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Vahn421
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Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers
#26829182 - 07/17/20 02:49 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Here is the video.
We already knew that in many cases of illnesses people were being counted as a Covid death even if Covid wasn't the direct cause, already inflating the numbers, but this? This is just fucking ridiculous.
Why should anyone believe what the media tells us about Covid now? Why shouldn't we be skeptical of it all, even down to mask wearing?
The media has successfully polarized the country over this issue.
I posted a news article the other day explaining that Hospitals made anywhere from 10-40K more money if they wrote off a death as a covid death due to executive orders being passed a few months ago.
Do you really think this fraud has only happened once? I'll bet it's happening WAY more than we realize.
Bottom line, they're inflating the numbers and scaring us into thinking covid is more deadly than it really is, and we need to sniff them all out and not do anything they tell us to do in the meantime.
I'm so glad Trump got the CDC out of the picture.
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Edited by Vahn421 (07/17/20 02:52 PM)
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421] 1
#26829247 - 07/17/20 03:11 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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I'll bite.
While you might be correct that the numbers are somewhat inflated, and that hospitals make more by reporting Covid deaths, it still appears that Covid is FAR deadlier than the flu. As I said before, I knew the first person to die of Covid in the US, and even if the 'true' number of deaths isn't quite 140,000+ (and rapidly growing), it's still FAR more than a flu, and has potential for long term consequences other than death.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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nooneman


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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421] 1
#26829254 - 07/17/20 03:24 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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So when exactly did you eat the red pill Vahn? I've mentioned before that prior to very recently, you never started any political threads, and you didn't really take many political positions either, and then all of a sudden during an election year BAM, you're posting a fuckton of political threads and they're all hardcore conservative. So what happened?
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Vahn421
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#26829256 - 07/17/20 03:26 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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I don't think the virus is a hoax, I think they've capitalized on human being's propensity for fear and made appear 100 times worse than it really is.
Given how inflated the numbers are, I would be surprised to find out less people actually DIRECTLY die or have permanent damage from covid than they do in automobile accidents.
People seem to argue about what the actual death rate is. My research tells me it's way less than 1%.
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Vahn421
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: nooneman]
#26829258 - 07/17/20 03:30 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
nooneman said: So when exactly did you eat the red pill Vahn? I've mentioned before that prior to very recently, you never started any political threads, and you didn't really take many political positions either, and then all of a sudden during an election year BAM, you're posting a fuckton of political threads and they're all hardcore conservative. So what happened?
I used to post on the general board on the shroomery years ago when I was first getting into psychedelics. I messed around in the philosophy and spirituality forum a bit back then, too.
Since Trump got elected in 2016 I've become more interested in politics and what is going on. I saw so much irrational hatred for Trump with very few people being able to give me reasons beyond, "racist, sexist" bigot." in the beginning, so I wanted to look at what was going on for my self. You could say Trump being elected got me into politics.
I've been looking to have my ideas challenged and I also figured I'd come back here to see if and how psychedelic use affects political affiliation as well. (It doesn't seem to affect it much.)
Quote:
you're posting a fuckton of political threads and they're all hardcore conservative.
I don't see how saying "they're lying to us about the covid numbers" is a conservative stance. 
EDIT: I'm not a conservative, I'm a rationalist and a futurist. One side simply engages me more thoughtfully than the other, so I know where I stand right now. It could change in a few years. Republicanism were the nut-job party that was pro-censorship 30 years ago. That script has completely flipped now, and anti-censorship is like my BIGGEST position.
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Edited by Vahn421 (07/17/20 03:35 PM)
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Enlil
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421] 1
#26829263 - 07/17/20 03:32 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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So, that's one that "could have" been included in the numbers.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
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Enlil
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421] 2
#26829264 - 07/17/20 03:33 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Vahn421 said:
I don't see how saying "they're lying to us about the covid numbers" is a conservative stance. 
You posted a link to the youtube channel of "conservative daily."
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
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Vahn421
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Enlil]
#26829269 - 07/17/20 03:37 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
Vahn421 said:
I don't see how saying "they're lying to us about the covid numbers" is a conservative stance. 
You posted a link to the youtube channel of "conservative daily."
Who CARES who is telling the story if we're listening to facts and figures?
I certainly don't, being unaffiliated. Give me a democratic source for news and if they report the truth, I'm going to take it in regardless.
Not taking information in because of WHO said it is classic ad hominem. Cmon, this ls logic/debate 101.
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Edited by Vahn421 (07/17/20 03:37 PM)
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Vahn421
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421]
#26829272 - 07/17/20 03:38 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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In fact, I'll go a little further.
The very fact that (primarily) ONLY CONSERVATIVE NEWS SOURCES are reporting about this deception is very telling, don't you think? (And remember, I say that being unaffiliated.)
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Edited by Vahn421 (07/17/20 03:40 PM)
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Enlil
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421] 1
#26829284 - 07/17/20 03:45 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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You aren't unaffiliated, though. We have all seen stealth righties before.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
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Vahn421
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Enlil] 1
#26829288 - 07/17/20 03:46 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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You don't know me better than I know me.
If this is how you're going to attempt to one-up me, it's going to backfire.
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koods
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#26829305 - 07/17/20 03:53 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: I'll bite.
While you might be correct that the numbers are somewhat inflated, and that hospitals make more by reporting Covid deaths, it still appears that Covid is FAR deadlier than the flu. As I said before, I knew the first person to die of Covid in the US, and even if the 'true' number of deaths isn't quite 140,000+ (and rapidly growing), it's still FAR more than a flu, and has potential for long term consequences other than death.
Neither of these things are true. Nobody makes more money for reporting a covid death. And the numbers are not inflated they are under reported. People who die of covid who were never diagnosed aren’t included generally. The US death toll is closer to 200,000.
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421]
#26829324 - 07/17/20 04:01 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Vahn421 said: I don't think the virus is a hoax, I think they've capitalized on human being's propensity for fear and made appear 100 times worse than it really is.
Given how inflated the numbers are, I would be surprised to find out less people actually DIRECTLY die or have permanent damage from covid than they do in automobile accidents.
People seem to argue about what the actual death rate is. My research tells me it's way less than 1%.
Right, and I agreed there's some exaggeration, but how did you get to "100 times worse than it really is"?
I don't know how inflated the numbers are, but I'd guess no more than 10%, which still makes covid pretty deadly. But that's just a guess, so if you explain your research, I can be persuaded to change my guess.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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Psilynut2
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421]
#26829335 - 07/17/20 04:07 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
"racist, sexist" bigot.
Pretty good reasons not to like someone , IMO .
Edited by Psilynut2 (07/17/20 04:07 PM)
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Vahn421
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Psilynut2]
#26829359 - 07/17/20 04:15 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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https://www.factcheck.org/2020/04/hospital-payments-and-the-covid-19-death-count/
"I would remind him that anytime health care intersects with dollars it gets awkward. Right now Medicare has determined that if you have a COVID-19 admission to the hospital, you’ll get paid $13,000. If that COVID-19 patient goes on a ventilator, you get $39,000, three times as much. Nobody can tell me after 35 years in the world of medicine that sometimes those kinds of things impact on what we do."
"It is true, however, that the government will pay more to hospitals for COVID-19 cases in two senses: By paying an additional 20% on top of traditional Medicare rates for COVID-19 patients during the public health emergency, and by reimbursing hospitals for treating the uninsured patients with the disease (at that enhanced Medicare rate)."
Basically what is unconfirmed is whether or not hospitals are intentionally doing it to make more money.
Um, duh. This is the human condition 101. We're not the altruistic motherfuckers we think we are. If we find a way to make some easy bucks that doesn't require us breaking the law, you can bet motherfuckers are gonna do it.
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Edited by Vahn421 (07/17/20 04:17 PM)
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Vahn421
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421]
#26829367 - 07/17/20 04:18 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Same article: "it is acceptable to report COVID-19 on a death certificate as ‘probable’ or ‘presumed.'“If we think it’s presumptive … we can go ahead and put down COVID-19,” Jensen said, “or even in some situations, even if it’s negative.” He pointed to the example of a 38-year-old man in Minnesota whose death was attributed to the coronavirus even though he tested negative."
Edited by Vahn421 (07/17/20 04:20 PM)
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koods
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421]
#26829374 - 07/17/20 04:23 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Where’s the evidence of them faking covid for payment?
Your original claim is they get paid more for a covid death
Just to be clear. Medicare pays a flat fee to hospitals for their services. For covid. For chemo. For everything. They get the same amount if they live or die or how many days they spend in hospital. There’s no conspiracy.
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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Vahn421
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: koods]
#26829378 - 07/17/20 04:27 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Medicare pays a flat fee to hospitals for their services.
"It is true, however, that the government will pay more to hospitals for COVID-19 cases in two senses: By paying an additional 20% on top of traditional Medicare rates for COVID-19 patients during the public health emergency, and by reimbursing hospitals for treating the uninsured patients with the disease (at that enhanced Medicare rate).
Both of those provisions stem from the Coronavirus Aid, Relief, and Economic Security Act, or CARES Act.
The CARES Act created the 20% add-on to be paid for Medicare patients with COVID-19. The act further created a $100 billion fund that is being used to financially assist hospitals — a “portion” of which will be “used to reimburse healthcare providers, at Medicare rates, for COVID-related treatment of the uninsured,” according to the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services."
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koods
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421]
#26829379 - 07/17/20 04:28 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Where’s the evidence of them faking covid?
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NotSheekle said “if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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Vahn421
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Re: Motorcycle Crash Victim Included in FL Covid-19 Fatality Numbers [Re: Vahn421]
#26829380 - 07/17/20 04:29 PM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Your original claim is they get paid more for a covid death
I may have misspoken on this point. It may be for actual treatment of covid and not the death per ce.
What I am now digging into is whether or not hospitals get another chunk of money from medicare or insurance relating to someone dying in their hospital. (It's likely true, but I need confirmation.) If/when I figure out how much money that is, the above bonuses in the last post I just threw up would apply to that as well, so hospitals would indeed make more money for not just treatments of covid, but covid related deaths.
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