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Offlineuketernity
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First Grow & Monotub Questions
    #26833828 - 07/20/20 08:41 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Hello Everyone

I am doing my first grow, and after 1 failed start (bad spores), I have successfully colonised a 1 x 3lb premium rye grain bags with B+. Colonisation took about 1 month to be fully complete.

Note: I live in a small 400sqft apartment so I am space limited but am making it work, I have big floor to ceiling windows that face north so should be good when it comes to fruiting & light.

My friend suggested I go the monotub route for a larger yield, and lent me his.





I also ordered a kit from the same supplier as the grow bags with a tub that's twice the size for another grow, and comes with bulk substrate, polyfill, vermiculite, and a light & trash liner.



I used a bulk substrate from the supplier above that contains Coco Coir, Vermiculite, Hydrated Lime, Gypsum, ph buffers, ph stabilizers, & mineral water.

I stuffed the 4 holes with polyfill so it was medium tight, about a golf ball sized chunk, and popped it in the cupboard.

After 1 week, the substrate appeared fully colonised



The tub was kept in a cupboard in the dark, and I misted the walls daily according to the kit instructions.

Now here is where I have questions.

The kit instructions say: "Mist the inside walls of the chamber with fresh clean water. Put the lid on tight. Make sure the entire container is in the dark.
Use a blanket to keep it dark if you are using a clear container from one of our kits. Continue to mist the walls of the chamber
on a daily basis to help ensure the humidity stays elevated."

However, I have read a bunch of posts on this site and others that say during colonisation you should just seal the tub and not open it again, which is correct? Have I done any harm by opening the tub daily to mist? I have kept a household temp/humidity monitor within the tub which has remained around 77f and 99% humidity.

After a week I have moved the tub from the cupboard and by a north facing window. Not much has happened in the last week but I have continued to mist the sides. I have read that some folks don't move to fruiting conditions until they see a few pins. Is this advisable? Did I move it too early?

The mycelium has small water droplets sitting on top of it (I did once accidentally mist the substrate but only once however these droplets were there before).

The tub only has holes in the top, that have had polyfil tightly packed during colonisation, which I have now reduced to half the amount so it's less tight. The tub doesn't have bottom holes, how much of an issue is that? I understand about FAE and exchanging CO2 and letting the less dense warmer air escape, how important is it to have bottom holes VS opening daily and fanning whilst misting? How long should one fan for?

I see some very small pins forming, so that's a good sign.

I have a central air system about 5 feet from the tub that sucks air in at about the level the tub is, and blows it out at about 9ft high, well above the tub, is this ok?

Thanks for reading so far, I will summarise my questions for easy answering:


1. Was opening the tub misting the walls during colonisation a bad idea? Should it be kept sealed?
2. Should I wait to see pins before moving to fruiting conditions?
3. Are water droplets on top of the mycelium anything to worry about? It's not pooled, just like morning dew on grass.
4. Is temp/humidity ok at 77f/99%?
5. Is not having bottom holes ok? How does this affect FAE if the top holes are loosely packed and the tub is opened daily to fan & mist?
6. How long should one fan for? Does one always mist or is it only if the sides are dry?
7. How will my central air system affect things? Air is being drawn in to the air system around the level where the tub is and blown out at about 9ft high.
10. Is there anything else I am doing wrong or not doing?

Thanks so much for your time.


Edited by uketernity (07/24/20 10:37 AM)


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OfflineA.k.aM
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: uketernity]
    #26833861 - 07/20/20 09:12 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Opening the tub is fine, just extra air. The myc is supposed to have little water beads on it which then evaporate and this triggers pinning.

everything else seems fine so far. Lots of air is good as long as it’s not drying your surface out. You can adjust the stuffing in the holes if needed.


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Offlineskullhuman
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: A.k.a]
    #26834358 - 07/20/20 02:12 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

If the substrate was hydrated properly there's no reason to open it up and mist it at any stage.  The sub itself generates ~10F of heat while colonizing so keep that in mind while measuring temps- ultimately you want it anywhere from 75-85F, ideally.  High humidity is also what you want.  Don't stress a ton about where the holes are placed.  I like to have a couple extra on the bottom of each side myself but monotubs are a KISS approach- they're really forgiving as long as your spawn and sub were on point.


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Edited by skullhuman (07/20/20 02:21 PM)


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Offlineuketernity
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: skullhuman]
    #26834405 - 07/20/20 02:43 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks for the tips.

Yeah I checked the field capacity of the substrate and it was perfect before adding to the tub. Good to know that I don't need to mist whilst colonising, and I am assuming only need to mist whilst fruiting if it appears to be drying out. On that note, how does one tell if it's drying out, what does one look for?

Thanks


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Offlineskullhuman
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: uketernity]
    #26835191 - 07/20/20 10:25 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

The myc will look all shriveled, thirsty, and dry, and any fruits will be small.  As long as you hydrated to field capacity and maintain high humidity throughout the process your myc will not dry out.


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Offlineuketernity
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: skullhuman]
    #26837820 - 07/22/20 09:41 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I read that monotubs often have holes at the bottom near the substrate to allow for CO2 to escape. My tub doesn't have those holes, how necessary are they? Does fanning have the same effect of removing the CO2?


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OfflineGan
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: uketernity]
    #26837850 - 07/22/20 09:54 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Also dont mist the walls. Walls dont grow mushrooms, the substrate does. If misting is needed, mist above the substrate and let the mist fall on to the surface.


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Offlineuketernity
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: Gan]
    #26837860 - 07/22/20 09:57 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Gan said:
Also dont mist the walls. Walls dont grow mushrooms, the substrate does. If misting is needed, mist above the substrate and let the mist fall on to the surface.




Thanks for the feedback.

It's so hard to find consistent advice on this. One person says mist the walls to keep humidity up, another says don't mist the walls but spray over the substrate, another says don't spray the substrate, another says don't mist at all because the substrate should provide the moisture, another says open the tub twice a day and fan it, another says don't open the tub at all, another says if you have the tub dialed in you shouldn't need to open it, but maybe do if you want and mist/fan.

Quite a minefield of info.


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Offlinemeowjinx
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: uketernity]
    #26837913 - 07/22/20 10:17 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

uketernity said:


Thanks for the feedback.

It's so hard to find consistent advice on this. One person says mist the walls to keep humidity up, another says don't mist the walls but spray over the substrate, another says don't spray the substrate, another says don't mist at all because the substrate should provide the moisture, another says open the tub twice a day and fan it, another says don't open the tub at all, another says if you have the tub dialed in you shouldn't need to open it, but maybe do if you want and mist/fan.

Quite a minefield of info.




LOL for real. I've noticed the same thing


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InvisibleRoger Clemency
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: meowjinx]
    #26837964 - 07/22/20 10:39 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

And to exacerbate you a little more, but give good advice (lol), don’t colonize in the dark. That’s old school stuff I guess from when people thought all mushrooms needed the same conditions. For cubensis in monotubs or shoe boxes you can just spawn them, and go directly into “fruiting conditions” which just means they should be getting light and some air right from the jump. Covering in a blanket is unjust and cruel :smile:

Kits often have some odd instructions. Check this out for some good reading and links to all kinds of up to date stuff https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24144021

And if you want to do shoe boxes which help with smaller spaces - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26009662


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OfflineGan
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: meowjinx]
    #26837977 - 07/22/20 10:48 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I would say it's more of a matter of careful reading and good research. The only people that will say mist the walls are the ones that are following advice from a decade ago. There's no reason to mist the walls. The mushrooms react primarily based off the microclimate right above the substrate surface. There are dudes here that grow in places with like 10% RH. But, they keep good surface conditions, so it's not a problem.

You never want to spray directly on to the substrate. Only spray above it and let it fall down onto the substrate. Especially once you get pins.

Read what skullhuman said carefully. He said if you hydrate your substrate properly and dial in your conditions, then you wont have to mist. If it's your first or second grow, there's a good chance it is not hydrated perfectly. Therefore, you may have to mist. You will learn how much or little hydration your substrate needs with time and experience, as it is specific to your conditions and the way you dial in your tubs. For now, check your tubs. Are there glistening beads of water on the substrate? If so, then great no need to mist. Is the surface dry with no beads of water? Then mist that shit.

As for fanning, that's an outdated technique. The fresh air will exchange naturally, so there's no need to fan to excavate CO2 or anything else. You can fan if you want, but it wont help anything and will increase your chance of drying out your sub.

Check this link for how your surface should look. Follow it exactly! https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23999053

Like I said, careful reading and good researching skills will turn the minefield into an abundance of knowledge. Limit your search to nothing older than 3-5 years at least for the most up to date stuff.


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OfflineFuddyduddy
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: uketernity]
    #26837994 - 07/22/20 10:56 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

In my houses climate it's good to mist the walls of the tub directly to keep the humidity in the container up. If I don't occasionally spray the walls then the edges if the sub get too dry compared to the center, even in a small shoebox size.

Gotta adjust your misting to your tubs needs depending on its size, heat, humidity, amount of air flow and where that air is coming in from.


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Offlineuketernity
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: Gan]
    #26838007 - 07/22/20 10:59 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks both of you for your helpful responses.

I purchased the substrate already pasteurised and hydrated. When I squeezed it some drops fell out, kinda like squeezing a mildy wet rag, maybe 5-10 drips which I understand is about right.

The surface looks exactly like those photos



I've got pins forming and seemingly doing well, so I guess whatever I am doing is working.

I have another tub that is colonising in the cupboard right now, in a larger tub with 10lb of substrate and 6lb of fully colonised 5-Grain Spawn Bags. It's almost all white.

Good to know I don't need to keep it in the cupboard, assuming it doesn't do it any harm though.

When do you move to fruiting conditions? I read some people says once it's all white, once you see knots, and also once you see pins. Is there any correct time? Or does it not matter as you don't really change anything assuming the conditions in the tub are right it should just *go* when ready.


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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: uketernity]
    #26838033 - 07/22/20 11:08 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Most people have moved to the opinion of introducing fruiting conditions as soon as you spawn (as in as soon as you mix your colonized grain spawn and substrate and put it into the tub). Fruiting conditions just means allowing more FAE than normal. It's not something crazy like removing all stuffing from the holes and leaving the lid completely off. But, depending on how much fresh air exchange (FAE) you are allowing, it may just be cracking the lid or loosening the stuffing.

Most have found that there's not a difference in yield in introducing fruiting conditions immediately, but there is a difference in the time from spawning to the tub to harvest. Faster times are found when introducing fruiting conditions immediately.

But, I like to let people that have way more experience speak when I can. So here's a good thread introducing the idea. Let it take you down the rabbit hole: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24692251


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Offlineuketernity
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: Gan]
    #26838346 - 07/22/20 01:35 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Interesting read, thanks for the tip.

Do you folks case cubes? I read there wasn't really any point and casing is usually best for edible mushrooms like oyster etc. I have some vermiculite but haven't used it yet. Afaik it's only needed to ensure humidity stays high, and it's on 99% according to my meter so don't see a point.


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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: uketernity]
    #26838367 - 07/22/20 01:41 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Nah I'd not bother with casing cubes in a monotub.


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OfflineA.k.aM
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: skullhuman]
    #26838813 - 07/22/20 05:00 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Only PE usually.


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Offlineuketernity
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: A.k.a]
    #26840348 - 07/23/20 11:01 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I'm actually going to try growing Penis Envy next, have some spores on the way.

Any advice/recommendations for growing them?

I have a couple of 5 grain premium spawn bags which I read should work for PE, and will be using a bulk substrate containing Coco Coir, Vermiculite, Hydrated Lime, Gypsum, ph buffers, ph stabilizers, & mineral water. I also have a bag of vermiculite for casing which it seems that PE requires to stop the mutant blobs.


Edited by uketernity (07/23/20 11:50 AM)


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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: uketernity]
    #26840534 - 07/23/20 12:20 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

There’s a couple good threads on it. I just let it consolidate a few days before fruiting and case it, besides that it’s the same.

I’d skip the lime, gypsum and buffers. Or use them on the casing, peat/verm mix works best. I just use jiffy mix right from the bag.


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Offlineuketernity
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Re: First Grow & Monotub Questions [Re: A.k.a]
    #26840552 - 07/23/20 12:30 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Turns out I accidentally ordered just rye spwan bags rather than the 5 grain. Will these work for PE?


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