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Offlineqman
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26898537 - 08/25/20 11:18 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Vahn421 said:
At first I said I would have tazed him, but I've re-watched the footage a few times and I've changed my mind. This guy must have been out of his mind to be so belligerent with guns in his faces. He wasn't getting in his car, watch closely, he was *reaching* for an object in the car.

So on second thought, I can't find fault in anything but *how many* times the guy was shot. Once or twice should have been enough and someone got a little trigger happy... but I don't think tazing someone who is reaching is enough.

Seriously why the fuck would anyone ignore two people waving guns in your face and telling you to comply... and then open your car door and REACH for something?

Here is the footage again.  Watch closely around the 16 second mark for the quick THRUST his arm makes to grab something in the car. It is not until that moment that the cop fires.

As I said, I'm not sure the need for firing 6-7 times, but firing was justified. This is standard procedure. Especially given the new footage.

I don't know what this moron was thinking. He sealed his own fate.

There are better examples to make a case against corrupt cops. This is a bad example, guys. The cops were justified.




Non-compliance with cops depends on what's at sake, correct?  It's all a matter perspective.

There's nothing in that video that justifies shooting a man in the back, it just isn't there at all. Let's not forget the three children in the car, who the fuck fires 7 shots into a car with three children, that's fucking retarded.

I also agree there's many more cases of cops being even more out of line with citizens, but that doesn't mean this case doesn't have any merit. The cops were wrong.

Here's the thing that people like yourself need to rethink, the public is now DEMANDING different policing TACTICS from OUR public SERVANTS that will EMPLOY. We expect more from them and they haven't adjusted to the new level of expectations. They will over time, the old way of policing is coming to an end. It might take another few years, but the times are changing.


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OfflineVahn421
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: qman]
    #26898560 - 08/25/20 11:31 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

the old way of policing is coming to an end. It might take another few years, but the times are changing.




And what are we gonna replace it with? Because some people have got this dumb idea in their head that the majority of humans will still act benevolently without law to keep them in line.

And I disagree about the shooting, man. That guy made strong jerk like reach in his car and the cop literally didn't fire until the moment. I consider that good training.... and then he fired too many times. I dunno man. Maybe he's had experience or heard stories about belligerent drug users who don't go down with one or two shots. The guy was almost acting suicidal by behaving that way in front of cops with guns right in front of him. He either had the I.Q. of a peanut or was on some serious drugs. Take your pick. :shrug:


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Edited by Vahn421 (08/25/20 11:32 AM)


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Onlinechristopera
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26898569 - 08/25/20 11:35 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Chaos theory has been proven wrong time and time again.


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OfflineVahn421
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: shivas.wisdom]
    #26898570 - 08/25/20 11:36 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Yeah you said the same about George Floyd - a man who was slowly choked to death, on video, in broad daylight, in public. I think you just have a soft-spot for authoritarianism.




I've said multiple times that the knee-on-the-neck was the one part I was NOT ok with. :rolleyes:


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OfflineSirTripAlot
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26898583 - 08/25/20 11:43 AM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Cops dont prevent crime.
That cop had PLENTY of time to shoot somewhere other than his back. How the fuck you shoot someone 7 times in the back and only paralyze him? The reaction of his partner says it all, poorly trained at amateur night.


--------------------
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Offlinekoods
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26898609 - 08/25/20 12:01 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Vahn421 said:
Quote:

the old way of policing is coming to an end. It might take another few years, but the times are changing.




And what are we gonna replace it with? Because some people have got this dumb idea in their head that the majority of humans will still act benevolently without law to keep them in line.

And I disagree about the shooting, man. That guy made strong jerk like reach in his car and the cop literally didn't fire until the moment. I consider that good training.... and then he fired too many times. I dunno man. Maybe he's had experience or heard stories about belligerent drug users who don't go down with one or two shots. The guy was almost acting suicidal by behaving that way in front of cops with guns right in front of him. He either had the I.Q. of a peanut or was on some serious drugs. Take your pick. :shrug:




This is a very strong “don’t resist tyranny and everything  will be fine” attitude

A jerk motion isn’t justification for shooting someone. In fact, having a gun isn’t justification in a country where citizens have a right to bear arms. Until that gun is pointed at you, the police shouldn’t be allowed to defend themselves. If you don’t like that, then repeal the second ammendment.


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Edited by koods (08/25/20 12:07 PM)


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Offlineqman
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26898617 - 08/25/20 12:04 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Vahn421 said:
Quote:

the old way of policing is coming to an end. It might take another few years, but the times are changing.




And what are we gonna replace it with? Because some people have got this dumb idea in their head that the majority of humans will still act benevolently without law to keep them in line.

And I disagree about the shooting, man. That guy made strong jerk like reach in his car and the cop literally didn't fire until the moment. I consider that good training.... and then he fired too many times. I dunno man. Maybe he's had experience or heard stories about belligerent drug users who don't go down with one or two shots. The guy was almost acting suicidal by behaving that way in front of cops with guns right in front of him. He either had the I.Q. of a peanut or was on some serious drugs. Take your pick. :shrug:




Cops RESPOND to potential crime and the debate at hand is how to RESPOND to it, not the prevention of it.



Guess what?  If we didn't have the 'war on drugs' and other oppressive policing tactics, there would be significantly less responses, therefore less illegal/poor responses to the citizens.

So yeah, there's plenty to replace and plenty to change from this shitty criminal justice system.


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InvisibleMadMuncher
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26898623 - 08/25/20 12:07 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Vahn421 said:
Quote:

the old way of policing is coming to an end. It might take another few years, but the times are changing.




And what are we gonna replace it with? Because some people have got this dumb idea in their head that the majority of humans will still act benevolently without law to keep them in line.

And I disagree about the shooting, man. That guy made strong jerk like reach in his car and the cop literally didn't fire until the moment. I consider that good training.... and then he fired too many times. I dunno man. Maybe he's had experience or heard stories about belligerent drug users who don't go down with one or two shots. The guy was almost acting suicidal by behaving that way in front of cops with guns right in front of him. He either had the I.Q. of a peanut or was on some serious drugs. Take your pick. :shrug:




maybe he was grabbing his phone or his wallet or something. they said he was unarmed


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InvisibleMagicMush123
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26898677 - 08/25/20 12:29 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Vahn421 said:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8660213/Video-shows-Jacob-Blake-brawling-cops-shot-Wisconsin-cops-placed-leave.html

New footage shows the cops and the man were struggling on the ground before the shooting. They were likely trying to cuff him and he broke free and walked away like it was no big deal, he was given MULTIPLE warnings. He didn't listen.



I cant figure out why they resorted to shooting a guy in the back instead of just using their taser or even just tackling the guy


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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: MagicMush123]
    #26898709 - 08/25/20 12:38 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

The cop should have no recourse. The fact that blake was walking away from
the cops means they were in no immediate threat of harm. Many non lethal approaches could have been taken.


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InvisibleEminence
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26898725 - 08/25/20 12:47 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

That's what I said, his arms were in reach of theirs, both of them could have just walked a little faster and grabbed him. But at the same time, I can't pretend to be upset that a rapist was killed. He's fucking stupid though too. I guess he thought he was invincible because of George Floyd riots or something.


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Invisiblenatedawgnow
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Eminence]
    #26898735 - 08/25/20 12:54 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Not saying he is innocent, but apparently that case was dismissed. Why?
I dont know. But accusations are not proof.

Regardless, criminals have rights too. Sorry if the idea of a criminal seeing
their day in court hurts your sensibilities, but that is how it is supposed to work.


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InvisibleEminence
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: natedawgnow]
    #26898795 - 08/25/20 01:19 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Wait, now I hear he was fighting with the cops before he went to grab whatever from his car? The guy's dumber than I originally thought. He's lucky to still be alive.


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OfflineVahn421
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Eminence] * 1
    #26898819 - 08/25/20 01:33 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Eminence said:
Wait, now I hear he was fighting with the cops before he went to grab whatever from his car? The guy's dumber than I originally thought. He's lucky to still be alive.




Yeah, that's why I changed my mind. Full context. There was a physical struggle with the cops first, NO GUNFIRE, then the guy walks off even though those two cops, post struggle, have guns pointed right at him and are telling him to comply, the guy opens his car, makes a JERK reach for something in his car, and then the cop shoots.

If I'm a cop, I'm not gonna wait to turn around to see what he's thrusting to grab. I just wouldn't.


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OfflineVahn421
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: qman]
    #26898825 - 08/25/20 01:36 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Vahn421 said:
Quote:

the old way of policing is coming to an end. It might take another few years, but the times are changing.




And what are we gonna replace it with? Because some people have got this dumb idea in their head that the majority of humans will still act benevolently without law to keep them in line.

And I disagree about the shooting, man. That guy made strong jerk like reach in his car and the cop literally didn't fire until the moment. I consider that good training.... and then he fired too many times. I dunno man. Maybe he's had experience or heard stories about belligerent drug users who don't go down with one or two shots. The guy was almost acting suicidal by behaving that way in front of cops with guns right in front of him. He either had the I.Q. of a peanut or was on some serious drugs. Take your pick. :shrug:




Cops RESPOND to potential crime and the debate at hand is how to RESPOND to it, not the prevention of it.



Guess what?  If we didn't have the 'war on drugs' and other oppressive policing tactics, there would be significantly less responses, therefore less illegal/poor responses to the citizens.

So yeah, there's plenty to replace and plenty to change from this shitty criminal justice system.




My concern is about violence and I think there's still an argument to be made about drug-induced violence being the most common kind of violence cops respond to. Not all drugs are created equal. Do we legalize just the safe/good ones, or all of them? And if we did legalize ALL of them, would that cause violent crime to go down, or to rise? Because violent crime is the only crime I really care about. (Rape, murder, assault, theft, etc...) (And then a little bit of law-abiding is necessary so drunk people aren't all over the road all the time, etc...)


--------------------


Edited by Vahn421 (08/25/20 01:37 PM)


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Offlineqman
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Vahn421] * 1
    #26898927 - 08/25/20 02:46 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Vahn421 said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Vahn421 said:
Quote:

the old way of policing is coming to an end. It might take another few years, but the times are changing.




And what are we gonna replace it with? Because some people have got this dumb idea in their head that the majority of humans will still act benevolently without law to keep them in line.

And I disagree about the shooting, man. That guy made strong jerk like reach in his car and the cop literally didn't fire until the moment. I consider that good training.... and then he fired too many times. I dunno man. Maybe he's had experience or heard stories about belligerent drug users who don't go down with one or two shots. The guy was almost acting suicidal by behaving that way in front of cops with guns right in front of him. He either had the I.Q. of a peanut or was on some serious drugs. Take your pick. :shrug:




Cops RESPOND to potential crime and the debate at hand is how to RESPOND to it, not the prevention of it.



Guess what?  If we didn't have the 'war on drugs' and other oppressive policing tactics, there would be significantly less responses, therefore less illegal/poor responses to the citizens.

So yeah, there's plenty to replace and plenty to change from this shitty criminal justice system.




My concern is about violence and I think there's still an argument to be made about drug-induced violence being the most common kind of violence cops respond to. Not all drugs are created equal. Do we legalize just the safe/good ones, or all of them? And if we did legalize ALL of them, would that cause violent crime to go down, or to rise? Because violent crime is the only crime I really care about. (Rape, murder, assault, theft, etc...) (And then a little bit of law-abiding is necessary so drunk people aren't all over the road all the time, etc...)




The VAST majority of drug related crime is due to the prohibition of the drug, not the user intoxication. Did you forget about alcohol prohibition and the results it produced and the lessons we learned from it?

The Elite always blame the drug for the violence that the drug prohibition actually produces, which of course is their policy. We also know The Elite benefit from drug prohibition and that's why it continues to this day. Why would you buy into their scare tactics once again?

Drug intoxication is health issue, not a criminal issue unless you break some other law.

If drug induced violence is the most common violence the police have to deal with, it's obviously from a legal drug that's used more than anything else- alcohol.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: Vahn421]
    #26898970 - 08/25/20 03:16 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

You classify theft as violent crime?

Is your name Javert?


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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: koods]
    #26898982 - 08/25/20 03:25 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

Vahn421 said:
Quote:

the old way of policing is coming to an end. It might take another few years, but the times are changing.




And what are we gonna replace it with? Because some people have got this dumb idea in their head that the majority of humans will still act benevolently without law to keep them in line.

And I disagree about the shooting, man. That guy made strong jerk like reach in his car and the cop literally didn't fire until the moment. I consider that good training.... and then he fired too many times. I dunno man. Maybe he's had experience or heard stories about belligerent drug users who don't go down with one or two shots. The guy was almost acting suicidal by behaving that way in front of cops with guns right in front of him. He either had the I.Q. of a peanut or was on some serious drugs. Take your pick. :shrug:




This is a very strong “don’t resist tyranny and everything  will be fine” attitude

A jerk motion isn’t justification for shooting someone. In fact, having a gun isn’t justification in a country where citizens have a right to bear arms. Until that gun is pointed at you, the police shouldn’t be allowed to defend themselves. If you don’t like that, then repeal the second ammendment.



Again on point.
I sure as fuck don't want to be shot by cops for owning a gun and having it at arms reach.


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OfflineWinterOwned
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: ballsalsa] * 2
    #26898993 - 08/25/20 03:29 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

I’m so glad most people have a well enough informed worldview to know not to engage OP seriously. Too much fiction in that ones diet...


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OfflineVahn421
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Re: Who are the real terrorists? Or are they ALL just terrorists? [Re: ballsalsa]
    #26899059 - 08/25/20 04:16 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
You classify theft as violent crime?

Is your name Javert?




Actually, I didn't quite mean to assert that. The two are often intertwined but obviously don't have to be.


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