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InvisibleSrirachi
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Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring?
    #26837759 - 07/22/20 09:08 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Twitter is banning QAnon accounts is why I ask. I didn't post this in Pol because it isn't a political question. It's about situational ethics. Do you believe that only those you agree with have the same rights you do?

I find it remarkable that we claim kids cannot be affected by violent entertainment, but that grown adults cannot possibly resist the influence of Twitter.


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InvisiblefeeversM
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: Srirachi] * 7
    #26837806 - 07/22/20 09:34 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Yes I'm generally against censorship from any side, but I also think that private social media companies can do what they want with the bandwith they pay for, they shouldn't be required to host anything. The crazies are totally free to start their own platform. If the government or ISP's started controlling speech and content then it'd be worrisome.


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Invisibletyrannicalrex
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: feevers] * 1
    #26837813 - 07/22/20 09:37 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

feevers said:
Yes, but I also think that private social media companies can do what they want with the bandwith they pay for, they shouldn't be required to host anything. The crazies are totally free to start their own platform. If the government or ISP's started controlling speech and content then it'd be worrisome.



I agree.


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Invisiblelarry.fisherman
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: Srirachi] * 1
    #26837825 - 07/22/20 09:44 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I try to be as unbiased as possible whenever I can but we're all human. We should all have our turn to speak but words do have power especially among those who don't understand that significance like kids and those among us who are less woke than others. There needs to be a balance, that balance means there needs to be a space where most things are tolerated without question but there's just too many folks out there who are out for themselves.


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InvisibleSrirachi
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: tyrannicalrex]
    #26837831 - 07/22/20 09:47 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I appreciate the input. That's pretty much where I am with it - Twitter is their own company, and I'd be pissed if the government told me I had to do something with my own company that I didn't want to do.

Like bake a cake for a wedding I didn't want to bake.

However, if Twitter et al claim they are not responsible when someone posts something that violates DMCA, or any other law, because they are "a platform not a producer" then I feel they should not censor accounts that are not violating the law.


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InvisiblefeeversM
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: tyrannicalrex] * 2
    #26837863 - 07/22/20 09:57 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

What's troublesome to me is that it seems to be many of the same politicians and people who claim to be free market capitalists, who are against regulation in the environment, banking/wall st, workplace safety etc because 'the industries will regulate themselves', are the ones that seem to be all for heavily regulating private social media companies. It's almost like they only want the kind of capitalism that directly benefits them.

The conspiracy stuff has quite a few times materialized into real world violence and harassment, so I can't really blame companies for wanting to distance from it. Some other stuff I've heard of people getting banned for is pretty silly, but I still support their right to control content on their own platform.


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InvisibleSrirachi
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: feevers] * 1
    #26837886 - 07/22/20 10:07 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

You also make some good points, but don't forget that Tucker Carlson's house got attacked while his wife and kid were there, by angry mobs incited by far-left Democrat posts, and no one has started banning The Squad's posts, which openly incite the harassment of people they disagree with.

Again, I'm not asking this in a political sense even - I just want to try and get people to examine their own motivations. Only each person can answer this: Do you really support freedom, or do you only support freedom for those who say things you agree with?


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Invisibletyrannicalrex
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: larry.fisherman] * 1
    #26837887 - 07/22/20 10:07 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

larry.fisherman said:
I try to be as unbiased as possible whenever I can...




I do as well.



Quote:

larry.fisherman said:
and those among us who are less woke than others.




Here is where I got vomit in the back of my throat. If I could, I would eradicate this way of using the English language, and educate every single person on the use of proper grammar in the English language. I absolutely despise (and cringe) at this kind of language and way of speaking. I'm not formerly educated, but it is completely obvious that sayings like "my bad", and "are you woke" etc...are fucking annoying to anyone that appreciates good conversation and at least a slight bit of intelligence and proper grammar. I would sensor urban hip hop inner city street lingo (this applies to all races, so don't try to get an attitude of "that's racist" with this statement) if I could, and replace it with proper grammar.


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Invisibletyrannicalrex
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: tyrannicalrex]
    #26837931 - 07/22/20 10:25 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I swear I'm becoming a crotchety old man, lol.:heart:


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OfflineNonagon Infinity
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: Srirachi] * 1
    #26837990 - 07/22/20 10:53 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Srirachi said:
It's about situational ethics. Do you believe that only those you agree with have the same rights you do?



I don't think that's the philosophical position that Twitter is taking here - in all reality, they're probably just censoring QAnon accounts because not doing so would lead to outrage for a large portion of their user-base, potentially leading to boycotts and a large loss of active users and, therefore, a large loss of revenue. I think it's just a PR move, personally. That doesn't mean that it doesn't have positive effects (personally, I think it's a net-positive that there are fewer QAnon accounts spewing radical, dangerous misinformation on a popular public forum), but I think Twitter's motivations behind the move have little to do with ethical philosophy and a lot to do with profits.


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Nonagon Infinity Opens the Door


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Offlinelowbrow
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: Nonagon Infinity]
    #26838087 - 07/22/20 11:35 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Nonagon Infinity said:

I don't think that's the philosophical position that Twitter is taking here - in all reality, they're probably just censoring QAnon accounts because not doing so would lead to outrage for a large portion of their user-base, potentially leading to boycotts and a large loss of active users and, therefore, a large loss of revenue.


the people that would be complaining about these accounts would never boycott twitter.  Twitter is a known leftist partisan platform and them doing this is no surprise.  We’re going to see more of this prejudice as we get closer to November.


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Amanita86 said:
Sui is trying to mod right now.  Kinda like a newborn calf tryin ta stand fer the first time ain’t it..


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OfflineNonagon Infinity
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: lowbrow] * 1
    #26838111 - 07/22/20 11:47 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

lowbrow said:the people that would be complaining about these accounts would never boycott twitter.  Twitter is a known leftist partisan platform and them doing this is no surprise.  We’re going to see more of this prejudice as we get closer to November.



My point is that Twitter takes a leftist stance publicly because that's the best way for them to appeal to their largely left-leaning user base. I don't think they're running some program where they're trying to indoctrinate everyone into leftist ideology - they're running a business, and I think their left-leaning position is largely a consequence of the fact that they learned this is what makes them the most money.

I wouldn't call it prejudice. I'd call it a PR move. Twitter as an entity doesn't give a shit about politics, they give a shit about keeping their users happy so that advertisers will continue to buy ad space on their site and so that they can continue to sell the personal information of their users to advertisers.


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Nonagon Infinity Opens the Door


Edited by Nonagon Infinity (07/22/20 11:48 AM)


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Invisiblelarry.fisherman
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: tyrannicalrex]
    #26838188 - 07/22/20 12:18 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

It's just a word. Find a word that better suits the meaning , be my guest. At that moment that's the one that came to mind. You have to remember that the word was started by people who actually made the term make sense. I could refer to the antithesis of that as sheep but I doubt you'd bat an eye even though it's overused and a fairly rough terminology. The people who associate the term with the fools who make it look bad are just as cringey, I assure you. The problem with the term is it's now a norm, it's a majority or atleast a loud and large minority. It doesn't make sense unless you're using it to separate specific groups of people to make a point which is where your post began to fail, brah. :smile:


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OfflineNonagon Infinity
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: tyrannicalrex]
    #26838225 - 07/22/20 12:31 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

tyrannicalrex said:
Here is where I got vomit in the back of my throat. If I could, I would eradicate this way of using the English language, and educate every single person on the use of proper grammar in the English language. I absolutely despise (and cringe) at this kind of language and way of speaking. I'm not formerly educated, but it is completely obvious that sayings like "my bad", and "are you woke" etc...are fucking annoying to anyone that appreciates good conversation and at least a slight bit of intelligence and proper grammar. I would sensor urban hip hop inner city street lingo (this applies to all races, so don't try to get an attitude of "that's racist" with this statement) if I could, and replace it with proper grammar.




Geeze, chill. The laws of grammar and words change their meanings all the time. The whole purpose of language is to communicate, right? If you understand what he meant, why is there a problem? If you don't like saying "my bad", and "are you woke", then you don't have to say those things, but if you fully understand what is being communicated to you by those phrases and your gut reaction is to criticize that person for not speaking correctly, then you're just being a dick.


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Nonagon Infinity Opens the Door


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Invisibletyrannicalrex
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: Nonagon Infinity]
    #26838288 - 07/22/20 01:06 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I know guys, I'm just a crabby fucker today. I like both of you, and most everyone in this place actually. *gets off soapbox*.


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OfflineNonagon Infinity
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: tyrannicalrex]
    #26838315 - 07/22/20 01:17 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

tyrannicalrex said:
I know guys, I'm just a crabby fucker today. I like both of you, and most everyone in this place actually. *gets off soapbox*.



I get it, man. We've all been there. Just the other day I was correcting one of my friends for a language problem and he pointed out that I was being a dick. It happens to all of us sometimes :thumbup:


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OfflineBANANA.MAN
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: feevers]
    #26838329 - 07/22/20 01:26 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

feevers said:
What's troublesome to me is that it seems to be many of the same politicians and people who claim to be free market capitalists, who are against regulation in the environment, banking/wall st, workplace safety etc because 'the industries will regulate themselves', are the ones that seem to be all for heavily regulating private social media companies. It's almost like they only want the kind of capitalism that directly benefits them.

The conspiracy stuff has quite a few times materialized into real world violence and harassment, so I can't really blame companies for wanting to distance from it. Some other stuff I've heard of people getting banned for is pretty silly, but I still support their right to control content on their own platform.



I totally agree.

The argument people usually make is not that private companies should give a platform to anyone. its that if they are going to act as publishers of certain content they should be treated as publishers and held accountable for the content on their platforms.

I dont care if they are treated as publishers but it does seem like a pretty big loophole for publishers to promite certain content above others without being held accountable and thats the common argument. That twitter, etc are acting as publishers not social media.

Again I dont care but Twitter it's self is taking responsibility for banning certain people and removing posts  but then they can turn around and say its not their fault if someone posts something defamatory or threatening for example.

But again I totally agree private companies should be able to fo what they want and its not a freedom of speech issue for private companies to censor people and most free market advocates agree.


Edited by BANANA.MAN (07/22/20 03:16 PM)


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OfflineSeriously_trippin
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: BANANA.MAN]
    #26838396 - 07/22/20 01:53 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah private companies can do what they want. It's like the decision to ban Alex Jones it was really a business decision because social media then becomes a platform for straight disinformation that could kill people,hate that can turn into real attacks all of which would've been facilitated by twitter,FB etc. People have no idea what rights we have or don't have anymore as Americans. Not wearing a mask during  pandemic isn't a constitutional right and freedom of speech does not apply to private companies that is why there are terms nd agreements. Generally I don't like any censorship to happen even to the people I think have the worst ideology. When people like Alex Jones though say that specific Parkland parents are crisis actors led to those parents being harassed whole trying to grieve. To the point where they were inundated with Death threats, in that sense Alex Jones definitely deserve to be kicked off.


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OfflineNonagon Infinity
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: Seriously_trippin]
    #26838609 - 07/22/20 03:26 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Seriously_trippin said:
It's like the decision to ban Alex Jones it was really a business decision



Exactly. It was a PR stunt. Twitter didn't ban Alex Jones because it was the right thing to do, ethically. They banned Alex Jones because it was the best thing to do to protect their source of income.

Personally, I think it was a very good thing that Alex Jones was banned from Twitter, considering that he's basically a snake oil salesman who spreads blatantly false information and sometimes incites harassment against innocent people. I think that society is probably safer when he doesn't have a large platform. That said, Twitter probably didn't ban him for that reason. They most likely banned him because they did market research and realized that it was the most profitable decision to make.


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OfflineBANANA.MAN
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Re: Will you speak out against censorship even if you fucking hate what they're censoring? [Re: Nonagon Infinity]
    #26838614 - 07/22/20 03:30 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I agree Alex Jones spreads false info and I'm no fan but I havent seen any evidence that hes incited harrassment.

I dont hold Bernie Sanders accountable for his supporter that shot up a congressional baseball game and I dont hold Alex Jones accountable for something his crazy fans did.


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