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OfflinePitcherCrab
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Lowering fruiting room tempeartures
    #26849629 - 07/28/20 10:19 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

How do you guys with larger fruiting chambers deal with temperature without lowering your RH too much?

I have a ~200sqft room framed out inside my insulated stand alone garage. The fruiting room is also insulated with 1” polyiso panels. Outside temperature this time of year are hitting 85-95°F and inside the garage is typically around 85°F. Inside the fruiting room is a bit lower, but still warmer than I would like. Because it is so insulated in there the temperatures tend to go up during the day then stay around 80°F at night and during the day inside the FC. All in all warmer than I would like.

I yesterday I added a 400cuft 6” vent van in the ceiling of the main garage which will help things cool off at night. With the size of my garage I calculated it will replace the air in about 20min. I’ve also added a 10,000btu AC (rated for a 300sqft room) unit inside the FC, however when I run the AC my humidity dips from 90% RH to around 60%. I’m using a 12 disk ultrasonic for humidity.

During the non summer months I’m all good, but when it gets too hot outside I struggle to keep my temperatures down. So I’m trying to puzzle out how to deal with it without lowering my RH too much. I’ve seen some people make a little pre-conditioning room for their AC units then pipe that air through their humidifier so it isn’t so dry. That could be an option, but I’m wondering if there is an easier solution before I embark on that construction project.

Any thoughts and input would be greatly appreciated.


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“I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.” - Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear



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OfflineSHROOMSISAY01M
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: PitcherCrab]
    #26849711 - 07/28/20 11:20 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Go to high-pressure mist and get rid of the 12 disk pond fogger. I have a kit that will hook to a pressure washer. But if I were you I would go with building a cat pump misting system.



Where I would buy my pump...

https://www.kleen-ritecorp.com/search.aspx?searchterm=cat+1cx05&oq=CAT+1CX05&queryAssumption=correction

I don't think that AC unit is going to be big enough either.


Edited by SHROOMSISAY01 (07/28/20 11:27 AM)


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OfflinePitcherCrab
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: SHROOMSISAY01]
    #26849725 - 07/28/20 11:25 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

SHROOMSISAY01 said:
Go to high-pressure mist and get rid of the 12 disk pond fogger. I have a kit that will hook to a pressure washer. But if I were you I would go with building a cat pump misting system.



Where I would buy my pump...

https://www.kleen-ritecorp.com/search.aspx?searchterm=cat+1cx05&oq=CAT+1CX05&queryAssumption=correction




Will that solve my temperature problems? The fogger is working quite well at keeping my humidity up, my main issue right now is the temperatures.


--------------------
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“I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.” - Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear



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OfflineSHROOMSISAY01M
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: PitcherCrab]
    #26849751 - 07/28/20 11:40 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

What I was saying is when you cool the room with the AC you said the humidity drops. So go to a better humidification system. I don't see that 12 disks being big enough for that size room anyway without running constantly. The high-pressure mist will cool the room a little but you will need to use an AC to cool it more. That AC you got is not going to be big enough either with the air exchanges you need to do.


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Offlineseagu

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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: PitcherCrab]
    #26849757 - 07/28/20 11:44 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

just ac your garage room the fruiting chamber is in. If you leave your AC inside your fc instead of outside it your AC will clog shortly and die. Then pipe your humidifier air from that to your FC.


--------------------
Plan to win or you are planning for failure. Don't let anyone tell you you can't do it. Just figure out the solution. Even if that means banging your head on a wall until the solution oozes out of you.


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OfflineSHROOMSISAY01M
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: seagu]
    #26849782 - 07/28/20 11:58 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

He only has about 1/2 the AC he needs.


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Offlineseagu

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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: SHROOMSISAY01]
    #26849794 - 07/28/20 12:03 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

SHROOMSISAY01 said:
He only has about 1/2 the AC he needs.




Yea that too. I have a smaller FC and I need 14k BTU.


--------------------
Plan to win or you are planning for failure. Don't let anyone tell you you can't do it. Just figure out the solution. Even if that means banging your head on a wall until the solution oozes out of you.


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OfflinePitcherCrab
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: seagu]
    #26849883 - 07/28/20 12:46 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Okay, so what you guys are saying is get a larger AC unit and AC the main part of the garage? The garage is insulated, but not super well, so I’m a bit concerned with energy costs if I have to condition that entire space which is why I was trying to just AC my fruiting chamber. The garage itself is about 15’x25’ with 15’ ceilings.

I’m thinking the solution may be to frame out a smaller room with extra insulation to house the AC unit so its won’t get clogged with spore from then pipe that cold air from there into my FC. Would that work instead of AC in the entire garage?

I’m open to building a new humidification system if necessary, but right now I’d like to figure out how to best solve my heat issues.


--------------------
PC's LAGM 2021 (TOC & TWC)
P. natalensis Growlog 2021
Pans for PC Fall 2021 Growlog

“I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.” - Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear



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OfflineSHROOMSISAY01M
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: PitcherCrab]
    #26849890 - 07/28/20 12:52 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Yes only cool the fruiting chamber. From what I understand the fruiting chamber is 200 SF. If I remember correctly you need an AC unit that is around 3 times the size that you would normally use to cool the room. This is due to blocks creating heat and the air exchanges you need to do.


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OfflinePitcherCrab
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: SHROOMSISAY01]
    #26849919 - 07/28/20 01:14 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Ohhh, okay. That’s the part I wasn’t understanding. My FC is indeed only 200sqft, which is why I bought the AC that was rated for 300sqft, but because of air exchanges and everything I’ll need something bigger, more like a 14000btu AC. Is that right?

You were saying if I get a better humidification system I won’t have the dips I’m having when I turn the AC on. Is that right? Do you have your AC inside your fruiting chamber?


--------------------
PC's LAGM 2021 (TOC & TWC)
P. natalensis Growlog 2021
Pans for PC Fall 2021 Growlog

“I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.” - Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear



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Offlineseagu

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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: SHROOMSISAY01]
    #26849945 - 07/28/20 01:27 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Depends on whether it will work on a few things. Is the FC insulated enough to prevent the outside heat from the garage to counter the cold you are piping into the FC. I've seen that issue. If that doesn't work you could make a frame around your FC about 1-2ft. Call it air insulation. And AC that and have a fan blowing the cold air all the way around it. So you have a room within a room of sorts. I know that can work very well.

Yea the Air exchanges demand the much larger capacity to keep up with pulling all the cooled air out for the FAE. Yea, I think my shed is 150 2/ft. The FC is smaller inside. And I think it minimum needed 11k or 12k btu.. I went 14k just in case. You may need an 18k at least. You might want to look into a dual inverter window AC. Not sure if they are the best best or whatever but I think they run cheaper than other types and its what they use in larger units usually but they got it down to some smaller sizes such as 14k and 18k to spread the savings and pwoer .. or something like that I think.


--------------------
Plan to win or you are planning for failure. Don't let anyone tell you you can't do it. Just figure out the solution. Even if that means banging your head on a wall until the solution oozes out of you.


Edited by seagu (07/28/20 01:28 PM)


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OfflineSHROOMSISAY01M
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: seagu]
    #26850086 - 07/28/20 02:56 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I think you need at least a 20000 BTU AC. Like I said That is from research I have done.

Yes, a high-pressure system will be able to keep up with the humidity drop. I run a high-pressure system in a small room 10' x 4' (I build it from a Pressure washer) and it runs for 10 seconds every 10 minutes with air constantly being pulled out of the room 24/7. So a high-pressure system especially one like I gave you a link to will solve the humidity problem. The system I built would probably be enough but I have never tested it on a bigger room. But it would just mean you would need more misters. Either way you go DO NOT buy slip lock connectors buy compression connectors. I have them for cheaper than anywhere around. So contact me if you decide to do the high-pressure system.


Edited by SHROOMSISAY01 (07/28/20 03:21 PM)


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OfflinePitcherCrab
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: seagu]
    #26850626 - 07/28/20 07:47 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

seagu said:
Depends on whether it will work on a few things. Is the FC insulated enough to prevent the outside heat from the garage to counter the cold you are piping into the FC. I've seen that issue. If that doesn't work you could make a frame around your FC about 1-2ft. Call it air insulation. And AC that and have a fan blowing the cold air all the way around it. So you have a room within a room of sorts. I know that can work very well.

Yea the Air exchanges demand the much larger capacity to keep up with pulling all the cooled air out for the FAE. Yea, I think my shed is 150 2/ft. The FC is smaller inside. And I think it minimum needed 11k or 12k btu.. I went 14k just in case. You may need an 18k at least. You might want to look into a dual inverter window AC. Not sure if they are the best best or whatever but I think they run cheaper than other types and its what they use in larger units usually but they got it down to some smaller sizes such as 14k and 18k to spread the savings and pwoer .. or something like that I think.




Got it. My FC is pretty well insulated, enough to have it be about 10°F cooler than the surrounding garage. It still warms up as the air in the garage warms, but certainly not as quickly. Today seemed to be cooler overall which I think was because of my new ceiling vent fan.

I’ll definitely look into some more options such as the dual inverter window AC you mentioned. Unfortunately I’m not going to be able to build a 1-2’ dead air space around the FC just due to space constraints, so I’m really hoping I can figure out a solution between my ceiling vent fan and some AC. If I *really* need to I suppose I could put another layer of insulation around the entire FC, but ultimately the vent fan inside the FC is pulling air from the garage into the room, so if its warm out there it will eventually warm up inside the FC.

Out of curiosity, what temperature to you typically keep your FC at?

Quote:

SHROOMSISAY01 said:
Yes, a high-pressure system will be able to keep up with the humidity drop. I run a high-pressure system in a small room 10' x 4' (I build it from a Pressure washer) and it runs for 10 seconds every 10 minutes with air constantly being pulled out of the room 24/7. So a high-pressure system especially one like I gave you a link to will solve the humidity problem.




What’s your RH with your system running like that?


--------------------
PC's LAGM 2021 (TOC & TWC)
P. natalensis Growlog 2021
Pans for PC Fall 2021 Growlog

“I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.” - Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear



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OfflineSHROOMSISAY01M
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: PitcherCrab]
    #26850671 - 07/28/20 08:12 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

It sounds to me like an attic vent fan may be needed to vent the garage around your fruiting chamber.

My pump kicks on at 90% and kicks off at 93% but the humidity keeps rising to 97% after the pump kicks off. My humidity sensor is not fast enough to keep up with how fast the humidity rises. The pump only runs for like 10 seconds every 10 minutes to make that drastic of a change in the rooms hummidity. I also have an exhaust fan running constantly that causes fresh air to be pulled into my room constantly. So in other words I am running a passive intake air system.


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Offlineseagu

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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: SHROOMSISAY01]
    #26851118 - 07/29/20 04:59 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Right if your vent fan is pulling in the hot air it will warm up. And if your exhaust is pulling out all your cold.. you need to supply more.. And then does all this pull in enough cold air quick enough to keep that room cool. That is the balancing act. And yes, an extra layer of insulation can help if your walls are heating up from outside forces. oh as a side note even though you don't have the room for it, the 1-2 ft air buffer with a fan blowing the air completely around it is just another way of doing a plenum. Which also allows for not perfectly sealed FC chambers so that only cold air gets pulled in.

I run this fruiting chamber when it is running, I have 2, around 70 F, though I plan on running it colder. The other one I have I run between 70-72 F. That one is in the house so the temp kinda depends on how cold we feel like living. :lol:


--------------------
Plan to win or you are planning for failure. Don't let anyone tell you you can't do it. Just figure out the solution. Even if that means banging your head on a wall until the solution oozes out of you.


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OfflinePitcherCrab
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: seagu]
    #26851334 - 07/29/20 08:02 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

SHROOMSISAY01 said:
It sounds to me like an attic vent fan may be needed to vent the garage around your fruiting chamber.

My pump kicks on at 90% and kicks off at 93% but the humidity keeps rising to 97% after the pump kicks off. My humidity sensor is not fast enough to keep up with how fast the humidity rises. The pump only runs for like 10 seconds every 10 minutes to make that drastic of a change in the rooms hummidity. I also have an exhaust fan running constantly that causes fresh air to be pulled into my room constantly. So in other words I am running a passive intake air system.




I just installed an attic vent fan two days ago. It is a 400cfm 6" fan so in theory should remove all the air in about every 15min. Yesterday's temperature readings we're very encouraging with my FCs temperature dropping all day. It was still quite warm in there but way better than just seeing the temperature rise all day. I'm curious how it will be today since last night it got down to about 64F.

As for the humidity, that sounds like exactly what I need to keep my humidity up while running fresh air through there. As of right now I have my FC vent fan on a repeat cycle but it's also apparent to me I'm not getting enough FAE. Also when the fan does kick on the humidity drops dramatically.

Perhaps between the vent fan and a new humidity system is be able to drop the temperature to something more workable...

What size pump would you recommend from that link you provided?

Have you ever considered chilling the water you use in your mister system as a way of dropping the temperature? It was a thought I had yesterday but wasn't sure how viable it is.

Quote:

seagu said:
Right if your vent fan is pulling in the hot air it will warm up. And if your exhaust is pulling out all your cold.. you need to supply more.. And then does all this pull in enough cold air quick enough to keep that room cool. That is the balancing act. And yes, an extra layer of insulation can help if your walls are heating up from outside forces. oh as a side note even though you don't have the room for it, the 1-2 ft air buffer with a fan blowing the air completely around it is just another way of doing a plenum. Which also allows for not perfectly sealed FC chambers so that only cold air gets pulled in.





Got it. It seems like I have multiple issues going on here! So I'm gonna do my best to solve for one at a time... The attic vent fan really seems to be helping cool the FC by cooling the air that's being pulled in. So that is a start. I think most likely I'll need to upgrade the humidity system then add a larger AC unit in a pre conditioning box.

Ugh... I was hoping this would be a simple fix but it's become apparent to me I've got some bigger issues at play.


--------------------
PC's LAGM 2021 (TOC & TWC)
P. natalensis Growlog 2021
Pans for PC Fall 2021 Growlog

“I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.” - Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear



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OfflineSHROOMSISAY01M
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: PitcherCrab]
    #26851463 - 07/29/20 09:44 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

If you Buy a cat pump just make sure you get one with the pulse hose. If money is a concern and you can not afford the cat pump your best bet is to just buy my system It is much cheaper and you could have it installed quickly. My system has been running for 3 years with not one problem. Either way I will cut you a deal on the misters and connectors since from what I understand you are going to need 50 pcs of each of the connectors and mist nozzles. I built my kit to make it long enough so I could afford to buy the cat pump and then I was going to replace the pressure washer with the cat pump but this thing is like the energizer bunny it keeps going and going and going. I did not expect it to last 3 years but I have no complaints. I don't have to do any maintenance to keep it running either. I have not even changed the water filters yet. Either way, you go I am here to help if you need it just PM me.


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Offlineseagu

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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: PitcherCrab]
    #26851469 - 07/29/20 09:49 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Yea and If you are not venting the back of your window AC outside you will be heating up the garage which will make the job of cooling your FC down even harder since that would heat up the FC walls. And if you try and use cool air from inside the garage on the intake part of the back part of the AC and just vent the backside you will pull all the cooler air from the garage outside sucking in hot air from outside ... DOH


--------------------
Plan to win or you are planning for failure. Don't let anyone tell you you can't do it. Just figure out the solution. Even if that means banging your head on a wall until the solution oozes out of you.


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OfflineSHROOMSISAY01M
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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: seagu]
    #26851482 - 07/29/20 10:04 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

:whathesaid:

I forgot to mention on the cat pump at the end of the serial # if there is a P it has the pulse hose if it does not have the P it does not come with the pulse hose

Example...

CAT 1CX050RA5P this one has the pulse hose. I am not saying buy that one I am just saying it has the pulse hose because of the P at the end.


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Re: Lowering fruiting room tempeartures [Re: PitcherCrab]
    #26851961 - 07/29/20 02:16 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Is using a basement or cellar an option? Mine stays between 55-60F year round unless I heat it.


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