. When the HCQ daily dose exceeds 20 mg/kg, the incidence of retinopathy is a 25 to 40% within 1 to 2 years (Marmor et al. 2016). Although the use duration of HCQ and CQ in COVID-19 patients is generally very short, it is still necessary to be aware of their retinal toxicity. Retinal degeneration caused by HCQ and CQ can continue to develop even after treatment is stopped.

The CQ and HCQ side effects in the heart are mainly conduction disorders and cardiomyopathy, which are usually irreversible and fatal (Frisk-Holmberg et al. 1983; Tönnesmann et al. 2013). The cardiotoxicity of these drugs may be related to the their long-term use, which causes acquired lysosomal accumulation disorder. This eventually leads to drug-induced cardiomyopathy, or in the case of excessive doses ingestion, acute poisoning (Yogasundaram et al. 2014). There is a case report of an elderly woman with lupus patient who used HCQ for a long time was diagnosed with refractory ventricular arrhythmia due to a prolonged QT interval. After excluding other causes, she was diagnosed with cardiac conduction abnormalities caused by chronic HCQ poisoning (Chen et al. 2006).

Because CQ and HCQ affect the cardiac conduction system, their use should be avoided in combination with other drugs that block cardiac conduction to prevent fatal arrhythmia. Among them, digitalis drugs (digoxin, desacetylgoxin, digitoxin, and trichoside K), antiarrhythmic drugs class Ia (quinidine and procainamide), antiarrhythmic drugs class III (amiodarone, sotalol, ibutilide, and dronedarone), benpredil, hydrochlorothiazide, and indapamide. In addition, the CQ/HCQ combination with antibiotics, such as quinolones and macrolides, should be prohibited to avoid the risk of promoting the QT interval prolongation and leading to tip torsion. In addition, it is worth mentioning that the interval between the therapeutic and toxic doses of CQ and HCQ is narrow, and acute CQ poisoning is associated with a potential life-threatening cardiovascular disease (Touret and de Lamballerie 2020).

Regarding the nervous system, currently there is no experimental evidence that CQ, HCQ and their metabolites can affect its conduction properties. It is only known that quinine is neurotoxic to dopaminergic neurons in the limbic system (Zou et al. 2018). Further studies are needed to investigate the CQ and HCQ effects on the central and peripheral nervous systems. Therefore, the CQ and HCQ use should follow strict rules and self-medication is not recommended. Moreover, for patients using these drugs, ECG and echocardiographic monitoring should be performed regularly to early detect potential cardiac toxicity early (Yogasundaram et al. 2014).

Over the years, researchers have measured the correlation between CQ/HCQ and toxicity. Their toxicological properties are concentration-dependent. The concentration that causes mild side effects, such as dizziness, diplopia, and fatigue, is about 0.5 to 1.2 × 10–6 mol/L. According to previous reports, about 80% of patients with side effects have CQ/HCQ plasma concentration higher than 2.5 × 10–6 mol/L. On the other hand, no toxic reaction has been reported when their plasma concentration is below 1.25 × 10–6 mol/L. Finally, the critical plasma concentration of cardiovascular toxicity caused by CQ is about 1000 μg/L (3 × 10−6 mol/L) (Ducharme and Farinotti 1996).

Parlay me, bitch!

I need to get a bigger soapbox.

Until then, I'm going to wait for all these studies being done on HCQ to release.

I suppose I can look at how well other countries using HCQ are doing.


--------------------
Jokeshopbeard said:
I like that I rustled your jimmies though. That brings me joy.
InfiniteDreams said:
You realize emotion doesn't have a place in  mathematics?
koods said:
Asshole.
Jokeshopbeard said:
And also no; science, research, and peer reveiwed bollocks means very little to me.
Such things belong in the realm of intellect, not of reason, wisdom, and common sense.


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